This probably sounds dumb, but could a drone be flown into the center of a tornado from above...

[Tx4obama]

... while the tornado is still out in the countryside away from houses, and detonate a bomb inside the funnel in order to demolish it ???



I am not a scientist and I do not play one on TV

[HubertHeaver]

1. No

[Xipe Totec]

25. Actually, the answer is yes, you can fly a drone anywhere

Getting it back out in one piece is another story.

As for detonating a bomb inside, a big enough bomb could disintegrate the tornado together with half the state, and then the heat convection would create it's own tornado to wipe out what's left of it.

[Major Nikon]

62. I'm thinking tactical nukes might be the answer

[leveymg]

56. Nuke the tornados. That'll teach the vermits to mess with Texas.

"Just Drop the Big One, Right now." Your choice of delivery system.

[darkangel218]

2. Demolish what? its wind

I don't think you can demolish wind

[Tx4obama]

7. It's wind spinning/turning in one direction forming the funnel, so it seems...

that an explosion in the center would push all the air outwards in all direction and stop the spinning.

[TexasTowelie]

3. It's simpler than that.

Remember the butterfly effect concerning the smallest of details leading to profound effects? I suggest that there is a significant correlation between states along tornado alley and states with Republican governors?

[Politicalboi]

4. Yeah that's it,

Blame it on Obama.

[freeplessinseattle]

5. My first instinct is this is satire...

but with all the armchair scientists today coming up with all sorts of magic solutions, I am not so sure anymore....

[Tx4obama]

6. No, it was a real question. Seems as if the explosion would push all the air outwards and...

break up the spinning of the funnel.

[HooptieWagon]

9. There is probably energy the equivilent of many of the largest atomic bombs in a large tornado.

I don't think an ordinary bomb would faze it in the least.
Theres also the matter of finding the center...clouds overhead, debris blowing around.
Also, given the updrafts and wind, its possible a released bomb would blow upward and be spit out the side before exploding, causing even more damage.

[DCKit]

16. +1 and it's distributed over a huge area.

Nice idea, but you'd end up making the majority of the U.S. radioactive.

[lastlib]

59. wouldn't have to be a nuke......

a good-sized fuel-air bomb could be used......

That said, there would be a lot of problems with the idea. A drone flying into the leading edge of a tornadic windstorm would likely be very rapidly converted into a large unrecognizable agglomeration of plastic, metal, circuit boards, and aircraft fuel--and a loose explosive device; and it wouldn't be agglomerated for very long. To penetrate the cyclone, it would have to get high up OVER it, and enter it from above--which might be doable. But once penetrated, you have the problem of when/where to detonate the explosive. Once in, you're effectively out of control of where that device goes or what it does. Would you want to be the one to set off a sizable bomb over a school, or a house with children in it? I think you get the drift......

[applegrove]

11. I read somewhere, or saw it on the news,

that some farmer somewhere hired a helicopter to fly over his crops on a night when there was going to be a late frost. I cannot remember if it was apples or grapes he was growing but it worked. Hot air from above was forced down and displaced some of the cold air. I think there was a three degree change in temperature warmer. So if that worked why not mess with tornadoes while they are still over farmers fields. It has, I‘m almost positive, already been looked into. I don‘t know if we are at a point in technology where we have such power. And people feel so powerless right about now that I‘m sure it will be written up in the days and weeks to come.

[Jenoch]

57. I was in Arizona

when the owner of a large peach growing operation did something like this with a helecoptor. It wasn't so much as driving warm air down as it was to keep the air moving. The amount of force inside a tornado would really make the use of helecoptors or drones ineffective.

[truebluegreen]

61. OT but I always had Christmas lights in my apricot trees...

they were the earliest to bloom and always in danger of a late frost. The lights raised the temperature just a couple of degrees and were enough to ensure a crop almost every year.

[freeplessinseattle]

13. It does sound like a nice theory, but I have to wonder why no one else

has thought of it? Those with the expertise anyway. If it was possible, I would think it would already be under study.

But of course can't hurt to share your idea with those that might be able to actually do something about it, in addition to us clueless DUers.

[LeftInTX]

53. Deleted. My post didn't make sense

[wercal]

54. I don't know what kind of explosion you're envisioning

But this thing was a mile wide. I don't think any conventional explosive would have any effect.

[MattBaggins]

34. Reflects the American way

Problems can be bombed away.

When we had the BP oil leak, people wanted to use nukes to solve that one as well.

[freeplessinseattle]

35. Exactly! Why is that the instinctive go-to solution for everything?

Some really frightening magical thinking right there. Never mind more likely creating recipes for even greater disaster.

[SQUEE]

50. actually it is just harnesssing the potential of explosive reaction.

The internal combustion engine, core drilling and blasting, the vast majority of day to day explosions have nothing to do with bombs or war.
..nothing magical, and yes it has been tried, and found to be too ineffective and too dificult to obtain any accuracy due to the debris fields.

[uppityperson]

8. I think the problem of it starting at the top would still be there though, would

Simply reform from the top.

[rightsideout]

10. The drone would probably be destroyed

But that probably wouldn't matter if the idea was to carry a bomb.

A vacuum is created inside a funnel cloud. Except I'm not sure what direction that vacuum is. The bomb could be sucked down to the ground and cause more damage on the ground. God forbid it landed on a survival shelter or the vortex or vacuum would catch it and toss it a mile away on someone's house. Probably not a good idea.

Also, above the storm is alot of electrical activity, debris, lighting and I imagine, high winds. Some of the ceilings on these storms can be pretty high. The drone would probably be destroyed before it could dispatch the bomb. And all the electrical activity within the storm could interfere with RF signals for the drone and the bomb. You probably have to fly high above the storm and hope to follow it.

[nebenaube]

55. easy..

The vortex creates a channel between the surface air and the upper atmosphere. The upper atmosphere is a lower pressure. Bernoulli forces create a negative pressure in the channel. Air flows violently from the surface to the upper atmosphere presenting resistance to said bomb. The bomb likely detonates at the top channel due to debris or electrical activity in the atmosphere. On detonation, the channel at the top is deformed, perhaps even obliterated while the channel continues to spin on at the bottom, or not. If it does. then the channel's spin accelerates while reforming due to the presence of even lower pressures at the upper atmosphere, the Coriolis effect and the inertia of the intact portion of the channel.

[KittyWampus]

58. interesting read!

[Tx4obama]

12. I did a Google and found some more 'replies' on the links below

Would a nuclear bomb destroy a tornado?
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Would_a_nuclear_bomb_destroy_a_tornado

Why can't they just bomb in the eye of an hurricane or something?
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110902154651AAkb7RC

Who would win if you detonate a nuclear bomb in a (F6+) Inconceivable Tornado (319 - 379 mph)? Will the tornado still be standing or will the bomb obliterate the tornado?
http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/107150


p.s. But I wasn't thinking about a 'nuclear' one, just a regular one

Thanks everyone

[kentauros]

40. The idea I had the other day

was not to use a bomb, but microwaves. Remember that crowd-control weapon that was developed to induce pain? It's basically a large microwave oven projected into the water in a person's body, heating it up.

Now, to have any effect on a tornado, you'd probably need hundreds of similar projectors, scaled up even higher, and gimbaled so they could be focused to one point or area. Granted, this would also likely be a huge drain on electric resources, but if the goal is to stop a tornado, I'd think most people could live without power for a bit while still living in their still intact homes.

Stopping or converting the convection currents would weaken it, though I don't know enough about that to say one way or the other on the full effect. Plus, it would likely be quite expensive to deploy that many "beam weapons". Then again, if we could convince the RW that the weather is an enemy greater than any brown terrorist, we'd likely get all the funding needed in a heartbeat

[davidn3600]

14. A simple bomb would have practically no effect

The type of blast needed to accomplish what you are suggesting could cause just as much, if not more, devastation on the ground as the tornado itself.

[SCUBANOW]

15. "countryside away from houses", I only hope I not in that countryside.

[newfie11]

17. My thought also. Nt

[Lady Freedom Returns]

18. If it was possible timing would be a problem.

Launching the Drown in time to stop it because many a tornado forms and disparate faster than the drown can take off and get there.

Some tornados will form right on top of cities.

[longship]

19. Yup, but it would have to be a nuke.

Maybe somebody should present the idea to Inhoff.

Sheesh!
:satirical:

[Recursion]

20. There's already too much energy in the air; adding more won't help

Even if you could disrupt the wind pattern, you'd probably end up with something worse.

[chknltl]

21. I've a second notion, equally unenlightend i suspect.

The actual path a tornado takes has to be subject to measurable factors. What those factors are I don't know but I have wondered if micro differences in atmospheric pressure could play a role. If so, could a town or a city deliberately produce enough heat to cause a jump in its local atmospheric pressure forming a sort of shield that forces the tornado to go around it?

Here is how I could see it working. The 'protected town' would have the majority of its roofs painted dark which naturally absorbs the heat from the sun. This heat could be stored and used as an energy source. When a tornado is spotted approaching, that same heat would be deliberately and rapidly dumped back into the atmosphere. This would cause a small temporary rise in the atmospheric pressure over the town. The incoming tornado, seeking the path of least resistance (if that is indeed how they travel) would be forced to divert around the town.

I know it seems silly of me to be suggesting something so simplistic but I suspect that at some point in our nation's future we will be able to deploy a technology that adjusts the environment in order to divert tornadoes away from populace centers.

[JHB]

26. Doubtful. Cities are "heat islands", yet still get hit...

...and tornado tracks don't seem to show any such deflection at round hot spots, as far as I know.

It's also problematic how you could dump enough heat into the local atmosphere fast enough to create the sort of "pressure bubble" you're thinking of, especially on the short notice of a tornado bearing down on the locale.

And even then, in most places you'd still just be redirecting it towards someone else.

[chknltl]

37. i can not disagree with any of your logic

I do feel that there are three options for our future dealings with tornadoes: Change nothing, Change how we live around tornadoes and lastly Change the tornado itself. The OP attracted my attention because it is that third option.

Of those three, changing the tornado seems as far fetched from our perspective as walking on the moon seemed only a couple hundred years ago. Looking to find ways to influence tornadoes may be a fools errand and best left to authors of science fiction stories....but do we really know this??? I don't think that book is written yet.

That said we are aware that tornadoes are being intensely studied right now with one of the goals to better understand what factors of nature control the path a tornado takes.

My thinking is that once we have a better understanding of those natural forces, we may find a simple way to alter those forces and in essence have a useful influence on the tornado, (that third option).

Cloud seeding may not be foolproof but we have had successes with it. It is an example of a third option when it comes to how we can deal with local weather phenomon. Perhaps we may see a time when some form of cloud seeding is used to prevent tornadoes from even forming.

Yeah, that 'heat shield' was pulled out of my butt as was the above example of tornado birth control through cloud seeding. One might argue that the same 'science' concocted the notion that one could maybe blow up a tornado too! That said you must agree that fanciful musings like this reflect 'mans' desire to find better ways to control 'Mother' Nature.....maybe its just a 'guy' thing. ....well some guys. ( )

[telclaven]

44. Don't know about tornados, but for hurricanes

I read a proposal to use a deep water pump on a ship to bring cold water to the surface in the path of a hurricane. The cold water acts as a barrier to the hurricane, causing it to slide off to the side. Keep the storms out to sea instead of making landfall.

[chknltl]

60. Now that seems like a good idea.

We keep hearing how hurricanes are fueled by warm moist air evaporating off of the ocean. With the Gulf of Mexico now warmer than it has been in centuries, we are told that the potential for stronger catagory huricanes are now also increased. Perhaps some of the cooler water from the depths off of Cuba could be brought up and circulated throughout the Gulf cooling it by a full degree or more. This would not divert an oncoming huricane but it could significantly impact its fuel supply. In theory that would lesson the strength of the hurricane. Can you imagine the bennifits if we could drop a hurricane's strength by a full category?

This all begs the question of environmental impact. Most specifically the impact to the area from which the waters were drawn and the impact on natural marine currents throughout the gulf.

[Gravitycollapse]

22. You would need a small nuclear bomb. And then you're dealing with a whole new set of problems.

[olddots]

23. there is a good sci fi movie idea here

We figure out how to control weather then a volcano trashes us all or the weather controls get into the wrong hands .

We can get the dopiest Baldwin brother to play the hero and the drone drops him into the center of the tornado --nothing happens but we won't have to sit thru anymore of his movies.

[LunaSea]

24. Forget explosives.

Think microwaves, or some other directed energy. Perhaps even a sizable parabolic mirror in orbit could focus the right amount of heat to an exact location to disrupt formation.

IF you knew exactly where and when to put it.

But knowing when & where AND being able to deliver such a force would likely be far more difficult than hitting a missile with a missile.

Weather control has long been a topic for SF writers, as far back as 1759!
http://www.sf-encyclopedia.com/entry/weather_control

(not a scientist either, but I often get to work with them...)

[kentauros]

43. I should have read further down in the thread!

I just posted something along these lines above

[lapfog_1]

27. Actually,modifying the weather is probably simpler than that

it has long been theorized that if you can reduce the differential between the hot moist air on the ground and the encroaching "dry wall" of cooler dryer air overtaking it... you can cut off the fuel that creates "super cells" that spawn tornadoes.

The problem is time and effect... and what technology to use to create the change (either heating the cold air or cooling the hot air or removing humidity).

Some have suggested microwaves or lasers... some have suggested shooting dry ice or silver iodide crystals (cloud seeding). The problem is getting this to a super cell as it forms and tracking it as it moves...

All very complicated.

And the forces involved (the amount of heat differential to overcome) is massive.

Theoretically possible, but not very likely in the next 20 to 30 years.

[JHB]

28. What's needed is a method to disrupt the airflow so that it doesn't organize...

...into a concentrated funnel. Any bombing enough to do that would cause more damage, and would only be temporary. If tornado-forming conditions exist, a new one might form within minutes.

[trumad]

29. There are better ways...

[liberal N proud]

30. In the most basic terms, a tornado is a swirling wind

What you see is clouds and debris that were caught up in the swirling wind.

Tornado's pick up debris and the fling it much like when you were a kid and rode a merry-go-round, you would slide off from the centrifugal force.

So, if you could drop a bomb in the funnel, where would it go?


Second, there is not enough time from the time these things form to when they do their damage to get a device into the air. They form quickly and do their damage and then disperse. These people had 16 minutes notice and they consider that a lot of time in a tornado.

Instinct is the only thing that saves lives in a tornado.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

31. *****

(Why do people consistently think you can bomb a storm????)

[kentauros]

45. Speaking of Star Trek: Next Generation,

they also had weather-control, using their tractor beam technology. Now, if we could somehow develop that tech, just set up projectors all across the country, for the cost of, say, your average Middle Eastern war, and we'd be set for life!

[kentuck]

32. I live on the front range of the Rockies...

In southern Colorado, we have dramatic drops in temperatures sometimes when the winds come over Pikes Peak. In the wintertime, we sometimes get winds from the south called Albuquerque "lows". That is when we get our biggest snows. Also, the counter clockwise winds push eastward into Kansas and Oklahoma and sometimes over into Missouri and Arkansas and other states, creating blizzard conditions.

In the spring and summer, when the colder winds come over the mountains, the counter clockwise winds circle the front range and move out into Kansas and Oklahoma and other states. Because the temperatures in these states are usually quite a bit higher than the front range or the cold front coming their way, the change in temperatures creates unpredictable weather, including tornados. The weather is predicated on what comes over the Rockies.

[Roland99]

33. Easy fix, really.....

If all we need is hot, moist air, just send all the rwingnut talking heads into a plane ahead of the storm, open the windows, have them start bloviating.


problem solved.

[cbdo2007]

36. Better idea would be to have superman fly REVERSE of the tornado to change wind the wind speed

and slow it down.

[RebelOne]

38. All types of weird things have been tried on hurricanes,

and nothing has worked. You just can't fight against Mother Nature. She always wins.

[NCTraveler]

39. You, my fellow duer, are a true American. nt.

[geek tragedy]

41. Glenn Greenwald: Obama admin violates tornado's due process rights. nt

[reformist2]

42. +1. I love creative thinking.

[hunter]

46. Wind turbines, that's how!

Switch them from power generating mode to giant blower mode, opposing the rotation of the swirling winds.

And if you want to create a tornado, you simply turn your blowers in the opposite direction.

(Evil megalomaniac scientist laugh...)

[CJCRANE]

47. I was thinking about that too...

Not necessarily a bomb but something to stop the flow of air.

I wonder if there's a way to create an artificial tornado in a lab/wind tunnel and test out ideas?

[datasuspect]

48. only if bruce willis is the pilot

[Tommy_Carcetti]

49. And only if we can get a sappy Aerosmith ballad in the credits. nt

[pinboy3niner]

51. And instead of a bomb, drop blowhards like Bachmann, Palin, Gohmert, etc.

That oughta do it!

[Horse with no Name]

63. I found this on a weather site today...

"The National Weather Service gave it the top-of-the-scale rating of EF5 - which means it has the most violent winds on Earth, more powerful than a hurricane.
And the one yesterday was literally a perfect storm....
There must be humidity for a tornado to form, but too much can cut the storm off. The same goes with the cold air in a downdraft: Too much can be a storm-killer.
But when the ideal conditions do occur, watch out.
Yesterday's tornado dwarfed the power of an atomic bomb.
Several meteorologists used real time measurements to calculate the energy released during the storm's 40-minute life span. Their estimates ranged from 8 times, to more than 600 times, the power of the atomic bomb that leveled Hiroshima. Their calculations were based on energy measured in the air and then multiplied over the size and duration of the storm."

[freeplessinseattle]

64. Great points, thanks! eom

[LWolf]

65. You could get a drone in there, maybe.

The ALTUS, perhaps. It can fly damned high.

I don't know anything you could do from within that tornado to shut it down.

[Dash87]

67. I don't think so, unless of you're Dean Cain of course.