My 16 year old got into a heated text exchange over beliefs tonight...

[Mother Of Four]

I ended up having to put a stop to it. On one hand I'm proud and thankful my daughter has fire in her for what she believes.

But on the other, it felt terrible to me to have to call her out on forcing her beliefs on others.

I hold a deep seated value, that people have the right to what they believe so long as it doesn't hurt others. In this long text exchange my daughter and her friend argued over Obama vs Romney, Abortion vs Choice and Homosexuality being Born vs being a Lifestyle decision/sin.

Her friends family, are conservative republicans.

It became very ugly, and then the mom got involved. I ended up taking the phone from my daughter and typing this after the mother wanted to start quoting verses to my daughter.

"Ok...Daughtersnamehere brought me the phone (mom) and I'm putting an end to this. Call me right now please."

I was answered with "I'm not going to talk to anyone who believes in abortion."

I waited a few minutes and responded with. "I want you to know, we aren't going to try and change your mind on very personal beliefs. Everyone has a right to their beliefs whether others agree or not. I wanted to reassure you that we value and respect your choices as a family."

I left it at that. My daughter was furious, and couldn't see how I could be this way. I told her wait, to please just give the mother a minute to think. That what I had done was a backhanded comment, meaning it will gently push her into responding without being cruel or condescending.

My phone rang.

I answered with "Well, that got really out of hand didn't it?" and laughed. I think it took her off guard, she laughed a little uncomfortably and said "Yeah...it did."

We talked some then I said, with little to no preamble "You know, now a days it doesn't matter what you hold personal, someone is out there and going to attack you on it."

Silence then "Yeah, I guess you're right."

Then I said "You know what I think? ...and I'm not talking about politicians here."

She asked me what?

"I think that we can all agree that children deserve warmth, love and a good home right?"

Well yes, she said.

"And, that we deserve safety and a chance at prosperity?"

Uh huh...she said.

I think we can also agree that violence is tragic, and disease running rampant without cures is a crises right?

She said "Yes...and oh lord in heaven New York...those poor people."

I said yes, aren't there so many very large important things to think about right now?

We talked about the Red Cross, and giving blood. We talked about donating money, because items are hard to disperse. We talked about compassion, and clarity in goals. We talked about the BIG PICTURE, without dwelling on the details.

We didn't talk about religion, politics or homosexuality.

I got off the phone and my daughter was staring at me, she was still angry and she had wet eyes. She asked me, what did you just do?

I told her, I planted a seed. That patience and persistence is required to change minds, not bullheadedness and strong arming.

I'm choked up right now, because the hug I got after that was the best hug I've had in a long time.

I wanted to share this, because too often we lose sight of the real goal. Making sure everyone has that chance at making it, having a dry bed to sleep in and warm food in their belly. Allowing people to have the free will to choose their paths, whether spiritual or non. If their beliefs give them comfort, who are we to try and take that from them?

We need to work to a future where health is a right, not a privilege.

We need to look down the road, to laughter and compassion and working together. Yeah, right now it might seem like a pipe dream and I know there are a many who are bitter and jaded. But it WILL come if we stick with it, I know this.

Just an exchange and my humble opinion. I hope everyone is safe and secure tonight, I'm being a little introspective following that talk.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

1. You're a fine mother

your children are very lucky.

[salin]

2. great approach to end conflict and open dialogue.

More importantly, a great example of modeling behavior that can stop total conflict and open doors for future exchanges.

[OriginalGeek]

3. Seems to me that

Four kids got a heckuvva mom.

[Angry Dragon]

4. Always good to look inside ..... that is where you find yourself>>>

[GoneOffShore]

5. You did better than this 65 year old could have done.

I'm way too angry at "Teh Stoopid" - And that's what I consider the pro-zygote, forced birth crowd along with creationists and trickle-downers to be - to have that kind of kind and rational response.

[DonViejo]

6. Job well done, Mom!...

[badhair77]

7. We need more of this.

Sometimes we get so involved and angry to the point where we don't think. If our true goal is to win someone over to our side we need to be more welcoming in sharing commonalities and then ideas about differences. Otherwise people just dig in and nothing gets changed. Love the "plant a seed" metaphor. Good job.

[LiberalAndProud]

8. You did good.

If pro-lifers would stop trying to force their comfortable beliefs on what should be a personal prerogatives, we'd all be better off. Still, when backs are up we can find no common ground. You did great.

[Old Codger]

9. Absolutely

Superb course to teaching daughter the right path to take and to make a good connection and disarm the whole thing... I would give a lot to be able to think that fast .. very nice

[Delphinus]

10. What a lesson

I learned tonight! Thank you - I am impressed.

[wellstone dem]

11. Beautiful. I'm headed to my warm, dry bed

and I will sleep better because of you. Thank you for raising wonderful children and sharing your wonderful example.

[AverageJoe90]

12. Congratulations on your fine parenting, AND negotiating skills, ma'am.

You did something that many of us, myself included, have a much harder time doing: planting the proverbial seed.

[randome]

13. I get into very vociferous discussions with my 15 y/o daughters, too.

And we are 99% in agreement!

But they get into the same kind of discussions with kids at school, same as your daughter. I tell much the same as you did, to not try to 'preach' to others and try to convince them in more subtle ways.

They are heading the Gay/Straight Alliance in high school now and they are often chomping at the bit to set others straight (pun) on gay rights. But I think it's true that 'slow and steady wins the race' more often than loud voices.

[Marmitist]

14. "If their beliefs give them comfort, who are we to try and take that from them?"

And if their beliefs try to deprive me of my rights, who are *they* to take my rights away from me?

This is a tough one for me... I see where you are coming from, but hateful bigots shouldn't be humored. People who would cheer the end of safe, legal abortion rights shouldn't be humored. Perhaps, for now, all they are doing is expressing their beliefs, but my own experiences have shown me that it's a very, vanishingly small step from expression of a belief to trying to restrict the rights of others with whom you disagree.

[XemaSab]

17. The more that I research the fundamentalists

the more I think we should give them no quarter.

[left coaster]

26. I agree 1,000%!!!!!!!!!!!! Thank you for bringing this up..

I'm rather disappointed, until my post, that you were the only person here who DID bring it up..

With all due respect to the woman and her daughter, the right for a woman to exercise control over her own body is not open for any kind of debate. It's a human right issue, and someone else's "beliefs" are not the moral equivalent of that. It seems the daughter knew this, and she got shut down.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

42. yup

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

48. I'm with you. It doesn't stop at holding their own beliefs, they will not be happy until every US

citizen is forced to live their lives in accordance with the RW's sick, selective interpretation of their bible. I'm not going to allow them comfort in their belief that that is OK. There is, or at least there was intended to be, a wall.

[Mother Of Four]

15. I've read the responses ...

and wanted to let you folks know you made my heart warm up. Thank you for reading and taking the time to answer, I'm not that good at individual answering to a thread because many times I'm just putting thoughts to paper.

DU has been a true bastion of sanity for me, and I can't tell you how much this forum means to me even though I don't really post that much.


Basicly guys...thank you for being here and being yourselves.

[Pharaoh]

19. Thank you!

[BadGimp]

16. Thank you for this post!

It is very inspirational

[yellerpup]

18. I get a little teary just thinking about that epic hug.

Good job, mom. Beautiful.

[nolabear]

20. I'm proud of you. This is worth a million "Fuck ____" posts.

I get wound up myself I'll admit but I believe in trying to talk, planting those seeds. I have a WHOLE lot of RW relatives and they make me insane sometimes, but I feel better when I back up and find common ground. And I don't mean get run over.

Thanks for what you did today. I'll try to follow your fine example, even when I want to scream.

[Live and Learn]

21. Thank you. A timely and much needed post at this time.

It can get so frustrating to talk to these people especially when they are voting against all our best interests but staying calm and thoughtful can go along way.

[sarchasm]

22. Well done!

... and thanks for sharing.

[flying_wahini]

23. you did the right thing and provided a great example for your daughter

[northoftheborder]

24. You handled that situation superbly.

Wish I had your patience, and the ability to say the right thing at the right moment.

[FourScore]

25. You taught your daughter a very important lesson tonight.

You are obviously a great Mom, and I agree with you 100%.

[brooklynite]

27. Sorry, but you were wrong...

Last edited Thu Nov 1, 2012, 11:13 PM - Edit history (1)

...to stop your daughter.

At age 16, she can handle debates by herself, even if her opponent calls in her Mother for support.

[defacto7]

33. I think her daughter learned more because she did interrupt...

Age means little. A parent knows more about their situation than the public. It's not like there's a "child timer" sitting around. There is no broad brush where family is concerned.

[brooklynite]

37. When I was 14, I could hold my own in an argument on Watergate with any Adult...

a 16-year old who's engaging in policy discussions should be allowed to continue.

[defacto7]

39. maybe you were advanced.

What's good for you may not be right for someone else. You're painting again.

[missingthebigdog]

56. Stepping in is good parenting

Even for a sixteen year old.

As parents, we have the responsibility to guide our children, and to PROTECT them. In this case, the child needed protection from her friend's mother, and from herself. Stepping in, and demonstrating that there is a constructive, respectful way to handle a dispute without backing down from your own beliefs was the perfect response to this situation.

If we have learned nothing else from this election cycle, haven't we at least learned that the "winner" of a debate doesn't necessarily win the hearts and minds of the people?

[Whovian]

28. KnR + 1000

[Gman]

29. Good lesson, and an opportune way to teach it

good on you!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

30. Well, you made this mother tear up a little too...

You really did well!

I know I would not have.......

Thank you!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

31. This may shock you but that's the way diplomats during the Cold War kept us from nuking each other..

Focus on things that we agree on.

[bluemarkers]

32. great response, I've said "I love You"

and told people that even though our opinions were different, I still love them.

I always try to plant a seed too, You did it beautifully

[Yul A]

34. Yeah.

I'm sorry, but this doesn't smell right. We are all victors in our own recollections.

[defacto7]

36. It depends on what's in the eye of the beholder.

[defacto7]

35. This is one of those cases where

the ends DO justify the means. It's about understanding and progress, growing and learning. It's not about winning an argument. How many of us are more worried about the pride of being right than winning the war?

Great job, Mom!

[piggy2000]

38. Beautiful Response

What a way to make life more positive! Good tactic.

[Richard D]

40. Beautiful

Your children are very fortunate.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

41. when you are straight, you have the luxury to not talk about homosexuality

for some of us this is not an option.

[proud patriot]

43. nicely done

[Lucinda]

44. Perfect.

?

[trailmonkee]

45. k&r&f

[lady lib]

46. If I could cast your post in bronze, I would.

Bravo...very well done!!

[SamKnause]

47. Text goes bad

Thank you for sharing your excellent parenting skills story with us all !

Let's hope that seed grows and multiplies.

[beachgirl2365]

49. WAY to GO MOM!!!!

You echoed what I believe the majority of Americans truly believe and what they hold dear when it comes down to it..........the things that are truly important...........Here's to hoping you have a green thumb with regards to planting a seed!

[California Expat]

50. Good job Mom

Seeds are more important than chopping down trees you dont like

[rosesaylavee]

51. And THAT what you just did is the heart and soul of

non-violent communication techniques by Marshall Rosenberg and techniques taught used by the National Coalition Building Institutes. You agreed on commonalities. You built a foundation of agreement on which to move forward to other things if you ever wanted to go there but for now, what a powerful lesson you gave your daughter. You are awesome!

[obxhead]

52. When their beliefs bring pain, sorrow, and misery to many

We have the responsibility to take them away.

Great way of doing things though.

[sabrina 1]

53. Beautifully done, thank you. Especially this:

I told her, I planted a seed. That patience and persistence is required to change minds, not bullheadedness and strong arming.

Too bad there is much of the bullheadedness and strong arming on both sides. You are a very wise mom!

[woofless]

54. Way to go Ma.

[Alleycat]

55. Nice

[vlyons]

57. Jesus said, "Blessed are the peace makers."

I don't believe in a creator god, or any religion, but I believe in peace and respect those religious figures that taught peace, kindness, patience, etc. You taught your daughter a valuable lesson. Teen-agers get all pationate about stuff and tend to see the world as black&white. It just takes so much energy and stress to churn up all that vitriol and hate. It's so much easier and comfortable to find common ground.

[renate]

58. well done!

You taught your daughter--and, I hope that other girl and her mother--a wonderful lesson, very gently, very kindly, and by example.

[southernyankeebelle]

59. Your a good parent. That is the way it should have been handled. I try never to talk politics or

religion unless I know the person very well. You never know. Sometimes I will halt a person and tell them I don't talk politics or religion. Why get yourself upset and everyoneelse.

[Robyn66]

60. Awesome job mom!

You are an inspiration! I have two strong minded liberal girls who get into similar arguments often. But you have helped me think about how I will communicate with other parents and I want to thank you for that.

[Dem_in_Nebr.]

61. Wow! Just Wow!

I appreciate and applaud this approach!!

[Marr]

62. And that, in a nutshell, is why fundamentalists are able to push their agenda on all of us.

"If their beliefs give them comfort, who are we to try and take that from them?"

We are the people their medieval bullshit affects through policy in a million ways, from science education to access to basic medical procedures.

I can't say I agree with your go along to get along position here. Idiots should be marginalized. Stupidity should be maligned. I do not respect their "personal beliefs", because they don't want to keep them "personal".

[Crunchy Frog]

63. Thank you for posting this very inspiring story.

I very much agree with you that planting seeds and working to break the cycle of demonization and hatred is the way to go.

Funny how some people here seem to believe that if someone is "wrong", that you can somehow force the wrongness out of them if you're obnoxious and pigheaded enough about it. Being obnoxious and pigheaded may feel emotionally satisfying, but it won't change people's beliefs, only harden them and close them off even more to even considering a different way of thinking. Showing someone that it's possible for people to have radically different beliefs but still regard and treat each other as human beings is at least a start.

At the very least, it sounds like it was a really positive learning experience for your daughter.

[qanda]

64. I cried while reading this

Because it was the little seeds planted in my life that brought me around from many of the beliefs that I was taught growing up. It's so much more important to love and have compassion than to always be right.