Missouri bill would require gun safety course in first grade

[proud2BlibKansan]

Missouri first-graders would have to take a gun safety course under a bill being considered by a state Senate committee.

Sen. Dan Brown, a Rolla Republican, outlined his proposal Tuesday before the General Laws Committee, which did not vote on it.

The bill would mandate the teaching of the National Rifle Association’s Eddie Eagle Gunsafe Program in every first-grade classroom. It also would require teachers to take eight hours of training on responding to an armed intruder.

“I hate mandates as much as anyone, but some concerns and conditions rise to the level of needing a mandate,” said Brown, who filed the bill on Dec. 13, one day before the Connecticut school shooting that killed 26 people.

Senators watched a brief segment of the training video, which featured a cartoon eagle telling children to step away from an unsecured gun and immediately report it to an adult.


Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/2013/01/29/4038000/missouri-bill-would-require-gun.html#comment-782748620#storylink=cpy

[RKP5637]

1. This, is a sick country. It's just absolutely a seriously disturbed country. n/t

[smirkymonkey]

50. I cannot agree with you more.

This is beyond f***ed up.

[Eleanors38]

2. Gun safety should be offered at an older age, and be voluntary.

[TheKentuckian]

6. That age or younger seems right and should be mandatory

It is too important for opting out. The child will make that call when they become an adult, whether to own or not but everyone absolutely needs to know what a gun is and how to deal (and not to) with a gun. Same with sex education, the situation has far too much gravity for inflicted ignorance.

[Eleanors38]

12. I taught a class of fellow jr hi students on the safe use of a pump shotgun...

Demonstrating with a M 870, with the teacher's permission.

I can't specify an age, but older than first grade seems appropriate. I don't think mandatory attendance is wise until I hear better arguments.

Can you imagine me doing a 10 min. Demo nowadays?

[TheKentuckian]

67. Early on it should be safety and awareness.

We had D.A.R.E. at such ages and I think one is more likely to encounter a weapon than coke or heroine and more likely to end up dead.
They need to know what a gun is and what it can do about as early as they can remember the experience. Actual use would come later, say early teens after the middle school hormone spike settles.

[Eleanors38]

74. This could work, though there needs to be a serious

effort to evaluate any program's effectiveness. The D.A.R.E. program was of dubious effectiveness, and has largely been discontinued.

[upaloopa]

54. We are born sexual beings. We are not born gunners.

There is a difference.

[TheKentuckian]

66. I don't see how that matters when one is born into a world with them

It doesn't matter one iota if one is a born gunner when you come across one as happens all the time and ignorance can mean death, injury, or accidental killing.

This is a country with as many KNOWN firearms as people ans I think it is reasonable to expect there are millions more. Many of us grew up safely with guns and have done so for generation after generation, it happens because of education from a very early age.

Ignorance is death.

[Recursion]

14. I don't know. Every kid should probably hear "If you see a gun, don't touch it", very early

Which is what the "Eddie Eagle" program is about.

[upaloopa]

57. You can tell your kid that in a few minutes.

It does not have to be taught in such a way that the kid sees guns as a part of everyone's life.
We want less guns and less gun lore but gunners can't understand that.

[Recursion]

63. Accidents with found firearms have killed more kids...

Than mass shooters in the past two months.

[SailorMike]

68. Very early

and very often.

See a gun, don't touch it...tell an adult.

[PrezHillary2016]

3. obsured!

[DogPawsBiscuitsNGrav]

4. My first thought was NO! But then I really stop to think about it,

and we teach them the dangers of sex and drugs the same way for the same reasons - To keep them safe and in the drug case, to teach them that they're dangerous and to stay away.

[proud2BlibKansan]

5. But not in 1st grade

[Rhiannon12866]

8. When I was a camp counselor, I taught riflery to kids

I learned to shoot there, myself, was on a couple of teams, one at camp, one at school. We shot at targets against other teams. Any kind of clip was against the rules.

The kids I taught had to be at least 13, not an activity for young children, and had to memorize and prove that they understood a number of safety rules. Children younger than that wouldn't have been able to understand the rules or even pick up a gun (.22 rifle). It scares me witless to know that there are gun owners who don't know how to shoot, nor how to handle a gun safely.

And I never had a gun in my home, was always locked up in a cabinet at the range either at camp or at school. It was a sport for me, like others who excelled at sailing or gymnastics. I wouldn't own a gun now, though I know how to use one. I support gun control, see gun ownership as an accident waiting to happen or the very real possibility of it falling into the wrong hands...

[Recursion]

13. They aren't being taught to use guns. The GunSafe program is the "Don't touch Do tell" thing

If you see a gun, don't touch it and do tell an adult.

[proud2BlibKansan]

20. It all depends on who the teacher is

When we used this program with the Boy Scouts we had a NRA certified instructor. But you can also send for the materials and present the lessons yourself. I'd rather do that than have to depend on someone I don't know from outside the school or district.

[LiberalFighter]

7. I wonder how many would invite him into their home to volunteer

to demonstrate to him how they would protect themselves from an intruder. (Bat behind their back)

[The Straight Story]

9. Sex ed and gun ed, it's all about safety and 'kids will do it anyway'

Nothing wrong with home safety courses that cover fires, carbon monoxide, guns, household cleaners, etc.

Or we could just pretend millions don't have (sex or guns, etc) them in their homes.

[proud2BlibKansan]

10. Home safety courses are a lot different from mandating it for 1st graders at school.

And 8 hours training for teachers is absolutely ridiculous.

[Robb]

11. Exactly. It's a handout to the gun industry.

[proud2BlibKansan]

21. Seems to be.

We'll know for sure if this bill passes.

[Third Doctor]

15. What?

At first I thought this was from the onion but I guess not.

[Recursion]

16. What's wrong with kids having a class that says "don't touch a gun if you see one"?

Sounds like "Stop drop and roll" kind of stuff to me.

[Recursion]

17. While we all hate the NRA, the Eddie Eagle Gun Safe program is actually really good

If you see a gun,

1. STOP
2. Don't touch it
3. Leave the area
4. Tell an adult

As long as this doesn't involve paying the NRA (and they usually provide the materials for free), this honestly sounds like a great thing for 1st graders to learn.

[Berserker]

49. That's a great program

And all children should be taught these set of rules at home and in school. Or just go on name calling and hating and pretend all this will magically go away.

[Starry Messenger]

18. If I'm expected to be a cop, am I going to be paid as one?

[joeybee12]

19. Totally phucked up...gun safety is one thing, forcing NRA sponsored propganda

on first graders is something different...phuck this asshole.

[friendly_iconoclast]

22. Point us to gun safety information from the Brady Campaign or VPC, will you?

Oh, that's right....you can't, as they do not provide any.

[joeybee12]

23. Yeah, let's get it from a terrorist organization because that's better

than nothing.

Pathetic.

[friendly_iconoclast]

25. I hate the NRA, but the Eddie Eagle program *is* better than nothing.

And nothing is exactly what the Bradys and VPC do. Shit, I'd respect the VPC and/or the Bradys
a lot more if they shamelessly cribbed from the EE syllabus:

If you see a gun
1. Don't touch it.
2. Get away from the gun and stay away from it.
3. Tell an adult.

Sound lessons are sound no matter who gives them, IMO.

You are, of course, free to embrace the genetic fallacy- but don't expect me to.

[joeybee12]

26. Their focus is not gun safety, and if we didn't have scum like the NRA

promting the idea that everyone is entitled to a gun and guns solve every problem, the need for gun safety would diminish...they are a terrorist organization and giving them any forum is wrong.

[friendly_iconoclast]

31. So what? Ignorance is *not* strength, especially in re kids and guns.

Also, you might just want to consider that there's a difference between what you think the NRA says
and what the NRA actually says (which is quite often pants-on-head-stupid, granted- just not in this case)...

[LanternWaste]

39. Yet not better than parental involvement...

"but the Eddie Eagle program *is* better than nothing..." Many years ago, prior to the organization being co-opted by politicians, maybe.

Yet not better than parental and family involvement... which isn't necessarily sponsored by a Right Wing PAC and forced on them by financial interests.

But I do understand the empathy one may freely give to a right wing political action committee, yet rationalize it as hate.

[friendly_iconoclast]

53. If you seek empathy for the NRA from me, you're looking at the wrong person...

[upaloopa]

59. If you need some fucking organization to teach

your kid what you should be teaching them you shouldn't have kids.

[friendly_iconoclast]

61. Those kids are with us, like it or not, so *somebody* needs to give them safety education.

And, complaining and handwringing aside, I've yet to see any of you lot providing the lessons the NRA
does- or for that matter, any gun safety whatsoever. Do you think guns are Voldemort? That they
must not even be mentioned? FFS, just blatantly copy the Eddie Eagle stuff and leave the NRA out of it.

You can't even do that; instead we get what sounds like the same old "ignorance is strength when it come to guns"
line...

[Hoyt]

34. Exactly, keep Wayne LaPierre, Teddy Nugent and the right wing NRA away from children.

I can here the kids now, "what kind of guns do you carry Mr. LaPierre, can you show it to us?"

Gun safety is one thing, since the darn co-called responsible gun owners aren't going to quit adding guns to their cache. Introducing kids to these right wing tools, is another matter.

[gulliver]

58. The NRA shouldn't be allowed to teach the class.

The police should teach this, not some private organization. We don't need the NRA using it as an excuse to market for gun manufacturers.

[Initech]

24. So the solution to a mass shooting of kindergartners is to teach them how to shoot.

I am fucking speechless.

[friendly_iconoclast]

27. They'll be teaching them to not touch guns and tell an adult if they see one.

Google "Eddie Eagle" if you don't believe it...

[Buzz Clik]

30. False equivalency.

[Recursion]

70. Accidents with found guns kill a LOT more kids than mass shootings

They respond to the largest source of child gun deaths (accidents) by teaching kids not to play with guns they find.

[Buzz Clik]

28. Sex Ed in first grade, but not gun safety.

Interesting.

[LanternWaste]

41. I can certainly understand your reticence to teach a wholly natural aspect of biological sciences

I can certainly understand your reticence to teach a wholly natural aspect of biological sciences at a young age, if not treated with the same due deference as... guns?

Interesting, indeed.

[Buzz Clik]

45. Nicely done! Take my words, change them, and then argue against them.

Rather than respond to you, I'll let you do it for me.

[Whovian]

29. All in a process to normalize guns as a normal to every family object.

Sickening.

[Buzz Clik]

35. They are too common to not have this training.

[Kalidurga]

32. I have no problem with telling first graders to report if they see a gun..

Don't touch it and whatnot. But this part: It also would require teachers to take eight hours of training on responding to an armed intruder.


Makes the whole thing sound like a backdoor way to make it mandatory for teachers to have a gun in the classroom.

[JohnnyBoots]

33. They have evacuation and action plans for school fires, Why

not take an inservice day and have the same evacuation and action plans for a school shooter. Getting the faculty on the same page with what to do if that, God forbid, ever happens cannot be a bad thing. I don't see a firearm being mentioned in the training, I see it as how to secure doors, taking cover in a class room away from windows/thin walls, escape through windows type response and training.

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. Because we don't currently spend 8 hours on the art of Reading instruction

But they want teachers to spend 8 hours on learning how to fight off an armed intruder?

It's absurd. If you think test scores are low now, just wait.

[SQUEE]

44. Seems you spent 4 years in college to learn that

What harm is there in teaching kids to stay away from firearms, and tell an adult if they see one.
I was brought up with firearms and was shooting a .22 before first grade. I DO NOT expect that other people would have this childhood, but I would like every child to learn to respect them and have basic education on what to do if they should run across one. Remove the stigma and awe and less children could end up blowing a hole in themselves or others.
I mean if it saves on life right?

[proud2BlibKansan]

46. I'm not opposed to the training

But 8 hours for teachers is ridiculous. A 30 minute video would be enough.

Let's keep in mind that our role as teachers is as deliverers of instruction, not bodyguards for children. We have a brief 30 minute refresher once a year on first aid. We don't need to spend more time than that on malicious intruders, which are a rare event anyway.

[SQUEE]

47. I do agree, I think hardening classrooms is a better idea.

To expect all educators to become guardians is a troubling step.
But there is a chance to also accept prior Mil or LEO as teachers that can respond with a weapon, after extensive training, and using specialized ammo.

[Berserker]

51. I don't read that

Part the way you do.
It also would require teachers to take eight hours of training on responding to an armed intruder.

Would it be better to pretend violence is not a real thing and have the teachers look like a deer in the headlights if something happens again?

Or be trained on what to do to save lives?

[Crepuscular]

36. Good idea!

Good idea to teach kids at a very early age that guns are not toys and that they should notify an adult immediately if they find one. Just like it's a good idea to teach them "Stop, drop & roll" fire prevention techniques or to always wear a seat bel. Why someone would have a problem with that kind of education is kind of hard to understand. Those that protest sound frighteningly similar to those fundies who want to prevent their children from being exposed to any form of sex education other than chastity belts.

[LanternWaste]

42. Should they then teach safety for any and all consumer products which are not toys

Should they then teach safety for any and all consumer products which are not toys which that cause death or injury?

Or merely the consumer products which are politicized and considered as sacred cows to many people?

[Crepuscular]

56. Within reason

Withing reason, sure teaching basic safety would be a good idea. Teach them not to run out into traffic, not to drink from a bottle that has a skull and crossbones on it and not to run with scissors or put a plastic bag over their head. Not sure why anyone would think such precautions would be a bad thing?

[Lady Freedom Returns]

38. The idea of teaching kid not to play with guns is good,but..

I know Missouri, especially the SW area. This can and will, in parts of that area, become a bad idea.

[Buns_of_Fire]

40. Stop / Don't touch / Leave the area and / Tell an adult

That's the gist of the Eddie Eagle Gunsafe Program. Try as I might, I just can't see a problem teaching kids this. If the NRA had stuck with stuff like this rather than morphing into an industry mouthpiece, we'd all probably be better off.

But this crap about training teachers to be Rambos and Ripleys (in eight hours?!) -- that's insane.

[sarisataka]

43. I have taught such classes

In summary-

Anyone may teach The Eddie Eagle GunSafe® Program, and NRA membership is not required. The program may be readily incorporated into existing school curriculum, taught in a one- to five-day format, and used to reach both levels or simply one or two grades. Materials available through this program are: student workbooks, 7-minute animated video (available on DVD), instructor guides, brochures, and student reward stickers. Program materials are also available in Spanish.

The NRA is committed to helping keep America's young children safe. In efforts to do so, we offer our program at a nominal fee. Schools, law enforcement agencies, hospitals, daycare centers, and libraries may be eligible to receive grant funding to defray program costs. Grant funding is available in many states to these groups to cover the cost of all program curriculum materials.

The purpose of the Eddie Eagle Program isn't to teach whether guns are good or bad, but rather to promote the protection and safety of children. The program makes no value judgments about firearms, and no firearms are ever used in the program. Like swimming pools, electrical outlets, matchbooks and household poison, they're treated simply as a fact of everyday life. With firearms found in about half of all American households, it's a stance that makes sense.

Eddie Eagle is never shown touching a firearm, and he does not promote firearm ownership or use. The program prohibits the use of Eddie Eagle mascots anywhere that guns are present. The Eddie Eagle Program has no agenda other than accident prevention - ensuring that children stay safe should they encounter a gun. The program never mentions the NRA. Nor does it encourage children to buy guns or to become NRA members. The NRA does not receive any appropriations from Congress, nor is it a trade organization. It is not affiliated with any firearm or ammunition manufacturers or with any businesses that deal in guns and ammunition.

{Highlights added}
I usually recommend it as an opt-in so parents are aware in advance and are welcome to attend.
There is no similar program from a pro-gun control group. All similar programs are from other pro-gun groups, and basically repack the NRA material, or hunter specific.

[slutticus]

48. How is this a bad thing???

Here is what children are typically taught to do if they find a gun (when they are taught at all that is....)

Stop
Don't Touch
Leave
Tell an adult


Is that really a bad thing to teach a kid? Even if you are terrified of guns and will never be within 1000 yards of one, you never know when your child might be in a situation (god forbid) where they would want to have these words ingrained in their heads.


Now the training for teachers IS a bit over the top...

[upaloopa]

52. You teach your kid gun lore and leave other people's kids alone.

Most people don't see more guns and more gun lore as the solution to gun violence. I don't expect you to understand that because of the paradigm you look through on gun matters.
Most people want less guns and less gun intrusion into their lives.

[friendly_iconoclast]

55. What 'paradigm' is that, and do you have any evidence that said paradigm actually exists?

[upaloopa]

60. Can you reply without it being a question?

I'm not playing that game anymore.

[friendly_iconoclast]

62. Of course you're not- you can't handle anything but unquestioning acceptance.

And that is why you lot keep losing in the political arena- if you don't get what you want when you
want it, you revert to acting like a bunch of ill-bred middle schoolers. When things don't go the way you want,
you revert to insulting gun owners and/or rural people and making dick jokes.

The people you oppose are for the most part quite serious and act like adults (LaPierre and Nugent, et al excepted). If you hope to get anywhere against them, you'll do the same.

[benld74]

64. Thank God my Missouri Legislature is working HARD to make Missouri a better place in which to live!

Man it hurt like hell to write that,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[Tx4obama]

65. No no no !!! It is the NRA program.

Missouri Lawmaker Proposes Mandatory Gun Safety Classes For First Graders

When State Senator Dan Brown made the proposal, no one spoke in opposition.

The bill would mandate the teaching of the National Rifle Association’s Eddie Eagle Gunsafe Program in every first-grade classroom. Brown says it would teach young children what to do if they come across an unsecured weapon. The bill would also require teachers to attend eight hours of training on responding to an armed intruder inside a school.

Brown filed the measure Dec. 13, one day before the Connecticut school shooting that killed 26 people.

http://www.alan.com/2013/01/30/missouri-lawmaker-proposes-mandatory-gun-safety-classes-for-first-graders/

The NRA needs to have LESS power NOT more.

[friendly_iconoclast]

69. Like them or not (and I certainly don't), they're the ONLY people teaching gun safety.

And that includes the so-called 'gun safety advocates' like the Brady Camapign and the Violence
Policy Center. Since those worthy organizations have fallen down on the job, you're pretty much stuck
with Eddie Eagle...unless, of course, you'd prefer ignorance.

[lynne]

71. Excellent and I hope other states will follow -

- to teach children not to touch a gun is a good thing and something that has been missing. Why is it we have no problem teaching them about how to avoid other things that can hurt them but we clam up about guns? If it saves even one life, it's certainly worth it.

And, YES, to teachers and all school administrators having training on responding to an intruder. We have fire drills and drills on how to respond to earthquakes and tornado's. We should have drills and training on how to respond to armed intruders.

This is only a good thing.

[LWolf]

72. The most disturbing thing about this

deeply disturbing idea is that there are actually people, right here in this thread, that think it's a good idea.

[proud2BlibKansan]

75. I don't disagree that it's not

I believe, however, that it should be the parent's responsibility rather than the school's. And 1st grade is way too young.

[LWolf]

80. A lot of my students take gun safety courses.

Usually at about 11-12. I'm glad they do. They get excited about it, and talk to me about what they are learning. Since so many of them spend a lot of time in the woods hunting deer with their families, I'm always relieved to hear them speak so firmly about what to do, and not to do, with a gun.

Of course, they've grown up with guns in the house, and their parents have been informally teaching them for their whole lives.

That IS their responsibility, and putting them through a formal course SHOULD wait until they are old enough to process the information well.

[lunatica]

73. Why not start teaching them in pre-school?

[HockeyMom]

76. "Tell an adult"

Assuming that teachers will be required to take a course in HANLDING guns as part of this program. No right to say NO to that????? Time to find another occupation, and state.

[proud2BlibKansan]

77. What makes you think teachers will be handling guns?

I taught this program. We didn't handle any guns.

[HockeyMom]

78. If a loaded gun if found in a school,

it will stay where it is until the police are called?

[proud2BlibKansan]

79. How would you know it was loaded if no one handles it?