Democrats believe in certain principles.

[kentuck]

Last edited Tue Jul 2, 2013, 12:54 PM - Edit history (1)

They believe in equality for women and a woman's right to choose. They believe in equality for all.

They believe in human rights and do not support torture under any circumstances.

They believe in openness in government and do not support spying or eavesdropping on American citizens. They do not support secrecy with little or no oversight.

Democrats do not believe that leaders have a right to lie to the American people. The "least untruthful" method is not acceptable.

Democrats believe in the right of whistle-blowers to make secrets known when there is no other way for the people to find out what is being done in their name. Also, Democrats do not support revenge by the same government that is keeping secrets from them and spying on all their communications.

Democrats believe in the rights of the people, as written in the Bill of Rights, over any rights claimed by the government.

on edit: removed "as a general rule" per suggestion.

[RC]

1. +10

I do not understand how all the secrecy around NSA, the latest so-called Free Trade Agreement and such can be justified by anyone calling themselves a Democrat.

Actually I do:

[datasuspect]

2. so where are they?

[ProdigalJunkMail]

4. there a none in gov't...

at least not at the federal level...

sP

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

3. Alas, some believe that prinicples are fungible or discardable in the "real world".

See DLC, New Democrats, 3rd Way, triangulation, bi-partisanship, for references.

[datasuspect]

5. political thought process:

'hmmm . . . big ass check or my convictions and principles? hmmm . . . how much was the amount of that big ass check again?'

[bvar22]

15. Sensible CENTRISM!!!!

[font size=3]...because it is so EASY!
You don't have to STAND for ANYTHING,
and get to insult those who DO!


Whatever is In-the-Middle,
is Good Enough for ME![/font]

[LWolf]

28. +1

[emulatorloo]

6. Good OP. Most everyone here will agree with what you say

Except of course the GOP trolls.

Now the problem I see here these days is not the principles you've laid out. Everybody is on the same page there. Everyone here wants the Patriot Act gone.

It is just that some here where willing to take everything that Snowden said at face value, while others felt some skepticism about Snowden's claims and were waiting for more evidence of the abuse he said was going on (possible for him to wiretap Obama et cetera)

This had led to some pretty vicious name calling and people yelling at cross purposes. So I am less interested in hearing about whether this or that DU'er is a True Democrat or A Nazi.

I would like to see that shit die down so DU could go back to discussion of what to do about this. What is it gonna take to get a full investigation and get the Patriot Act back on the table for discussion?

To me it is gonna take lots of activism - not yelling or name calling.

[kentuck]

7. In defense of both sides...

it is difficult to be calm when you are in the middle of a shit storm.

[emulatorloo]

8. Understood

I had my less than stellar moments.

[NoPasaran]

9. Democrats believe if your pizza isn't there in 30 minutes or less it should be free

[galileoreloaded]

10. democrats yes. Democrats we have in office.....not so much it seems. nt

[Cleita]

11. You have made excellent points and I don't want to distract from them.

But we also used to believe in the rights of workers and unions. Where did that go?

[kentuck]

13. True

[Enthusiast]

20. Thank you, Cleita! I felt the same thing.

The Democratic Party should always consider what a piece of legislation (or agreement) will do to the well being of the American worker. For example, will we be subjected to unfair competition? These things have been ignored and they are why we are hurting.

[LWolf]

29. That belief dissolved with the takeover by neoliberals

in the form of the DLC, "new dems," "centrists," and "3rd way." They use the "Democrat" logo; the call themselves "progressives," and they have made the Democratic Party a corporate tool.

[Brewinblue]

12. Democrats also:

- Oppose war in all cases except where the sovereignty of our nation or our allies is at stake, where the safety of our citizens is in immediate peril, or in cases of mass genocide against innocent civilians;
- Demand that elected officials serve exclusively in the interests of the people, and at the will of the people;
- Always support the rights of each individual to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness;
- Know that corporations are but an artificial creation of law, and enjoy no rights or protections of personhood under law;
- Understand that our nation is built on laws and principles that apply equally to everyone, always; and
- Hold steadfast to these principles regardless of the party affiliation of those in office.

[kentuck]

14. Good points.

All.

[Enthusiast]

21. Well done, Brewinblue! nt

[bvar22]

16. I joined the Democratic party 46 years ago because I believed in THESE values.

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established [font size=3]for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.[/font]

Among these are:

*The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

*The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

*The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

*The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

*The right of every family to a decent home;

*The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

*The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

*The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being."--- FDR, 1944

Please note that FDR specified the above as Basic Human Rights to be OWNED by the Public
and administered by our government of The People,
and NOT Commodities to be sold to Americans by For Profit Corporations.

There was a time, not so long ago, when voting FOR The Democrat was voting FOR the above traditional Democratic Party Values.
Sadly, this is no longer true.

I still cling to some hope that there is the possibility for a revival and return to these values that built the largest, wealthiest, and most upwardly mobile Working Class the World has ever seen,
but lately that hope has been growing dimmer.

----bvar22
an old, middle-of-the-road, FDR/LBJ Working Class Democrat for more years than I like to remember.
I am fortunate enough to have lived during a time when the Working Class & The Poor had representation in our government,
good jobs with benefits were easy to find and hold,
a blue collar worker could raise a family and live in comfort,
the Working Class had enough security to enjoy life,
and you could honestly tell your children that they could do better than you.

If we had a Party that represented the Working Class & The Poor,
we could have those things again.
There IS enough wealth in this country to provide that,
but the RICH have grabbed it all up over the last 30 years with the help of their friends in Washington.


I am ashamed of the World we are leaving to the children.


You will know them by their [font size=3]WORKS,[/font]
not by their excuses.
[font size=5 color=green]Solidarity99![/font][font size=2 color=green]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/center]

[pampango]

17. Well said, bvar22. n/t

[kentuck]

18. Good points.

Thanks.

[Enthusiast]

24. You always say good stuff.

[woo me with science]

25. Thank you for this reminder

of how desperately far this party has been wrested from its principles.

This frog is not just warming up anymore.

[KoKo]

19. Good Points...but it's grown thin...and few believe that stuff, anymore...imho.

[Enthusiast]

22. Kicked and Recommended!

Wonderful thoughts and suggestions, kentuck!

In this, "They believe in human rights and do not support torture under any circumstances, as a general rule." I would remove "as a general rule".

[Savannahmann]

23. Agreed absolutely

Nothing more needs to be added. If we could get back to those, it would be a better party, a better nation, and a better world.

[midnight]

26. Thanks Kentuck.... K&R

[woo me with science]

27. This is still true

of Democrats in their homes across the country.

In government, we have mostly pod people now.

K&R