As someone born and raised in a small rural area, I believe I am qualified to comment on

[Atticus]

the "right-to-life" zealots who I have been compelled to rub shoulders with.

They are world-record hypocrites whose insecurity motivates them to furiously wave their "Save the Babies!" banners to advertise just how "good", how "righteous", how "God-approved" they are.

These "good Christians" who coo so lovingly about the "tiny children" they supposedly cherish have no problem with snarling their contempt and hatred for us "baby killers" and wishing us "early deaths".

They do not care if BORN babies go hungry or cold or homeless or die of preventable diseases, but they will self-righteously watch a woman die rather than abort a wad of cells that they would not recognize if it was splattered on their windshield.

Welcome to this "Godless heathen's" world.

[Bettie]

1. They will also sneak their own daughters in

through the back door of the clinic, because they have a "good reason" to end a pregnancy, they just don't want others to have the same right.

It's all about performative religiosity. They want everyone to SEE how perfect they are.

[Horse with no Name]

4. I was just going to say this.

This is so accurate.
I, too rub shoulders with these zealots and know for a fact that girls that I went to high school with were fucking like rabbits and had multiple abortions amongst them.
As we are all now entering old age, they have the biggest bandwagons on religion and morality.
If I had solid proof to what I know, I would most certainly post it in the local paper.
I have grown to despise these people.

[OldBaldy1701E]

66. Same.

In my little ass school, one of the jocks went on to become a detective in the drug enforcement division of the county sheriff's office. He became quite a little prick to say the least. However, when I moved back to help my dad for a few years as well as joined a band to do some touring, I got word that he and his cronies were scoping out my father's house to try and catch us doing something. (The idea among the county people was that we were a major drug trafficking location. How they arrived at this idiotic idea, I still do not know.) They spent tons of money surveilling us. They would follow us to some of our gigs, even once following us to Georgia! And, all for naught, as there was nothing going on other than some partying with some smoke and some trip. That's it. The culmination of this was when one of the crew was pulled for speeding and was taken into the station for 'questioning'. They showed him that they had lots of pictures and video of my father's house. They tried desperately to get him to cop to anything. (Because they had lots of nothing.) After this little bit of lunacy, I ran into my old classmate. I said hello and watched as he squirmed. (He was with a few other 'detectives' at the time.) He gave a tepid response. Then, I asked about my father's house and the ongoing crap. He gave the usual crap about 'I cannot talk about any of that.'. So, I decided that it was time to bring this crap to a halt. I leaned close so that only he could hear me and said, "If you think for one second that I will not grace your entire department with some of the shit you used to drop in high school, you better think again. I suggest you stop harassing my father and stalking his property or I will write a very detailed account of some of your exploits and mail them to your bosses and every local paper. You DO remember that there is proof of one incident because there was media coverage. You think they might want to finally solve that little case?" He looked at me with eyes of terror. I smiled again and loudly said, "Good to see you, (person)! I hope you don't get into the trouble you used to!" and left the store. Suffice to say... for some reason the entire operation stopped their efforts about a month later. I never heard from any of that department again.

(If you only knew what that little asshole did back in the day. The fact that he became a cop says a lot about his ludicrous ego and the police in that area.)

They are all Dunning Kruger alums that think they have a functioning brain. Their brains have been poisoned with lunacy for too long. Now they have only one mission, to prove that they were right on every topic. The fact that they are completely wrong, and that every day they have to see this for themselves, does not deter them in any way. It is what Asimov pointed out:


“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”

[slumcamper]

42. Excellent characterization: "performative religiosity" !!!!!!!!!!!!! n/t

[SharonAnn]

63. Excellent description! I'll be using it.

[Whatthe_Firetruck]

61. "The only moral abortion...

... Is my abortion" is a classic article about this very thing.

https://joycearthur.com/abortion/the-only-moral-abortion-is-my-abortion/

[leftyladyfrommo]

2. I have found that the Christian Zealots compete with

each other on who is the most Christian. Who can pray the most earnestly. Who is the most Godly. And that false face covers up a whole lot of sin.

Those people develop a wierd too clean shine about them.

[Richard D]

20. They conveniently ignore . . .

. . or do not understand Matthew 6:6 (Or maybe they have an aversion to the number 6?)

"But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you."

[leftyladyfrommo]

22. I worked with a pentecostal preacher fir a while.

He was one of the meanest people I have ever met. Man did he hate Catholics. It's pretty hard to out religious the Catholics.

He was in his '50s and had a new wife. They used to makeout in the office parking lot. Talk about tacky.

[no_hypocrisy]

3. Not mention letting the zygote get born, only to be blown to smithereens

by an AK-15 in a supposedly safe classroom, even in a Christian classroom.

[TheBlackAdder]

31. This really picked up in the early 70s as a way for the churches to rally congregants for money.

.

Abortion wasn't really a hot topic before that, just in certain churches and activist groups.

With a reduction in attendance, fund-raising and also the desire for the churches to gain political power and influence, the life at conception argument was seen as one of the last ways to galvanize congregants, and it's been effective ever since.

.

[raising2moredems]

60. And lining the coffers "adopting out" babies

And that IMHO is the real reason they are so anti-choice, anti-birth control, anti-public aid. In the mid 1970s, the "diocese" in my area got $5K a pop for selling babies - white babies to be clear. Adoption is a revenue stream pure and simple.

[Diamond_Dog]

5. And many of them are

Unfettered gun rights believers. So, in other words, the only thing you can do to put a stop to little children being splattered all over their classroom by some insane gunner, is pray.

[barbtries]

6. it's great to get your perspective.

i want to ask you, are they willfully ignorant, or are their choices severely limited in terms of news, education, and so on?

you may not be able to answer this but i (atheist) wonder how anyone raised to praise jeezus gets to be so ugly on the inside. i think the common wisdom is not wise, that being that everyone should be raised with religion so they'll be better people. Maybe they should just be raised with kindness and empathy and the golden rule.

“Of all the tyrannies that affect mankind, tyranny in religion is the worst; every other species of tyranny is limited to the world we live in; but this attempts to stride beyond the grave, and seeks to pursue us into eternity.”

Thomas Paine

[radical noodle]

8. I think Faux News has a lot to do with it

I've seen good, decent people become monsters since the advent of cable news and Fox.

[barbtries]

12. i've essentially lost my own brother to that.

however, the rabid racism was there already. from sunny CA

[radical noodle]

14. I'm so sorry

A lot of families have gone through that, even more so after trump.

[barbtries]

15. he's been sucked in since gw.

but it's only since trump that we don't talk anymore.

i have to let it go because he's toxic. same story lifetime friend. hurts because i love these people, but i guess i love me more, because i choose not to entertain their bullshit.

[hunter]

25. California had "sundown towns" and KKK chapters like the rest of the nation.

I grew up in a California city that was 99% white and kept that way by various underhanded means, even after the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Issuing DWB (Driving While Black) citations was a favorite sport of the local police, people who were not white were not shown every available home or apartment, and employers favored white people over everyone else.

Few people in the city even thought about it. If you asked them, most probably would have said they were "color blind" and believed in "equal opportunity" for all. They were clueless. I was clueless.

But that's not why I got the hell out of there. I was a weird autistic spectrum white kid who was bullied constantly starting in middle school. Quitting high school for college was one of the better decisions I've made in my life.

My wife and I met teaching in a big city in the later 'eighties. The majority of our students were not white. Since then we haven't lived in majority white neighborhoods. We made a very deliberate decision not to raise our children in an affluent white community like the one I grew up in.

The kids who I grew up with who never left the city are still largely "colorblind" and clueless. The city is not so white any more, about ten percent of the population is Asian now, mostly working in high tech industry.

[barbtries]

28. gee i wonder if you grew up in the same town i did

Torrance?

actually reading on it wouldn't have been Torrance - we went directly from grammar school to high school there.

but seriously i did grow up in Torrance, CA, which I would wager is one of the most racist cities with over 100,000 population anywhere. they sacrificed federal funds to continue discriminating in hiring. this was probably the 60s or 70s, maybe as late as the 80's.

I wouldn't live there again. Now I live in Durham NC and one of the best things about it is the diversity.

[hunter]

47. No, but similar.

My parents were there for the work. They are artists and always had day jobs related to their arts. They left soon after my dad retired. All my siblings fled as well.

Aside from the tech industry it was also a bedroom community for the notoriously racist Los Angeles Police Department.

[csziggy]

41. Many were like that far before Faux Noise was around

My evangelical Southern Baptist preacher uncle was never a good, decent person. He played one behind the pulpit and around his congregants, but he was perfectly happy to tell my mother, his sister, that she was condemned to hell since she left the Baptist Church to marry my father, a Presbyterian.

He was also gleeful when telling hateful, racist "jokes" and being hateful towards any group he despised. I do have to thank him for opening my eyes at how two faced religious people are so that I began questioning the role of religion in society.

[Atticus]

9. In my experience, the ignorance is willful. They were taught science in school, but simply

choose to believe that a self-declared "man of God" preacher has more knowledge than all their teachers. Science---and common sense---just have no application to "matters of faith".

[radical noodle]

17. In our rural school

there was a short course on creationism taught alongside biology because the teacher was neck-deep in an evangelical church.

[Ray Bruns]

10. You have to remember what Lyndon Johnson said.

[area51]

32. I believe you may be referring to this:

"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."

source

[Ray Bruns]

34. You got it.

[treestar]

11. a big part of American evangelicalism

is the fear they the others are coming to destroy them, out to get them. The Bible has some feature about being persecuted for being a Christian and the Romans added to that. It's a tradition they cling to - that they have to prove they are willing to be persecuted and killed for believing.

[Lonestarblue]

36. I grew up in similar circumstances where church on Sunday was expected.

Southern Baptists were prevalent in my community, and I started seeing the hypocrisy and weird attitudes in the preaching at an early age, but most people like my parents simply accepted. My teenage self mentally questioned the preacher as he raged against things like playing cards, dancing (where are these restrictions in the Bible), and drinking (but Jesus made wine). Ministers at that time had gone to seminaries and been trained to preach. They were respected members of the community and had influence with people, though I don’t recall any ever talking about politics from the pulpit.

The religious right today is different, especially among evangelicals, because anyone can set up a church and become a preacher—no training needed. And these ministers have embraced political power as a means to spread their brand of religion. They interpret and use the Bible to reinforce their biases, and they are in the pulpits of the country every Sunday telling their audiences what to believe, what to think, and how to vote. So while Fox and other right-wing media contribute to the fanaticism we see today, it is also stoked in evangelical churches every Sunday.

[lildDemz]

43. Evangelicals and their churches vary widely in doctrine and discipline, sometimes intelligence.

My experience in a small rural town was not bogged down with racism or politics. Their prejudices were simply religious. I was not in the South.

[csziggy]

44. Among Southern Baptists it's alway been that anyone can set up a church

I know, because I am descended from preachers who did just that. One of them, Charles Crow, was partially responsible for the establishment of the Southern Baptist Convention. Not only did he wander around central Alabama starting churches beginning in 1819, he also taught others to think as he did. Crow was not a nice man - even in his most adoring biographies, he did things that were abhorrent.

For instance, the church in South Carolina where he was ordained decided that they did not want any church official (deacons, preachers) to own slaves. That is when he picked up his household, including slaves, and moved to Alabama. There are many other stories about him.

Another of my ancestors, traveled around Alabama, building churches so he could preach at them. When his wife was dying from tuberculosis in 1904, she wrote him and asked for her favorite dress to be buried in (she was in a sanitarium). He refused since his new wife wanted to be married in that dress.

There are more family stories, but all of them (and my uncle who took up the family religious tradition) convinced me that religion is NOT a positive influence in society.

[yardwork]

7. I agree that insecurity is the root of their issues.

Also raised in a rural community, I noticed that the loudest "born again" were deeply frightened and insecure. They believe they're going to hell unless they make a lot of noise. They don't understand Jesus's message at all. Ironically, for people who talk about Jesus all the time, they're stuck in the meanest, most regressive parts of the Old Testament. Love and kindness are luxuries they can't afford, intent as they are on proving their devotion to Mean Jesus.

[TheRickles]

18. In a way, this insecurity may lead them to identify with the fetus, who is also powerless against

the greater forces at work in the world. So the Evangelicals seek protection by obeying the omnipotent Old Testament God, since they, like fetuses, don't feel empowered in their own lives. (I'm not sure about this comparison, but it's something to mull over)

[yardwork]

30. Very interesting point!

They may well identify with the powerless. I was going to add that most of these extreme right wing "Christians" I've known have been quite racist (although they usually won't admit it). I think that this too arises from fear and a sense of being powerless. They walk around certain that others are putting something over on them. There's a lot of domestic violence, lots of signs of insecurity.

Fox News and AM radio play right into this. They brilliantly leverage these fears and fan the flames. It was done to get people to vote Republican but things are getting out of control now. The GOP has created a monster they can't control, I think. They've riled up a lot of people who are really quite unstable.

[haele]

13. I find a lot of them start out with Sunday School type good intentions,

But by the time they hit high school, they start getting anxiously resentful about how they're never going to be good enough - the girls are never going to have some Prince Charming to take them away from the dull, working class or housewife existence the grown-ups have planned for them and the boys are never expected to better themselves because there's very little opportunity to do anything different without moving away; they're expected to have their best days in high school and then grow up in Daddy's footsteps to take care of their families

So, they grow up with a lack of opportunities, which breeds resentment and anxiety - leading to a gnawing hatred of anything potentially happier or better off than them. Turns them into hypocrits, but that's the way their local "betters" -the preachers and politicians - like it. Don't want any uppity folks to upset the small pond status quo.

Just

[WhiskeyGrinder]

16. As someone who supports patients at a clinic regularly, I would say you're kind of right.

The evangelicals/fundamentalists who protest at abortion clinics -- the ones I have experienced, anyway -- aren't insecure at all. They're very, very secure in what they believe, which is that this world is full of sin and needs to repent, which is why you can't shame them into leaving. They have repented, and so everything they say on the sidewalks is bible-based -- people abuse kids because they don't have Jesus, people go hungry because this world has turned away from God, people who have not repented will go to hell but they want to tell you that so you repent, not because they think they're better than you. If someone dies because of pregnancy, it's because God willed it -- and people dying because of God's will is okay, because God's will is perfect.

The Catholics are a little different, and are a lot more into public prayer than active intervention IME.

The protestors aren't a monolith, either -- some will work themselves into tears because I haven't repented, some are definitely self-righteous, some are contemptuous of the work I do an actively try to bait me into responding, some ignore me entirely. I've gotten past the point where I don't give a shit whether they're hypocrites or true believers or a mix of both, honestly. They're terrible people and I feel sorry for some of them.

[Seinan Sensei]

19. Many are simply Pro-Birth, not truly Pro-Life

It's easier to fulfill a CONTRACT (get fetus through the birth-canal)
Versus living according to a COVENANT (which the Christian faith demands).

Many "good Christians" ignore the Beatitudes, etc., and (sorta) go with the "Ten Commandments."

[usaf-vet]

21. We adopted three children that no one else wanted. And we had one biological child.

It was no picnic, as they say.

That is what bothers me the most. The anti-abortion hypocrites that rarely, if ever, get into we'll adopt line.

Here is one other question. IF god is all-knowing and so powerful, WHY does he show doctors the way to perform safe terminations?

There usually are four highly skilled, trained people in the room where termination procedures are performed. Was that gods doing?

And finally, for those that want to lay it all at the "devil's" feet.

Let me say this the "devil's" work begins when the fetus is forced to term with no one providing the care that is needed to raise the child.

We know because three of them languished for 3-5 years in abusive, neglected situations before the courts intervened. They then spent the next fifteen to eighteen years with us. Graduated from high school, joined the military, found mates, had kids, and have stable jobs and family life.

[Glaisne]

23. Here's what a Christian minister had to say about these people

“The unborn” are a convenient group of people to advocate for. They never make demands of you; they are morally uncomplicated, unlike the incarcerated, addicted, or the chronically poor; they don’t resent your condescension or complain that you are not politically correct; unlike widows, they don’t ask you to question patriarchy; unlike orphans, they don’t need money, education, or childcare; unlike aliens, they don’t bring all that racial, cultural, and religious baggage that you dislike; they allow you to feel good about yourself without any work at creating or maintaining relationships; and when they are born, you can forget about them, because they cease to be unborn. You can love the unborn and advocate for them without substantially challenging your own wealth, power, or privilege, without re-imagining social structures, apologizing, or making reparations to anyone. They are, in short, the perfect people to love if you want to claim you love Jesus, but actually dislike people who breathe. Prisoners? Immigrants? The sick? The poor? Widows? Orphans? All the groups that are specifically mentioned in the Bible? They all get thrown under the bus for the unborn.”

― Methodist Pastor David Barnhart

[rubbersole]

26. 👆👆👆👆👆

[hunter]

48. Thank you for posting that.

.

[JanLip]

24. I was also born and raised

In a rural area. One Christmas at our family gathering my great niece who was about 12 years old told my mom and me we were baby killers because we were democrats. My mom was in her nineties and it really hurt her. We were so stunned we couldn’t say anything.

Jan

[dlk]

27. They have selective morals, depending on what suits them

They lack any true moral authority, although that doesn’t seem to stop them.

[wendyb-NC]

29. Well said

[Roc2020]

33. Hypocrites.

Jesus was brutal towards hypocrites. They are so self-righteous about abortion. But have no problems with a machine gun mowing down those same children a few yrs later. Hypocrites. That's the reason so many see the GOP as total naked Frauds and will vote against them.

[marble falls]

35. Welcome to Marble Falls, my hometown ...

... my Methodist church has left the Methodist convention over LGBT. They totally lost me and my wife (20 year+members). The vote was 88% against true Christian compassion.

Christ never condemned any 'sinner' (as if being anything but cis was a sin), sinners are convicted by our sin and Christ brings ALL of us into the church. Christ had a lot of things He condemned but curiously: He never, ever mentioned sexuality.

Self righteous judgement is no hallmark of a christian. "Judgement is mine," sayeth the Lord.

Those people love children until they're born. And have no problem killing them afterwards - most right to lifers are pro death penalty of even teens for crimes that don't rise to even murder.

I should have stayed Lutheran. We believe there are sinners amongst us, but we don't talk about it outside of coffee and hot dish. Then again, the Lutheran Church I belonged to in Pender, NE made a school teacher stop teaching Sunday School after her church board member husband cheated on her and divorced her - because they didn't think a divorced woman should teach Sunday School. Her husband stayed on the board.

[1WorldHope]

37. I loved what you said ...

...".they will self-righteously watch a woman die rather than abort a wad of cells that they would not recognize if it was splattered on their windshield.
Every time they yell about killing babies, I wish they would understand that is so inaccurate.
My daughter lives in a town of 120 people in rural western Nebraska. What I have seen is how dis-empowered and poor these people are out there. There are a hand full of big ranchers who have everything, everyone else are just peasants. They live in these little towns their whole lives and work themselves to death for the king. They are very unhappy and their kids are the only thing that gives them joy. They think people who live in cities are uppity and they want to think they are wiser than us. They are right in many ways. If things went to hell in society, they know how to live off the land, that I can admire. I just wish they could find Jesus. Like black folks have found Jesus. Jesus the man who preached peace, kindness to strangers and the poor, the sick, the weak, and WOMEN!

[Walleye]

38. They will refer to "our children" when talking about fetuses

But when it comes to school lunches, they’re other people’s children, and well, people shouldn’t have children they can’t afford to feed. Religion seeks to replace human beings’ ability to reason with the ability to rationalize

[tblue37]

39. Nor do they care about children shredded by AR-15s.

[judesedit]

40. Amen, Atticus. They want more babies born, so they can use them for target practice

They're a freaking bunch of hypocrites no matter how or where you throw it, which is the main reason I don't go to church anymore. They follow someone other than Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus would have denounced them immediately for their behavior.

[jaxexpat]

45. If one has an opinion about abortion and does not have a *womb,.....

that opinion is unnecessary and useless. If such a "wombless" opinionator persists, that person is an outrage to civilized society.

* Functional pregnancy processor and delivery system.

[AncientOfDays]

46. My father was a preacher

and when growing up, I saw that he was more concerned with appearances than actual religious belief.

He died with a stash of guns hidden in the crawlspace of his house.

[lambchopp59]

49. I've been reminding the Xtian anti-abortionists

Yes, those babies should be born, then taken to the altar at the Mount and stabbed to death there as a sacrifice to God the way the old testament describes.

[carpetbagger]

55. Conservative American Christians prefer to sacrifice children in mass shootings.

It's not like much of their practice otherwise conforms with the Bible anyway.

[twodogsbarking]

50. Some things are drilled in people's brains for so long they can't believe they could be wrong.

Free thinking is discouraged.

[underpants]

51. ❤️

[TexasBushwhacker]

52. They ESPECIALLY don't give a shit if those fetuses

have parents who are anything other than straight, white, evangelical Christians.

[plimsoll]

53. I'm going to propose something ugly.

We call them hypocrites because we assume they're making these arguments in good faith. Is that really feasible anymore. So much rightwing behavior is performed in bad faith shouldn't we start with the proposition that these contradictory positions do in fact work together to achieve the intended result?

You mention that they do not care if actual living babies are hungry/cold/homeless. If your goal is to increase the amount of people who suffer then making abortion illegal will help accomplish that goal. I hear lots from the right about "saving the babies," but not so much about feeding the poor. Sure it's tenant of their notional faith, but if you were to make a prioritized list of where that fits in their actual behaviors would it even make the top 100? I think it's easier to understand the abortion debate if you just assume that for much of the religious right the actual point is to increase the human misery of our country.

That's clearly not a universal statement, I am sure there are people who sincerely want to end abortion and will gladly support social programs to help lift everyone out of poverty. I'll stipulate that in those cases, they probably don't support the rights agenda, because all those aspects of suffering including the fear of poverty are elements contributing to seeking an abortion.

[carpetbagger]

54. Just narrow definitions of "neighbor" and "worthy poor"

I understand the theory of Christianity, but as the religion is practiced, at least in small town America, it's different. At the end of the day, I judge the truth of the religion on how it changes people's hearts and mind.

In all fairness, the last mayor here was a retired Baptist preacher who was on all the do-gooder boards and committees before and after, and who had a heart for all the people here. But his type of Christianity doesn't seem to be retained by the latest generations.

[czarjak]

56. Jesus loves the little children.

So much so, he lets 25,000 of them starve to death. Every day.

[AverageOldGuy]

57. Preach it, brother!!

I live in a rural Virginia county that went for Trump 75% and is overrun with Baptists.

[republianmushroom]

58. like this posting, thank you

You did nail it.

[pansypoo53219]

59. pro-fetus,

[lostnfound]

65. Pro-embryo, mifepristone is usually used up to 10 weeks, embryo is up to 10 weeks Nt

[Lunabell]

62. Well, as a former worker in two women's clinics

I can tell you they DO get abortions, too. But, their situation is different. I heard it several times.

My favorite was the catholic woman who was getting married in a few months and having a huge wedding. She just couldnt walk down the aisle pregnant. She would be forgiven at her next confession.

And another is that the daughter of a prominent anti-abortion ObGyn in Tallahassee, was worried her mother would find out, but she said pretty much the same thing as the bride. She just had to confess, do penance and all would be swell.

[Smackdown2019]

64. Lets say what it is

Catholic beliefs bestowed into to American Political System.