Two weeks later: The answer is more guns.

[cali]

This country's response to Newtown is more guns not more gun control. Since the massacre, there has been a frenzied buying spree, a spike in NRA membership and more schools putting in place plans for armed guards and arming teacher

We are insane.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_SMALLBIZ_GUNS_FOR_CHRISTMAS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2012-12-28-20-57-21

[graham4anything]

1. Only from the racist radical rightwing tea/repubs and libertarians and conspiracy theorists loons

but they get immediate action

what the rest of the nation will get is more and more killings

but the spark has been lit and this time it will eventually lead to a whole different system

But it might take 6 years of elections still, and tens of thousands of deaths

leading to the question

WHO WILL BE THE LAST CHILD, THE LAST PERSON TO DIE from a mass murderer in the streets of the USA because of the blackmailing hold of the NRA and the gun nuts?

[cali]

3. I know it's comforting to believe that, but it's not true.

[graham4anything]

4. the answer is simple MIKE BLOOMBERG THE GREAT EQUALIZER

the mirror opposite of the NRA

financing any/all candidates (on any side) to go against the NRA

hopefully the democrats will catch on quick and 100% go against the NRA and get guns off the streets, to secure his backing

like happened in California, which was the test
the pro-NRA incumbent lost in a major upset to the anti-NRA

their side is smaller and though the NRA has a major advantage, their side has a definitive # of people

the other side is an unlimited number of people

6 years, all politicians will be up for office from 1 to 3 times.
With the knowledge the NRA can't buy them and blackmail them, and someone watching their back, they can learn to change, or they will be changed from having the title of house,senate, governor, etc.

Money can't buy the presidency, however, it can help turn the tide against the guns and NRA
within 6 years

all it takes is a new supreme court to define the 2nd different, not even to change it, just define it different, and some money

[cali]

5. you're just not making a lot of sense here.

and you're operating on a lot of assumptions. You're assuming that Bloomberg will back every pro-gun control candidate. You seem to be assuming that every well financed pro-gun control candidate will win. You assume all democrats are pro-gun control. You assume that California is representative of the the rest of the country. You assume that this debate can be neatly packaged with "sides". You assume that "their side is smaller".

Your assumptions are deeply flawed.

Let me give you an example: Bernie Sanders has consistently opposed gun control. It's a major factor in how he got elected to Congress in the first place. You think you can defeat Bernie in Vermont?

[graham4anything]

7. your logic here is flawed-no one has tried.

If you put up BernieSanders2 who is for the same things as Bernie except gun control,
or you rename/reframe the issue, then why not?
Also, Bernie is just a loud voicepiece, but if he were the 60th vote, how do you know which way he would vote here?

He would vote on the side of the people. If the people are now saying they want it, he will vote with them if he is the 60th vote

If not, he, like 99% of the time,really doesn't matter at all.

He serves a purpose, but at end of day, he votes Democratic.

Now, Mike Bloomberg singlehandedly elected Angus King because of King's gun stance.
So you tell me.

(and whether or not I would be sad if Sanders were not in office is irrelevant, this is not personal personalities, but the gun issue, which is why everyone should put their hatred of Bloomberg if they have any, for other wedge issues, aside.

[cali]

10. absolutely... wrong

as far as Bernie goes. You don't Vermont very well, do you? And Bernie is far more than "a loud voicepiece"- whatever that's supposed to mean.

And it's ridiculous to claim that Bloomberg singlehandedly elected King.

You're living in a silly fantasy world where the angel Bloomberg is going to magically transform the political landscape- and for the record, I don't hate him or like him.

[graham4anything]

14. It took 100 years from Lincoln to LBJ signing acts. 50 more to have a black President.

90% of the people used to smoke
now 90% don't.

and its not violence in movies, because America steals from the japanese films from day one
and they don't live out the fantasies in the movies
It is the wild wild west which NEVER existed as sheriffs banned guns from the street

it can be done
but it will take at least 6 years maybe 20 or a new court to narrow define what the 2nd means

[LAGC]

2. Yup.

Nothing is going to change.

And if this latest mass-shooting couldn't do it, nothing will.

[KharmaTrain]

6. Sadly...What I Expected...

Those who want/need to cling to their guns will find way...there's ZERO political will among politicians to take on the NRA and a corporate media that plays constant false equivalency games that not only distort the issues but attempt to further alienate and polarize people. Here on DU we still see people talking past one another rather than to one another...with little accomplished other than more angst and animosity. Yep...two weeks after this horrendous massacre, we're back to where we were before the shooting began...the stage set for another shooting spree...more victims...and we'll play this mental masturbation game again. Sad...shamefull...disgusting!

[cali]

8. well put.

[graham4anything]

9. How possibly could you expect something to change on the other side in 2 weeks...

when congress is NOT even in session.

It would be easy if the President were a dictator, but he is not.

It will take years.

It took over 250 years of what it is now to be in people's minds, and you are lamenting 2 weeks?

A good analogy is a major flaw in a car
One person dies from it and the manufacturer does nothing
10 die, nothing
100 die, nothing
1000 die and they issue a total recall and fix it

[KharmaTrain]

11. Nothing's Changed...

This isn't about Congress...it's about a national mindset that is what spurs the legislative...or in this case won't. Just like the a woman's right to choose this issue is highly polarized in such a manner where the two sides don't talk to one another...only past. You see it here on DU where "gun nuts" use the same talking points against the "gun grabbers" and visa versa. Except for a rare moment of exhaustion when someone will try to reach out, the "debate" are two echo chambers that got louder and louder in the days following this massacre.

I didn't even refer to the President in my post as I know there's nothing he alone can do...this is a breakdown of the legislative. Do you honestly think we'll see any serious gun control or strengthening of existing laws with a Congress that is willing to sell 99% of the country down the economic river to protect .02%? While I applaud those who will try to push legislation to get these murder machines off the streets, I know it's yet another futile effort that won't even see the light of day in the rushpublican controlled house and surely won't pass a 60 vote level in the Senate. Thus where are we? I wish this wasn't the case but there's no political will to really address the out of control gun culture in this country head on...and a polarized populace that still can't discuss it without letting passions get ahead of rational discussion. Yes...unfortunately more innocent people...and children will die. Prove me wrong...please!!!

[graham4anything]

12. Mike Bloomberg. For a change.

[KharmaTrain]

19. And His Infulence Is???

...especially with rushpublicans...a party he used and threw away? Do you really think he's got the clout to convince 218 Congressional rushpublicans to vote for any gun control? It's good the NYC mayor...like many others...are speaking out against the bloodshed happening but he alone is another voice in the wilderness. Maybe he'll use some of his billions to help educate and that someday we may have a smarter country that can deal with this issue. Right now that ain't gonna happen. The only change I've seen in the past two weeks is the names of the latest victims...nothing more.

Personally I'd love to see those on this side of the sandbox who want to try to start on the long hard road to getting any real meaningful gun control to start in demonizing those who make and sell guns similar to how the right has ostracized those who perform abortions. Make it such a big cause that it begins to counteract the big money the NRA and its proxies throw in distorting the issue. Right now there's no real will in this country for an honest dialogue about guns yet any meaningful legislation to close loopholes and give law enforcement clear laws to enforce.

[graham4anything]

20. He is a liberal democrat. NOT a repub. Stop confusing the person with his winning an office

and he is not running for anything

But except for a couple of kids in the OWS, he is extremely popular with both sides.

again, all you want is instant gratification, and it is impossible under our system on this side of the issue

all you see or hear is the other side

And what the hell do you think Bloomberg is doing but throwing his own personal money against the NRA during elections.

and there is no middle ground as any bullet kills, so you need to get rid of all to make the streets safe

[KharmaTrain]

21. Huh??

Bloomberg WON his first term as a rushpublican...and has changed his affiliation to Independent...he's NEVER been a liberal Democrat. And that means nothing anyway. He has little sway with people outside of New York City...one of many, many mayors (most who are REAL Democrats) who have been calling for more gun control and tighter enforcement of laws. And we see how well that's gone with legislators so far...nowhere.

Let's stick to the OP, please...this has nothing to do with OWS or what ever "other side" you imagine I'm hearing things from. I'm writing observations...and they remain that two weeks after this horrendous tragedy this country is still as polarized as ever about the concept of guns...be it registration, banning assault weapons and 30 round clips and even discussing any legislation. The corporate news media has moved onto the next big thing...this issue will once again fade and there will be less and less political will by those who can make a difference to do so.

You're the one who is dreaming if you think there's the political will to get rid of all guns...

[graham4anything]

23. sorry, but the NRA is toast.

Much as you might want otherwise it appears, the beginning of the end of the NRA has started

Nobody before agreed to put BILLIONS up against the NRA millions

[99Forever]

15. I fear you..

... are correct. Sadly so.

[graham4anything]

16. there was zero will for LBJ to sign the voting rights/civil rights & 50 other acts into law

but he saw and open and did it

otherwise it would have been the same 50 years later as I never bought the certainty that either JFK or RFK would have or could have.

and if it doesn't we will have tens of htousands of more deaths

and watch, soon it will be friendly fire that makes the next one happen

when you get anarchy, you get anarchists

zimmerman already proved the vigilante can kill and nothing happens til it happens

[spanone]

13. sick society. insane, yes.

[B Calm]

17. That wacko Arizona sheriff

wanting armed citizens to patrol school grounds. Want if one of the armed citizens is another nut case?

[farminator3000]

18. i'm not sure 'answer' is the right word. it implies that it might be right!

i totally agree. it's basically an unorganized civil war going on here.

couldn't obama declare a state of national emergency (someone shot every 45 minutes?) and skirt congress by executive power?

if he did something reasonable, that even gunners could understand, and it worked out, it could be even help him politically.

i realize that's a bit idealistic, but sheesh, LaPew is making us look like freaks in front of the UN

"The cornerstone of our freedom is the Second Amendment. Neither the United Nations, nor any
other foreign influence, has the authority to meddle with the freedoms guaranteed by our Bill of
Rights, endowed by our Creator, and due to all humankind."-La Pew

who the F is born with a gun?

[cali]

22. what I meant was the answer to the queston of what will we do about guns

post-Newtown.