The security state will continue regardless of which party is in power. Let's focus on the things

[apples and oranges]

we can actually change!

Instead of wasting time on activities that have been going on since the 70s, can we focus on the surprisingly fast erosion of other rights that we've fought hard to get? If we lose the next two election cycles, EVERY progressive achievement will be evaporated. Every single one.

We lost the government-privacy battle decades ago. Americans grow up with the expectation that the government is watching and listening. I know it's hard to accept, but your neighbors want the country to be protected and don't mind data being collected. They also resent classified info being shared with foreign countries. Ask around, you'll see.

[Puzzledtraveller]

1. What the hell is this tripe?

[Democracyinkind]

2. In the Bush years...

You would have been chased off of this site for posting something like that.

How things change.... ("chased off" is hyperbolic, perhaps... people would have surely given you flak for it. I'll be back to see what other people are replying to this.

Generally, I am not a fan of the "roll over and take it" argument...

[Octafish]

3. The problem started Nov. 22, 1963.

Love Field, Secret Service agent Don Lawton reacts after being ordered OFF the bumper of president's limo.



It's been pretty much wars for profit ever since.

[Waiting For Everyman]

6. Thank you! The forgotten coup.

We started to get back on track at the height of Watergate and the Church Committee years, and dropped the ball. We never got the reform done, and it still needs doing. And of course so much added to the 'reform needed' pile since then.

[bemildred]

4. Nice try. nt

[cali]

5. what a steaming pile.

First of all, the Patriot ACT and the FISA Amendment ACT of 2008 put the security state on steroids.

Patrick Leahy has introduced legislation limiting some of the most egregious lawful practices.

[Waiting For Everyman]

7. I don't care what my neighbors think, I mind global data being collected.

Government battles between the rich and the common people swing back and forth in cycles. That doesn't mean that just because we are at a low point now, we accept that as the norm, and inevitable. No, it isn't. It's high time for the pendulum to swing back now.

We have to attack this beast's blood source -- money. Limit money going to the top, and the monster will shrink back to a manageable size. Easier said than done, but that's all we have to do, to enable the rest getting done.

But little irrelevant fixes on the edges won't make any difference, it's a waste of time.

[Egalitarian Thug]

8. You honestly don't see the utter futility of your proposal, do you? n/t