I'd like Daniel Tosh to explain his "wouldn't it be funny is she were raped" joke in the wake of...

[alp227]

Last edited Sat Jan 5, 2013, 01:44 AM - Edit history (1)

stories like the Delhi gang rape case and others I've seen at DU. A warning, some details that follow are VERY graphic. Do not read if you've just finished eating dinner.

Background

Last summer, talentless comedian Daniel Tosh generated much buzz over this remark made at a show after a blogger at tumblr wrote about it:

So Tosh then starts making some very generalizing, declarative statements about rape jokes always being funny, how can a rape joke not be funny, rape is hilarious, etc. I don’t know why he was so repetitive about it but I felt provoked because I, for one, DON’T find them funny and never have. So I didnt appreciate Daniel Tosh (or anyone!) telling me I should find them funny. So I yelled out, “Actually, rape jokes are never funny!”

...

After I called out to him, Tosh paused for a moment. Then, he says, “Wouldn’t it be funny if that girl got raped by like, 5 guys right now? Like right now? What if a bunch of guys just raped her…” and I, completely stunned and finding it hard to process what was happening but knowing i needed to get out of there, immediately nudged my friend, who was also completely stunned, and we high-tailed it out of there.

As the Atlantic Wire reported:

On Twitter, Tosh cited "out-of-context misquotes" in a tweet that linked to the post on Cookies for Breakfast, before saying "I'd like to sincerely apologize." He followed up: "the point i was making before i was heckled is there are awful things in the world but you can still make jokes about them. #deadbabies."

Of course between the initial tumblr post and Tosh's non-pology of course the usual ignorant teenage boy and teenage man fans of Tosh swarmed message boards/online communities accusing the tumblr writer of making stuff up. Combined with the usual language I shall not repeat here.

I remember last summer battling Tosh-bots/MRA-bots/"free speech"-bots on the YouTube comments sections of the videos below. All they ever say is "anyone can be offended by anything"/"comedy has no limits because of free speech" without ever analyzing Tosh's statement (notice I say STATEMENT not JOKE) AT ALL. Those videos with the Tosh-bots are: a video "Tumblr Feminists" by The Amazing Atheist where that stupid man (I unsubscribed from Amazing Atheist's channel after learning of his reddit rape threats) rambles for 13 whole minutes without anything of substance. (Note: You may skip the extraneous posting of YouTube videos to the next section with a bold heading.)

For example this fuckwit at 1:53 starts by condemning rape as something that harms a person psychologically only to make a stupid strawman at 2:27 claims that tumblr feminists call rape "worse than genocide...worse than murder". At 3:30 he condemns the feminists as arrogant moral elitists but turns around at 4:00 to defend rape jokes in general (based on http://jezebel.com/5924437/is-it-wrong-to-call-this-20+year+old-who-punched-a-street-harasser-a-hero). 5:30 is where he starts to defend Tosh by dismissing the tumblr writer as a heckler who should've expected Tosh's tastelessness. Basically Amazing Atheist spent a whole 2+ minutes struggling with the simple moral issue that some topics are too dark for comedy.

The other video where I tried with no avail to reason with idiot commenters was at the Young Turks' video about the Tosh controversy:

And nearly 6 months later, we KNOW what Tosh was joking about.

If you can stomach it, read Tosh's joke again: "Wouldn’t it be funny if that girl got raped by like, 5 guys right now? Like right now? What if a bunch of guys just raped her..."

So let's see what being raped by like, five guys sounds like as Wikipedia describes the Indian gang rape (graphic detail ahead!) :

The woman's friend became suspicious when the bus deviated from its normal route and its doors were shut. When he objected, the group of six men already on board taunted the couple, asking what they were doing alone at such a late hour.

When the victim's friend tried to intervene, he was beaten, gagged and knocked unconscious with an iron rod. The men dragged the woman to the rear of the bus, beating her with the rod and raping her while the bus driver continued to drive. Medical reports later suggested that the woman suffered serious injuries to her abdomen, intestines and genitals due to the assault, and doctors say that the damage indicates that a blunt object (suspected to be the iron rod) may have been used for penetration...According to the International Business Times, a police spokesman said that the youngest attacker "sexually abused his victim twice and ripped out her intestines with his bare hands."[9] ...After the beatings and rape ended, the gang threw the two from the moving bus.

Or this story out of Alaska as posted on DU with 41 recs so far, sourcing a huffington post story:

A high school football player and his brother have been arrested by authorities in Alaska for allegedly raping a drunken teenage boy with a beer bottle at a raucous underage drinking party.

...

After someone removed the victims' pants and underwear, Anthony Resetarits allegedly took a 12 oz. Alaskan White beer bottle and inserted the full length of the neck of the bottle into the victim's anus. At least one juvenile male witnessed the assault, which was also captured on a camera.

Or the recent case of high school boys from Steubenville, Ohio who raped an unconscious girl at a party. Others who witnessed the incident never bothered reporting the boys to the police...of course because the rapists were on the school football team! As this NYT profile of the case details, sadly too many people in the Ohio town sacrificed basic morality for HS football player worship. Recently, video of the rapists LAUGHING ABOUT THE INCIDENT leaked online. In fact, much respect to fellow DUer trumad for posting about lecturing (261 recs!!!!!) teenaged sons about this case.

Or this outrageous decision by a court in my home state California to order a new trial for a man convicted of rape: "Because a 19th-century state law does not explicitly protect unmarried rape victims from attackers pretending to be a boyfriend, a California appeals court Thursday overturned a man's conviction for having sex with a sleeping woman."

So whenever you hear comedians like Tosh resort to using rape as comedy, remember these cases. This is what they joke about. Being held against your will around a bunch of sickos who will do everything from posting your ordeal on the internet to everything short of cannibalism. I wonder if Tosh is deep down inside embarrassed for that "wouldn't it be funny if she were raped" comment? What frustrates me is that SO. MANY. FUCKING. PEOPLE in this country lack such BASIC FUCKING MORALITY when it comes to women. Even in COLLEGES! (I say people because it's not just the typical over-entitled alpha male who often comments "sluts/non-virgins deserve it"...but sadly too many women follow that perverted patriarchal authoritarianism.)

In America, conservatives howl "MORALITY IS DOOOOOMMMEDD!!!!!" over the most trivial things like gay marriage, heavy metal music, video games, hell even black children being able to attend suburban schools (y'know because that's "FORCED INTEGRATION&quot .

In the Middle East, fucked-up-mentalist (yeah I said that) Muslims were willing to bomb cities and harm others simply over European political cartoons of the prophet Muhammad.

In India, men AND women NATIONWIDE stood in solidarity with the rape victim nearly every day since the news first came out and sacrificed the new year holidays because the victim DIED.

But where was the picketing outside the Laugh Factory (where Tosh performed that controversial bit) after "Wouldn't it be funny if that girl got raped by like, 5 guys right now?" Or at the University of Notre Dame after Lizzie Seeburg committed suicide because the football players who raped her (and those players get a national championship game) got away with it?

sigh. THIS COUNTRY MAKES ME SO DAMN SICK sometimes.

[niyad]

1. the sheer hatred for women all over the world makes me sick. that this so-called "comic" could

say something like that and not have the audience get up and walk out is beyond sickening.

the war against women continues apace.

[freshwest]

2. Thanks alp for putting this here. Still, some deny the rape culture. You proved it.

[smirkymonkey]

3. Sickening. If it were up to me, he would be, ummmm....

something that I could not mention on DU.

[Tsiyu]

4. Makes me sick as well

Jokes about the powerful are funny. Jokes about the powerless are lame and cheap.

Tosh is an ugly, pathetic excuse of a man and a lousy comic.

I would have walked out as well, since Tosh basically was encouraging the audience to rape the woman. He probably would have laughed, just like Nodiamos, just like a goddamned high school-aged jock King.

What a sick, disgusting, perverted thug Tosh is.

I won't say what I wish would happen to him and all who think rape is a goddamned "joke."

[Tsiyu]

11. And all your assumptions gonna make you look stupid

1) I'm not a hater - but I am someone who thinks Tosh and his ilk are PIGS. That's FACT, not emotion. Anyone who doesn't think Tosh is a pig probably thinks rape jokes are hilarious, too.

2) I'm no kid.

[Undismayed]

5. The AmazingAthiest is hilarious.

Sometimes he says stuff that's off-color, but he is trying to get views you know...

[alp227]

7. Unfortunately the 100k's of ignorant teenagers and dumb 20s-aged men who subscribe to him

take that airhead's anti-feminist bullshit seriously. I used to like Amazing Atheist because of his religion-bashing. Unfortunately he's no better than Eagle Forum or CBN on feminism/women. Unsubbed as a thinking person.

[Undismayed]

8. He's a liberal in case you were wondering.

He has a libertarian streak, but he's quite progressive.

[alp227]

9. No excuse for his blatant misogyny however.

[Undismayed]

10. Yes, that's a common complaint.

No one is perfect. Look at Bill Maher.

[Tsiyu]

14. Are you Tosh?

Or his mama?

Maybe had he made the joke about you - or your girlfriend sitting there - you'd not think it very amusing.

If you are Tosh, apologize and act like a man, not like some goddamned PIG.

Jokes about rape victims are cheap and disgusting, just like Tosh.

[LisaLynne]

12. Even self-proclaimed liberals can be misogynists.

And we liberals don't have to give a pass to anyone proclaiming to be one.

[alp227]

19. Sadly, even DU has its own war on women.

See this general discussion thread exchange as opposed to one of the several feminist board threads about the tosh controversy

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002958016#post5

[randome]

24. I doubt anyone takes him seriously. That's not his schtick.

I don't see him as particularly funny but many do. If you watch or go to one of his shows, you're likely there because you like hearing people insulted or watching stupid people do stupid things.

What he said about rape was just one in a long line of insulting, stupid things.

[Starry Messenger]

20. Would you find lynching jokes funny too?

[Marrah_G]

13. Ugh

He should be ashamed of himself. I hope the women in his family have given him a verbal smackdown.

[Demo_Chris]

15. Some things are inappropriate for humor

Rape certainly falls into this category. Any violent crime really. It is TOTALLY inappropriate to make JOKES about this kind of human suffering! And I see no reason to stop there.

The holocaust (and any genocide) meets this "no joking" threshold, and as Cent suggested 9-11 falls into this as well. And if it is inappropriate to make light of the murder of 3000 Americans on 9-11, it would certainly be inappropriate to make light of any war or it's consequences. So no jokes about war victims. If the point of humor is to be funny, then the pain of the "victims of humor" should be the primary determiner of joke approporateness. And yes, jokes have victims! Don't think they don't! And it is impossible to tell, just looking, how much a joke might hurt someone, so be sensitive please!

Muslims, being particularly sensitive to humor, should definately be avoided as a target for jokes, and since I don't want to discriminate I will include all religions and religious holidays. No more pedophile priest jokes guys! And please people, stop the jokes about Christmas unless you limit them to jokes about mythical creatures immune to personal pain -- think Santa, Rudolf, and Jesus. Wait! Forget that last one, I forgot that some people believe in him. Actually, better to forget them all, as a whole lot of kids still believe in Santa and Rudolf as well. Stay safe and avoid Christmas, Easter, and any other religious holiday.

I should go without saying that jokes about people's appearance are totally inappropriate. Fat people like me have feelings too. On the outside we might look like jolly mountains of mirth, but inside we are crying -- and given our size there is a lot of inside to fill with tears! And it's not just fat people you need to be sensitive of. What about overly skinny people. Anorexics don't just have thin skin, they have thin everything. Keep that in mind before making them the target of a vicious humor assault.

So what's left? Not much.

Blonde jokes are probably fine, as the victims don't understand.

Alzheimer disease is okay because they'll forget you made light of it.

Not a whole lot on the list. And that's as it should be. Humor isn't funny people, it's not a joke! It's fucking serious, and when you forget this people get hurt.

[alp227]

21. what the actual FUCK is this word salad of yours?

As i described, I was battling an army of shitbrained teenagers on YouTube using this bullshit slippery slope argument...if rape jokes are inappropriate then even SANTA CLAUS jokes are inappropriate? One fuckwit on YouTube once commented something like "So? Some people are offended by Tupperware."

Welcome to my ignore list.

[Tsiyu]

22. I suppose you were trying for some humor here?

Fail.

If you think rape jokes are funny, many of us think YOU are part of this culture's problems.

But laugh on, Demo_Chris, and teach your sons to demean rape victims, too. And teach your daughters to expect to be raped and to just laugh it off, it's so fucking FUNNY. Ha Ha.

That'll certainly show us all how serious you are about getting laughs at the expense of others....Yesiree Bob

[Demo_Chris]

23. I guess you missed the point

There is nothing funny about any of the things I mentioned. Murder isn't funny, nor are child abuse, famine, disease, war, violence, or even obesity. People's personal and deeply held religious beliefs aren't funny, 9-11 wasn't funny, and neither was the holocaust. And rape damn sure is not funny.

Hopefully we agree that NONE of these things are even remotely funny in real life.

The question, however, is not whether or not something is humorous in real life. No one has ever said, "It sure was funny when Fred fell down the stairs!" or even "Some stranger threw food right in my face... it was hillarious!"

Yet all of these horrible issues have served as the material for comedy. Spousal abuse is definately not funny, yet Jacky Gleason made a career out of threatening to punch his wife. Incest is not funny, but Jeff Foxworthy made the world laugh when he joked about it. Pedophile priests are absolutely not funny, but I doubt there is a comedian in the western world who hasn't touched that one. Again, priests raping children... it's hard to imagine anything less funny. Let's move on to something else that's never funny: War and the nightmares that go with it. Yet perhaps because of this, the topic has served as inspiration for some of the funniest books and movies ever created. Comedians always have -- and always will -- make jokes about these and other serious subjects. That's the POINT.

You have laughed right along with the rest of us.

But on this one topic, or perhaps this entire family of topics, you have personally decided that this is TOOO FAR. This is the line that decent people cannot cross. Anyone who laughs at one of these jokes is a subhuman misogynistic monster. That's the line in the sand for you. For you.

For others it might be racism, or war, or their religion. Muslims killed ten people in rioting over that one Danish cartoon. A Cartoon! That was their line. Yours is this. Whatever. Draw the line anywhere you want and the court jester is going to cross it. And the people who laugh? They are just like you, with their own lines, and every one of them -- like you -- thinks that they are "better" people because their personal line is wherever it is.

Anyway, I am going to wrap this up by letting an older comedian address this topic. Here, for your listening pleasure, is George Carlin (Warning: Offensive language):

[Tsiyu]

25. "WOULDN'T IT BE FUNNY IF FIVE GUYS RAPED HER LIKE RGHT NOW?"

"Like Right Now?"


No, that was a fucked up retaliation because she didn't like the rape joke.

The penis as WEAPON.

"You don't like my jokes? Then I will humiliate you and threaten you with penises as weapons. Aren't I just a laugh riot?"

No, Tosh, you're a fucking BULLY and a LOSER. If you can't get a laugh without threatening your audience, you suck as a comic


Ha fucking Ha NOT

[seabeyond]

31. carlin is a white man telling groups to not be offended. my son bought a carlin book this xmas

as a gift. i told him, some is funny but understand, he is a white man telling groups how they are suppose to feel on sensitive issues.

what surprised me most is 3 of the adult men in my family are not fans of the man. i like some stuff he does. but i did say, when we discussed him, that too many people think he is some great intellectual. he is not. he is a comedian and he used sensitivities to get his life, a lot of the times.

[ReRe]

16. K&R

x 1000 Talk about passion! Now I have something in MY eye.....

[Incitatus]

17. Tosh is a fucking asshole

I never liked him.

[Stinky The Clown]

18. Daniel Tosh is a disgusting, unfunny, talentless asshole.

And that opinion is before I knew any of this about him.

[Z_I_Peevey]

28. +1

[PeaceNikki]

26. Honestly, I wish he'd just STFU and go away.

I don't give a shit what he has to say about anything.

[YoungDemCA]

27. What an asshole, and how dare that some so-called "progressives" would defend him...

..based on the "It's humor!" bullshit defense.

Women (and men) have every right to take offense at these kind of "jokes."

[LittleBlue]

29. Never found him very funny

People like him are just looking for attention ie Kathy Griffin. Comedians who aren't big like Leno need this attention to stay relevant and get gigs.

Don't give it to him.

[appleannie1]

30. I've never liked insult based humor and there is NOTHING laughable about rape.

[alp227]

32. B.t.t.t. for more visibility