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Sat Apr 27, 2013, 04:27 PM

Baby taken from parents who wanted 2nd doctor's opinion

SACRAMENTO, CA (KXTV) - A Sacramento family was torn apart after a 5-month-old baby boy was taken from his parents following a visit to the doctor.

The young couple thought their problems were behind them after their son had a scare at the hospital, but once they got home their problems got even worse.

...

Anna said Sammy suffers from a heart murmur and had been seeing a doctor at Sutter for regular treatment since he was born. After Sammy was treated for flu symptoms last week, doctors at Sutter admitted him to the pediatric ICU to monitor his condition. After a few days, Anna said doctors began talking about heart surgery.

"If we got the one mistake after another, I don't want to have my baby have surgery in the hospital where I don't feel safe," Anna said.

Anna argued with doctors about getting a second opinion. Without a proper discharge, she finally took Sammy out of the hospital to get a second opinion at Kaiser Permanente.

...

"I was pushed against the building, smacked down. I said, 'am I being placed under arrest?' He smacked me down onto the ground, yelled out, 'I think I got the keys to the house,'" Alex said.

Then police let themselves inside.

On home video shot with a camera Anna set up herself, police can be seen entering her front door on Wednesday.

"I'm going to grab your baby, and don't resist, and don't fight me ok?" a Sacramento police officer said in the video.

"He's like, 'okay let your son go,' so I had to let him go, and he grabbed my arm, so I couldn't take Sammy. And they took Sammy, and they just walked away," Anna said.


http://www.ksdk.com/news/article/377456/28/Baby-taken-from-parents-who-wanted-2nd-doctors-opinion-

The baby was put into care at the original hospital (the one that wanted to do an unnecessary operation).

25 replies, 4485 views

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Arrow 25 replies Author Time Post
Reply Baby taken from parents who wanted 2nd doctor's opinion (Original post)
The Straight Story Apr 2013 OP
elleng Apr 2013 #1
midnight Apr 2013 #2
PDJane Apr 2013 #3
SheilaT Apr 2013 #4
proud2BlibKansan Apr 2013 #12
Fumesucker Apr 2013 #23
proud2BlibKansan Apr 2013 #25
Zoeisright Apr 2013 #15
cali Apr 2013 #5
FarPoint Apr 2013 #6
RILib Apr 2013 #10
jeff47 Apr 2013 #20
silverweb Apr 2013 #7
burnodo Apr 2013 #9
ca3799 Apr 2013 #13
LisaL Apr 2013 #17
jeff47 Apr 2013 #19
LisaL Apr 2013 #18
pediatricmedic Apr 2013 #8
jeff47 Apr 2013 #21
ca3799 Apr 2013 #11
proud2BlibKansan Apr 2013 #14
LisaL Apr 2013 #16
jeff47 Apr 2013 #22
eqfan592 Apr 2013 #24

Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 04:38 PM

1. WTF???

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 04:44 PM

2. I hardly know what to think about what the state of California is doing here. I hope a good

legal advisor has seen this and will come to their aid...

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 04:44 PM

3. Just overreach or police state?

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 04:59 PM

4. Why do I feel that there is something seriously missing in this story?

 

However, leaving the hospital AMA (Against Medical Advice) is one thing if you're removing just yourself, another if you're removing a child. Nonetheless, doctors not willing to get a second opinion, unless the surgery is necessary on an emergency basis, also raises questions.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #4)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 07:50 PM

12. That's part of the pattern.

I rarely even click on these threads anymore.

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Response to proud2BlibKansan (Reply #12)

Sun Apr 28, 2013, 10:13 PM

23. Your OP about gardening tools didn't have all the facts either

Should I stop clicking on your threads?

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #23)

Mon Apr 29, 2013, 09:05 PM

25. If it's part of a pattern, yes you should.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #4)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 09:14 PM

15. Oh yeah.

There has to be more. If parents can withhold medical attention from their children and PRAY about it until the child dies, there's no way this makes sense.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 05:04 PM

5. we'll see, but that story is completely from the side of the parents

 

I'd like to hear the other side.

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Response to cali (Reply #5)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 05:24 PM

6. Agreed...

Child Protection Services has more than they can handle on a slow day.... so it would surprise me that an overzealous case manager could remove a child so easily. There are checks and balances with such a decision.

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Response to FarPoint (Reply #6)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 07:27 PM

10. not the first time I've heard

 

of the state bureaucrats with authoritarian complexes messing up.

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Response to FarPoint (Reply #6)

Sun Apr 28, 2013, 10:03 PM

20. No, CPS is very quick to "pull the trigger"

Think about the incentives they have to work under. If they don't react to a report, and it turns out the kid is abused or neglected, they are raked over the coals.

Sure, they don't have time to thoroughly investigate their cases, but they'll seize children quickly, "just in case".

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Response to cali (Reply #5)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 06:24 PM

7. Ditto that.

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]I feel sure some critical part of this story is missing in this telling.

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Response to cali (Reply #5)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 06:33 PM

9. did you watch the video?

 

Seems pretty clearly a hospital SNAFU

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Response to burnodo (Reply #9)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 07:54 PM

13. I don't agree

The baby is small, underfed (15 ml in a day?!) and has a diagnosed ASD/VSD and patent foramen ovale, and loud murmurs. Tghe mom left AMA (against medical advice). The hospital would be negligent if it did not report her to CPS for a neglect investigation. Hospitals, doctors and nurses are mandated reporters by law. The mom claimed the hospital made mistakes but never said what those mistakes were. Her only specific complaint was about why her baby got an antibiotic.

The video is edited to make the cops look bad, and I have no doubt the parents are scared and worried about doing the right thing, but leaving AMA with a sick baby from a hospital with a questionable excuse is not a good way to show responsible parenting.

You can see part of the baby's medical record in the video if you pause it. That baby is sick.

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Response to ca3799 (Reply #13)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 09:28 PM

17. Nobody, including the parents, is arguing that the baby is healthy.

His mother took him to another hospital.
Doctor in that hospital said it was fine for baby to go home.
Where is the neglect?

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Response to ca3799 (Reply #13)

Sun Apr 28, 2013, 10:01 PM

19. Neglect that was only apparent after they left AMA?

The kid's been seen regularly by doctors for his entire life. How come no previous doctor reported neglect? How come the hospital didn't report neglect until the parents left? If there was neglect, it would have been reported before the parents left.

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Response to cali (Reply #5)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 09:31 PM

18. That's not true.

They have a doctor's opinion from the second hospital that it was fine for the baby to go home with his parents.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 06:25 PM

8. Not sure what to think, we have used police to get kids as well

How sure are we that the operation was unnecessary? Without knowing the condition, I couldn't say if that was true or not. For several conditions, surgery is quite necessary for the survival of the child.

In each case where we have used the police, the parents do lose custody and CPS takes over.

Lot of information missing from this story.

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Response to pediatricmedic (Reply #8)

Sun Apr 28, 2013, 10:05 PM

21. Well, the 2nd doctor said the kid was healthy enough to go home

Either that doctor is grossly incompetent, or the operation was not needed in the short run.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 07:47 PM

11. Too soon to make a judgement... (more)

1)There is a bit of some of that baby's medical record in the report. If you pause the video, you can read it. It says the baby has an atrial septal defect, a ventral septal defect and a patent foramen ovale of the heart. Those can be very big deals. The baby looks small and thin for a 5 month old. Another part of the report said the baby had only taken in 15 mls of formula for the day. That is only one half of an ounce- far too little to sustain a growing baby. The report also said the baby had three wet diapers that day. I would be surprised at that many wet diapers for a baby with a very small fluid intake. The baby is on lasix, a diuretic, and digoxin, a heart medicine. I'm sure the lasix caused the wet diapers, but the baby still needs more than 15 mls of formula.

2) The mother left the first hospital AMA, or against medical advice, with an infant with a heart defect that possibly needs surgery. She said they had made mistakes, but did not say what those mistakes were. She talked only about one specific issue- about the nurse 'not knowing why' she was administering antibiotics. I find this hard to believe.

3)This first hospital would be negligent if it did not report the mother to CPS. They did not know she took the baby somewhere else. All they know is she took an infant in need of hear surgery away. CPS does indeed need to follow up.

4) I found the whole idea of leaving a video camera on strange. Certainly that clip is cut in such a way to make the cops not look so good. Did they just walk in? We don't know that by the way the video is cut. Did they take the baby? Yes. Were they too aggressive about it? I don't know. The clip is cut. But I think they needed to in this case until it is clear that the parents are following up with the baby's heart condition.

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Response to ca3799 (Reply #11)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 07:55 PM

14. Yes. Thank you.

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Response to ca3799 (Reply #11)

Sat Apr 27, 2013, 09:26 PM

16. But she did take baby to another hospital and police/CPS knew that.

The doctor in that other hospital said it was o'key for baby to go home. So what right did CPS have to take this baby?

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Response to ca3799 (Reply #11)

Sun Apr 28, 2013, 10:10 PM

22. Sure, as long as you ignore the entire 2nd hospital visit.

The cops and CPS know the baby was taken to another hospital. They also know the result of that other visit - that doctor said the kid could go home.

Second, the report was "severe neglect", not "we think the baby needs surgery". Yet that neglect was only apparent when the parents took the baby. Which is odd, because the hospital would have had to report the neglect long before the parents left AMA if there was "severe neglect".

Third, AMA isn't severe neglect even if the parents just went home. They're allowed to refuse medical care.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Sun Apr 28, 2013, 10:47 PM

24. CPS is an organization with FAR too little oversight.

Any organization that can simply remove a child from a parents custody needs better oversight, period. That isn't a commentary on this particular case, but on CPS in general.

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