Do the practices of Supermax prisons constitute torture and/or cruel and unusual punishment?

[cali]

Under international law they do. Using basic common sense they do.

Nothing much has changed since I posted this in 2006.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2901649

[ProSense]

1. And just think

this report is from 2000, before 9/11.

I. SUPERMAX PRISONS: AN OVERVIEW

There are currently more than twenty thousand prisoners in the United States, nearly two percent of the prison population, housed in special super-maximum security facilities or units. Prisoners in these facilities typically spend their waking and sleeping hours locked in small, sometimes windowless, cells sealed with solid steel doors. A few times a week they are let out for showers and solitary exercise in a small, enclosed space. Supermax prisoners have almost no access to educational or recreational activities or other sources of mental stimulation and are usually handcuffed, shackled and escorted by two or three correctional officers every time they leave their cells. Assignment to supermax housing is usually for an indefinite period that may continue for years. Although supermax facilities are ostensibly designed to house incorrigibly violent or dangerous inmates, many of the inmates confined in them do not meet those criteria.

Supermax confinement, no less than any other, is subject to human rights standards contained in treaties signed by the United States and binding on state and federal officials.1 According to these standards, corrections authorities must respect the inherent dignity of each inmate and may not subject prisoners to treatment that constitutes torture or that is cruel, inhuman, or degrading. Unfortunately, state and federal corrections departments are operating supermax facilities in ways that violate basic human rights. 2 The conditions of confinement are unduly severe and disproportionate to legitimate security and inmate management objectives; impose pointless suffering and humiliation; and reflect a stunning disregard of the fact that all prisoners -- even those deemed the "worst of the worst" -- are members of the human community.

There is no way, of course, to measure the misery and suffering produced by prolonged supermax confinement. Inmates have described life in a supermax as akin to living in a tomb. At best, prisoners' days are marked by idleness, tedium, and tension. But for many, the absence of normal social interaction, of reasonable mental stimulus, of exposure to the natural world, of almost everything that makes life human and bearable, is emotionally, physically, and psychologically destructive. Prisoners subjected to prolonged isolation may experience depression, despair, anxiety, rage, claustrophobia, hallucinations, problems with impulse control, and/or an impaired ability to think, concentrate, or remember. As one federal judge noted, prolonged supermax confinement "may press the outer bounds of what most humans can psychologically tolerate."

Some inmates subjected to supermax confinement develop clinical symptoms usually associated with psychosis or severe affective disorders. For mentally ill prisoners, supermax confinement can be a living horror: the social isolation and restricted activities can aggravate their illness and immeasurably increase their pain and suffering. Moreover, few supermax facilities offer mentally ill inmates the full range of mental health services and treatment that their psychiatric conditions require.

- more -

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2000/supermax/Sprmx002.htm

[Sunlei]

13. about the same treatment as a chained dog or the crappiest dog kennels. if it makes a dog crazy....

[hlthe2b]

2. Supermax in Florence, CO has mainly the "worst" who will (forever?) be solitary confinement &

confined to cell 22 1/2 hours/day. It appears they are allowed no visitors. Is that right? While I've read they aren't allowed access to news(?) from outside, nor to communicate with the outside, I also read that Rudolph has published a book and submitted editorials to local newspapers.

I also know that there is a population that is sent to Supermax, but only in isolation for a year and afterwards downgraded, so that if they behave they may be eventually sent back to a more "normal" prison?

It just seems that so much of what I've read contradicts itself.

Yes, harsh as hell. Cruel and unusual? Maybe, especially if it is true the 'worst' sent there NEVER again have a chance to escape solitary confinement, have visitors, or any outside info/contact no matter what they do, but I'd have to have more (less contradictory) information to judge. That is also not to say I can not imagine that being necessary for some.

[sorefeet]

3. They are IN the cell(tomb) for 23 hours

a day. What do you think that does to the mind.

[hlthe2b]

6. Don't be patrionizing. I am trying to clear the discrepancies as to how inviolable the complete

and harshest holding circumstances. Is there ever a path to move from solitary or not over time (contradictory reporting)? Is there access to visitors (ever)? Again, contradictory reporting. Is there access to outside materials, including news and are they allowed to communicate with those outside the walls. Again, there has been a great deal of contradictory reporting on this.

Leave the condescension elsewhere. I don't doubt the harshness and potentially irreversible suffering the worst conditions may bring.

[pamela]

38. I can't speak for every state...

but the ones I am somewhat familiar with allow a few of things you asked about. Maryland Supermax allows the inmate to have a few books and writing materials. They can send and receive letters. If they have money in their account they can purchase items from commissary, mostly snack foods. Visits are allowed but there are fewer visits than if one were in the general population, I think around four a month. Visits are held in a small room with a glass partition separating the inmate from the visitor with all communication on the phone. Prisons with a general population usually allow contact visits which basically just means the visitor and inmate meet in a large room, with other inmates and their visitors, and can hug briefly across the table at the beginning and end of the visit.

I described what I know from visiting a client and friend in Maryland's prisons, including Supermax, but from what I've read of Damien Echol's experience in Arkansas, they have a very similar set-up.It could, of course, differ by state but I think visits, letters and some reading/writing materials are usually allowed, just heavily restricted.

[dembotoz]

4. alway keeping a person in a cage that person can become an animal

ya get what ya pay for

[Cirque du So-What]

5. Yes

and no amount of protestation to the contrary, i.e., 'otherwise, we'd be mollycoddling criminals' alters that truth. I don't pretend to have the answers, but your question must be answered in the affirmative.

[Sunlei]

7. yes some of their rules and much of what goes down 'under the table' is torture, plain and simple.

people are at the mercy of their guards.

[pipoman]

8. The majority of the inmates in USP Florence ADX

are "disruptive group members". These people have usually been convicted of serious crimes like murder/injury of other inmates or staff, racketeering, extortion, contraband smuggling, conspiring to murder people, and such while in the Federal prison system. They are leaders of gangs like the Aryan Brotherhood, who no matter how locked down they were/are still seem to run their organizations. People think of prison gangs as within individual prisons. The reality is that prison gangs make up a huge network spanning the entire federal prison system. Gang leaders in USP Marion order hits in USP Lewisburg..These, International "terrorists" and "notorious criminals" are who occupy ADX for the most part. Some of the inmates in ADX pride in being there..some acknowledge they deserve to be there..some notorious criminals wish to be there because they are introverts or because they know they are not safe in general population..There is a need for the ADX facilities..

[cali]

9. how is it that other countries manage quite well without them?

[pipoman]

11. The US is different in many ways..

the "melting pot" model is a double edged sword..the prison system is broken...I wrote a long post about my opinion of the corruption within the system..

[Nye Bevan]

15. Why do you say that? Australia has them. So does Europe and Brazil.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermax_prison

The Goulburn Correctional Centre, an Australian Super Maximum, maximum and minimum security prison for males, is located in Goulburn, New South Wales, three kilometres north-east of the central business district. The facility is operated by Corrective Services NSW, an agency of the Department of Attorney General and Justice, of the Government of New South Wales. The Complex accepts felons charged and convicted under New South Wales and/or Commonwealth legislation and serves as a reception prison for Southern New South Wales, and, in some cases, for inmates from the Australian Capital Territory.

The current structure incorporates a massive, hand-carved sandstone gate and façade (pictured above right) that was opened in 1884 based on designs by the Colonial Architect, James Barnet. The High Risk Management Centre (commonly called the 'SuperMax') was opened in September 2001. This was the first 'SuperMax' facility in Australia and makes the Centre the highest security prison in Australia.[1]

[cali]

16. uh, what do you think I'm saying? Am I claiming the U.S. is the only

country in the world that has supermax facilities? Nope. I'm claiming that other countries manage without them. I will claim that the U.S. has the most extensive complex of supermax facilities in the world.

your response was silly. you wanted to make it appear that I said something I didn't. fail, dear.

[Nye Bevan]

17. Sorry, I thought you were saying that only the US has Supermax prisons.

While actually many countries all over the world have them. Now I see what you were saying us that there are countries in the world that do not have Supermax prisons, which I am sure is true.

[Yo_Mama]

30. They don't

Many countries have them, including countries that I don't consider to disrespect human rights, such as Australia and Canada.

If the country's population is small, then their prison population will be small, and they wouldn't need these units. The few very violent prisoners could be dealt with on an ad hoc basis.

Wikipedia's entry has a list of these types of units in many countries:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermax_prison

I was surprised to see that even Denmark and Sweden have small units. Denmark has less than 6 million in population.

If you don't have the death penalty, any country's prison population will have at least a few very dangerous people in it. Some of these people are not psychotic in the normal sense, but they have personality disorders that make them very dangerous. You can't expose other prisoners to these people. There are sadists in the prison population.

I think Canada has a behavioral intervention program involved with persons sent to these units which has had some success.

[alcibiades_mystery]

10. Yes, of course they do

Those promoting them for Mr. Tsarnaev here can't even get their points straight, on the one hand delighting in how "painful" (a fate "worse than death&quot life in a supermax would be, and on the other denying that they are cruel and unusual punishment. Solitary confinement for 30-40 years is cruel and unusual punishment. It's Count of Monte Cristo stuff. And that's why people want it for the worst offenders: precisely because it's so painful. People can't on the one hand rejoice in how painful a punishment will be and on the other deny that that punishment is torture. They like it precisely because they already understand it as torture; they WANT the prisoner to be tortured.

[pipoman]

14. That is as ridiculious as me saying

you don't want supermax prisons because you wish inmates and guards within the system to be murdered..which would happen more frequently if all of the inmates in ADX facilities were integrated into general population maximum security..



These guys are mostly there, the one's who aren't dead...several of these guys are responsible for so much crime including murder within the system that they were successfully prosecuted under RICO. One of these guys told me in a personal interview that society would not be safe if he gets out..I believed him..

[1-Old-Man]

20. What a silly thing to say - you have no idea at all what the poster wants or does not want

Your post is the one that is absurd, you have tried to contradict the previous poster but all you have really done is try to change the subject while calling him wrong. The poster speaks to the very real problem of our prisons, particularly the "Super Max" versions of them, as being little more than torture chambers. You on the other hand bring up some nonsense about the poster wanting the inmates and guards to be murdered - just wild ranting at best.

[pipoman]

25. Maybe try going back and reading

again..Follow the link in post #11, I made myself pretty clear in that post..I think we probably agree..

[KittyWampus]

22. It's quite possible to have maximum security without the having solitary confinement and no access

to sunlight or creativity.

[pipoman]

27. I don't necessarily disagree,

however, most ADX inmates are an extreme danger to other inmates and staff....they have all been in maximum security...didn't work..follow the link in post 11 if you care to..

[CBGLuthier]

34. Ted Kaczynski is in there. Which guards did he kill or what gangs does he lead?

[pipoman]

35. As I said, those there also include "notorious criminals" and "international terrorists"

Kaczynski is the former..Kaczynski is likely happier in that environment than in general population where he would have been dead years ago..I was at USP Florence a few months after he was arrested, before his trial, doing a series of interviews over several days. I had to leave early one of the days because Kaczynski was having a professional visitation (attorney meeting) and they didn't allow anyone else in the visitation pod when he was in visitation..

[Sheldon Cooper]

12. I think that putting an inmate in an environment designed to destroy whatever sanity they

possess is indeed cruel and unusual. Now I'm sure I'll be mistaken for someone who thinks prisoners should be tucked in with milk and cookies every night, but whatever.

[bemildred]

18. Quite. nt

[FarCenter]

19. Why would solitary confinement be cruel?

Solitude is a common practice in many religions.

Many people voluntarily avoid human contact as much as they can.

[KittyWampus]

21. It causes brain damage.

[derby378]

26. We tried that with Eastern State Penitentiary

It was designed, IIRC, by a joint effort between Quakers and Benjamin Franklin. Supermax-style solitary confinement for each inmate in the hopes that isolation would lead to personal penitence and inward transformation for the inmate. But too many inmates at Eastern State wound up going mad.

Administrative segregation has its place in the penal system, but without some sort of mental stimulation (including some contact with people other than guards) to help with the reformation process, it can be dangerous if overused. At least inmates at ADX Florence have some access to TV and radio broadcasts.

[FarCenter]

29. With life in prison, reformation is irrelevant

[derby378]

36. Not even personal reformation?

How someone lives is important - but sometimes, how someone dies can be just as important. If a hardened criminal who's put away for life can undergo a personal reformation to the extent that he can help other inmates as well as those at risk for becoming inmates, that's something in itself.

[FarCenter]

37. Interaction between inmates usually results in prison gangs and more criminality

It also allows them to conspire against the guards.

Give them an iPad and internet access.

[Yo_Mama]

23. It depends on whether they are necessary or not

Some offenders housed at these units are there because they are very violent and very dangerous.

The US is not the only nation to have these types of units.

If imprisonment and segregation in one of these units is imposed not to ensure safety, but as punishment, then I agree that it is a human rights violation.

[cali]

24. No, the U.S. is not the only nation to have supermax facilities

though we have, by far, the most extensive complex of them.

But there are plenty of countries that do NOT use them. They also have violent dangerous inmates.

[Yo_Mama]

31. I don't think there is any country that doesn't have special facilities for certain prisoners

If the prison population isn't too large, they won't need special prisons, but they will have some high security cells within other prisons.

Sweden, for example, set up a small Supermax facility in Kumla prison in 2009:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumla_Prison

It's to deal with people like this:
http://www.thelocal.se/38252/20111231/#.UXah38pu-ls

They do isolate dangerous prisoners:
http://www.thelocal.se/42834/20120826/#.UXah1spu-ls

In the past, some of these types of prisoners have really been isolated on death rows, especially after having been convicted of murders within prisons. As you get rid of death rows, really you just substitute these types of units.

If we don't want the death penalty, we have to have some way to deal with persons who are extremely aggressive and violent.

[cali]

32. Seriously? those comparisons are absurd

Kumla is NOT a supermax prison.

[idwiyo]

28. Yes, its torture, pure and simple.

[closeupready]

33. Yes, I think so.

[brooklynite]

39. Anyone who objects should be prepared to define what is the minimum acceptable treatment

[SlipperySlope]

40. I think that all prisons constitute cruel and unusual punishment.

Prisons barely existed when the Constitution was ratified. The idea of sentencing someone to spend a part of their life in prison as punishment for crime didn't really take hold until well into the 19th century.