Kucinich: "the Pentagon cannot properly account for $1.2 trillion in transactions"

[PETRUS]

Read more: http://www.commondreams.org/further/2012/12/28-4

[wildbilln864]

1. last time I heard something like this....

the WTC was attacked the next day!

[Rosa Luxemburg]

16. Rumsfeld still has it tucked under his mattress

[me b zola]

33. That was 2.3 trillion

We should keep a tab of what the pentagon owes us. Take that to the negotiation table as our offer to pay down the national debt.

[truth2power]

2. What a coinky-dink. Hmmm? n/t

[AldoLeopold]

56. Yah but Pentagon accounting errors have been going on for a LONG time

It's ALOT more than 1.2 trillion - and military accountants are extremely thorough. Just anecdotally, the former Air Force accountant who runs the books at my work flips if even a paper clip is missing.

[niyad]

3. colour me sooooo not surprised. and our spineless, gutless representatives do nothing to

correct the situation.

[Flashmann]

6. our spineless, gutless representatives do nothing to correct the situation.

Why should they??...Why WOULD they.....The more unaccounted money floating around,the easier it is to "appropriate some for oneself......

We're talking about a group of people,sorry lot that they are,who are DRIVEN mainly by greed and selfishness..I say that with apologies to the,perhaps,one half percent of politicians that are not primarily dollar worshippers.....

I don't dispute for one second that they're spineless and gutless.I just don't see those two hallmark characteristics,of the typical Pol,being the huge factor that greed is.....

[Cal33]

4. There should be a strict no-nonsense investigation. And if any hanky-panky can be proven,

the wrong-doers should be punished according to the law.

[spanone]

5. President Eisenhower, a FIVE star general, warned us of the military industrial complex....

and we did nothing.

[Fumesucker]

7. Is this the same organization that lost pallets of $100 bills in Iraq?

The five sided rathole?

[NMDemDist2]

8. basic accounting

how can you not keep records where the $$$ went??



I procure micro purchases for the government, i have to account for every penny from two directions. good grief

[Curmudgeoness]

9. Oh, I bet they do know where the money went.

They just don't want anyone else to know.

[The Wielding Truth]

14. ding ding ding ....... we have a winner

[AnotherMcIntosh]

10. If Obama wanted accountability for the $1.2 trillion, he could demand that.

[datasuspect]

53. someone else went there

he died in dallas.

[goclark]

65. Point well taken

Sad but true.

[maddezmom]

11. This number is from the speech DK gave on February 17, 2002 n/t

[Diclotican]

12. PETRUS

Last edited Sat Dec 29, 2012, 04:18 PM - Edit history (1)

PETRUS

Then Pentagon should be cut at the same sum - because if they "lose" 1.2 trillion dollar, they sure do not need all the money they do get from the US government.... Other government offices who waste money, (at least in other nations) will be punished by not given the same sum to work with next year - or to "save" the money they displeased over a couple of years..

To just waste 1.2 trillion dollar - and get away with it - that is something for the news papers I would say...

after advice from a member of the "grammar police" I changed some words, to possible give a better text for the poor souls who might be offended by a foreigner using the noble american-english language.

Diclotican

[adieu]

20. Please edit your post

"loose" means not tight.
"lose" means to have something missing.

You want to use the latter, not the former. Otherwise, it makes your post look juvenile and Tea-baggish.

[Flashmann]

22. it makes your post look juvenile and Tea-baggish.

Yeah,I have to agree.......This is fundamental,basic grammar at the 4th grade level,and it irritates me to no end too...

As you say,"loose" means not tight.

When you LOSE something it is LOST.......NOT loost......

[idwiyo]

44. I hope by now you realise that Diclotican is not native English speaker.

[Flashmann]

63. I didn't realize or consider that....

I am sorry and I am ashamed.....

[idwiyo]

71. All well that ends well :)

[Diclotican]

47. Flashmann

Flashmann

I agree that my english is far worse then yours - but then again I'm not exactly fluent in your noble language - I'm far more fluent in my own native tongue than in your noble english.. Who is a bastard language made out of anglo-saxian, Norman french and latin by the way....

But, I also suspect that most understand in a degree what I meant - but sometimes it might not be good enough for your soul out there..

And the fellow who advised me to do it better, he could have been doing it better in a PM or something that - and I would have been more than happy enough to do it better - and possible not even pointed to it either.

Diclotican

[Flashmann]

64. Diclotican

I apologize,sincerely......In my ignorance,I didn't consider the possibilty that you might be unfamiliar with the english language...So much for nobility.....I am genuinely ashamed of myself,and I beg your pardon......

[A HERETIC I AM]

66. Take yourself out back....

And beat the shit out of yourself.

[Flashmann]

68. Take yourself out back

At 16 degrees,it's bit chilly for that.....I think I'm doing an adequate job of it,here at my desk.....

[Diclotican]

69. Flashmann

Flashmann

No hard feeling my friend - it was a honest mistake on your part - so no hard feeling on my part English is a difficult language to learn and maybe even better if you have to translate from another language - to english... I have always envy ed people who is fluent in english, my own english is not exactly perfect.. I strife for a better english - even though I am at a loss for many of the finer points in the english language...

I hope you have a nice sunday - and also ha happy new year when it comes to you.

Diclotican

[Diclotican]

29. adieu

adieu

Right - the grammar police strikes again - thank you for your imput anyway - wil edit my post.

And I am from a tea-party member

Diclotican

[arikara]

37. Diclotican

Please ignore their churlish behaviour. There are many of us here who appreciate your posts very much.

[Diclotican]

39. arikara

arikara

Thank you - I have over the years discovered that many here like my post, I'm not always sure why but some like my post, others not so much. But I am always interesting in learning to write better english - and I hope that my english is better now, than it was when I started out here. But some may not like my "creative" use of the english language - and is going little "grammar-police" on me.

But to say that I am a tea-bagger, that is an insult to every good tea I would say

And I'm not to much insulted by them anyway... I guess they have no clue about a foreign language outside of english anyway...

Diclotican

[arikara]

58. Diclotican

You have a wonderful sense of humor and a great attitude.

[idwiyo]

41. Please accept my apology for such a rude and uncalled for behaviour.

I always read your posts and always appreciate them.

[Diclotican]

46. idwiyo

idwiyo

Thank you - and I gracefully accept your apology for a rude person

Thank you too - that you appreciate my humble post - it might not be much of a writing, but it is always nice to be recognized for my work

Diclotican

[dballance]

34. If you want to correct someone's grammar

why don't you do it privately and politely in DU e-mail rather than publicly in the thread? What purpose does it serve to embarrass someone publicly?

[adieu]

60. I have no intention of embarrassing anyone publicly

I think it's useful for others to see it because I see loose/lose a lot on various forums, so explaining it here should help inform others as well.

I'm not here to embarrass people. I'm here to help people raise their arguments to a higher level. Once you make some terribly stupid spelling error, it just destroys your otherwise very cogent and valid point.

Indeed, I do believe that I made that clear in the post.

I don't know Diclotican from Adam. But that doesn't excuse him from having clear, lucid and correct grammar.

I know RW'ers who use bad grammar, and I know who they are. They're smarter than how they write and I believe they deliberately misspell or misuse words just to hedge their positions that their points are attempting to make. We shouldn't play that game. We should be direct, clear and deadly focused.

Know your loose/lose, they're/their/there, then/than, a lot/allot/(no such thing as alot), and definitely spell DEFINITELY as d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y and not "definately".

Step it up, guys and gals.

[idwiyo]

62. You told someone who is not native English speaker they write like a teabagger and their grammar

sucks. Twice now.

Something to remember:
- there are a lot of foreign posters on DU for whom English is a foreign language.
- there are a lot of posters on DU who have dyslexia
- there are a lot of posters on DU who have other reasons why the write the way they write

Because one never knows, it's always a good idea to correct their writing style in private or in a stand alone OP.

[arikara]

36. That is just rude

Many people including myself appreciate Diclotican's posts and its obvious that English is not his first language. That type of judgmental behaviour is what is more juvenile and tea baggish.

[idwiyo]

40. You do know that Diclotican is writing his posts in foreign language?

[sabrina 1]

42. No, it doesn't. What it does to those who are not ready to jump on

on everyone without knowing anything about them, is to tell us that English is a second, maybe even third language for this DUer.

How many languages do you speak and write in btw? Perhaps you can converse with this poster in their own language in which I am sure they are fluent? I think it is admirable that someone has taken the time to learn our language in order to be able to converse with us. And it is embarrassing to see anyone attack them for a minor error in a language that is not their own.

It is extremely rude to do what you just did without apparently knowing anything about the poster.

Welcome to DU btw.

[Dustlawyer]

13. We need COMPLETE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM (CCFR)!!!

All of this is caused by our special interests running amok! They own our politicians, both parties are guilty! We need to take back our government, not our country, it is still here! If we all start demanding CCFR, we can eventually get it. Want to make a difference? Just get others to pass this on! Most of our issues would be better served being decided by representative government. Here, the missing money and equipment would not be near as large a number if these contractors did not have politicians protecting them and funneling them our tax dollars! We need to break up too big to fail banks and the media conglomerates that use our airwaves! General Electric owns a network and is one of the biggest military contractors we have. I find that a huge conflict of interest! We need statutory protection from so called news organizations (in this case it was Fox of course) who are able to legally lie, air false stories, because under the law they are "entertainment!!!" Let's get these scum bags who unfairly influence our government out! Imagine how much our politicians could do if they did not have to spend most of their time fundraising. Spread the word!

[John2]

19. There is a

double standard in this country and it starts with our elected officials. Even on the Judiciary, these people are dishonest. They seem to be more concerned about waste in Social programs, but when to comes to Defense,it goes by the way side. The person calling FOX entertainment should be impeached. The person I have in mind is Scalia. He is making up too many laws.

[bvar22]

28. Catch-22.

The same people that would have to write, propose, and pass legislation
to enact this reform...
ARE the Very Same Ones Riding-the-Gravy-Train.
They are not about to bite the hand that feeds them.



The ONLY way this comes to pass is through direct action,
like [font color=firebrick]OCCUPY![/font]
...and you have seen how BOTH dominant Political Parties DEAL with movements like Occupy!


...but there IS hope.
Our neighbors in Latin America have given us a Blue Print for REAL "change".
They HAVE successfully taken their governments away from the Plutocrats,
but you won't hear about it from the US Media or either Political party.
They will continue to demonize the successful Social Reforms in Latin America,
and continue to fund the few remaining Right Wing Police States like Colombia.
(Obama just gave THEM a Brand New Free Trade treaty!)

When the American Working Class & The Poor realize that WE have MORE in common with each other
than we have in common with the 1%elite and their employees in Washington,
THEN we can have change too.
The successful Populist Reform Movements in Latin America give me "hope" for The World.

Spread the Word.
VIVA Democracy!
and pray we get some here soon!

[Dustlawyer]

70. Direct action like OWS is great, but it is not big enough yet. I am not saying that demanding

COMPLETE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM is the only way, they are not mutually exclusive. Many who can't, or won't, take part in OWS, may recruit hundreds or thousands to call for CCFR! CCFR would require a huge mass of people from both parties, but it can be done! Who wants to cede control to the rich assholes? OWS should make this the issue in my opinion. CCFR is a direct attack on the powers that be. If we were to succeed at CCFR, most everything would fall into place. We will always need to be vigilant b/c they will never stop.

[bvar22]

72. You don't get it.

You seem to be under the delusion that if enough of a majority politely asks our "representatives" to do something that will adversely affect their incomes and investments, that they will reply,
"Oh sure. Here you go."

*Over 70% of the American people supported a Public Option.

* 65 percent (of ALL Americans, Democrats AND Republicans) say the government should guarantee health insurance for everyone -- even if it means raising taxes.

* 66 percent would reduce the deficit not by cutting domestic spending but by reducing Pentagon spending or raising taxes.

* 77 percent believe the country should do "whatever it takes" to protect the environment.

* 87 percent think big oil corporations are gouging consumers, and 80 percent (including 76 percent of Republicans) would support a windfall profits tax on the oil giants if the revenues went for more research on alternative fuels.

* 69 percent agree that corporate offshoring of jobs is bad for the U.S. economy (78 percent of "disaffected" voters think this), and only 22% believe offshoring is good because "it keeps costs down."

http://alternet.org/story/29788/

* 92% of ALL Americans support TRANSPARENT, VERIFIABLE elections!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x446445


The Point is....We no longer have a representative government.
If 90% of the American People signed a petition demanding Campaign Finance Reform,
NOTHING would happen from either of the two entrenched Status Quo parties.

The ONLY avenue that remains is working OUTSIDE the framework of the established Political parties.
THAT is how our neighbors in Latin America were able to achieve "change", and THAT is how we will have to do it here.

OWS was a good start.
Unfortunately, the forces of the entrenched Status Quo have gotten very good at infiltration, decapitation, provocation, False Flags, and militarized, coordinated, violent suppression of opposition movements in the USA.

My Wife & I went On Strike in 2006.
We are patiently waiting for you to join us.
Very little of our Labor & Money now goes to funding Wall Street Bailouts,
WARS, the MIC, Political Joy Rides, or conspicuous over consumption.

We are living well on a laughably low "taxable" income,
and skills we learned in the 60s.

[PETRUS]

74. Meanwhile...

...the holders of the minority opinions negotiate with themselves over the details and praise the virtues of compromise.

[JDPriestly]

15. Thanks for posting this.

[Historic NY]

17. If they built the F35 JSF that Canada & others are now..

peddling away from you will find it. The program is estimated now to top 1.45 trillion.

[Fire Walk With Me]

18. Stop interrupting their theft of US tax dollars! (cries)

[Electric Monk]

31. Leave the pentagon alone!!

[Autumn]

21. I think they can account for it. The problem is that they

won't, and no one really cares enough to insist that they do. Except for a couple of our politicians on the fringe and they will be ignored as usual.

[SomethingFishy]

23. 2.3 trillion is the number I heard..

There are a number of vids on you tube of Rumsfeld admitting it's 2.3 trillion...


This is what pisses me off about S.S. and medicare and tax rates... There is plenty of fucking money, so much so that missing a couple trillion doesn't cause much of a stir. Yet we need to cut a few billion from social programs...

Sorry I'm not falling for the "fiscal joke"..

[Sunlei]

24. There's the trillion in our Federal money Bush/Cheney squandered

[jmowreader]

25. How much of that never made it to DoD?

One of those things we prim, proper liberals don't discuss is the role of the defense budget in holding money for non-defense expenditures and controversial shit that could never be enacted in stand-alone bills.

This speech was given in 2002, when Bush could do anything he wanted. He and his minions were packing cash in huge leather satchels and shipping it to their contractor buddies, declaring it "defense expenditures."

A treasury officer named Eliot Ness was sent to Chicago. during Prohibition to rid the town of strong drink and to jail one Al Capone. Because putting Capone in jail rather than punishing him for some specific thing he'd done was the goal, Ness prepared a series of cases against Capone. If he was acquitted on one charge another would immediately be brought. How this applies: Since Bush did so many things, I would start by charging him with looting the Treasury to enrich his friends.

On real expenditures, the military has always been real nit picky. And this went down to the smallest expenditure: in 1991 the government gave unit fund councils $20 per soldier to throw a Fourth of July party. The council president had to account for the money to buy the food, the raw food to ensure no one took any home, the cooked food to ensure only approved people ate it...I almost thought they were going to require the troops to shit in buckets the next day so we could weigh it. When The Troops spend money there are extremely tight controls - ask any supply sergeant or mess hall headcounter. It's private industry that throws it around.

[libodem]

26. Black Ops

They funnel money to secret projects that are too fucked up to take credit for. Out quietly fomenting disaster to justify the spending.

[AldoLeopold]

55. And you know what kind of Black Ops right?

I won't go further, because it violates the TOS - but comon. COMON. If this country ever falls apart I wonder what kind of madness will finally come to light.

[msongs]

27. as the commander in chief to account for the money nt

[dballance]

35. Funny.

You must believe the Commander in Chief actually has real power over the military. He doesn't. Nor does his Secretary of Defense really have power. They're in office for, at most, 8 years. The Joint Chiefs of Staff and all the senior generals and admirals are in power for far longer and can ignore the President because he/she won't be there long enough to effect real change.

[sabrina 1]

43. And that needs to change. That is the exact opposite of what the FFs intended

for this government. To give that much power to the military was something they tried to prevent.

The government should be cleaned out after every election and a new president should appoint new people so that no one gets entrenched in these powerful positions.

Why have elections at all if the President has no power? Why not just place an actor in the WH (wait, we did that already, didn't we?). Either the president has power or s/he doesn't. If it is true they do not, then we the people have to do something about it.

[dballance]

45. You are ABSOLUTELY Correct

The FF's disbanded the "regulars" after the Revolution. They didn't want a standing army as is evidenced by the fact that years after the revolution they didn't write one into the Constitution.

The military and the military industrial complex have become a de facto fourth branch of our government. And they have all the weapons by the way.

[Starry Messenger]

30. But yet the military isn't being threatened with cat food diets to make up the shortfall.

[KoKo]

48. True...they are the Exception. Wonder why that is? N/T

[Starry Messenger]

49. Imperialism.

[Ian62]

32. Yep. Obama proposed saving $12bn a year by linking SS with chained cpi

but he doesn't want to do anything about the Pentagon's missing $1,200bn.

[KoKo]

50. Why isn’t Obama demanding corporate welfare cuts? $2.6 trillion without touching Safety Net!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022031440

Instead it's "Chained CPI" re: SS!

[Ian62]

57. Thank you for your article

A most important piece

[limpyhobbler]

38. Defense industry acts all like they are entitled to our money.

Put 'em on a diet already.

[AldoLeopold]

51. 1.2 Trillion?

Last edited Sat Dec 29, 2012, 10:00 PM - Edit history (1)

[link:|

[boomer55]

52. Careful there Dennis. The last time we got into this 9/11 happened

And it magically got forgotten about

[lovuian]

54. One bomb dropped is about a million dollars

talk about a waste of money

Being at war since for over 10 years is Ridiculous and is taking its toll on the country

the Military is going to have to be cut

[Skittles]

59. they would account for it, if they were ever held accountable

[Egalitarian Thug]

61. There is so much going into so many places it is easy to find enough to balance the budget this year

without touching a single dollar that goes to the benefit of the bottom 80%.

Perhaps Senator Sanders should reinstate Senator Proxmire's Golden Fleece award.

[Paulie]

67. This hs been going on for a long time

And people like Chuck Spinney have been shining sunlight on the Versailles on the Potomac for decades.

http://nation.time.com/2011/07/19/the-defense-death-spiral/

[Rex]

73. Oopsie...can we have a few trillion more?

We PROMISE not to lose it, this time...