So, the reports are that's it Meta . . . .

[Stinky The Clown]

That's what I'm hearing about the NSA phone data collection. They're collecting metadata on numbers called to and from. They're "rubbing" that data against the same data for other numbers. And they're "rubbing" *that* data against the same data for overseas numbers from people they're watching/following/spying on. They're looking for patterns, for connections. Once they establish patterns, if any exist, they'll take the next steps and start to listen in.

They claim they're not *now* recording voice from any of these numbers and that all of this is being done under the supervision of a FISA judge. Further, when they start their recordings, they will be back to the FISA court for more warrants.

Does anyone think this is some form of domestic spying that should make you uncomfortable? Is it any worse than all the cameras taking our pictures? Is it worse than TSA sniffing your crotch? Is it worse than virtually all of us having our fingerprints on file in the national database? Is it worse than signing in when you visit an office building or the dentist? Is it worse than the hundreds of other ways in which you give out data about yourself and your doings?

We gave up any right to privacy a LONG time ago when we failed to stop the creeping infringements way back when, that blossomed under St Ronnie and Poppy, matured under Clinton, turned into a torrent under Incurious George, and now seem to be standard procedure under Obama.

As a nation, we either take a stand or we don't. Clearly, apart from a few voices in the wilderness, we have chosen not to.

Let the hand wringing begin.

[hlthe2b]

1. There should have been a line in the sand drawn against these intrusions decades ago & certainly

that damned Patriot Act should never have been passed nor reauthorized. That said, because we are late to push-back doesn't mean we should not do so now...

ENOUGH!

[aquart]

5. My position has always been for total repeal of the Patriot Act.

Then the arrest and trial of Bush, Cheney....

But then, I'm LIHOP.


We all have our dreams.

[aquart]

2. What about downloaded internet data?

Phones aren't just phones anymore. They're personal computers.

Are they "rubbing" websites?

[backscatter712]

3. The term is traffic analysis. It's a huge invasion of privacy. n/t

[elleng]

4. No hand wringing here, Stinky;

NOT worse than ANY of the things you mention; gives govt (very awkward) tools to help look for bad guys, NOT eavesdropping etc etc etc., THAT would come LATER, AFTER they've sought permission from a court, as you say.

[Brigid]

7. And who doesn't believe that the courts will issue the requested warrants,

No matter how dubious the grounds for the request might be?

[elleng]

8. I 'doesn't.'

[spin]

6. Years ago I heard that terrorism would lead to the loss of our freedoms and ...

when that happened the terrorists would win.

[warrprayer]

9. Voyeurs

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[Stinky The Clown]

10. Lest anyone misinterpret the intent of this post . . . .

. . . . . . it is to chastise *every* politician who allowed things to get this far. And that includes Obama, who has been the biggest miner of data, the biggest tapper or wires, the most active dropper of eaves, of all the presidents mentioned.

I fear it is simply too late to reverse any of this.

[okaawhatever]

11. We can stop it, but then terrorist attacks will worsen. Terrorist attacks are being stopped. Many

more are thwarted before they begin. I was at a nfl game years ago and noticed an increased police presence, many undercover, some military looking. My brother in law is the director of criminal research and system analyst for our metro police dept. I mentioned it to him. He said they had intel a nfl game was targeted for a bombing. They could narrow it down to a few based on the info and stepped up presence. The bombing never happened. If that sort of thing is stopped, i'm willing to allow my data to be mined. I just want the three judge panel to issue the warrant.