They Cried “Wolf” About Benghazi and the IRS. Why do you Believe Those F ***ers About the NSA?

[riqster]

Honestly, the rush to judgement is getting to be almost lemming-like. Since we know that the corporate media has it in for Obama, and they've been manufacturing bullshit scandals for years now to try and unseat him, you'd think that DUers at least would have learned not to believe the little boys after they've cried "Wolf" a few hundred times. But nooooooo.

http://bluntandcranky.wordpress.com/2013/06/10/they-cried-wolf-about-benghazi-and-the-irs-so-why-do-you-believe-those-f-ers-about-the-nsa/

[uponit7771]

1. Because many don't know it comes from an Iraq war advocate and a winger. Media kinda

...kept that one under wraps

[riqster]

3. Yeah, funny how those little details get left out.

Frankly, after listening to Snowden explain why he fled to Hong Kong, I have my doubts about him. For the love of God, he actually said that the people of Hong Kong, having a strong tradition of free speech, would stop the Chinese government from extraditing him.

He may not have lost all of his marbles, but there is definitely a hole in the bag.

[pangaia]

14. I love your last line. :>)

Haven't heard that one.
WHERE have I been??

[riqster]

15. I saw it on a Grumpy Cat meme.

Look at SCE's LOL cats thread for this week, I posted it there.

[madokie]

24. And its a big ass hole too

that got a laugh out of me and gave me the energy to finish my weedeating.
fuck a wild man LOL

[riqster]

25. Your response got one out of me too.

No weed eating here, thank the Gods.

[madokie]

27. I hate to admit it but I like weed eating

helps to keep my old bod in shape, plus I get to play with my stihl weed eater toy

[riqster]

30. Back in the day, weed eating meant brownies

My, how the world has changed.

[madokie]

49. Oh yeah

I liked that too
Had some a while back, 6 months or so,) made with some killer and was it ever good.

[G_j]

4. who are you referring to? nt

[uponit7771]

5. Greenwald and a Carlyle Group company

[G_j]

11. that's makes no sense

Greenwald is a "winger"?

[emulatorloo]

13. Technically a libertarian. Was promoting Darryl Issa's talking points on Benghazi not that long ago.

In general, I don't find Greenwald all that credible. Promoting the Benghazi nonsense pretty much was the last nail in the coffin.

That's my opinion, I am entitled to it.

Before you call me a racist-apologist-enemy-of-the-constitution, this is pretty much where I am at:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022983101

Serious story, serious issue.

[G_j]

16. I was replying to a different poster

but yes, of course you are entitled to your opinion.

[emulatorloo]

18. Of course.

[Luminous Animal]

28. Technically! A weasel word in this context. You have no evidence that he is one so you just

throw it out there and hope it sticks.

[emulatorloo]

52. You are right, Darell Issa is a weasel

[Hissyspit]

51. He's not a Libertarian.

[emulatorloo]

58. OK

[msanthrope]

26. Ahem--Greenwald had no problem wiretapping for Matt Hale--

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002101211

[one_voice]

34. huh....

someone should bring that up......to Glenn.

[msanthrope]

36. I think that's why he isn't a lawyer anymore. I'd love to interview

Patrick Fitzgerald about the Matt Hale/SAMs issue.

[Hissyspit]

53. Oh, bullshit.

He caught on pretty fast and turned into one of the staunchest anti-Iraq, anti-Bush critics.

It wasn't kept under wraps. Greenwald has written about it often.

[uponit7771]

56. Bullshit to your bullshit, now the guy is saying he didnt support the Iraq war

http://thedailybanter.com/2013/04/glenn-greenwalds-hilarious-denial-about-his-support-for-iraq-war/

[Hissyspit]

59. Oh, please... Way to distort that guy's distortions.

[Enrique]

2. the GOP supports Obama on the NSA n/t

[uponit7771]

7. ...and the pusher of the story is a warmonger, either way this doesn't deserve the face

...value that it has gotten on DU

[Fumesucker]

19. Hillary Clinton also supported the Iraq war

Unlike Greenwald though she has never backed down from that support.

[Luminous Animal]

29. You don't know the definition of warmonger. Too bad.

[frylock]

47. the GOP supports Obama on the NSA

the GOP supports Obama on the NSA

[DevonRex]

84. Um, Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Glen Beck, Rush Limbaugh ring a bell?

The usual assholes don't.

[frylock]

89. peter king and lindsey graham aren't the "usual assholes?"

rand paul and ted cruz are fucking n00bs, much like the very vocal group of DUers that support this shit who signed up in 2007 and 2008.

[Hissyspit]

55. Greenwald is not a warmonger.

Lots of Dems supported the Iraq War and DIDN'T become staunch critics of it.

"Hey, everybody! Glenn Greenwald trusted President Bush on Iraq!"

"Yeah, you want to know who I found that out from? Glenn Greenwald. When writing about how he became one of our biggest critics of Bush and WAR."

This is getting old.

[Art_from_Ark]

69. Senator J. William Fulbright originally voted for the Tonkin Gulf Resolution

Two years later, he wrote "The Arrogance of Power" in which he became one of the biggest critics of the Vietnam War.

People can and do change their minds about supporting a war.

[DevonRex]

83. Um, Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Glen Beck, Rush Limbaugh ring a bell?

They do NOT support Obama on this. The ones that do, vocally, happen to be on the committees which have oversight - just like the Democrats who support Obama and the programs, like All Franken.

[liberal N proud]

6. The republicans are the ones who started the NSA data collection

And now they are the ones trying to fry Obama for it.

[uponit7771]

10. +1, The leaker worked for a Carlyle Group company but many on DU want to t

...take what he and his warmonger hommie at face value

[LondonReign2]

81. Still waiting for you to answer this

Tell me, since Carlyle is being paid what I can only presume are lavish sums of money to carry out the operations, explain to me how it is in their self-interest to leak information about the secret program which is generating them this money?

[riqster]

12. And a whole lot of DUers are playing chorus.

Even though it's obviously just another "Wolf" incident.

[FSogol]

8. K & R. n/t

[GoCubsGo]

9. I mostly agree.

But, it's not the media that is manufacturing these scandals. It's the House and Senate GOP. The media is just carrying their water for them. That being said, this NSA thing is looking more and more like another manufactured scandal. This leaker guy is making $200 K per year without even having a high school diploma? It just doesn't smell right...

[riqster]

17. Given that the media is owned by those who finance the Reeps, it seems

...that there is little difference between the two these days.

[riqster]

21. Here's a good article

http://thedailybanter.com/2013/06/nsa-story-falling-apart-under-scrutiny-key-facts-turning-out-to-be-inaccurate/

Might help give some substance to your instinctive reaction.

[GoCubsGo]

23. Thanks. I'm not surprised...

The fact that Glenn Greenwald is involved is the biggest red flag of all. Had it been someone like David Korn of Mother Jones, it would be another story. Korn is an actual muckracker, as opposed to a blogger. And, it's sad to see how low the Washington Post has fallen. I used to consider them a respectable newspaper. Not so much now.

[Hekate]

73. "there’s a way to have this debate without selling out to misinformation"

Canonizing bad reporting as a means of inciting a debate is as bad as no debate at all. Attachment to empirical reality must remain a central trait of the left, otherwise the progressive movement is no better than the non-reality based propagandists on the right who will say and do anything to further the conservative agenda.
http://thedailybanter.com/2013/06/nsa-story-falling-apart-under-scrutiny-key-facts-turning-out-to-be-inaccurate/

Another good article at the link. Bonus: I learned a brand-new word. Shpadoinkle.

[riqster]

76. That is truly an epic word. nt

[LaydeeBug]

20. Just Benghazi and the IRS? Shew, try birth certificate, college records, weather tampering

Mother bashing...oh help me if I've left anything out. Those were just off the top of my head.

But the NSA thing does warrant a conversation in post 911 America, and wanting to participate in that conversation is not a detriment to the President. It is an asset.

[riqster]

22. Absolutely, let's discuss

And roll back the Patriot act and all its children. I'm just saying let's get the facts before having that discussion, instead of leaping to conclusions.

[LaydeeBug]

60. The problem is that they've already let the cat out of the bag.

Unless you think "modest encroachment" is apt regarding civil RIGHTS

[riqster]

62. A cat, yes.

The breed and size need determined.

[LaydeeBug]

77. True. nt

[Buzz Clik]

31. BENGHAZI! BENGHAZI! BENGHAZI!

[Fire Walk With Me]

32. Because the 4th Amendment. Because $1 trillion per year is spent on the surveillance state.

Because it is a clear and present danger and it is absolutely out of control:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017124153

[riqster]

33. And, keep in mind, we don't have all the details

All we have now are some disintegrating "news reports". We need solid information and clear heads to undo the Patriot Act and its brethren.

Running around doing the headless chicken dance serves nobody except the Reeps and the Corporate media types.

[Skidmore]

37. ^^^This. nt

[Fire Walk With Me]

40. Truth. And you've given me an idea for an OP, because the surveillance state HAS been proven to be

over-the-top, specifically in regard to their spying upon the Occupy Wall Street movement...

[riqster]

44. Hellz Yeah.

Anything we can document via multiple and reliable sources, hit' em with.

[Fire Walk With Me]

61. Some bits:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022985577

[KittyWampus]

39. In the case at hand, it's about the NSA using warrants to obtain info from tech companies. So wtf

are you talking about…. and btw, I also think it's too large and a waste of money and too easily abused.

[riqster]

71. What I'm talking about are the exaggerations in the "reporting"

Like direct back-door access and all the other since-debunked "facts" that people took as gospel, even after the media has repeatedly proven itself to be a partisan and untrustworthy information source.

[wandy]

35. This has been going on for a long time............

We knew the NSA was a disgrace.
We knew the ill-conceived patriot act was a cancer.
We just sort of forgot about it for about five years.

It is not the NSA scandal that is suspicious.
It is the timing of the NSA scandal that is telling.

Somewhere Karl Rove is laughing his ass off.

[riqster]

38. That seems likely to me, too

That's why I advocate remembering that the Media and Congress have been crying "Wolf" since Obama was running for President the first time. It ill behooves us to jump to conclusions: points like yours need to be front and center in our minds when this crap gets put out by our enemies.

[wandy]

43. And although I will NOT secumb to the republican illness of blind following..........

2014: Get the vermin out of the House.
End the republican menace.

[riqster]

45. Damn Straight wandy.

GOTFV!

[Skidmore]

41. Rove is patting Jebbie on the back and assuring him

that the Bush guys at Carlyle are on it.

[loyalsister]

63. For some Democrats, it's cool to bash Obama

It shows that a person is better than RWers or something.
Knowing that this attitude exists, wouldn't it be absolutely perfect to have his own party perpetuate a scandal? It's a lot less work.

[Gin]

42. When I listened to the Interview...it didnt sound credible.......i knew we were being monitored

After 911......so.....none of this is news....

If he is a plant to discredit the dems......it will all fail....soon.

Is he a pawn or the real thing?

[riqster]

46. The problem with such failures

...is the discord they sow among us. If we would wait a day or three for confirmation before assuming that the Reep-controlled media was handing us truthful information, we'd all be better off.

[frylock]

48. lindsey graham, peter king, and many GOPers (like many DUers) are all cools with this..

Mark Udall and Ron Wyden, on the other hand, aren't.

[alarimer]

66. Enough reason for me to be against it.

I like Glenn Greenwald, unlike many here. I think he does good work. Democrats have their poor little feelings hurt that he goes after "their" guy. Obama's not my guy; I do not support him at all anymore. He promised transparency and gave us the opposite. He can go hell.

But Udall and Wyden have my full support.

[bushisanidiot]

50. There is a republican behind every one of these fake "scandals".

the leaker in this latest issue worked for bush and bought the cheney "mushroom cloud" theory about Iraq HOOK LINE AND SINKER.
sorry, that's a zealous, flag waving right wing republican who is trying his best to help republicans win in 2014.

the entire strategy since the beginning of the year from republicans has been to cast a suspicion of doubt..
that don't think they actually have to prove anything, they just want to make it look like there are lots of
dots that need to be connected so that the EVIL, POWER HUNGRY BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA can be
set up for impeachment.

that is it. that is all there is to this bullshit. it's disgusting that so many left wingers
in the press and folks like jon stewart are totally getting CATFISHED by the right.

[think]

54. Even Al Gore is fooled. How inconvenient....

Al Gore: NSA Phone Records Collecting 'Obscenely Outrageous'

The Huffington Post | By Braden Goyette Posted: 06/06/2013 12:14 am EDT | Updated: 06/06/2013 9:48 am EDT

While Gore is best known for his work on climate change, he has also expressed his concern about threats to privacy rights in the past.

Earlier this year at South By Southwest, Gore decried a creeping government culture of surveillance.

“The government is about to complete this $2 billion facility in Utah that can sweep up everything” from phone calls to emails,: Gore said, according to tech news website Slashdot. “And the Supreme Court just ruled you can’t sue.”

Gore was also outspoken when the media revealed that the Bush administration had been engaging in warrantless wiretapping. The practice "virtually compels the conclusion that the president of the United States has been breaking the law repeatedly and persistently," Gore said in a speech in 2006, The New York Times reported.

Full article:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/06/al-gore-nsa-phone-records_n_3394043.html

http://slashdot.org/topic/bi/sxsw-al-gore-talks-surveillance-culture-spider-goats/

[Hissyspit]

57. Because this isn't the same thing?

Yeah, Benghazi was massive unadulterated bullshit. The IRS thing almost as bad.

[99Forever]

64. Educate yourself.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

65. Thank you!!!

[Lady Freedom Returns]

67. As I have been wathcing this scandal and the others..

I am seeing that we are NOT watching what the Hill is up to.

There was a vote today to cut SNAP, a.k.a Food Stamps. This was in the Senate. One with even BIGGER cuts is to be voted for in the House.

What else is getting voted on that will hurt the 99% while we are not looking?

And it is interesting how all these scandals seem to be tying up the White House.

[pnwmom]

68. +1. n/t

[riqster]

70. ^^^This^^^

[Hekate]

74. ^^^yes, indeedy^^^

[DevonRex]

91. Regarding your last sentence...

Rand Paul is steadily trying to look like he's the good guy in all this. Ted fucking Cruz even jumped in on that action today. Glen Beck did, too, of course linking Obama to Hitler and the Holocaust, saying this program would leave no living Jews.

Meanwhile Greenwald has launched his own personal fundraising at The Guardian. The unlikely leaker was in a 5-star Hong Kong hotel, undoubtedly being watched and followed just because that's what they do there. But hey! Three cheers for FreeDumb and all that internet access China will (not) allow him.

[Hekate]

72. Well, because, you know, Obama failed to give us our...

Last edited Mon Jun 10, 2013, 08:57 PM - Edit history (1)

... unicorns, or something like that. I distinctly remember him promising to breed them at Camp David. And instead he threw the unicorns under the bus. I know it's true because I read it here.

So all this other shit must be true. The man who recently ASKED THE U.S. CONGRESS TO CUT BACK PRESIDENTIAL POWERS is -- well, he must be doing something reprehensible, I am sure of it. Because I read it here.

Good essay at the link, btw. As Mr. Blunt and Cranky sums it up: So, why for the love of GOD, do so many of you keep believing those little f***ers when they cry wolf? Really, people, you should have learned by now to wait for proof before believing the lying wolf criers.


Edited to add: Ratfuckers and the fucking ratfuckers who breed them.

[Lady Freedom Returns]

75. +1

[morningfog]

78. Different fuckers. It isn't all a grand conspiracy.

[riqster]

98. As the Rude Pundit says

"You can't be a motherfucker if you don't fuck some mothers".

Agreed, no conspiracy involved. But listening to any of these fuckers is a bad idea.

[neverforget]

79. Who are these Republicans that are going after the President on the NSA?

All I've heard is that Rand Paul hates this program. The rest of the Republicans in Congress are down with it.

[DevonRex]

87. Um, Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Glen Beck, Rush Limbaugh ring a bell? nt

[frylock]

90. how did rush limbaugh vote on USAPATRIOT?

what legislation is glen beck pushing to vote on?

[neverforget]

93. Does McCain, Graham, Boehner, Cantor, McConnell ring a bell?

Not to mention torture memo author John Yoo. They think it's great.

[davidn3600]

80. Because Bluffdale is not a lie

They are actually building the damn thing.

That ain't no fucking mirage in the Utah dessert.

[Skip Intro]

82. Was the IRS targeting deal disproven or something?

Last I remember reading two Cincinnati agents testified that orders came from DC, rather than what was said by DC, which was that rogue agents in Cincinnati had conceived of and implemented the policy.

This was a policy, by the way, that the IRS itself put out there - they outted themselves in a planned and orchestrated move that included having a planted question asked.

They then apologized for targeting right-leaning political groups.

The head of that division has taken the fifth before Congress, refusing to answer questions about any of the charges.

Please tell me how that all got settled.

[DevonRex]

85. Yes. Nt

[burnodo]

94. so why did Obama apologize for it so quickly?

why apologize at all?

[libodem]

86. What is phoney

Is the sudden interest. This shit has been on going. Everybody knows it. Why act surprised.

[Egalitarian Thug]

88. I don't suppose you remember how that story ended, do you?

[riqster]

95. Of course

...and the fault lay with the wolf cryer.

[Egalitarian Thug]

96. And what does it matter from inside the wolf's stomach?

[riqster]

100. There is another option

That is to listen to someone other than the crier who has been proven a liar.

That solves the problem and keeps us out of the lupine digestive tract.

[HiPointDem]

92. "the corporate media has it in for Obama" = since when?

[lame54]

97. Because of the Patriot Act

[riqster]

101. So you believe the liars because of the Patriot Act?

[sibelian]

99. GOD BLESS THE NSA!!!!

WOO HOO!!!