Why do some on the Left keep saying that Pres. Obama is "center-right"?

[Jamaal510]

Personally, I see him as center-left. But every now and then, I see somebody online calling him center-right. Can somebody explain to me how exactly he is center-right? I understand there is the matter of his drone policy and the Drug War, but there are a number of progressive goals that he accomplished, as well. For instance, there was the auto bailout, the Fair Pay Act, drawing down both wars and ending one of them, overhauling Food and Safety, eliminating the Bush tax cuts on top income earners and pushing for tax hikes on them, expanding access to health care, ending DADT, and advancing women's rights in the workplace. I think his liberal positions vastly outweigh his conservative positions, and I have a difficult time imagining many people on the Right side of the political spectrum supporting those policies. I also have a hard time imagining a RWer appointing someone like Sotomayor to the SCOTUS, or stumping for Elizabeth Warren.

That's just my $0.02.

[NYC_SKP]

1. Our US History teacher, in the 70's, said that if you go far enough left then you're right.

I can't be the only one that heard that.

California, circa 1971 to 1974. Most likely 71, since I had a full time job in 73-74.

[The Straight Story]

6. Heard that in the 80's in a poly sci class

That the political spectrum is not a line but a circle.

Loved that teacher, was an adult education center and he spent most the time just discussing politics and getting input from us. I don't remember really ever cracking the book

[HiPointDem]

44. give me an example.

[Moses2SandyKoufax]

65. (crickets) n/t

[BlueStreak]

2. Because everything has moved extreme right in the past 30 years. He is left of the most extreme

right wing, but put him next to FDR or JFK and I think the answer to your question should immediately become obvious.

Because of this far right shift, it probably is not possible to elect an FDR today, but may be in another 3 or 4 election cycles. Obama is as "left" as he can be in today's political climate, which is far, far to the right of our traditional center.

None of this is necessarily a reflection on where his true beliefs might lie. He is, above all else, a pragmatist, and we never really get to see where he really might be.

[ananda]

39. Yeah.

It looks as though the critical mass for change is going to have to be very high before anything substantive happens.

[BlueStreak]

51. That isn't exactly how I see it. The NRA thing has laid bare the state of our "democracy"

The people are in favor of background checks 90-10. What issue have you ever seen 90+% approval on? Yet most Republicans and a lot of Democrats are still blocking that. The people are in the right place, for the most part. Issue by issue, the public supports the progressive position strongly: 60% to 70% or more. The problem is not with the people. The problem is that our system is among the most corrupt in the entire world. We send election watchers to Kenya, but they probably have less election rigging than we have every single time. And the power of money in our system is inescapable.

I do agree with you that real change may require a much greater display of anger on the part of the public. But I don't necessarily believe that it will take riots in the streets to change.

The key thing is getting control over the SCOTUS and the House. We are only 15 seats away from controlling the House. Barring a lot of help from the actuarial gods, Obama won't be able to replace any of the evil 5 on the SCOTUS, but the next President will. America's demographics are changing quickly. Obviously there is a lot of Hispanic vote and the GOP has done everything possible to turn them off. They are anti-woman. Their only real support is old white men. And they have a SERIOUS problem with the generations coming up behind today's old white men. They just aren't going to fall into place for the Republicans.

At this point, I'd speculate the most likely ticket for the Dems in 2016 is Hillary and Julian Castro. If not Castro, another Hispanic of stature. Even with the best of Republican vote rigging, I think that would be a formidable ticket. And if that were to win, we would be assured of putting a real dent in the SCOTUS problem. From there it would take another 10 years to start to repair the damage that Scalia and friends of done to our democracy. But it can be done.

[OffWithTheirHeads]

3. You need to spend some time with Noam Chomsky.

Too many young-uns don't even k ow what the left is anymore. The corporate media has moved the diolouge so far right that people think right is left.

It's much too late to get into a fight over this so I've said my piece but what passes for center left these days has shifted so far to the right since Raygun that it is non-existant

[Go Vols]

4. The left has been moving

the wrong way since 1/20/80.


I voted for Jimmy.

[bowens43]

5. because he IS center right...

[white_wolf]

7. I've called him center-right so I'll give my answer.

His healthcare reform was a centrist solution. A center-left solution would have been the public option, a true left solution would have been getting rid of private insurance completely and going to a single-payer system or even nationalized healthcare. His use of drones is clearly a right-wing policy. His numerous free trade agreements is another example of his center-right stance. His Supreme Court justices have been okay, but he could have nominated more left leaning ones. His current picks are moderates. Far better than the right-wing Scalia, but not as good as someone he could have nominated.

[msongs]

11. health care based on romney care is pretty much rightist nt

[DonCoquixote]

12. yes except for one thing

I am tired of people treating Sonia Sotomayor like she is some right wing scum. She has been one of the few to stand up to the rich, even back to the days of thr baseball strike.

Why do people hate Sotomayor?

[white_wolf]

18. I never said she was right-wing scum.

I said she was a moderate and she is. She's far better than the actual right-wingers we have on the court, but when I think of left-wing justices I think of Earl Warren, for instance. Perhaps she will prove me wrong and I really hope she does.

[Honeycombe8]

19. You're confused. Congress passed Obamacare. It was Congress that told

Obama that they don't have the votes for the public option.

His S.Ct. Justices are not just "okay." They are decidedly Democrats and liberals. They may not be progressive, but no progressive would get past the nomination phase in Congress at this time (or maybe any time).

Was Reagan center left, since he nominated Sandra Day O'Connor, who sometimes sided with the liberals? Was Bush Sr. center left, since he nominated Justice Souter, who turned out to be a disappointment to conservatives?

The truth is...Presidents don't know how Justices will decide certain legal cases. They may have an idea, know their philosophy, etc., but no one can really know. Each case is different, and Justices may decide a case in a way that goes against their personal beliefs, but based on the law and circumstances.

Is Justice Roberts center left because he is the one responsible for validating Obamacare?

Truth is...when someone doesn't make decisions and do actions that some others totally agree with, they label them as some "other" thing from themselves.

Obama is most definitely center left. Just as he was when he campaigned in 2008. He's surprised us, for sure, in a few areas. And continues to surprise us. But his thrust is toward the left. If you don't think so, you're not familiar with the "right."

[xtraxritical]

21. Not to mention the fact that he could end the wars and chooses not to.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

36. Banning private health insurance isn't left-wing, it's just authoritarian.

A left-wing solution is to provide health-care from general taxation, but not to require people to use it or prevent them from making other arrangements if they prefer.

[white_wolf]

58. The UK and other European countries don't allow private health insurance.

At least not for necessary care. The prime minister goes to to the same hospital as the guy cleans his office. Do you think those countries are authoritarian?

[Donald Ian Rankin]

60. I think you're misinformed.

Who told you that we ban private health insurance here in the UK?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bupa

[stevenleser]

61. Not to mention that France has a two tiered system where 80% of citizens buy private insurance to

layer on top of the government system.

[OwnedByCats]

63. Yeah I was going to say

I used to live there, you most certainly can get private insurance. There are private hospitals and clinics that you can choose to go to. You probably still have to pay the taxes for the NHS if you decide to use private insurance, but the taxes for the NHS are not that bad at all, especially when you consider the only copays you make are for prescriptions, and that is even easily afforded. Compared with our insurance costs/copays, the system in the UK feels like it's free! I personally did not feel the need for private insurance because I really had no complaints with the NHS, but the option is there. I don't know about the rest of Europe though.

[green for victory]

8. maybe things like "...I would be considered a moderate Republican"- Obama

Obama says he'd be seen as moderate Republican in 1980s

President Obama said his economic policies are "so mainstream" he'd be considered a moderate Republican in the 1980s.

In a Thursday interview with a Miami-based local television station, Obama said he thinks few people believe he wants to impose socialism on the country.

"The truth of the matter is that my policies are so mainstream that if I had set the same policies that I had back in the 1980s, I would be considered a moderate Republican," he told Noticias Univision 23 in a White House interview.


"I mean, what I believe in is a tax system that is fair," he continued. "I don't think government can solve every problem. I think that we should make sure that we're helping young people go to school. We should make sure that our government is building good roads and bridges and hospitals and airports so that we have a good infrastructure.

"I do believe that it makes sense that everyone in America, as rich as this country is, shouldn't go bankrupt because someone gets sick, so the things I believe in are essentially the same things your viewers believe in," Obama said.

http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/domestic-taxes/272957-obama-says-his-economic-policies-so-mainstream-hed-be-seen-as-moderate-republican-in-1980s

Hope that helps

[OffWithTheirHeads]

9. You are from Oakland. Obviously too young to remember peoples park

Or getting tear gassed during the anti vietnam protests, or the Berkley Barb, or what the left actually looked like.

[NYC_SKP]

10. I remember the Barb.

Also the Milk Moscone murders and the People's Temple.

Sad times.

[OffWithTheirHeads]

13. Did you live in the bay area?

[NYC_SKP]

14. 49th street off Broadway near Rockridge/Broadway/College... Yes. (nt)

[OffWithTheirHeads]

17. I grew up at 19th and Douglass. Almost dead center of S.F.

Now called the Castro district but when I was there it was just a blue collar neighborhood.

[Notafraidtoo]

15. Compared to todays republican hes far left.

And on social issues i would say hes doing a good job and definitely left leaning. but economically hes center right, A true person on the left cares about.

1.Labor not just lip service,with out strong labor there will be no progressive economy.

2.Cuts military spending

3.Social security and medicare cuts would be non starters, the only exception would be being ripped off by the private companies that do business with medicare.

4.Would not be open to privatizing public education.

5.Would be serious about regulating wall street not just lip service, Conservative bankers don't have the answer when it comes to regulating the banks.

My biggest issue with Obama is he's willing to give away some of our foundation as a party for scraps from extremist, I would argue though he is more left leaning then Clinton talk about selling out labor in this country.

[KT2000]

16. he has described himself

as a moderate republican as they existed in years past.

[Marr]

32. That's pretty decisive, imho.

Why deny what the man himself claims?

[Notafraidtoo]

20. I Don't think

I don't think we will ever have a Left leaning economic president again until we either collapse depression style and people wake up or we publicly finance all campaigns. Its a shame the wealthy get to choose our candidates cause huge amounts of donations is the only way to win. A progressive economy rewards workers but the wealthy in todays climate have to reward shareholders instead.

[AgainsttheCrown]

22. I've saved this link for just this occasion...

[white_wolf]

24. Yep. Because that's just what you want in a Democratic president...

a moderate Republican. It's really frustrating that this is the best the Democratic Party can do. Moderate Republicans. It's like saying we aren't as bad as the bully who is beating you up and taking your lunch money, we're just going to beat you up. Now vote for us for class president because the other guy is an even bigger jerk.

[Puzzledtraveller]

49. you add those amongst us who view him as infallible

and you have quite a situation, he knows what he can get away with and what he can't and he can get away with a lot and half , or more than half the party won't utter a peep. I still support him as president but I do not believe that he in incapable of screwing up, or on some issues already has.

[bananas]

28. Here's a couple of great threads about that video

One by me: http://www.democraticunderground.com/101793318

One by kpete: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014336360

(kpete didn't have the video, just the text story, but it's a longer thread)

[Poll_Blind]

46. Word up. nt

PB

[bananas]

23. Noam Chomsky: Obama Would Have Been Called a 'Moderate Republican' in Recent Decades

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/noam-chomsky-obama-would-have-been-called-moderate-republican-recent-decades

Noam Chomsky: Obama Would Have Been Called a ‘Moderate Republican’ in Recent Decades

The professor argues Dems function as moderate Republicans and the GOP so extreme you can barely call it a political party.

January 31, 2013

Noam Chomsky, Professor Emeritus at MIT, and one of the nation's leading intellectual critics of the US political, corporate and national security apparatus. In this long interview, Cenk Uygur of TYT and Professor Chomsky discuss President Obama, the rightward shift of US politics over the past few decades, drone strikes, the labor movement, Aaron Swartz, the role of the media and what hope we have for the future

In the interview, Chomsky argues that the country's political shift toward corporate and business interests in recent decades reflects a "realignment" of the economy.

[bluestate10]

42. Two of our greatest Presidents were moderate republicans, Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt.

Neither would want to be part of the modern republican party. Many modern moderate republicans have either left the party or are in the process of saying goodbye to the modern republican party.

BTW. The policies that Chomsky gets so heated up about are the same ones that got the democratic party into the wilderness and allowed republicans to surge and fuck the country up over the last four decades. How is that progressive? Chomsky is no different from a teabagger, both are locked into failed philosophies and can't figure how to get the hell out of them.

[bananas]

25. The Political Compass: 2008

http://www.politicalcompass.org/uselection2008

US Presidential Election 2008



This chart was constructed on the basis of the speeches, public statements and , crucially, the voting records of each of the candidates. During the election campaign, we'll be tweaking their positions as, inevitably, some of them change. We'll also be adding other charts as the campaign continues.

When examining the chart it's important to note that although most of the candidates seem quite different, in substance they occupy a relatively restricted area within the universal political spectrum. Democracies with a system of proportional representation give expression to a wider range of political views. While Cynthia McKinney and Ralph Nader are depicted on the extreme left in an American context, they would simply be mainstream social democrats within the wider political landscape of Europe. Similarly, Obama is popularly perceived as a leftist in the United States while elsewhere in the west his record is that of a moderate conservative. For example, in the case of the death penalty he is not an uncompromising abolitionist, while mainstream conservatives in all other western democracies are deeply opposed to capital punishment. The Democratic party's presidential candidate also reneged on his commitment to oppose the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. He sided with the ultra conservative bloc in the Supreme Court against the Washington DC handgun ban and for capital punishment in child rape cases. He supports President Bush's faith-based initiatives and is reported in Fortune to have said that NAFTA isn't so bad. Despite all this, some angry emailers tell us that Obama is a dangerous socialist who belongs on the extreme left of our chart. In an apparently close race, genuine leftists McKinney and Nader may attract sufficient votes from Obama to deliver McCain to the Oval Office.

<snip>

[bananas]

26. The Political Compass: 2012

http://www.politicalcompass.org/uselection2012

The US Presidential Election 2012



This is a US election that defies logic and brings the nation closer towards a one-party state masquerading as a two-party state.

The Democratic incumbent has surrounded himself with conservative advisors and key figures — many from previous administrations, and an unprecedented number from the Trilateral Commission. He also appointed a former Monsanto executive as Senior Advisor to the FDA. He has extended Bush tax cuts for the wealthy, presided over a spiralling rich-poor gap and sacrificed further American jobs with recent free trade deals. Trade union rights have also eroded under his watch. He has expanded Bush defence spending, droned civilians, failed to close Guantanamo, supported the NDAA which effectively legalises martial law, allowed drilling and adopted a soft-touch position towards the banks that is to the right of European Conservative leaders. Taking office during the financial meltdown, Obama appointed its principle architects to top economic positions. We list these because many of Obama's detractors absurdly portray him as either a radical liberal or a socialist, while his apologists, equally absurdly, continue to view him as a well-intentioned progressive, tragically thwarted by overwhelming pressures. 2008's yes-we-can chanters, dazzled by pigment rather than policy detail, forgot to ask can what? Between 1998 and the last election, Obama amassed $37.6million from the financial services industry, according to the Center for Responsive Politics. While 2008 presidential candidate Obama appeared to champion universal health care, his first choice for Secretary of Health was a man who had spent years lobbying on behalf of the pharmaceutical industry against that very concept. Hey! You don't promise a successful pub, and then appoint the Salvation Army to run it. This time around, the honey-tongued President makes populist references to economic justice, while simultaneously appointing as his new Chief of Staff a former Citigroup executive concerned with hedge funds that bet on the housing market to collapse. Obama poses something of a challenge to The Political Compass, because he's a man of so few fixed principles.

<snip>

[dkf]

30. Wow I'm considerably to the left and way less authoritarian

[Egalitarian Thug]

27. Ask a question, and then can't wait 10 minutes for an answer.

Or perhaps you expected that we couldn't provide so many indisputable answers so quickly?

[TheKentuckian]

29. Center-right doesn't mean right wing other than in the loosest sense

It depends heavily on how narrow or broadly one views the political spectrum and where center is measured to be.

Probably where the person making the call actually sits will be an influence too.

I think center-right is probably about far left as can be described.

Signed the Ledbetter that had already been passed. Wouldn't refusing to sign it like Bush be just this side of Bircherism?

Wars? He just maintained Bush's agreement on Iraq. What was the non-extremist position to take? He surge in Afghanistan and has spread the whole "terror" debacle and has gone damn close to the edge of the map on civil liberties and the Unitary Executive bullshit in pursuit of it so how "left" is that?

Extending the Bush cuts and then making the permanent up to 400k isn't particularly leftist.

Enacting Gingrich/Romney health care designed by the Heritage Foundation is center-right by definition.

I'll grant the auto bailout but it is also what I would call a nonpartisan position up until about now. I'd imagine Poppy Bush would do it and I could see about any Democrat being a lot less interested in "haircuts" for already heavily pressed labor. Sane people don't sit on their hands when something as critical as your manufacturing infrastructure just go.
How is this not a very basic common sense deal?

I"ll give you DADT but even that is in a country the broadly supports the action in a world where it goes on without much fuss, it really isn't really off center other for the craven cowardice of politicians playing games

Then there are the education policies. The continuation and expansion of "war" powers established by villains. The mostly despicable and unsavory lot in cabinet level appointments.
The asswiping balance by lame ass finger wagging in the face of Wall Street wrecking us. Ramping up the drug war. Constantly working for "entitlement reform" and trying to shove those fucking peas down our throats. Constantly reinforcing the TeaPubliKlan frame and seeking to partner with the very fuckers who crashed the whole world.
Eating up Chicago School Economics

None of that balances to anything left to me but your mileage may vary, you may have a different point of view.

[patrice]

31. Because, in so doing, they subtract "the Left" from his base, thusly forcing BO to the right, which

"proves" that they are correct in calling him "center right", which in turn further subtracts "the Left" from BO's base.

Though this rhetoric results in some reduction of PO's base on the left (i.e. DEMOCRATS who have always supported social and economic justice issues), it also increases other political bases, one of which would be a base for what calls itself "the Left", which in some cases is in fact the authentic Left, but, because the Left is a relatively new dimension of the political spectrum at this point in American politics, not all of the "new" base is the authentic Left, especially since certain issues, such as the cannabis movement and peace, are distributed across a wider portion of the political spectrum from Left to Right and, thus, also redefining some of the Right end of the spectrum is also underway because of pressures created by the Tea Party playing into the Libertarian hand.

And btw, President Obama is NOT "center right", he is Center, but because the whole spectrum is skewed to the Right, due to corruption in our political systems that has resulted in weakness on the authentic Left, the Center which PO occupies, while I wouldn't say it is a Center in the middle of the Right portion of the spectrum, I would say, because of the Rightward skew of the whole spectrum, that PO's Center position ends up being Right of where the authentic Center would be if "our" representation were more authentic (i.e. not skewed) in manifesting the WHOLE variety of positions actually found in the body politic Left to Right. This means that PO is actually something Right of Center at this point in time, but not as far as Center Right.

[David__77]

33. In a global context, he most certainly is center-right.

He is further to the left of any US president since FDR, however.

[cyglet]

34. Like Paul Wellstone used to say

"I'm from the Democratic wing of the Democratic party..." even then recognizing that there was a corporate/3rd way faction...which has only gotten bigger and more powerful in the years since. Obama has shown partiality to the 3rd way/corporate faction rather than the progressive faction, in domestic and foreign policy. He may not have had choice in Obamacare (since that was a fairly bitter compromise, and I'll be fair with that) but he has choice in executive orders, signing free trade treaties, and cabinet appointments (would help a tad if he didn't appoint Republicans or Wall Street lackeys).

It's not just that the corporate controlled media is moving the country right, it's that labor has less power and hence the true political voice of the people is destabilized also (as it's not just in the workplace that unions are needed)...

[MannyGoldstein]

35. I defy you to find an issue where Obama is not

to the right of 2/3rds of Americans.
I assume you're asking about President Obama. Candidate Obama was a whole other character.

[hfojvt]

37. he didn't eliminate Bush tax cuts for the top

His ATRA kept 85% of the Bush tax cuts, including $600 billion in tax cuts for the top 1%, another $700 billion for the top 4% and another $1.1 trillion for the rest of the top 20%.
He cut the tax rate on dividends from 39.6% to 20% saving Mitt Romney almost $1,000,000 a year.
He cut the estate tax rate from 55% to 45% and increased the exemption from $1 million to $3.5 million.
He states as a goal of tax "reform", to lower tax rates.

When you say "I also have a hard time imagining a RWer appointing someone like Sotomayor to the SCOTUS, or stumping for Elizabeth Warren. " you are missing the point. CENTER right is well to the left of right WING. It's just a "little bit" to the right of the center, not all that much different that center-left which is a "little bit" left of the center. Center-left is like 55% and center-right is like 45% whereas right wing is about 10% and true liberal would be 80%.

[ananda]

38. That's because Obama actually governs from the corporate right.

He is also very much part of the CIA/Military-Industrial complex and seeks privatization of the commons.

That's just the way it is. It's not a matter of the pov.

[Spider Jerusalem]

40. He is centre-right; as was Bill Clinton, as is the Democratic Party, generally.

There is no "left" in mainstream American politics; by any reckoning which includes parties outside the USA in determining where the points of "left", "right", and "centre" align on a political axis, the US has a far-right party and a centre-right party.

[MadHound]

41. Compare him with Eisenhower,

You find that their records are pretty similar, hence he is governing from the center right.

[democrank]

43. President Obama is most definitely center-right.

Don`t compare him to today`s Republicans, compare him to left-leaning Democrats, of which there are few. The center dot on the political spectrum has been moved further and further to the right over the past couple of decades, which might make some think Obama is left-leaning.
He`s not.

[treestar]

45. They are either falling for or propagating

A divide and conquer technique.

[LWolf]

47. Here's one explanation,

among many. For the record, I've considered Obama to be center-right since I first looked at him, which is why he was at the very bottom of my ranking of primary candidates in '08. I find the political compass, which is a global positioning, more accurate than one centered on the U.S. only. What's interesting here is how the compass has moved him from '08 to '12. The rankings are based on actions, on record, more than on words.

'08:



'12:

hhttp://www.politicalcompass.org/charts/us2012.php

<snip>

This is a US election that defies logic and brings the nation closer towards a one-party state masquerading as a two-party state.

The Democratic incumbent has surrounded himself with conservative advisors and key figures — many from previous administrations, and an unprecedented number from the Trilateral Commission. He also appointed a former Monsanto executive as Senior Advisor to the FDA. He has extended Bush tax cuts for the wealthy, presided over a spiralling rich-poor gap and sacrificed further American jobs with recent free trade deals. Trade union rights have also eroded under his watch. He has expanded Bush defence spending, droned civilians, failed to close Guantanamo, supported the NDAA which effectively legalises martial law, allowed drilling and adopted a soft-touch position towards the banks that is to the right of European Conservative leaders. Taking office during the financial meltdown, Obama appointed its principle architects to top economic positions. We list these because many of Obama's detractors absurdly portray him as either a radical liberal or a socialist, while his apologists, equally absurdly, continue to view him as a well-intentioned progressive, tragically thwarted by overwhelming pressures. 2008's yes-we-can chanters, dazzled by pigment rather than policy detail, forgot to ask can what? Between 1998 and the last election, Obama amassed $37.6million from the financial services industry, according to the Center for Responsive Politics. While 2008 presidential candidate Obama appeared to champion universal health care, his first choice for Secretary of Health was a man who had spent years lobbying on behalf of the pharmaceutical industry against that very concept. Hey! You don't promise a successful pub, and then appoint the Salvation Army to run it. This time around, the honey-tongued President makes populist references to economic justice, while simultaneously appointing as his new Chief of Staff a former Citigroup executive concerned with hedge funds that bet on the housing market to collapse. Obama poses something of a challenge to The Political Compass, because he's a man of so few fixed principles.

[HereSince1628]

48. Left vs right is really not relevant, Obama and the DNC are pragmatists not measured that way

Ideologies can be characterized as left and right, up down, perhaps even in multidimensional hyper-space.

Pragmatism really can't be measured on a scale between ideas. It's position where it's at because that's one doable step from its previous position.

Pragmatism wanders over the cliff-face of politics from toe-hold to finger-grasp, to arm-wedge as best it can, doing 'what can be done'.

'Doing what can be done' almost always means doing less than what the unelected ideological left of the Dem base wants.

To people with ideological dreams it seems that left-appealing positions are always compromised in the direction of opponents anchored in ideology because under pragmatism they ALWAYS ARE. Compromise -is- the objective of our pragmatic leaders, and the pursue it, even if the only compromise is in their position.

Starting from the position of being dedicated to doing whats available to be done, requires a willingness to abandon or severely diminish the role of 'sacred' guiding principles. Read what the elected dems have said. In particular, read what Rahm Emmanuel has said in the past decade advocacy for pragmatism is there to be plainly seen.

More than 10 years ago the R's recognized that the DLC really weren't anchored ideologically. The r's realized that the dem leadership was motivated to compromise. The R's recognized they could get what they want by being ideologically intransigent. And, over the past decade we've seen the r's grow more and more intransigent while Dem pragmatists slowly work their way toward the right because that's what can be done.

[klyon]

50. economic policy - he follows the right wing philosophy and

appointed all right wing business execs
judicial he is also following the Bush model which is extreme right wing, his Supreme Court picks where a little better but hardly lefties
Just my opinion

[dembotoz]

52. rockerfeller republican at best--per robert riech???

more lefty than romney ryan?
yes but that was not hard was it.


did i vote for obama --yes

am i apeshit in love with him? hardly

[Festivito]

53. Silly statement. Consider your two cents returned. /nt

[Tom Rinaldo]

54. Some of us have a long memory

By mid 20th Century standards at least, Obama is Center Right. By "current" standards he is Center Left - emphasis on Center.

[Cal Carpenter]

55. In an objective sense, he is center-right

Outside the US, economic stances are what primarily define left vs right in political theory and policy. The Dem party, including Obama, is center-right in those terms.

The only way Dems are really 'left' is in a relative sense to Repubs. We may do more to protect existing social programs but there is little effort to confront the inherent problems in capitalism and make permanent lasting changes. For example, the New Deal did wonders for many people for many years, but it didn't stop the horrors of capitalism (in fact some argue that it basically saved capitalism given the mood of the world's working class at the time) and most of it has been chipped away over many decades under both Dem and Repub control. Even the 'social democracies' of western and northern Europe are center-left, in the sense that they protect their own people, but they aren't capital-L leftists in an objective way because they aren't challenging the global economic system on a bigger level.

US politics don't really give anyone a chance to be a leftist and get anywhere, maybe a token or two in the legislature but no one who truly challenges the center-right position can ever get very far, and if they do, they can't get anything done.

IMO, it isn't about Obama per se, it is about the whole system from the election process (really? Multiple billions of dollars?) to the legislation (eg written by corporate lobbyists to advance their own interests at the expense of the people). Obama can't be expected to fix this, and the legislature never will. For any real leftist movement to take root here, it must necessarily be independent of the 2 major parties and, at this time, the ballot box is not the place for fundamental change to occur.

[sendero]

56. I ..

... HEAR him as center-left, i.e. he TALKS center-left but his actions are center-right.

[Sunlei]

57. I always saw the President as a moderate.

[Rex]

59. Because.

nt.

[booley]

62. so what if he is?

I think Obama is centre right. I think others have made that point pretty well.

I also voted for the man,, twice. canvassed for him too.

And Claire McCaskill, who is also center right.

My problem is not whether some individual is center right or center left. we should have some people who are center right. There's nothing wrong with being right of center per se.

It's that the political spectrum runs from the right to the far right. Lets face it, if Nixon was resurrected and ran as a Democrat, many here would probably support him because compared to the GOP of today, he would be far more "Liberal". That may be an exaggeration but not by much. Politics has become skewed that everything is distorted by this right wing filter.

And no "practicality" is not really relevant. If a politicians pushes conservative policies, it doesn't matter if it's because he honestly believes in them or if he just thinks it's the most pragmatic way to get things done. The effect is the same. Not to mention this is undermined by the fact that we have had president push progressive policies despite lots of opposition. Does anyone think T.R. didn't face stiff opposition when he broke up the monopolies?

In short, yes Obama is centre right. But it also misses the real problem.

[loyalsister]

64. Because to some people, Ralph Nader is a RWer

and they have a misguided belief that their ideas are mainstream.