Maddow is showing clips how Mondale skewered incumbent Reagan in debate.....

[Honeycombe8]

How Reagan wasn't prepared, did a bad job. Mondale had a very good night. Reagan had had four practice debates, and was as bad in each of them, his team admitted, as he was in the actual debate.

Pundits saying that if Reagan had won the debate, it would've clinched the election. Instead, it game the Democrats new life.

Sound familiar?

It's okay to lose a debate. It's one night, one debate. It's not an election. And CERTAINLY doesn't mean the debate winner challening an incumbent will win anything other than that debate.

The next day, Reagan had a smile on his face, and his supporters showed up in droves to hear him speak. Sound familiar again?

(She covers other examples. Results: they almost never go on to win the election.)

[bluestateguy]

1. Maddow is lamenting Democratic bedwetting over the debate last night

Yes, bedwetting that you actively partook in last night yourself, Rachel.

[DemzRock]

7. Exactly.

MsNBC seems to be doing better since the Dem Con. But if they decide that this is the time to pander to everyone and lose their niche, well, we have some alternatives.

Stephanie Miller, for example!

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

8. Yeah, how dare she not fake a big smile and do her....

...."YEAAAA!" thing she does when they cut back from that disaster in Denver.

[DemzRock]

2. Meh! I'm sticking with Stephanie Miller and Current for a week or two.

MsNBC proved to me last night that they just wanted the horse race.

[Tx4obama]

5. So far, Ed Show and Maddow are very good tonight. n/t

[Tx4obama]

3. Historically there have been SIX incumbent presidents that have lost the first debate, only ONE won

the first debate.

So, Maddow said: Buck up kiddies (or kiddos or something like that)

[Mike Daniels]

13. and how many won reelection?

Ford lost, Carter lost and HW lost.

A 50/50 success rate for being the incumbent, losing the first debate and coming back to be re-elected doesn't give Rachel's argument a lot of strength. That comes down to a coin flip.

"You get one chance to make a good first impression" isn't a recognized truism just for sh.ts and giggles. The last debate covering foreign policy is going to be competing with Monday Night Football for viewers. I will be voting for Obama but since the VP debate counts for nothing re: voting choices if Obama muffs the town hall meeting Rachel can put her spin in the circular file.

[Tx4obama]

14. The next debate between Obama and Romney will be a 'town hall' ...

and President Obama does very well at those.

[warrior1]

4. IMO the President won this debate

Lying and talking over everyone and not following instruction would and should fail rmoney.

[DemzRock]

9. Romney only won for two reasons...

1> He was strong and wrong.

2> The media wanted him to win to keep the horse race going and sell soap.


((Also 3. Obama played it safe and by the rules. There is the possibility this was intentional. We'll see.))

[Honeycombe8]

11. I don't think so.

I was watching the debate. I really wanted him to win. But it was painful, watching Obama struggle. I didn't need the media to tell me anything. I knew what was what.

I also saw one of those stupid focus groups of low-info undecideds on TV. 19 people. 17 thought Romney had won. They had been kept from the media while watching the debate and afterwards.

But YES, the media is delighted at the results of the debate. The thing about the debate results, though, is that I think there is no shame to Obama not doing well. No one wins everything all the time. And since I've seen every one of O's debates since he started running for the 2008 election, I know that debating isn't his strong point. He's good, but not great at it. His manner of speaking doesn't lend itself to it (the thoughtful pauses, the thinking through of statements, etc.). I also don't think a President HAS to be great at debating.

Why are there debates, anyway?

[DemzRock]

16. What are you saying no to in my post?

I didn't say Obama won. I think you misunderstood me.

Let me rephrase.

Myth Romney won because he was strong and wrong.

The media helped to propagate and exaggerate his win, because they wanted that result.

Obama played it too calm and didn't fight back sharply. There are several possible reasons for this. He was playing by the rules of the debate. He may have had too good an anniversary. He let it happen. It could have been a tactical move.

We shall see.

But in any case, there is more fun to come! I really look forward to Biden/Ryan.

[Honeycombe8]

17. Oh, maybe I missed part of your post. I don't think the media was the driving force

behind the people thinking Romney won. I think they really did think, during the debate, that Romney was winning.

First time ever a poll showed over 60% people thinking a candidate won a Presidential debate. I used myself as an example. I gradually came to the conclusion that Romney was "winning," even though I didn't need anyone to tell me that. I could see it.

What I think is the difference, with me, anyway, is the weight I give the debate. I don't give it the big weight that some others do. It's important, but not all-important. It was just one night, one debate. And the fact that a lot of people thought Romney won doesn't translate into votes, necessarily. Example: I can think that Romney won, but that doesn't change my vote.

I also don't think this was some super secret extra sharp tactical move on Obama's part to trap Romney. No one foresaw that Romney would do what he did. No President wants to be seen as unprepared, distracted, off his game, or weak.

But...eh....it was just one night. Obama's in a good position for the election.

[andym]

6. I remember that

Reagan seemed to have trouble recalling what he wanted to say, as if he were having serious problems with his memory. In the next debate he was in top form.

[Honeycombe8]

10. You know, I've long thought he had beginnings of Alzheimer's in his 2nd term.

Nancy started prompting his answers to questions, occasionally answering for him, his memory seemed to get really bad.

[andym]

12. You may be right

Alzheimer's is a progressive disease and the brain atrophy and dysfunction often occurs years before Alzheimer's is officially diagnosed.

[gkhouston]

15. Saying that it gave the Democrats a new life implies they needed one.

Looks like Clinton is the only won to have won his first debate.