CNN and Wolf Blitzer just talked to Hamas spokesman Osama Hamdan...

[Archae]

The guy talked and talked and talked...but didn't say anything, naturally.

Blamed the entire mess on Israel, of course, they do nothing wrong, and changed the subject when Wolf mentioned the terrorist rockets.

Is this typical of Hamas? Afraid so.

And as long as Hamas has it's groupies in other countries, they never will knock off the shit.

[msongs]

1. Israel and Hamas are a natural pair, 2 peas in a pod nt

[bigwillq]

6. Indeed

[teddy51]

2. And along with the current leaders of Israel, they make a lovely Terrorist couple. To damn bad

that the innocents are the ones dying though.

[SoCalMusicLover]

3. Gotta Love All The Anti-Israel Folk On DU

How can anybody not respect Hammas, and show support for the Palestinian people in Gaza?

Aside from the "Death To America" chants, and the occasional burning in effigy of our President, and all the "Death To Israel," calls, they're a nice friendly group of ordinary cats. They probably wouldn't harm a fly.

An Israeli or an American on the other hand...

[teddy51]

5. And my guess would be that you see Israel as totally innocent in all of what is going on!

Hey lets not worry about the fact that they assassinated a Hammas leader.

[Archae]

8. They killed a terrorist.

The guy they blew up BRAGGED about how many more rocket attacks he and his goons would launch, against Israeli civilians.

But...that's ok, "Palestinians can do no wrong!"

[teddy51]

11. So Terrorist's assassinating a terrorist is ok, gotcha.

[SoCalMusicLover]

12. No, Israel Is To Blame As Well

I don't like hearing how this many innocent children were killed in a rocket attack. An innocent is an innocent, regardless of whether they're Israeli or Palestinian.

But Hamas is an evil group. And they are the chosen leaders of the population. Just like IDIOT was the "chosen" leader of the U.S. for 8 years. And that reflected upon us as a whole, even though many of us disagreed with the policies and acts our "leader" chose to engage in.

What Hamas essentially wants is the destruction of Israel, or at the very least, the destruction of the Jewish population. Once they achieve that, they feel that Israel, or at least the part they want now, should become their land automatically.

Peace in the middle east is just something which will not happen in my lifetime, or perhaps the next generation's lifetime either. When two parties both feel strongly that something is theirs, and they are willing to fight, kill, die over this belief for decades, then there is little chance for compromise. If 2 parties want to fight over 1 m&m, it's impossible for both to have it.

Israel won't give up the land they need to maintain their safety. Hamas won't give up until that very land is theirs. So they go on killing one another, in hopes of achieving that elusive victory. Kind of like the Russians and the U.S. tried for that "victory" in Afghanistan. We all know how well that went.

In the end, everything dies.

[teddy51]

13. I agree in most part with your post. The one thing that I think though, is Netanyahu is every

bit as bad as Bush was. He doesn't care if innocents get killed.

[SoCalMusicLover]

15. Netanyahu Is A Right Winger, No Doubt

He seems to be like Burlosconi in Italy. You just can't get rid of him. He keeps coming back, and the people of Israel, continually put him back in charge, sometimes not long after they dumped him.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

20. Another word, jagoff. Or is that two? nt

[War Horse]

25. A voice of reason

Few and far between. It seems to be mostly either/or around here.

[Democracyinkind]

26. That's a misperception.

I am convinced that you commented on the majority opinion.

it's just that the either/or crew is sooooooooooo much more commited to this topic than any voice of reason could ever be, so they tend to drown out other opinions in a deluge of propagandistic calls-to-arms. Plus, taking the middle road in this question will bring the ire of both sides of the either/or crowd on you, and that makes allot of people simply walk away from the discussion.

I'm convinced that even the majority of "Israelis" and "Palestinians" see the complexity of this issue. At least in those moments when the drums of war aren't clouding their brains.

[Archae]

7. Of course.

As we've seen all too clearly, Hamas has to have "Death to (whoever)."

Their goal is power. Power to destroy Israel.

All those who say "Israel is just as bad" aren't ACTUAL Israelis having their house blown up by Hamas terrorist rockets.

It's a stupid mentality that began in 1948 when Arabs said they would destroy Israel and the Jews, and they lost.
Every time since then Arab countries and the terrorists they support inflict war on Israel, they lose.

But the terrorist groupies still whine about "Israel is just as bad," even though it's plainly obvious that is absolute BULLSHIT.

[teddy51]

10. Not plainly obvious to me, and I suspect there are a number of others that agree. Israel

with it's current Right Wing neocon as leaders, are every bit as bad as Hamas. They care nothing about killing innocent civilians.

[PCIntern]

19. OMFG...

Never mind...it's useless.

[ceile]

16. Guess I'm a "terrorist groupie" then.

Israel is just as bad, if not worse.

[Democracyinkind]

27. Of course...

All those who say "Palestianians are just as bad" arent ACTUAL Palestinians having their houses blown up by IDF non-terrorist rockets.

The thing about jingoistic propaganda is that, by just changing a few words, it works in the other direction.

To some of us, this goes a long way to discredit this kind of talk. Then again, there's all kinds of people, right?

[billh58]

22. See, there's that broadbrush phrase again --

"anti-Semitic" being used against those who are critical of the right-wing Likud and Bibi. Yes, the same Bibi who backed RMoney in the US presidential elections, and who is pals with Rumsfeld and the PNAC crowd.

It is NOT anti-Semitic to criticize Israel's right-wing government or it's policies of economic persecution of the Palestinians, blockades of humanitarian aid organizations, and outright assassinations. Americans have a right to criticize Israel's government because our tax money goes to support their form of terrorism. This has absolutely nothing to do with bigotry or anti-Semitism, and everything to do with Liberal, Democratic values.

And yes, Israel has a right to defend themselves, but they must also take responsibility for their neoconservative government's role in inciting the Palestianians to violence.

[dlwickham]

23. when you have posters criticizing EVERYTHING

that the Jewish government does, it's antisemitic

[Democracyinkind]

28. If you have posters criticizing EVERYTHING

that the Palestinian government does, it's what? (I guess antisemitic is just as apt, considering both parties in this conflict are semites.)

Then again, your use of "Jewish government" instead of "Israeli Government" gave away the game without reading the rest.

the notion that a critique of Israeli foreign and domestic policies is per se antisemitic is just idiotic. It can be, and sometimes it is. But definitely needn't.

[Comrade Grumpy]

31. I like their medical marijuana policies.

But you can take your tired anti-semitism tripe elsewhere.

[billh58]

35. See, there's your problem.

The Likud is not a "Jewish" government in that Israel is not a theocracy. Bibi and his gang are right-wing, neoconservative criminals just like their American and British counterparts.

Criticizing the Israeli government is not in the least bit anti-Semitic, and the term "everything" is another broad brush exaggeration. Judaism is NOT the problem -- the Likud is.

[Xolodno]

4. They need to lock...

The Likud Party and Hamas into a giant room with knives in the center and let them go at it. Once a victor is achieved....blow it up.

[AnOhioan]

9. And as long as Bibi and the Israeli govt have their groupies in other countries....

they too will not knock of the illegal settlements, the economic blockade, the assassinations.

Typical of them? yep...Afraid so.


A pox on both houses....and the innocent suffer.

[riderinthestorm]

14. Did they ask him about the extrajudicial executions, without trials, in the public square by Hamas?

Hamas Kills 6 Suspected Israel Collaborators: Witnesses
Source: AP

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip — Masked gunmen publicly shot dead six suspected collaborators with Israel at a large Gaza City intersection Tuesday, witnesses said. An Associated Press reporter saw a mob surrounding five of the bloodied corpses shortly after the killing.

Some in the crowd stomped and spit on the bodies. A sixth corpse was tied to a motorcycle and dragged through the streets as people screamed, "Spy! Spy!"

The Hamas military wing, Izzedine al-Qassam, claimed responsibility in a large handwritten note attached to a nearby electricity pole. Hamas said the six were killed because they gave Israel information about fighters and rocket launching sites.

The killing came on the seventh day of an Israeli military offensive that has killed more than 120 Palestinians, both militants and civilians. Israel has launched hundreds of airstrikes, targeting rocket launching sites, weapons caches and homes of Hamas activists, as Palestinians fired hundreds of rockets at Israel.



Read more: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/20/hamas-kills-suspected-col_n_2165236.html
(GRAPHIC PHOTO AT LINK)

[dlwickham]

24. but the Jews made them do that

Hamas is a terrorist organization and should be dealt with accordingly

[alcibiades_mystery]

18. Anybody who tries to convince me that either Hamas or Israel is ULTIMATELY at fault

gets the big gasface.

Unfortunately, these two populations have state apparatuses that truly deserve each other - vicious, warmongering imbeciles on all sides.

And while I will usually consider "A pox on both their houses" to be intellectually lazy, we're coming very close to the point where it's accurate here - or at least the only ethical mode of action left.

[Democracyinkind]

29. Seconded.

And let's be honest here: The existence of one nut-case leadership on one side is wholly determined by there being nutcases on the other side.

No Isreali ultra-right winger without the Jihadists.

No Jihadists without Israeli ultra-right wingers.

That is the real conundrum here. Both sides are dependent on the status quo of perpetual violence in order to establish their political legitimacy on a domestic level.

If this rasies a shitstorm, I'm sorry. It's way past bedtime, I'm off.

[JI7]

30. like Bush and Bin Laden

[Hippo_Tron]

32. Hamas wants to control all of Israel

Their position is akin to Gahndi saying that the British not only need to leave India, but they need to leave Britain as well.

[arikara]

33. And Israel wants to take over all Palestinian land

the big difference between the 2 is that Israel is very successful at the taking. Meanwhile the ones who suffer from this vicious warmongering is always the people no matter if Palestinian or Israeli.

[Hippo_Tron]

34. A contingent of nutjobs in Israel want to take over all Palestinian land

Likewise a contingent of nutjobs in Gaza called Hamas want to take over all of Israeli land. Sadly the nutjobs on both sides have way too much power.