General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhat we saw tonight was Mitt Romney's Gish Gallop.
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_GallopThe formal debating jargon term for this is spreading. You can hear some mindboggling examples here. It arose as a way to throw as much rubbish into five minutes as possible. In response, some debate judges now limit number of arguments as well as time. However, in places where debating judges aren't there to call bullshit on the practice, like the internet, such techniques are remarkably common.
Essentially, rMoney took a large snort of cocaine, walked up on the stage, and spewed a enormously aggressive stream of bullshit, knowing that Obama would only get mired down and appear defensive if he tried point-by-point rebuttals. And Jim Lehrer was entirely unhelpful in that he let rMoney continue the Gish Gallop and wouldn't put his foot down enforcing time limits.
Obama did keep his cool - I think he knew better than to try rebutting the Gish Gallop - the place to tear rMoney to pieces is after the debate, with his surrogates tearing rMoney to pieces, with lots and lots of attack ads showing rMoney flip-flopping his positions, and demanding he show how his actual math works for his budget proposals.
I hope Obama's rapid-response team is already working on a shitload of attack ads!
grasswire
(50,130 posts)I'm not unhappy with Obama tonight.
SoCalDem
(103,856 posts)the Bain stuff unloaded in June-July hurt him
the tax stuff hurt him all summer-long
then the dismal convention in early september walloped him
followed by the 47% thing.
There is more, I suspect..
at least I hope so..
The perfect time would be next week to take away the "rush" he's feeling about now..
BarackTheVote
(938 posts)NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)The concern tonight at DU is remarkable and sad.
K/R this post.
DarleenMB
(408 posts)but I got quite peeved with Lerher ... he's done this in every debate he's moderated and it needs to STOP.
President Obama did look to me to be annoyed on several points but he kept his cool.
Other than that I thought the Pres did a good job. Not great, but not as dismal as the pundits would have us all believe.
Avalux
(35,015 posts)Didn't know there was a term for what Romney was doing, and now that I do, confirms my thinking that Obama's demeanor and responses were entirely appropriate and smart. He would have looked a fool trying to attack Romney.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)I couldn't keep track of all the lies, nor did I care to. Romney is just a constant lying machine. But, the one on cuts to medicare that was huge and Romney acknowledged the truth for a split second and then went back to lie about it again several times in fact, it was bizarre. So, in essence Romney said he was in favor of tax payers over paying insurance companies and hospitals and that he would bring that back if elected. Then there was the lie about his tax plan not raising taxes on the middle class, BS. And then there is the lowering tax rates but closing loop holes, bs especially when many of those loop holes aren't really loop holes like mortgage deductions, child care expenses, expenses associated with care giving, etc... many of those loop holes are what keeps families afloat financially and wouldn't apply to small businesses and Romney knows this but lies anyway. Romney looked like a total tool and a constipated one at that.
backscatter712
(26,355 posts)ProSense
(116,464 posts)four ads for each day until the election.
BarackTheVote
(938 posts)he came off as manic and scattered in his presentation. And I really don't think that break-neck pace he was going at is going to play well for positive sound-bites. If I were the editor faced with those clips, I would be PISSED.
backscatter712
(26,355 posts)I think he came across as a real prick - take those freeze-frames, photoshop them into black-and-white, throw them into attack ads!
elzenmahn
(904 posts)...and let MittWitt have his delusion of victory now, while the fact checkers are having a field day unspinning his web 'o' fibs.