Okay, I'm going on record. Jokes about the Boston bombing and certain political figures: Not funny.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

Had no one died or been seriously injured, I'd say joke away. But with 3 dead and 145 injured: Too soon. Way too soon.

Give it a year. Or two.

Or five.

And while the joke is bad enough, the amount of Rec's it receives? Not really DU's proudest moment.

Sorry, don't mean to interject with this, but being that there's no more Meta.....

[Tom Rinaldo]

1. There are better things for people to show how clever they are by joking about. Much better n/t

[still_one]

2. That you even have to mention it is sad

[get the red out]

3. Disgusting

I'm glad I haven't seen that one.

[Cha]

4. I agree.. thanks for going on record.

It's stupid and heartless.

[lunatica]

5. Humor is used as a way to cope with tragedy all the time

I just came back to DU for the first time since the bombings happened so I haven't seen any 'joke' threads, but I do understand how humor is a factor in dealing with a tragedy. It can be and is a release from the feeling of a broken heart.

No one thinks the bombings are funny or that dead and severely injured people are funny.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

8. If you are one of the people actually affected, that's one thing.

Might take the edge off a situation.

But for someone who presumably wasn't there, it's just out of place and, well, tacky.

[lunatica]

13. You make a good point

And I was referring to a particular family tragedy. You're right, of course.

[OnyxCollie]

6. It wasn't even a joke.

Let me put Paul Ryan and Sarah Palin next to a terrorist bombing. Isn't that funny? No? What if Paul Ryan jumps over the dead kid, is it funny now?

[bluedigger]

7. People cope with tragedy in their own way.

I suggest you cope by using "trash thread" as needed.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

9. It's how such a "joke" reflects on DU as a whole.

Me personally trashing the thread wouldn't make a lick of difference there.

Do we really want to give ammo to outsiders who claim we are being cheaply political about a tragedy?

[IdaBriggs]

11. Because DU matters to the whole wide world?

And *every* liberal/progressive/Democrat in the United States, whose opinions are already worshiped/valued/fawned over by not only the Mainstream Media, Republicans everywhere, *and* our own elected Government Leaders *REALLY* cares?



Dude, we can't even get them to pay attention when we flip out over *REAL* problems; you think they are going to start paying attention because somebody made a bad/dark/rude joke on the inter-tubes?



Seriously, just trash the thread. Or hit alert if you think it is "over the top" and let a jury decide if it should be hidden.

Stuff in "poor taste" on an internet discussion board? Whatever.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

12. Do you happen to recall when *one* poster at DU complained about the re-instated payroll taxes....

....and the next day, Rush Limbaugh went on air and pointed to that single post and claimed it was evidence that "Even liberals are mad at Obama for raising their taxes!"

(Not to mention all the trolls on here that followed his reference to DU)

But if you don't care about needlessly giving some ass-clown like Limbaugh ammo to claim liberals are being partisan and insensitive and giving us all a bad name, then....Whatever right back at you.

[Duer 157099]

14. So you're saying that if just one person at DU does something,

we all need to cringe and hide, afraid of what a big gas-bag might say on the air?

Isn't it a better strategy to just post what you want and let others do the same? Read what you want, hide what you don't want to read. You know, freedom and all that.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

16. I'm just saying think before you post.

Don't cause headaches when you don't have to.

Think of it as a public service announcement of sorts. You're welcome.

[CreekDog]

19. but that poster isn't dumb, he's just completely inconsiderate and insensitive

he's joked about a little girl in a wheelchair crying from TSA, he helped justify a restaurant kicking out a family because their child had a skin condition...

[Duer 157099]

21. But what if someone's posting humor is their way of dealing?

And truly it is, for many people, the best way they have of coping. Humor has survived in our genepool for a really good reason.

An astute comedian can talk endlessly about how and why humor should not have boundaries. There's something to be said for considering that perspective, imho. I happen to value humor tremendously and so err on the side of letting it go, even if it personally offends me.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

23. If they were somehow personally connected with the events, sure.

But if it's someone just making a cheap laugh, better left unsaid.

Whatever. The post at issue is off the first page, so let's just hope it sinks fast.

[Duer 157099]

26. C'mon, really?

You don't really mean to restrict people's coping methods to how closely they were affected by a specific event?

There's PTSD. Think of the implications. Someone, anywhere in the world, who has been affected by, say, an IED in their life, might very well be very closely affected by yesterday's tragedy. I'd call that a personal connection, wouldn't you?

Some people might not even realize they have such a connection, or why they make the jokes they do.

I don't even know which post provoked the OP and it doesn't much matter to me anyway.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

27. It wasn't just that it was a joke.

For example, one of the replies to this thread attempted to make a joke, and was hidden, but was far less bothersome to me personally than the OP to which I'm referring.

I guess what bothered me about the joke at issue is that it was blatantly partisan. Not that I give one shit about Paul Ryan or Sarah Palin specifically, but turning the incident into a partisan joke just is petty.

[Tom Rinaldo]

28. Yup. It compounded poor taste. The now hidden post was more garden variety "black humor"

and was a more clear cut example of trying to use humor to break the tension, not to pile onto an adversary, or even an enemy, piggy backing off of a tragedy. In the end though we are all just posters on a discussion board. All of us are saddened by what really happened.

[CreekDog]

34. that poster isn't "dealing" with anything, they are posting elsewhere on DU like this is nothing

they dont' care what this site thinks, what you think, what anyone thinks and as far as being offended?

they think they are the one who should be offended. they think you or anyone else that's offended is completely wrong.

because they are right and everyone else is wrong. that's how they think. they post insensitively on many topics, they never learn.

[LanternWaste]

38. Yeah... someone makes a joke about rape at a survivors meeting. Happens all the time, right?

"What if someone's posting humor is their way of dealing?"

Yeah... someone makes a joke about rape at a survivors meeting. Happens all the time, right? Right?

Or maybe (just maybe) there's a time and a place for just about everything. And sometimes a joke isn't a coping mechanism, but simply an idiot thinking he's clever. Happens more than jokes at survivors meetings.

But I imagine we all of us rationalize acting like a fucking idiot at one time or another...

[lunatica]

17. The best thing to do is tell that poster that we disagree with him/her

Or chastise him/her. That way no one is given ammunition against us. Like this thread, for example. It was posted to show DU that some people take exception to bad behavior.

[Duer 157099]

20. I agree with you

however, it doesn't address the point about what a radio host might say. They never talk about the follow-up posts like this thread.

[IdaBriggs]

18. Let Limbaugh give the sight free publicity to his hearts content.

The man loves to lie about everything else, so I am *not* going to freak out on those (thankfully rare) occasions when the broken clock is right and *someone* says something inappropriate on DU. The hens will cluck, and anyone with working brain cells knows he is a moron; if he thinks "everyone on DU says something" well, I'd rather they see how we all like "freedom of speech (even when it is tacky, and in bad taste)".

Let his minions come and read. Some might get edumicated or sumthink. <== Bad Spelling On Purpose

Frankly, we have Gungeoneers and Other Whacky Folk with more embarrassing opinions than dark humor, so seriously, not even first world problems.

And P.S. I *AM* partisan as all get out -- I suspect domestic terrorism by anti-government morons, but am actually waiting for more details before calling for the tar-and-feather brigade. I am also thanking my lucky stars that President Obama and his team of COMPETENT folk are in charge.

All in all, I feel a heckuva lot safer than when Cheney and Junior were in charge.

[Floyd_Gondolli]

35. And that mattered because....

What, you think Rush's guns would have fallen silent if someone hadn't posted that.

Sorry, but despite what some of us want to believe nobody is curing cancer here.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

37. When does typical Rush Limbaugh BS drivel cease being typical Rush Limbaugh drivel?

Answer: When it becomes fact.

Let's say Rush Limbaugh says liberals have cheaply politicized the Boston bombings.

We say bullshit. And we'd be right.

Except when someone here starts making stupid jokes about Paul Ryan, Sarah Palin and the Boston bombings. Which, sadly, would be proving that gasbag right.

And I don't know about you, but I hate the idea of Rush Limbaugh being right. About anything.

So let's not do it.

[bluedigger]

29. Our detractors will find "ammo" where ever they seek it.

It's natural for a political website to make fun of the opposition. As long as no harm or threat is made to actual victims, or anyone else, I'm really not worried about it.

Gallows humor has the social effect of strengthening the morale of the oppressed and undermines the morale of the oppressors.[6][7] According to Wylie Sypher, "to be able to laugh at evil and error means we have surmounted them."[8]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallows_humor

It may not work for you, but it is as valid a reaction when faced with adversity as any other. It's also a good topic to discuss and gain mutual understanding.

[LanternWaste]

33. Often, that same coping mechanism further opens the wounds of others

"People cope with tragedy in their own way..."
Often, that same coping mechanism further opens the wounds of others. Kind of tough to know ahead of time if a thread is in poor taste.


"I suggest you cope by using "trash thread" as needed..."
Trashing a thread doesn't really reduce the opening of wound.


Sometimes, best way to help is simply to shut the fuck up for once, and use that time to read a book on civility and manner... I mean, as we all seem to feel full of suggestions as to how others should cope and such.

[MrBig]

15. Agreed n/t

[brooklynite]

22. I altered on the "joke" about Paul Ryan...

It got upheld 4-2.

[Tom Rinaldo]

25. I wasn't on the jury but I would have upheld it, though I wish it wasn't posted

Someone had a right to post it, I have a right to wish they hadn't. I prefer self editing.

[CreekDog]

32. a right? you can't post Obama birther stuff, nor Chemtrail nonsense, nor right wing talking points,

what makes you think we have a right to joke about a tragedy on the day it happened?

why do DUers think this?

if you think we can post whatever we want at DU and have a right to do so, you are ignoring the actual rules of this place.

[Tom Rinaldo]

41. "a right" as stipulated in DU rules. They aren't always as specific as the examples you mention

The majority of the jury which I was not on obviously thought it was not against specific rules. A lot of DUers also gave R's to the thread in question. I refused to even bump it once. I gave my "R" to this one. I never said I thought we could post whatever we want here, stop yelling at me just because we don't read the rules the exact same way. I agree with you about not joking about a tragedy.

[CreekDog]

49. i'm not yelling or blaming you, but you said 1) that you would have upheld the post

2) that it's innapropriate
and 3) that the jury system reflects our standards.

do you see the disconnect?

you won't hide something you think is inappropriate, while recognizing that all things are not allowed to be posted. it's as if you don't realize that you are empowered, as other jurors, to enforce the rules --yet you describe how you won't in this case, if you could.

that's all i'm pointing out and it's maddening because one of the problems we're having is bigoted posts, for example, being left by juries for the sake of discussion and people are leaving DU because of that.

[Tom Rinaldo]

55. It would have been a close call for me and I would have noted that

Even the word inappropriate has shades of grey in it. I've been on 60 or so juries and I've voted to hide things about a third of the time. It is not always crystal clear what is inappropriate by community standards. Disagreeable isn't the same as inappropriate. Counter productive isn't the same as inappropriate. Unfair isn't the same as inappropriate. In poor taste isn't the same as inappropriate either since opinions on that vary wildly, as do opinions on whether being in poor taste is itself inappropriate. Even offensive doesn't nail it because not everyone gets offended by the same things. When I participate on a DU Jury I do not solely look at matters through my own set views because on a discussion/debate board that can be pretty stifling, I expect to have disagreements on all kinds of things with others here. When it comes to matters of free speech I tend to start out with "an assumption of innocence unless proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt" In the long run I think that is the safest default setting to start from.

[Gormy Cuss]

40. Having the right to post it implies that it's acceptable.

We are expected to judge such post based on acceptability within the broad notion that there are community standards which disallow posts that make DU suck. For example, posts that are "disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate." (the language in the alert form.) IMHO, the "joke" was clearly insensitive and inappropriate thus should have been hidden.

It's not an issue of rights, it's one of civility.

[randome]

24. I haven't told any jokes, although several occur to me.

Some people see things from more than one perspective, even if those perspectives are diametrically opposed to one another.

[cbdo2007]

30. Depends on the joke.....I thought the Paul Ryan joke was great.

Sometimes you need to take a break from the constant videos and pictures and talking heads and have a laugh. The joke was solely at the expense of Paul Ryan, not any of the victims.

[CreekDog]

31. so after you see the guy with his feet blown off, you need to go to DU and joke about the marathon?

can't you just turn on a Simpsons or something?

a little levity about Boston? that's the cure?

please.

[cbdo2007]

36. I was referring to the joke about Paul Ryan. Didn't see the one about the guy with his feet blown

off. I definitely don't agree with that!!

Yeah, it was funny to see the Paul Ryan joke though. It was either that or sit here and cry all day. You can only do so much crying and worrying about an issue before you need a laugh and that one was topical.

I would much rather read a well crafted joke about a serious event than the constant barage of blaming and generalizing and speculating that goes on here after a serious event, OR the anti-blaming, anti-generalizing, anti-speculating posts about it.

[OnyxCollie]

42. That wasn't a well-crafted joke.

It wasn't even a joke.

At least this is a joke:

"A bomb went off in an elevator today. Five people were killed. They were detailing Mitt Romney's car."

It's a joke because you don't anticipate that it occurred in Romney's car elevator.

[cbdo2007]

44. That's much more offensive than the Paul Ryan joke....because the victims are part of the joke.

[OnyxCollie]

50. The Paul Ryan "joke" used the bombing as a prop.

Because Paul Ryan lies about his marathon time, he didn't get his legs blown off.

He's a liar, and that's why he wasn't maimed or killed, like the people who were maimed or killed.

That's the joke. Ha ha.

Edit to add: My joke didn't use an actual event.

[CreekDog]

45. i'm reacting to your words --you suggested what we needed was a laugh b/c of this tragedy

i don't disagree that we all need to keep ourselves sane in the midst of tragedy.

but posting a joke about the tragedy itself, in its aftermath?

that's the issue. not that some of us don't need a humor break in the midst of bad news --but there are LOLcats, there are comedians, there are all kinds of things, and not all of the things that make us laugh need or should be posted.

that's all i'm saying.

[alp227]

43. Is it too much to observe a simple moral issue?

And be SENSITIVE about tragedy?

[cbdo2007]

47. Being sensitive about a tragedy and laughing at a stupid joke are two separate issues.

It's so funny that with all the sh*t I read on DU making fun of people and situations that this goofy Paul Ryan joke has been called out as being so offensive. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

People need to learn to laugh or else we'll all end up killing ourselves cause we're so scared and depressed at the world.

I welcome any and all well crafted jokes about tragedies on DU.

[alp227]

58. Ok, is it also too much to be a thinker

and acknowledge you can't FEEEEEEEL happy all the time?

[cbdo2007]

61. That's the exact opposite of what I said....

I didn't say anybody needed to be happy all the time, but yesterday consisted of 16 waking hours of still being sad about the Boston Marathon bombing and 15 seconds laughing at a stupid joke about the idiocy of Paul Ryan on the DU. That, to me, seems like a fair balance.

[randome]

39. We should have a 'Boston Bombs Black Humor' thread.

[backscatter712]

46. +1!

People who don't appreciate black humor don't have to join in.

[randome]

48. And anyone who posts a joke in another post can have their post hidden.

[Jamastiene]

51. K&R*1000000

[Donald Ian Rankin]

52. As soon as you say "not funny", you've lost the argument.

What I guess you mean is "jokes about these subjects are offensive and hurtful, please do not make them" - which strikes me as an eminently sensible thing to say.

But as soon as you make the debate about whether or not they are funny, I think you've lost it.

If someone else says that they *do* find them funny then ipse facto they're right and you're wrong - there's no definition of funny other than "some people find it funny".

So I'd suggest criticising jokes for being hurtful, rather than for being unfunny.

[iandhr]

53. Who is making jokes.

[NealK]

60. ?

[iandhr]

62. The poster said people were making jokes who was doing that \?

[MiniMe]

56. It was years before I saw a Princess Dianna joke

A few of them were amusing when I finally saw them, but most were not even years later.

[NealK]

59. Yes, same thing for me...

And that OP was horrible.

[VOX]

57. Thanks, Tommy -- as you may know, I wholeheartedly agree...

Appreciate your care and concern for others.