I don't understand people or the US in general

[fadedrose]

How could Americans vote for a Republican after they started 2 wars, one against the wrong country, lied about some mythical weapons never found, took us into a heartbeat from a depression, lost a zillion jobs, refuse to do anything good for the country in Congress for fear of Obama looking good, etc.., and get mad if you blame anything on the Reps?

And if they are stupid enough to vote for a Rep, it follows they're going to vote for the worst Rep, Romney, who outsourced 50,000 factories, keeps his money overseas, confidentially told a bunch of rich people that 47% of the public won't vote for him, and that's okay with him because they're spongers anyway..

I think America deserves Romney.

[montanacowboy]

1. If by hook or crook he does get in

Americans are in for the time of their lives

Pre revolutionary France won't hold a candle to what will be coming for this country

nothing more needs to be said

[Jackpine Radical]

2. The Battleship Maine

blew up in Havana Harbor because some idiots were smoking in the powder room. Their idiocy earned them a fast ride to oblivion. Unfortunately, a whole lot of the crew who had no culpability in the event took the ride with them.

Ol' Harry Harlow (famed monkey psychologist) used to say that humanity is barely smart enough to keep society running.

Harlow was a hopeless optimist.

[fadedrose]

4. Our last president was a chimp, so they say..

but you know what, with a different vice president, anybody other then Cheney, say Dole or one of the ladies from the NE, Bush wouldn't have been a bad president.

So the monkey would do alright if the vice president was also a monkey, not a snake...

[Jackpine Radical]

8. That's an interesting hypothetical.

But of course Bush was a Post Turtle* who couldn't have gotten there without the likes of Rove & Cheney, who wanted a sock puppet.


*An old rancher is talking about politics with a young man from the city. He compares a politician to a "post turtle". The young man doesn't understand and asks him what a post turtle is.
The old man says, "When you're driving down a country road and you see a fence post with a turtle balanced on top, that's a post turtle. You know he didn't get up there by himself. He doesn't belong there; he can't get anything done while he's up there; and you just want to help the poor, dumb thing down."

[Viva_La_Revolution]

14. never heard that one... my G-Great uncle was chief machinist

it was probably because they were using bituminous coal, instead of anthracite which the ship was designed for.

the powder was stored in cans resistant to 300+ temps, and the magazines were locked down at 8pm, one officer had the keys. Explosion at 9:45pm

[ieoeja]

16. I heard the same story as the person to whom you are replying.

I had a history professor at Austin University who had interviewed Maine survivors. When they pulled into Havana everybody went looking for the marijuana. While it was not yet illegal in the United States, it was forbidden aboard naval vessels. The survivors with whom this prof spoke said the officers didn't search the powder room for MJ smokers on the assumption that nobody would be that stupid.

General consensus among the Maine survivors was that someone aboard ship accidentally blewup the ship while sneaking a pot smoke in the powder room.

Doesn't necessarily make them right.

[get the red out]

3. Their identity is wrapped up in it

Religious Right identity, "manly anti-government" identity, ect.... To the right this election has very little to do with actual ideas, but a lot to do with people's identity in whatever group they see themselves as a part of, which is why they can't be reasoned with and easily buy into all the lies the RW wants to spew.

[fadedrose]

5. Oh that religious right is another group I don't understand..

THey say they want to protect a fetus, but will kill millions in wars, starve people, deny children medical care, not help the unwed mother, and you name it, they're anti people. THey ONLY like fetuses (maybe the rich like their taxes low so that fetus stuff is a shield for many).

[get the red out]

10. It doesn't have to make sense to them, unfortunately

It just has to be accepted and encouraged by their identity group. Then if the "ideas" that are promoted by their votes cause various piles of horrific shit for everyone, including them, they can blame it on Democratic opposition or not going far enough right to please God. And if all else fails RW radio and Fox News will create a scenario where they are right and everyone else is the cause of all bad things, as they usually do.

[Odin2005]

6. For the same reason folks on our side are now OK with drone strikes.

Tribal thinking, everything one's own side does is good and pure and everything the other side does is evil and vile. Policy doesn't matter.

[Jackpine Radical]

9. Among the many things I hold against Obama

are the drone strikes and other unpleasant uses of those unholy machines.

I will also list whistleblower retaliation and pot law enforcement as comparably wrongheaded policies pursued by this Administraton, and I culd come up with a bunch more if I felt like it.

The fact of the matter is that the left is not a unified, disciplined bunch of dittoheads. I haven't been putting a lot of time into criticizing Obama lately because either he, with all his flaws, or Romney (who in my mind comes close to a personification of evil) will be sworn in on January 20, and I see it as an application of the principle of harm reduction.

Not since McGovern has my Primary choice gotten the Dem nomination, but I keep plugging along fighting and voting for less-than-ideal candidates.

In short, I suspect that you are pushing a false-equivalence here. Tribal thinking may dominate on the right, but the left is a very different story.

If this topic interests you, have a look at this book:

The Republican Brain: The Science of Why They Deny Science- and Reality
http://www.amazon.com/The-Republican-Brain-Science-Science-/dp/1118094514/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350928620&sr=8-1&keywords=the+republican+brain

Bestselling author Chris Mooney uses cutting-edge research to explain the psychology behind why today’s Republicans reject reality—it's just part of who they are.
From climate change to evolution, the rejection of mainstream science among Republicans is growing, as is the denial of expert consensus on the economy, American history, foreign policy and much more. Why won't Republicans accept things that most experts agree on? Why are they constantly fighting against the facts?

Science writer Chris Mooney explores brain scans, polls, and psychology experiments to explain why conservatives today believe more wrong things; appear more likely than Democrats to oppose new ideas and less likely to change their beliefs in the face of new facts; and sometimes respond to compelling evidence by doubling down on their current beliefs.

Goes beyond the standard claims about ignorance or corporate malfeasance to discover the real, scientific reasons why Republicans reject the widely accepted findings of mainstream science, economics, and history—as well as many undeniable policy facts (e.g., there were no “death panels” in the health care bill).
Explains that the political parties reflect personality traits and psychological needs—with Republicans more wedded to certainty, Democrats to novelty—and this is the root of our divide over reality.
Written by the author of The Republican War on Science, which was the first and still the most influential book to look at conservative rejection of scientific evidence. But the rejection of science is just the beginning…
Certain to spark discussion and debate, The Republican Brain also promises to add to the lengthy list of persuasive scientific findings that Republicans reject and deny.

[get the red out]

12. I agree

People don't get banned from DU or other liberal message boards for discussing the drone strikes, as they would for being opposed to actions or policies of the right on RW message boards. We are permitted discussion about and anger at our leadership among those who identify as liberal or Democratic Party. The only discussion opposing Bush that I heard from right wingers was that his policies weren't far enough right, as in hate-mongering and war-mongering.

I will never cast a vote or neglect to cast one that could help a right winger get into office, that will include voting for my blue dog Congressman yet again among others, but our choices have been limited by the right wing domination of the media to the point that keeping the worst evil at bay right now may be all we can do. And I really feel that the worst evil is represented by today's Republican Party.

[ieoeja]

17. Name one.

Name one DUer who railed against drone strikes under Bush who supports them under Obama.

One of the things I noticed when Bush was President was that generic anti-war OPs could get a hundred comments from half a dozen of the same people every time. While the rest of DU pretty much ignored it.

I believe on this subject you encountered the same problem that racists encounter. 99% of the time nobody wants to confront the racist. So 99% of the time he believes everyone agrees with him. When confronted he rejoins, "most people agree with me, but they are just too political correct to say it." He sincerely believes that.

So DU ignored your anti-war posts. Not because we agreed. But because they didn't particularly want to defend Bush even when they agreed with the idiot. And didn't care enough to make the exception on this issue. Same issue for a President we like and some of us will make the argument.

They didn't change their position. They just started articulating it finally.

[maxsolomon]

7. the most thoroughly propagandized population on the planet

politicians cannot discuss:

solutions to climate change
increased regulation of private firearms as a health issue
reducing our military budget
opening relations with cuba
ending the drug war
the futility of both bush wars
peak oil
that america is not, nor does it need to be, the "greatest" nation on earth
reasonable progressive taxation levels that balance the budget

[hifiguy]

19. The old Soviet propaganda masters would be green with envy

if they saw the M$M in this country. They knew they weren't really fooling anybody who was paying attention and most Soviet citizens did.

Herr Goebbels would smile with approval at just how effective US corporate propaganda is against the citizenry. And why not? It's all based on principles he invented or perfected.

[Egalitarian Thug]

11. Welcome to the club. We'd have jackets, but the budget is tight.

People are hurting and very angry but they just don't have the tools to understand what has been done to them and by whom.

The artists and thinkers have been trying to tell us for decades, but we would rather listen to the charlatans that claim to have the ability to protect them, to blame those "others". The current wave of rampant authoritarianism began here prior to the beginning of the last century and was the direct result of breaking up the trusts, the 19th century version of hedge funds, and they fought back.

The concepts of economics, tolerance, and community are intangible and remote, but they can see that a chunk of their meager wages have been taken from them before they even got it by the government and so it's easy to just nod and agree when a parasite with a $500 haircut and a manicure comes to them and says their life is hard because the government is bad.

[sinkingfeeling]

13. Because Mitt appears white?

[HopeHoops]

15. Because there's a black Democrat in the "white" house - what more do they need to know?

[We People]

18. I understand the "I think America deserves Romney" and "We get the leaders we deserve" sentiments

I do have a major problem with people who are voting GOP, even if they literally have been brainwashed.

I really do believe that the majority of voters will not be voting for Romney, but likely all of those votes won't be counted. Let's not forget all those who have been disenfranchised from voting.

The 2000 & 2004 elections were stolen and it's obvious that the GOP is pulling out all the stops to do it again. Keeping that in mind, we always have to remember that the majority of citizens here don't deserve that because they didn't vote for it.

When we vote, we need to remember those who had the right to vote but couldn't get ID for reasons from lack of funds, transportation, name change due to marriage, couldn't get off work to vote, had their registrations stolen and destroyed, and still stand to have their electronic votes changed. It's through no fault of their own.

Like you, I've had it with the stupidity of right wingers. I do understand and agree with everything you wrote, except that many of the people who did vote for Obama, or could have but were prevented from having their votes counted, won't get what they deserve if Romney (God forbid) gets elected.