Fancy That - Some RW Friends Of Ours Are Suddenly Supporters Of Obamacare

[stopbush]

We're in our late 50s.

My wife was on the phone yesterday with a high school friend who gave her the bad news that her husband had not only lost his job - and with it, their health insurance - but that he wasn't feeling well, went to a doctor anyway and was diagnosed with a terminal illness. He has a few years to live.

The lady was freaking out because she believed that due to his diagnosis, they would not be able to get any insurance and would be facing financial ruin. My wife told her that under Obamacare, her husband couldn't be turned down for insurance. She had NO IDEA about that!

My wife had to hang up. A few hours later, she got a VM from her friend saying that they had gotten on the phone and had, indeed, secured health insurance for themselves. "You must be my lucky charm today" was the message.

These are old friends of my wife who always vote Republican, and who have in the past made mildly denigrating remarks about Ds of all sorts - Clinton, Obama. They're of the "we hate all those moochers" crowd, as both of them have had very long and successful professional careers, no kids, and a bank roll that allowed them to travel the world.

But when it all came crashing down for them - as it has for so many "moochers" in this country - it was Democratic policies that threw them a lifeline.

Fancy that.

[napi21]

1. I hope they relay that message to their other RW friends!

Things always work this way. When something doesn't affect YOU, you denegrate those who do benefit as users, moochers, etc. But when it suddenly hits in YOUR HOUSE... they realize just how wrong they were.

I think the same thing happens when people who "hate, mistrust," specific groups like blacks, LGBTs, ME's, Indians, etc actually work with them, or get to know them as neighbors, they suddely realise that those people really are just like me!

[ellenfl]

25. forget about the relay! let's hope they remember the help when times get better. eom

[Ikonoklast]

60. They won't. When it comes down to their turn in trouble, it's "I earned it!"

Everyone else in need of assistance is a moocher, a scammer, lazy, shiftless, undeserving...only Republicans have "earned it."

[wryter2000]

2. I guess they haven't had to face the death panels yet.

I'm sorry about their disasters, truly, but why is it that people can't get a clue until something happens to them personally?

[AAO]

6. Lack of something most of us take for granted - empathy for people you don't know.

Sad but true...

[wryter2000]

13. The sad thing is there are so many people like them

The only way you can vote Republican is if you're lacking in empathy.

[AAO]

28. I really believe it's as simple as that

[laundry_queen]

46. I agree. nt

[The Wizard]

48. With pain

comes awareness.

[mercymechap]

3. Nothing new here, but I wonder if that will

make them realize just how uncaring their party is? I also have a Republican acquaintance whose daughter was affected by Katrina, and she was so happy that her daughter was going to receive government aid, because the daughter lost everything, didn't have apartment insurance, is divorced and has two kids. Thank God for Democratic policies that provide this sort of help - but I don't think she even thought of that, because in their minds, they are deserving, other people are just moochers.

[AAO]

29. Reeducation camps may be needed if this gets out of hand.

[Nay]

58. Yes, they will feel that they are deserving, and others are moochers -- we had next-door

neighbors who had a severely disabled daughter in a state institution - completely cared for by the state -- and they thought that was fine, but anyone else, they're just bums. Yes, they still voted Pub. It never fazed them to take, take, take, and then disparage others.

[thesquanderer]

4. I thought no turn-down for PE conditions starts Jan 2014?

...and also, under current law even before Obamacare, PE conditions were okay if you had no lapse in coverage... which meant that the problem wasn't that someone who lost coverage due to a layoff wouldn't be able to get coverage, but rather, that it might be ridiculously expensive. I was under the impression that there's no change in any of that until Jan.

[City Lights]

8. Same here. nt

[freshwest]

21. I don't think so. We have a member here with cancer who was kept on because of the ACA last year.

She was terrified the USSC would make it unConstitutional. Her doctor said they would have to stop treatment if it was thrown off as she was approaching the limits of her company insurance. I wish I could remember all the details, but she was not the only one here to relate the benefits to their families. We went through many, many details last year before the USSC case was decided here. Most of those posts were by ProSense and the threads were loud and long. Medicare for myself - I can only afford the basic, grandfathered version - has gotten better but I don't use it really. I don't have any other insurance and don't qualify for Medicaid but many I know who do have that are better covered. I've known some GOP who finally retired early and were pleased to finally get Medicare instead of the very expensive private plans they had. I've never seen them look more relaxed, knowing that the fighting for healthcare for them and their families was over.

[bvar22]

11. You are correct, for adults.

The PE Exclusion for children was nixed immediately,
providing the family had the funds to cover the Buy In price of these rather pricey policies.
No CASH = No Insurance.

After 2014, no insurance company can turn down a child or adult due to a PEC.
Depending on the financial situation of the applicant,
they will either be covered under the Medicaid Expansion,
or Mandated on to The Exchange.

[pnwmom]

49. For people up to incomes of $88K, there are tax credits

that will kick in in January 2014. The government will pay its credit directly to the insurance company.

So it's not true that the policies will be "pricey" for everyone.

[Bette Noir]

42. You can keep the SAME coverage under COBRA, for a limited period of time.

After COBRA runs out, you're at the mercy of the system. Our state (OR) has a high-risk pool for people who can't get insurance on the open market. I think it may have been put into place as part of Obamacare, but I'm not sure. It costs a fortune, and doesn't cover everything, but, in a bad year, it's a lifesaver.

Yep, as long as you can afford $30K/year for health care, that high-risk pool is a dandy.

I'd retire to Canada, but I couldn't pass the physical.

[pnwmom]

50. Next year the tax credits will reduce payments for people with incomes up to $88K. n/t

[stopbush]

45. You may be right. I heard things second hand from my wife.

It could be that he had opted not to take a COBRA, got the bad diagnosis and thought that was the end because he now had a preexisting condition. But you get 45 days to accept the COBRA. You pay the premiums backdated to the day it would have started. As long as he was within that window, he could get insurance. That would qualify as having uninterrupted insurance coverage.

Beyond that, most health care plans cannot impose a pre-existing clause as long as you don't have over 61 consecutive days of not having insurance while between policies.

I think that maybe my wife mentioning Obamacare got them off their butts and making some phone calls to health providers or maybe his ex-company's HR department to discuss options, and that they found out that they did have options besides financial ruin.

[leftstreet]

5. How can he afford insurance if he lost his job?

That's great news for him, but they must still have some decent income?

[mwooldri]

37. If things are desperate after termination,

it is possible to withdraw any retirement funds or 401k funds since employment has ended. There is a penalty for earlier withdrawal but sometimes decisions have to be made, like liquidating your retirement assets - providing there is anything to liquidate. However there is a clever way - roll the funds from the retirement account to a HSA account. Under certain circumstances the funds in a HSA account can pay the insurance premiums.

[stopbush]

56. How can anyone afford a COBRA if you're out of work?

It costs you double what it cost you when you were working because you also have to pay the half that your employer was paying.

We're currently on a COBRA, but it's because my wife left her job at JCP to work elsewhere. The new place doesn't have health insurance benefits, so she took the COBRA from her old job. That runs out in January. Hopefully, I'll get a job with benefits before then and we'll switch over to that insurance.

[Gman]

7. Tell her luck had nothing to do with it

It was a lot if hard work by a lot of people.

[calimary]

9. Definitely. Do it gently, but seems to me a teachable moment has arrived.

And ABSOLUTELY offer a gentle reminder, as so eloquently put in the OP:

But when it all came crashing down for them - as it has for so many "moochers" in this country - it was Democratic policies that threw them a lifeline.

Offering gentle help connecting the dots will always be beneficial. NEVER a bad thing to have the veil (and the wool) lifted away from the eyes.

[freshwest]

22. Well said. For those who are big on private everything, I've let them know that in such systems as

Medicare, SSA, etc., that we are the shareholders and have more to say about things than with private insurance. It's nice to see that little light bulb light up over their head when you put it in the language that they understand.

[Swamp Lover]

10. Let them know that we voted for Obama because we love our country....

...and our countrymen!!!!!

[SemperEadem]

12. the thing is...

people like your wife's friend always have the attitude that there are "moochers" because given the same circumstances landing in their lives, mooching would be exactly what they would do. It's called projection.

It never crosses their minds that most folks who need Obamacare need it for exactly the very same reasons that they do at this moment in their lives--the difference being that now, they have to join the ranks of those who've been tossed on the garbage heap of society to shift for themselves and they're finding that just like those they've denigrated in the past, they would far rather have a job that paid enough for them to afford their own insurance so that they could face catastrophic illness costs without being turned out of their lives in exchange.

It's not news what the Affordable Care Act involved--all anyone had to do was to do a google search on it and go to the website and read up on it. No, the lucky charm is that the AFA exists for people like her; all she needed to do was to stop drinking the RW kool aid and being hateful... but karma is a you know what...

[lexw]

14. I know someone (elderly now) who refused to pay her yearly fair share...

...you know, one of those who say it's unconstitutional. Now said person, after having been out of work for a long long time, is on welfare.

[Downtown Hound]

15. Don't mean to insult your friends

Well okay, maybe I do a little bit, but I don't mean any disrespect. It's just that they sound like typical Republicans to me. They don't give a shit about anything or anybody until it affects them personally. Rather than welcome people like that to the light, I want to smack them upside the head for making us all suffer and fight so hard for things that should be a no-brainer.

Glad they got their health care. Too bad about the millions who have already died because they didn't have that luxury thanks to people like them.

[Skittles]

20. CORRECT

it's like they lack the empathy gene

[Jack Rabbit]

16. Colbert's Law strikes again

Reality has a well-known liberal bias.

[BlueStreak]

17. I hope they did get insurance. But I'm not so sure about this.

When terminated from a job, you have 18 months of COBRA. My guess is THAT is what they got, and that has nothing to do with the ACA.

I'm not sure that ACA guarantees them they can get a policy with a pre-existing condition like this. The ACA does have some support for high risk pools. And I think once the exchanges are in place, a person with pre-existing condition can get a policy through the exchange. but until then, I'm not so sure. Maybe somebody can educate me on this.

[TxDemChem]

24. I think you're right

But it may be an issue of what to do after Cobra expires next year. Sounds like they have the money for Cobra right now.

[Tanuki]

27. Unfortunately, the federal pre-existing condition program created by the ACA

recently suspended enrolling new members.
https://www.pcip.gov/

[BlueStreak]

38. Egads !! I didn't know that

And I am still unclear whether participation in an exchange means that insurance companies have to take all comers. I was thinking that the ones with expensive per-existing conditions might still have to go into a different high-risk pool.

Notwithstanding these details, I still think the big point stands about "Obamacare". Without that, we know exactly what this family faced. Assuming the husband survives 2 years. they could get 18 months of COBRA. and then they would be dumped on the street with absolutely no options. Absolutely no doubt about that. None whatsoever. No insurance company would cover them. As a practical matter, they would need to spend the next 18 months transferring assets to the wife, and then they would have to get divorced in order to avoid financial ruin for her. That is the Republican plan. There is absolutely no question about that. As Alan Grayson says, the Republican plan is to die quickly. This is a perfect illustration of that.

We may not have all the answers, but dammit, we are trying -- and without us, this woman's live would end in a shambles.

We should be telling that story every day.

Regarding this woman, I hope this becomes an epiphany for her. And if everything works out, the exchanges will be up and running before the COBRA runs out.

[closeupready]

57. "why has it been suspended" - 'because it's too expensive.'

That's essentially what the notice indicates on the website. LOL Imagine that.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

18. I know someone who STILL rails against all things "Liberal",...

.....even though he's on Social Security and Medicare.

I pointed out those were Liberal ideas and the idiot didn't even know they were government programs.

This is what we get for electronic deposit.

They used to have to take this into the bank.

[DeSwiss]

19. Good for them.

I'm happy that they found out some of the truth. And some insurance.

But IMO, they seem to me like many Americans today, having no idea why they hold the political (racial, gun ownership, etc.) views they do. Most of them having gotten their attitudes and beliefs as the rest of us did - from our parents and relatives (some us got the better deal there from the start). Which is also why they're so hard to let go.

But some of us didn't stop there with our folk's view of the world as sacrosanct. Some do stop there and go little further. Those who never exceed what they learned as children and young adults from their parents, well they're what we now call TeaBaggers. Critical thinking isn't a strong suit. Fear and emotion-based instinctual reactions are.

The good side of all this is that like reformed smokers, reformed Republicans can be the best ally for Progressives. And absolute hell on their old buddies for still being so thick.

But that only happens if they learn the truth. It rarely happens voluntarily, as in this case. So maybe there is a silver lining for (some) dark clouds.

We should spend more time trying to do more to find commonalities with all people, rather than knocking them for their lack of intelligence, prejudices and lack of understanding. It would show true understanding and more importantly, compassion, on our part for our fellow man -- no matter who they are. It's got to be that way or nothing works. Not for long, anyways.

As many more of us will be finding out over the next few days and weeks -- it ain't easy to discard decades of beliefs. Especially when we have little to put in their place once discarded. All you need to know is: ''The answers you need can only be found inside yourself.''

And that's exactly what must happen if we are to evolve......


[center]

''Changing one's response to the story's narrative, is how the story is changed.''

[/center]

[southernyankeebelle]

23. Sad thing is this is how it always goes. I hope you remind her that dems feel we want

to help everyone and lifting all boats helps everyone. Not just the rich.

[zipplewrath]

26. Old joke

You wanna turn a democrat into a republican, rob 'em.

You wanna turn a republican into a democrat, fire 'em.

I guess these days it'd be "fire 'em and take away their health care".

[BlueStreak]

39. Health care really is the key

The couple in question was reasonably affluent, it seems. People in their situation can make plans for just about anything. They can live in a gated community. They can hire their own security and fire services. They can plan their assets so they live well the rest of their lives.

But the one thing they can't plan for is a medical situation that costs hundreds of thousands -- or millions -- of dollars. The way we did health care before the ACA, One unlucky diagnosis can wipe out all the assets of a couple that has even 5 million bucks in the bank.

A heart arrhythmia that requires a few days in the hospital can cost 100 grand easily, and that's a relatively minor condition.

It truly is only the 0.1% that are safely above the reach of health care bankruptcy.

The only real difference between Republicans and Democrats is that Republicans can't anticipate it or empathize with it until it happens to them personally. Republicans see some of our neighbors suffering and their first instinct is "look at those takers." Democrats see some of their neighbors suffering and say "there but by the Grace of God go I." (Or a non-religious variation on that theme -- you get the point.)

[Flying Squirrel]

30. Fancy that. n/t

[Honeycombe8]

31. My rightwing Dad sure loves his Medicare! He doesn't think of it as a "govt entitlement"

program. Those are things that those leeches are on. Not him. Not his Medicare. Or his Social Security. His Democratic Party programs.

[Mr.Pain]

32. Under Obama care you'll get insurance...

but will you get better healthcare at more reasonable prices?
Insurance does not= health care, they are 2 (TWO) separate industries.
Obamacare simply guarantees that the insurance companies will be stronger than ever.
I know this may seem like a flaming post but I would rather pay a health care tax to my state than INSURE big profits for corporations that are not even in the health field.

[Kennah]

33. Not flaming, and you are making valid points ...

... however, the entrenched anti-Moocher mindset that the OP speaks of in GOOPers wasn't going to accept real universal healthcare. "Don't cha know, that's just Commonism".

ACA does put us on the road to universal healthcare, and over the next 10-15 years, it's going to start to sink in with GOOPers.

[Mr.Pain]

34. I used to think that insurance was a socialist ideal.

Until I realized that a few people were getting rich off of it.

[just1voice]

35. Not surprised at all that repugs like for-profit health insurance

Fancy that.

[SheilaT]

36. I am so fucking sick and tired of people like this.

Okay, you don't want Obamacare? You don't get it. Period. You get the health care you think everyone should get, which is basically, "You're on your own."

[mick063]

40. Now if your friends could only grasp one level better

and realize the benefits of single payer.

As it is now, the "tit for tat" battle over escalating health care costs are being waged between insurance companies and the health care companies at the expense of all the rest of us.

It will take years to sort through ALEC's "model legislation" to get our nation's ills (such as health care) squared away. Enlighten them about that as well.

[area51]

51. +1

Regarding the OP, think of how happy they'd be if we had transitioned to single-payer, and bankruptcy wouldn't be a possibility.

Bankruptcy is still a possibility under GingrichCare.

[juajen]

41. Having been diagnosed with a terminal condition,

he should immediately apply for disability. While there is a waiting period, maybe six months, medicare would kick in. He will be fully covered. This would, however, not apply to her unless she, too, becomes disabled. If they have children under the age of 18, their children will also be eligible for funds. It used to be $500 per month per child, but I do not know what this is now. Why do people not know about ss benefits for people who can not work and/or are diagnosed with a terminal illness? I don't get it. It's not a foreign language. Thousands of people would be devastated without this coverage.

[Bette Noir]

43. The waiting period is two years.

[tex-wyo-dem]

44. Interesting how that happens, eh?

I've had a few RW acquaintances over the years who have experienced similar epiphanies. It usually involves said RW acquaintances railing against whatever "socialist" program they want, but when things turn south for them, or someone close to them, they suddenly change their tune.

What drives me nuts, however, is how the RW loons support politicians that cut budgets for social or other government programs (ex: FEMA) and then complain when they need the service and it's slow or insufficient. Gee, maybe it's because they supported politicians who cut the budgets...DUH...and THEN they use that experience to justify their view that government doesn't work

[grahamhgreen]

47. Imagine everyone being covered always, imagine Medicare for all.

[freeridemro]

52. Like they say "There's no atheists in foxholes"

There's no RWers on their death bed

[DFW]

53. Let me guess--despite it all, they will still vote Republican

Right?

[Javaman]

54. the usual republican reaction, "It only matters when it happens to me"

And the real lucky charm in this situtation? Obama, he's the one that pushed this.

[SHRED]

55. you nailed it

I suspect that if a "2nd Amendment solution" type lost a child at Sandy Hook they would change in a heartbeat.

[NoMoreWarNow]

59. THAT is awesome

[DissidentVoice]

61. Losing insurance

Right-wingers seem to think that they can never lose their insurance/health care.

One of the most bloody irritating things to me is when they get on their soapbox and preach "take care of yourself and I'll take care of myself...it's not my job to concern myself with your health care."