General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsChris Hayes All In continues to drag down MSNBC ratings. MSNBC Primetime sinks to lows they haven't
seen in three years.
http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2013/04/25/cable-news-ratings-for-wednesday-april-24-2013/179524/
Whoever made the decision to move Chris Hayes to primetime and fire Ed (yes, that's what they essentially did, don't buy the story about spending time with the family), either needs their head examine or they are purposely sabotaging MSNBC progressive lineup.
I think it is the latter. Comcast, just needs a reason to switch course. They just about have it.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)at MSNBC, or anywhere else in the MSM.
Too bad. Ed did it well.
Enrique
(27,461 posts)kudos to MSNBC for giving quality a chance.
itsrobert
(14,157 posts)Comcast will scrap the whole lineup. Enjoy it while you can.
brooklynite
(94,548 posts)...when Keith Olbermann?
people are not watching, we have been watching the golden girls in that time slot. Even OReilly said his re-run beats the '8:00 show' on MSNBC.
Chris should have a morning show not lead in for Rachel.
KharmaTrain
(31,706 posts)...why will he be starting a new weekend show starting next weekend? He'll be on for two hours on Saturday and Sunday...sure doesn't sound like fired to me.
And, yes, I've heard Ed talk about him wanting to cut down on all the travel he's done for the past several years and stay closer to his wife who is still recovering from cancer treatments. Don't like Chris Hayes...don't watch. Problem solved...
TDale313
(7,820 posts)itsrobert
(14,157 posts)smack the hand the feeds him. Ed is a professional and the reason he has survived in radio and television is that he is a faithful employee. Weekends is a demotion and this gives MSNBC a little cover to prevent a liberal backlash. MSNBC is being setup to fail.
KharmaTrain
(31,706 posts)He was doing his radio show...3 hours a day followed by several hours to do the nightly show. That's a back-breaking schedule. Rachel gave up her radio gig to focus on TV but Ed's been a radio guy and looks at the TV show as an extension of his radio work, not visa versa.
He can do his radio show from his Fargo home...which is what he did prior to taking the NBC gig. Instead he had to travel from Fargo to Minneapolis to New York every week...that's a lot of travel; especially for someone whose in their 50s. Doing TV is also very time consuming in the production and teamwork. He was having a tough time being able to keep up.
Ed also mentioned that the TV show chained him down from traveling and meeting people...something he enjoys doing. The weekend gig frees him up to do more town halls and public appearances on behalf of unions.
Now where is this "liberal backlash" you speak of? How comes some of us didn't get that memo?? Especially Ed...
itsrobert
(14,157 posts)And that's the story Comcast wants you to believe. I am not buying it.
KharmaTrain
(31,706 posts)...enjoy!!!
Samantha
(9,314 posts)(months before it actually happened) did he (Ed) deny it so passionately?
Sam
KharmaTrain
(31,706 posts)I never heard or saw an article that mentioned the network replacing him. If anything I thought they did a good job trying to accommodate him while he was going back and forth from Fargo. There were many nights his show originated from Minneapolis...but it makes producing the show a lot harder when you're operating from two locations. Ed has maintained that the move to the weekends was his choice...I still hear him on my radio every afternoon and look forward to seeing his new show starting next weekend. That sure doesn't sound like he's been silenced or replaced...
Samantha
(9,314 posts)wanted. But for now, I will give you this:
"Until we get that backstory, all we have is speculation and Brian Stelter of The New York Times. Last November, Stelter reported that MSNBC was thinking about replacing Schultz with Washington Post wunderkind blogger Ezra Klein, drawing a furious denial from Schultz. "If somebody is telling Stelter that I'm going to be replaced, we know that his nose as a reporter doesn't sniff very well," he said on his radio show.
On Wednesday night, Stelter cited his old story, saying Schultz's ouster "has been expected at least since late last year," and repeated that Klein is still the frontrunner for Schultz's spot, along with Chris Hayes and Joy Reid. He doesn't say why Schultz is being pushed out, but in a March 1 profile of Schultz in the Columbia Journalism Review, Stelter tells Michael Meyer: "When MSNBC talks about its brand, it talks about Rachel Maddow and Lawrence O'Donnell and Chris Hayes. It doesn't talk as often about Ed Schultz."
http://theweek.com/article/index/241365/why-msnbc-is-demoting-ed-schultz
and this:
"Happy faces aside, it seems clear this was Schultzs spin and that, in fact, MSNBC had pushed him out of the more far prestigious primetime slot.
No one knows exactly why Schultz was demoted to weekends, but the shift undoubtedly comes as a move towards the young, technocratic image the network has effectively crafted under the Obama administration. As The Week notes, Schultzs bellicose manner is a relic of the Bush era, when progressives were fired up and on the warpath. But now, its likely MSNBC wanted to make room for the youthful, cerebral and mild-mannered Hayes to fill out an evening that also includes young wonk-in-chief Rachel Maddow.
The media world remembers when New York Times media reporter Brian Stelter broke the story back in November that Schultz was likely on his way out of 8 p.m. In return, the fiery host unleashed a flurry of insults at Stelter, accusing him of reporting media garbage and not being able to sniff very well when digging through a scoop."
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/msnbc-fooled-ed-schultz-and-the-media-about-his-future-in-primetime/
and note the remark about the ratings here:
"The switch from Schultz to Hayes marks the next step in MSNBC's transformation into a young network dominated by wonky policy discussions. Another rising star cut from the same mold, Ezra Klein, was thought to have a shot at the 8 p.m. slot and instead might fill Hayes' former spot at 8 a.m. on weekends.
MSNBC is counting on Hayes to surpass Schultz's ratings in the valuable 25-54 demographic; according to the New York Times, of The Ed Show's nightly 1 million viewers, only 249,000 fell in that range. On the other hand, Maddow, the network's top host, pulled in 339,000 pairs of eyes in that range. Hayes' early weekend morning show pulled in 139,000 viewers in that range."
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/msnbc-names-chris-hayes-new-428555
Personally, looking at NBC/Comcast's history, it is all about the money. They have that corporate attitude that any "body" is good enough if they save the company money. Ed Schultz made a cool million his first year on MSNBC and Chris Hayes has only had a cable show for 8 months. How much money do you think this switch saved the network?
Sam
KharmaTrain
(31,706 posts)...these are profit-making corporations and the news division is expected to pay its way. It's the same deal at all the other networks. Ratings are always used as an excuse for personality issues as while Ed's numbers were behind his competition (there was no way he'd ever approach the numbers Olbermann drew in that slot), his ratings had improved...as did the network...over the past couple years.
Also keep in mind Ed, like all the others at the network, have very structured contracts that stipulate when they'll appear...if they were to fire him, they'd still have to pay him off (like Olbermann) and even if they changed his hours they'd have to come up with a new deal. The fact they're having to add a new production staff, I don't see much money being saved by moving Ed from doing 5 hours during the week days to 4 hours on the weekends.
I'm just glad he's still around and look forward to watching him. I also don't mind Chris Hayes. I would suggest he be given some time for his show to hit it's stride. I recall many on DU who panned Ed when his show first appeared...picking on him for being a former republican...and the poor production style of the show. Doing a TV show of this scope is a team effort.
I'm just grateful there's a network that is an alternative to the right wing bile that propagates on other channels...I an remember when no such alternative existed.
Cheers...
itsrobert
(14,157 posts)Ed was going head-on with Bill O'Reilly in that timeslot. Like him or not (I don't Like), O'Reilly is the most popular pundit in cable news. Maddow competes with the less popular Hannity.
Most people in the business, don't compare host in different time slots, they compare them to host in the same time slot on other networks.
Samantha
(9,314 posts)I think that ratings thing is the spin MSNBC chose to attach to it. It is really all about the money, I believe. I think Ed probably had to take a steep salary cut to move to Saturday night, and I think Chris Hayes with only 8 months of broadcast experience in having his own show makes nowhere near what Ed was getting in that time slot. To executives at NBC and COMCAST, it is always about the money. They don't really care what the audience (meaning us) think at all; the more in expenses they cut in production, the bigger their bonuses. Nothing personal, it is just business.
Sam
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)for years. Fact is they have to open up the weekends. That means someone has to draw viewers, either a regular setting forth from the week day line up or new and high cost talent, big enough to draw cold. Either they are never on the weekends or someone has to go first. That's just a simple fact. Add to that Ed's personal priorities calling for a work life that is less demanding and it seems like a solution that would work out for everyone.
The notion that anyone would run a network to fail is a dubious one, as they could simply close the doors, it does not have fail, if they want it closed just close it. No more excuse is needed than you need to sell your house.
They are expanding their lineup to weekends, which needs to be done, should have been done long ago, if not Ed, who? If not him, how?
Tarheel_Dem
(31,234 posts)were said when Keith left MSNBC and Lawrence took over the spot. Then came Ed, and the same predictions were made about him. (Some) people were pissed when Cenk left. (Some) were pissed when the dude who does hydroponic gardens now. And why do you think Ed would lie about his reasons for giving up a daily show?
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)Maybe the magic didn't transfer to week nights. I tend not to watch TV from 8 pm on, since that is my wind down time.
itsrobert
(14,157 posts)But it doesn't transfer to primetime.
DeeDeeNY
(3,355 posts)They thought the younger Chris Hayes is better for younger viewers. Their demographic "experts" think you can only watch someone in your age group.
justhanginon
(3,290 posts)really enjoy the Chris Hayes show. It is nice to get some in depth opinions on what is happening. I do think they should go back to the four guest format. On the weekend shows it seemed he had really good, knowledgeable guests that brought a variety of different perspectives to the subjects at hand. I wish him success and think the show will be tweaked as it goes along.
G_j
(40,367 posts)I think he does more to attempt to educate people on the nuts and bolts of issues than any of the others. Up was an excellent show. I no longer have cable do I haven't seen his new show. Maybe he's just too good?
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)You sure he was fired?
itsrobert
(14,157 posts)Being banished to weekends competing against top notch sporting events (NFL, NBA playoffs, NASCAR, GOLF, etc) is not exactly a promotion.
nadinbrzezinski
(154,021 posts)And my gut tells me he wanted it, since he said such
Save the loyal employee for so embody else...his wife has been indeed quite sick.
NOVA_Dem
(620 posts)itsrobert
(14,157 posts)NOVA_Dem
(620 posts)I don't think Ed wanted this transfer but he's a team player. I know everyone brings up his wife but Ed likes the limelight and being on the weekends for 1 hour initially is a demotion (they're "supposed" to bump him up to two hours later in the summer).
After I read that story on Phil Griffin and how he applied for a job at FOX NEWS and how Tucker Carlson found Rachel and how msnbc was supposed to be Fox-ish I knew MSNBC wasn't liberal in the C-suite.
malaise
(268,994 posts)Ed doesn't want the weekdays.
bahrbearian
(13,466 posts)lpbk2713
(42,757 posts)And he's not likely to return either.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)taken care of whatever he needed. I do miss Ed too though and I think he got mistreated.
RockaFowler
(7,429 posts)And this is a week after the Boston Bombing. The show will bounce back after this. And please do not show just one day. Wait until the weekly numbers are out. As someone who is in TV Research - one day does not make a trend!!
Comcast is not changing this anytime soon. They wanted Chris Hayes there and they will promote him there - as they have been doing. Everyone needs time to work their way into new shows - especially in cable.
Jennicut
(25,415 posts)MSNBC but I doubt it is permanent. CNN is still going 24/7 with coverage about the bombings but interest in that only goes so far and single event news generally has less interest as time goes on from the event. I don't know, I must be in the minority. I prefer Chris over Ed. It is thoughtful discussion. And it is not always flattering to Dems. Chris is one of the most progressive people on MSNBC.
kentuck
(111,094 posts)For weekend political junkies. Average news viewers do not cotton to his deep analysis of the issues. It was a mistake by MSNBC,
Puglover
(16,380 posts)Chris then Rachel. Wonk and wonk.
Ed was different than Rachel and they complimented each other.
I liked Chris mucho on Sat. and Sun.
Now, not so much.
Enrique
(27,461 posts)we seem to be under the impression that this giant corporation is insufficiently attentive to their bottom line.
This is crazy, imo. We should be encouraging QUALITY. These corporations are obsessed with ratings, they don't need our help with that.
MADem
(135,425 posts)AlinPA
(15,071 posts)they know everything about everything. They are arrogant amateurs.
MADem
(135,425 posts)JI7
(89,249 posts)MADem
(135,425 posts)It's like nails on a chalkboard...and when the nineteen year old liberal in the house does the old eye roll and rolls outta the room rather than watch, it's clear to me that they aren't hitting their demographic.
Politicalboi
(15,189 posts)Is switch him with Martin Bashir. He and Rachel are my favorite hosts.
AlinPA
(15,071 posts)loyalsister
(13,390 posts)and does a good job of it. He is far more skilled than an average interview and commentator. We need his expertise where he is. Although, I do wish they would replay his broadcasts.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)Larkspur
(12,804 posts)I've always enjoyed Chris and he has been doing excellent work delving into tough issues in an interesting way. He gives the most thoughtful and heartfelt editorials on air.
Ed has a radio show and I bet a subset of his TV audience was a portion of his radio show audience. Chris never had a radio show. He is a reporter for The Nation, but that forum doesn't allow one to build a personal audience, like Ed and Cenk do with their own shows independent of MSNBC.
I like Ed too, but he has a 3 hour a day weekday radio show that consumes lots of his time and that along with his wife's health is why he supported the weekend shift. He'll have more time to delve into issues and he will be going out into the field talking with average Americans.
I liked Olbermann too, but he screwed himself with his temper tantrums.
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)I understand that he hasn't got the same crowd appeal as Ed, who was excellent in that time slot.
I want MSNBC to keep Chris and let him keep doing what he's doing. I think he's doing an excellent job and getting better and better.
But they also need an "Ed."
trueblue2007
(17,218 posts)femmocrat
(28,394 posts)I don't watch Chris. That sums it up.
Raine
(30,540 posts)I need something with a bit more zip to it, especially at that time. That whole change was a BIG BIG mistake, whose ever idea that was should be fired.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)like Chris Matthews gets two hours.
Whisp
(24,096 posts)Most of the rest of them are actors more than anything, or book sellers. Al is okay, but just barely.
I'd like to know how all the other shows ratings are. I think MSNBC is dropping generally - I think people are wising up to their schtick which is their own personal schtick and that's about it.
I know the First Debate stupidity thing most of the elite there went wild with, made me see those cretins for what they are and aren't.
Response to itsrobert (Original post)
olddots This message was self-deleted by its author.
rsmith6621
(6,942 posts)...We dont need the discussion dissected, parts identified, numbered put back in the body and sewed up.
We just need simple facts that allow us to make thoughtful consideration and form our own opinion on the issues. We dont need a Dr. level explanation and that is why I wont watch Chris.
Larkspur
(12,804 posts)Chris Hayes does an excellent job of explaining the issue that even low info voters can understand. His penetrating insight into issues is important for Progressives and Democrats to understand in order to make good decisions or understand the consequences of our decisions.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)but I have to admit that I haven't watched MSNBC at all since Ed left. It was kind of a tradition around here to turn him on at 4:00 and then go right into Rachel before turning on our local news at 6:00 (I would record Lawrence). Chris just doesn't seem to fit into that time slot for me. Maybe I'm too old. I liked Ed's working man persona. Now it's just wonk, wonk and another wonk.
Chipper Chat
(9,678 posts)4pm - Martin Bishir
5pm - Al Sharpton
6pm - Ron Reagan
7pm - Joy Reid
8pm - Keith Olbermann
9pm - Rachel Maddow
10pm - Lawrence O'Donnell
11pm - an announcer to tell everyone to go to Comedy Central for Jon Stewart
Bake
(21,977 posts)I couldn't watch him when he subbed for Rachel, either.
And I do miss Big Ed.
Bake