As a recovered victim of abuse...Romney makes my hackles raise.

[Mother Of Four]

I'm kind of going out on a limb here, and I feel a little exposed for it. So please bear with me if this is rambling. I read DU three times a day, but go in spurts and starts as far as posting goes so this is just a tish hard.

When I hear him speak, there are two tones he takes. The first is what makes my back go up the most, it reminds me so much of my mother when she was putting on face for company. Breathier than normal, and a little higher pitched "Nothing to see here, we are all one big happy family!" It's his normal speaking voice when he's doing an interview.

The other throws me back in time to around 9 years old, standing in front of my mother and having her look at me over the top of her glasses. "Let me speak, you WILL let me speak. You stupid child, there's nothing in that coconut is there?" This is the voice that makes me want to hit stop, and just not finish watching whatever video it is.

I won't go over the things she did, she's dead and buried and is no longer an issue in my life. The point of this post isn't to lambaste my mother, it's to explain what I realized today.

I spent some time watching videos of when Romney would come close to losing it, getting more and more uncomfortable as I watched. He's always made me uncomfortable but I couldn't put my finger on it, the only way I could explain it made me sound like I was crazy. "Well, he's like some kind of reptile. That slithery dry kind that hides under your house."

It all came together today, my girls and I were putting together brownies for a charity bake sale to help women in domestic violence. I was just randomly thinking about my past when it popped into my head. When you grow up with someone who will hurt you more than they will hug you, you get a bit of a built in radar. I've just never had it from watching video, this is a first for me.



His eyes are flat, it's not just his voice. He's got doll eyes, there just isn't any warmth to them.
The lines across the bridge of his nose, the fact that the lines around his eyes look more like ones you would get from the sun rather than smiling. If you were to scrunch up your face as though your brows were down and you were glaring at someone, then either look in the mirror or feel with your fingers. It matches.



Even when he's looking at his wife, he has the set of his face right but it just doesn't ring true. There's nothing "there" in his look, it's feels more to ME like he's saying "Well, to stop any questions I better look in love"... In other words "Nothing to see here, we are all one big happy family!"

I'm not accusing him of being abusive, I don't live in their home and I'm no fly on the wall. I just know from my own life experience, if I had met him out and about and he asked to see me again it would have been an immediate no. There's something about him that screams "I have a temper...and I don't care what happens when I get pissed."

I'm not any kind of professed expert on any of this, I'm a mom, a wife...a daughter and a person. That's it I'm just a random human, and it's my primal human side that's telling me "Do not trust." I know there's been some speculation floating around, but my feeling isn't based on that. It's based on the can't sit still skin crawly feeling when I see him.

I guess I'm hoping to be told that I'm not crazy, or the only one out there that feels like this when you see him.

[riderinthestorm]

1. When you grow up with someone who will hurt you more than they will hug you, you get a bit of radar

I wasn't abused growing up, but I have members of my family who were.

My mom is a hard core Rethug who NEVER is demonstrably affectionate except when its a social event and she gives me the air hug and air kiss.

Your post is brilliant. So glad you weighed in....

[Mother Of Four]

8. Thank you

[undergroundpanther]

67. I know what you mean.

My radar still gets fooled but over time it gets harder for them to fool it but this detection system has come at a great price to my mind body and soul...Wish I had a radar capable of spotting monsters like him without fail.No matter how good they fake who they are, or for how long,and I would know instantly..this asshole is a lying sack of psychopath shit.

[RKP5637]

2. I think Romney is a true sociopath. I'm not a professional, but he unnerves me too and

at least in my reading he has the hallmarks of a sociopath. I also find him quite a strange man. There is a hollowness about him, emotionally void.

[Mother Of Four]

10. Hollow is a good way to describe it.

Like all those spots that should have joy, compassion or love are just empty.

[silvershadow]

13. I have been saying this for months on end. He's one scary dude. My feelings of him

are way worse than they were for Bush, pre-presidency, and those were awful. In fact we are now living in the nightmarish world I envisioned in 1999 or so when I saw Bush speak. I had abuse all around me and in my home. What he is is a failed individual, a man devoid of truth. He has slithered into the Mormon faith and of course was attracted to the authoritarian set up. Mitt is a guy who desperately wants to be somebody. Somebody who is always right. Somebody who is never questioned. He is a tax-dodging one-man Mafia boss, for strictly the Romney family. I am no mental health professional, bud he gives me goosebumps.

[mrs_p]

3. I understand you perfectly

That clip where the teacher says he told her he "didn't ask her a question" brought me right back to something my own abusive, pathologically lying, narcissistic father would say.

There is something beyond creepy in his eyes.

[Mother Of Four]

21. ...

[MFM008]

4. reptile

with sharks eyes.

[Indpndnt]

7. I was just about to say shark's eyes!

He is extremely disturbing, no doubt.

[gkhouston]

5. When I see him speak, I always get the feeling that the only person in Mitt's universe is Mitt.

Everyone else is rental furniture. It's such a marked contrast to photos/videos of the President working a rope line. For that moment, whoever he's talking to is the only person in his world: he actually looks at people and listens to them as if he's eager to learn about their lives.

[nc4bo]

6. No, you are anything BUT crazy.

When you said it's something primal - yea it is and I believe in my heart it's real. He's dead inside except for his greed and his own personal ambitions and possibly a penchant for cruelty, which burn red hot. He has a public history of these behaviors and I can't help but wonder how he behaves when he's not in public. I bet it's much worse.

What's also sad is that he had 5 sons who may or may not have picked up the same personality or been treated to a taste of the meanness in Mitt Romney.

I'm so sorry you had what sounds like an awful childhood and I'm grateful you were able to move on and not let that negativity ruin your life and love of life.

[Mother Of Four]

9. About the sons...

I hope they turn it around instead of being the same way if he was terrible to them.

Thank you for the comment, very much.

[left on green only]

11. I think that you have described as best you can......

......the mechanism that lies behind your sense of intuition. Intuition is something that does not need to be rationalized, and also something that you should feel no obligation to ever have to rationalize....not even to your self, if you happen to be a student of Socrates! Hold your head up high and go with it, never stopping to look back! Some people envy you for what you have.

And just for the record, I happen to think that your intuition is astute. At least it is in this case!

[Mother Of Four]

18. I didn't even realize ...

I saw your post and went back over mine, and you're right I was trying to rationalize it. Thank you for that, I appreciate it.

[tavalon]

54. I'm far less worried about what people will think when I label the Romneys as sociopaths

I'm much more worried that he may be unleashed on the "free world".

As a fellow abused child, I know that we were indoctrinated to downplay and to question our perceptions. That was probably worse than the actual abuse - at least that had a beginning and an end. The bald faced lying was 24/7.

I think you're spot on. You sense the familiarity just as I do.

[XemaSab]

12. Two things:

First, everything he says sounds like he's reading off a script. Bill Clinton was derided for coming off like "I feel your pain," but for Bill, you never doubt the emotion behind what he is saying. With Romney, everything is said in a totally matter-of-fact tone.

"47% of Americans don't pay income taxes."

"We don't want people to get tired of my wife."

"It would be easier if I was Latino."

It all sounds like he's saying it in the same tone that a newsreader would say, "The high today in Fresno was 83 degrees."

Second, the dude put his dog on the roof of the car and it was so scared it was shitting itself, yet the problem for Romney was that the car was a mess.

That's not something that a nice man would do.

[amandabeech]

24. His treatment of Seamus gave him away.

No one with any heart would do that to a loving dog.

It is interesting to note that no one in the family seems to have tried to protect Seamus.

Were they afraid of Mitt or were (and are) they just like him?

What a creep. And yes, I suffered abuse as a child, too.

[shanti]

64. nobody questions rmoney

nobody. you see, he's a bishop in the mormon church, as well as the CEO of his own company, AND the priesthood holder of his family. do those kind of people ever get questioned? HELL NO! they, and only they, are the ones doing the questioning.

rmoney as POTUS is unthinkable!

[Kath1]

14. You are not crazy and definitely not alone.

He reminds me too much of my very disapproving father and my abusive ex. I have lived through this. Putting on the "happy family" face in public when it is hell at home. I get the same vibe from him and I am scared by it. Thank you for making me realize I am not alone in my thoughts. Peace.

[Mother Of Four]

19. ...

and welcome to DU

[KauaiK]

15. Romney is a Sociopath

I am convinced Romney is a Sociopath. The snarky "heh..heh" laugh to buy time to to think when asked a question he does not like. The lies...the LIES without any semblance of remorse. It appears that he and Ann has complete disdain for anyone below their socio-economic level. Ann talks down to voters like they are her hired help. They struggle to carry on conversations with middle class voters. It's apparent he uncomfortable in those settings. He's not stiff; he's a big fake.

What I cannot get out of my mind are the bullying incidents in school (the hair cut; vicious pranks against a blind instructor) and the story here on DU of a man's father who was told to use the hired help entrance when taking materials to his father's house.

I think they are both scary.

[Mother Of Four]

20. The lies

are a big thing too. No qualms or stumbling at all, just open the mouth and let the verbal diarrhea start.

Welcome to DU too btw, it's great to see so many new posters.

[lunatica]

43. It's like lies are quite comfortable and at home in his mouth

[undergroundpanther]

68. sad thing that some listen to his lies

will find ally in him because THEY are psychopaths themselves(1 in 4 ) or it can work in the saddest of all ways, a victim of abuse sees familiarity in him.I think abuse to kids happens so much,and child protection and domestic abuse /rape services are such an underfunded part of our system,is because the sociopaths hold too much power they have twisted the laws..And the Denial/Awareness of abusers like Rmoney , makes abused people either trigger or see him as familiar.I think the more people learn about psychopathy abuse and triggers,the more wise to the psychopaths as a country we will become.

[Cleita]

16. You are right. He makes me uncomfortable too, and

quite honestly, Ann makes me even more uncomfortable. They seem to be a matched set.

[gkhouston]

47. +1000. So glad I didn't grow up in those houses! n/t

[cheriemedium59]

17. I too had an abusive childhood...

and I agree with you 100%! My father used to be like that too. I thought the
very same thing about Romney as you. I am glad I am not the only one that can see
he is a ticking time bomb with his anger.. It's like 'How dare you challenge MY
comfort!"

[Mother Of Four]

22. Thank you

And welcome to DU ...so many new people

[pnwmom]

23. It is completely normal -- and healthy -- to have that reaction in the presence

of a malignant narcissist.

You sense, correctly, that he doesn't recognize the reality of you as a separate person, with separate needs and opinions. You are just a thing to him -- a thing that will either admire him or be squashed like a bug.

He can say "corporations are people" because he really doesn't understand what people are. In his view, all other human beings are just extensions of himself -- or they don't exist.

It is a creepy feeling to be in the presence of someone who doesn't acknowledge your separate existence.

[Mother Of Four]

25. A thing...

I think you hit the nail on the head, that was a really perceptive post.

[pnwmom]

26. Sadly, you and I have gained our understanding the hard way.

It took me a long time to figure out why certain people repulsed me. It was because I was invisible to them -- just a thing to be used or ignored.

Over the years I've known more than one person like this, and they can be beyond creepy.

[Mother Of Four]

36. ..

[renate]

32. wow--really, really well said

It's interesting, the idea of malignant or pathological narcissism, because it's not as though he makes a conscious decision to see others as things that either help him or get in his way. It's not deliberate... but it is built in.

I suppose philosophers or ethicists could discuss which is worse--a person who knows the difference between right and wrong but chooses to do wrong anyway or a person for whom right and wrong are irrelevant and meaningless, because the only thing that matters is that he gets his way.

Creepy indeed.

[pnwmom]

35. That's it exactly. He doesn't have a choice, really; it's built into his (warped) personality.

People are either useful -- or not. He can't see them any other way.

[tavalon]

56. You and I are in exact concordance.

I only use the term sociopath because it's more familiar to the public, even though the psychiatric system no longer uses that term.

[Scootaloo]

27. You hit the nail on the head...

Maybe my "radar" is tuned a little differently - I respond with anger to this sort of thing. But I know exactly what you're talking about.

This is a man who feels powerful by crushing other people. That's all there is to it. I'm not going to even try to imagine why that is, maybe some people are just that way. But he does not feel "big" unless he is making sure someone else feels small.

[freshwest]

28. I noticed his boys appear afraid of him despite his act. No telling what goes on there.

I won't watch most of them because they use all the dog whistles that incite hatred and contempt for others. A person that will do that is oppotunistic to a dangerous level and doesn't care who gets harmed.

[CoffeeCat]

29. You are spot on!

Your analysis is very astute, and you understand so much more than you give yourself credit for. Your intuition and your insights into human behavior serve you well. Don't ever doubt them.

I also grew up in an abusive household. When you grow up this way, you do develop a radar of sorts. I think this is an adaptation or a coping mechanism. We know that we are not safe and we know those in our household are unpredictable and that they can hurt us. So we become hyper vigilant and sensitive to external cues that our abusers give off.

Maybe it's a facial expression or a tone or a gesture that signals that we are not safe. You and I both know the fake, syrupy facade. We know what an abuser looks like when they are out socializing and interacting--living a double life. You can pick up when people today behave this way.

And Romney's latest facial expressions are the worst. You can see the anger and indignation underneath the forced smile. That's a real trigger for me, as I grew up with abusers who had a great deal of repressed rage. I see the same undercurrent from Romney.

There are many stories about Romney's youth and how he mistreated people. He held that man down and cut his hair. Romney also thought it was amusing to pretend to hold doors open for a blind professor, and then watch the professor walk into the door. He seems sociopathic.

Romney always seems to be in hyper mode to me, which was similar to my own household. Abusers have a different cadence than most people. Their speech, mannerisms and the way they move about a room and interact with others--is just off. It's like they operate in their own little tornado of activity--with everyone orbiting their universe, but never really making meaningful contact with them.

I sense all of this, and more, about Romney. He seems detached.

People who grow up in unsafe homes can sense am abuser, and even fellow victims. You're very in tune with human behaviors that aren't "right."

I'm sorry about What you endured and that your parents failed you. I wish you peace and healing.

[Mother Of Four]

34. Repressed anger...like hes a pressure cooker with too much steam.

It makes me think...in each of the videos I watched it was because someone had the guts to question what he was saying. His reaction was immediate, there wasn't any build up on his end. It was question or statement followed by him bulldozing over the person who was asking.

I found myself reading over your post a second and a third time, the thought that kept popping up was "She's right, in a nutshell what doesn't kill us makes us stronger isn't just a cliche' " I'm sorry you had to go through that as well, I hope you have peace with it too.

It took me a little to write this, because I'm finding it hard to put my response into words. So many wonderful people on this site- it's a digital community but a community all the same. Each of the responses have been comforting.

[tavalon]

57. I've always said I have antennae that scrape the roof

It's almost like a sixth sense. It can be a pain in the butt sometimes that I read everyone in the room, whether I want to or not, but as a child, it was how I stayed alive.

[grasswire]

30. I have seen emotional battering up close and personal...

and I know how destructive it is. The batterer is a monster, and the destruction he/she does is insidious, sometimes not understood for many years.

I would say that Romney is likely a batterer. He should not hold the power of the American military in his hands.

[DearAbby]

31. So I am not alone feeling this

very articulate putting it into words. Just a feeling of familiarity, having been there. Like the spirit of the abuser bounces from one to another...same shit, different person.

[AverageJoe90]

33. Grew up with a somewhat dysfunctional family myself.

Wasn't all bad most of the time but there were a few times were things came close to getting out of hand; unfortunately, this crap still haunts me to this day.

[renate]

37. I'm sorry... every child deserves unconditional love and support

I really am sorry that you didn't have that.

What you wrote is so sad, and so very very authentic. I think you are right.

Look at his eyes. The smile doesn't reach them. That plastic look on his face when he smiles... it's as though he's learned to copy an expression that seems to please others and elicit a positive reaction, but it's not a genuine smile because one of the muscles around his eyes isn't involved--the orbicularis oculi, the one that some people can contract even when they don't mean it, but not everybody. Mitt is one of those who can't.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smile#Duchenne_smiling

I can't believe that during the primary my kids would ask me which of the Republicans was the least bad, and (other than Jon Huntsman, who was never in the running really) I thought that if Obama lost to anybody, Romney would do the least damage to the country. It's crazy that I ever thought that, but at the time, his pandering, lying, say-anything nature just hadn't shown itself yet. Now, his utter emptiness as a human being scares me more than even Rick Santorum, who at least sincerely believed what he said.

[garthranzz]

38. You weren't rationalizing...

you were explaining.

You've had so many excellent responses, I hesitate to add another. I'm not psychologist enough to classify someone like Romney from a distance. But what sets off your radar are very real signals of a person who is not qualified to lead. Character is who we are and that expresses itself early. We can change our behavior and train our character, but not our essence.

Bush was an alcoholic frat-boy - shallow, confusing being present for bringing value. He was an indifferent student, and he was an indifferent "president" - He may have stopped drinking, but he got drunk on power. Still an alcoholic frat-boy.

Mitt Romney is an abuser of privilege. The comment to DUers father, the blind professor, the haircutting, the dog-on-the-roof - how do we explain his turning all of Bain's resources to find an employee's missing daughter? - the same way we explain a capricious earl's deciding to feed a starving peasant one day - whim, a random moment of humanity, a sense of noblesse oblige - perhaps obligatory. But then there are the emerging reports of his behavior as a "bishop".

He's an authoritarian, at the very least, and that's just the other side of the window from an abuser.

For me, the statement that was most revelatory - and I agree with you about the facial expressions and the facile ability to lie - was: "I can never convince those people to take personal responsibility for their lives..." For sheer arrogance, I don't think I've heard anything that matches it. Those words are abusive.

Thank you so much for posting.

[B Calm]

39. K&R

[Raine]

40. He's a bully that's for sure. I wasn't abused but my mother was

I remember how my grandmother was, Rmoney gives off the same vibe.

[raccoon]

41. Great post. Thanks for sharing that.

This thread is a keeper.

[DirkGently]

42. I get the same impression. Rage wrapped in insincerity.

...and a stark lack of empathy. Free-floating contempt for others. And a sense of entitlement so fundamental to his nature that he was able to speak of other people who pay little income tax as entitled with no apparent sense of irony.

Great post.

[lunatica]

44. Thanks for your OP

He's like an onion you have to keep peeling only to find each layer is darker and more rotten. Ann is too.

I know all about the double life of abusers. The outer charm and gentlemanly manners hiding the inner monster who comes out in private. It does tend to leave you "snake bit" and wary for life, and that's the good part. It's a lesson well learned which you should never ignore. I see you have learned yours well. Thanks for sharing it because it's always helpful to others.

[AnotherMother4Peace]

45. His expression was the same when he was on the verge of physically attacking a reporter who

persistently asked asked him a question rMoney did not like. rMoney was pissed, but had the same sardonic grin and lifeless eyes. His people separated them. It is a very revealing video. I saw it either here on DU or MSNBC. You can probably google it.

[Wounded Bear]

46. I don't think you're crazy......

It would be crazy to ignore your feelings, they help to protect you.

The bottom line to me is that Romney seems not to feel any empathy at all for other people (or animals, of course).

You look at him and listen to him and there's no "there" there. Everything's "Father Knows Best" when the neighbors are watching, but when the front door closes and you're alone in the house with him, you'd better watch your ass.

[Ikonoklast]

48. If you believed that one day you would be a God with your family and an entire planet to command

and worship you for all eternity, why would you even bother with what anyone else thinks?

We are nothing but pond scum to this asshole.

[ananda]

49. Romney WAS a bully in his formative years ..

.. and it seems pretty clear to me that he still
has a bully mentality.

[Skidmore]

50. Thank you for giving voice to something I have wanted to

say for a while but couldn't get myself to do so. I have had the same response to him and her. Just a clenching in the gut. My sense of her is as an enabler who smooths things over so that the great man doesn't have to get worked into a foul mood. I, too, grew up in a family with abuse in it and took a lot of abuse until I was in my middle teen years when it dawned on me one day that I could stand up for myself. I carry those inclinations to this day to deflect and to make myself smaller and, hopefully, invisible when heated conversation occurs. It is something that just stays with you and you know it when you see it.e

[tavernier]

51. Playing Devil's Advocate

I'm just thinking, wouldn't it be awful if none of the above was true; if he truly was a good and kind family man?

I have no idea, none, zilch, zero, regarding is private life, so I withhold judgement on that.

I do think he is a moron. He has shown plenty of cause for me to draw that conclusion.

[truebluegreen]

52. Your concern is noted.

[siligut]

59. Will you edit your post?

The OP told us she feels a little exposed and your post is a bit like a slap in the face. I really am not sure of where you are coming from with this. Please just edit out the first two lines and the rolling smiley.

[tavalon]

60. If you're playing the Devil's Advocate

Then Romney must be the Devil you are advocating for.

[HangOnKids]

61. Please post more stuff in your profile

We just don't know enough Really?

[treestar]

63. We could think that if we didn't know anything, but we do

His very sons told us about Mitt tripping his daughter-in-law to win a race. About putting the dog on the car roof. And eating first, before the children, so he wouldn't have to wait for them as they take too long. We're getting the family vibe right from the family.

[Raine]

70. I see no kindness in a father who pushes his kids & grandkids faces into butter

it's just sadistic and bullying.

[tavalon]

53. My father and step mother were sociopaths

I have antennae that scrape the roof. I know sociopaths and Mittastrophe is a sociopath.

I have a different way of describing it, but yeah, it's the false front of an evil, soulless person. Those of us who were abused by such people know that creepy, crawly feeling. Even if Mitt has never back handed anyone, he has strapped a dog to the roof of his car and slammed his kids faces into the butter dish and has been a bully all of his life.

[HangOnKids]

62. Amen

Those crafty lying shits think nobody notices. Well yes those of us abused by those assholes saw it all. The lies, the never going past a mirror without gazing at themselves, the non stop critical commentary, the jealous envy for anybody who did things right, the total FAIL at everything in their lives but it was somebody elses fault. I've lived with one of them and it sucked. Rmoney is that asshole.

[tavalon]

69. Yeah, we really don't need a GWB redo

[Liberal_in_LA]

55. polls say most unlikable prez candidate ever - I think people feel what you describe

about Romney.

[lonestarnot]

58. He's a smiling dick and Annie Oakley is right there with him.

[Arugula Latte]

65. He is a proven bully.

The hair-cutting, the abusive "pranks" (on a blind guy for one!), Seamus on the roof, making workers building their own stage to be fired upon, his joy in firing people and shipping their jobs overseas, his cutting insults, often to people who have freaking come out to see and support him (cheap rainjackets, insulting homemade cookies, etc.) -- it all adds up. He is a bully, and therefore he is abusive.


edited to add the bullying: "I didn't ask you a question!" remark to the teacher:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021399318

[undergroundpanther]

66. he sets off my triggers too

I hope anyone who has been abused will not vote for the Rmoney and is clear about what bothers them about him.. I think he is a monster. I can't listen to him hardly at all because I find I feel angry and disgusted and I don't like,respect,interact with or even want to be around anyone who has the sociopath bully personality type.Rmoney HAS it. Makes my skin crawl. Hate him.He is a poison to non-sociopaths.Human people's well being,Rmoney if he's (s) elected, is the type of abusive bully who will be the bringer of mental anguish to all.I think he likes that idea,when he gets power you bet he'll abuse it and this nation,and the people not like him.

[SIDURI]

71. You're not crazy. I used to get those vibes from Dubya...

The way he'd get all hot-and-bothered when he'd talk about killing people; the way he'd lean over the podium in an aggressive manner... I can't really describe it any more now that he's been gone for several years, but it used to make my skin crawl. I felt the threat.

Romney strikes me as a hyperprivileged male with a 1950s mindset when it comes to women and other subordinates (which is damn near everyone). Toxic Father Knows Best.

I react differently from him than you do, but my gut (like yours) is telling me something is really wrong there. To invite a small-town schoolteacher to a so-called roundtable discussion, then berate her publicly for real and imagined wrongs in the entire country's educational system, then when she tries to speak up he says: "I didn't ask you a question!" That is abusive.

He is abusive as well as supremely arrogant.

Wouldn't want to live in that family, not for all their wealth and privilege.

Siduri