General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsA proposal to encourage responsible gun ownership.
The basic conflict between gun owners and those who would restrict access to guns is the increased risk that the widespread availability of guns impose on people who do not themselves own or wish to own guns. The laws that currently enable responsible gun owners to have guns also enable irresponsible people to obtain and misuse firearms. If a responsible and conscientious gun owner opposes more stringent regulation to keep firearms out of the hands of those who might abuse them, then he must accept that he bears partial responsibility for abuse when it does occur. His right comes at a cost to others. One person's right to own a Bushmaster compromises another person's right to send his kids off to school without constant anxiety for their well-being.
An alternative way to encourage more responsible gun ownership could be a system of collective accountability by the gun-owning community. My suggestion is that each gun owner should be required to be vouched for by 5 other gun owners. If a gun owner misuses a gun or allows a gun that he owns to be misused, the people who vouched for him would also be criminally and civilly liable for the misuse of that gun to a reduced, but non-trivial, extent.
People who vouched for other gun owners would then have a vested interest in keeping tabs on those owners- their attitude, circumstances, and behavior. If a person vouching for another gun owner changed his mind or moved out of the area, that would be documented and he would have to be replaced within a short period of time. Obviously, a gun owner who couldn't find or keep 5 people to share responsibility for his gun-ownership would have limitations on his ability to possess firearms.
I arbitrarily picked 5 as the number of people needed to vouch for another gun owner's good character and behavior. The number could be lower or higher. The number of people required to vouch for another person's gun ownership could also be variable, depending on circumstances, including the types of weapons owned and the geographical location.
The general idea is that the level of responsibility of gun ownership should be made commensurate with increased risk to the community as a whole that accompanies the right of gun ownership.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)him.
Probably need qualifications for "vouchers." But, general idea is good.
hay rick
(7,640 posts)Last edited Fri Dec 28, 2012, 01:48 AM - Edit history (1)
1. Must own at least one registered gun.
2. Must have confirmed address.
3. Must not have a criminal record.
And, assuming they didn't have criminal records, 6 Aryan Nation wingnuts could indeed all vouch for each other. But that's ok- I'm looking for an improved system, not perfection.
LP2K12
(885 posts)a full comprehensive background check? The kind like I, and many others, had to get to enlist with a security clearance in military intel.
At the cost of the person who wants to own the firearm of course.
I mean, if it's a true NEED to own the firearm, you must be willing to pay for the privilege/right... correct?
I'd have no problem with this.
jody
(26,624 posts)Kaleva
(36,345 posts)like a candidate for President goes thru. Plus going thru numerous public debates facing people who oppose you're getting a permit. And then having the public vote on if you ought to get a permit. One could dedicate two or more years of their life in pursuit of getting a permit and the odds would be stacked against them.
jody
(26,624 posts)farminator3000
(2,117 posts)the public gets to vote if you want to open a pizza place..
Kaleva
(36,345 posts)Coyote_Tan
(194 posts)farminator3000
(2,117 posts)living in your house.
having a bank account
your refrigerator for pete's sake
your gun?
NickB79
(19,270 posts)Same with having a bank account and owning a refrigerator.
You do realize that, right?
farminator3000
(2,117 posts)privilege
noun
1.
a right, immunity, or benefit enjoyed only by a person beyond the advantages of most: the privileges of the very rich.
2.
a special right, immunity, or exemption granted to persons in authority or office to free them from certain obligations or liabilities: the privilege of a senator to speak in Congress without danger of a libel suit.
3.
a grant to an individual, corporation, etc., of a special right or immunity, under certain conditions.
4.
the principle or condition of enjoying special rights or immunities.
5.
any of the rights common to all citizens under a modern constitutional government: We enjoy the privileges of a free people.
NickB79
(19,270 posts)By that definition, we as US citizens have no rights whatsoever. Exercising my 1st Amendment right to post on the Internet requires a computer. A woman using her right to obtain a legal abortion usually requires money to be paid. My right against unreasonable search and seizure of property requires I have money to purchase said property in the first place.
I'd suggest you look up the legal definition of "intrinsic rights" before you make yourself look any more foolish. As it stands, your 5th definition you listed bolsters my case:
As in, we are privileged to live in a country where our intrinsic rights, as defined in our constitution, are protected. Driving a car is not a constitutionally protected right, as the courts have repeatedly upheld.
derby378
(30,252 posts)They need some serious learnin'.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)Coyote_Tan
(194 posts)You are not billed for the right to speak.
Ok sir, you've got an approved 30 minute free speech license.
Or...
Okee dokee... One voucher for 30 days of protection from unreasonable search and seizure. You wouldn't be doing anything immoral would you? I think we are going to have to keep a closer eye on you.
It's for the greater good after all.
LP2K12
(885 posts)and I have no problem with this idea.
Paying for or buying into something shows that you really need it.
You can spend a couple hundred on the firearm, another hundred or so on the fingerprinting and class for the CCL... but you can't see paying for a comprehensive background check to verify you're "right" to own that firearm is backed by a comprehensive review of your background?
People like to use the big R word... RIGHT.
Let's start focusing on the other big R word... RESPONSIBILITY.
I don't want to take your firearm(s) away. I do, however, want to make it more difficult for irresponsible owners to get their hands on them.
So... charge for the bg check, charge for fingerprinting and CCL, charge for the firearm, limit the amount of ammunition on can have on hand outside of a range, limit magazine capacity. Hell, I'd even consider having to carry insurance like one does on their automobile, motorcycle, etc.
Heck, why not have tiered insurance? You get a inspection of your home for homeowners insurance. Listen here Mr/s. Gunowner. Here's your annual premium for your firearm insurance. However, if you let our inspecter verify that you have the proper means of storing the firearm in your home, we'll discount that rate. Take some sort of class every few years re-verifying you can safely operate your firearm... another discount.
That's just me though. I'm not afraid of losing my firearms and I'm not afraid to pay for something I love to do.
farminator3000
(2,117 posts)it takes the guy in the parking lot of the gun show out of the equation.
3 people would be enough for me.
call it the Firearm Owners Sponsorship Initiative!
NickB79
(19,270 posts)And you think that's going to fly with "reasonable" people?!?
It would be like suggesting we fight the war on drugs by arresting EVERYONE on in an apartment complex because ONE guy was found with drugs in his apartment. Would that sound reasonable to you?
farminator3000
(2,117 posts)that would only be reasonable...
ever hear of a cigarette tax?
cthulu2016
(10,960 posts)A cigarette tax is not a collective punishment. It is a tax on cigarettes.
farminator3000
(2,117 posts)what is a collective punishment?
farminator3000
(2,117 posts)my first. not a bad idea, in theory...