General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSomeone explain to me what the big deal is about Elizabeth Warren and her native american heritage
I mean I'm missing something here and I saw Scott Brown's opening remarks. Hell he might as well wished he were Latino, sprayed his face orange and asked for Obama's birth certificate after that opening remark.
Here's what I know.
Warren was born in Oklahoma so there is a good chance that somewhere in her family tree is Native American.
I've also had genetics, and I know that after a few generations you could see Native American features less prominent if any at all. I've met others who have said they have Native American history and look as pasty white as me. Doesn't mean they are faking something.
From what I've read about Elizabeth Warren's life she's a pretty smart person. She got scholarship into college, always had great grades and was very successful at the work she has done. So whether or not she used the Native American card to get into Harvard or any job seems kinda moot when you're talking about a person who has had a history of excellent grades and work history.
So really, what is the issue here? Why is that the key #1 comment that Brown had to lead with that makes Elizabeth Warren just totally 'unelectable' in his eyes?
rustydog
(9,186 posts)to gain a hiring advantage, but since she is plainly white, she can't be native american.
DonViejo
(60,536 posts)what Native Americans (Latins, Blacks...Jews?) look like.
LynneSin
(95,337 posts)I mean he is!
catbyte
(34,431 posts)on merit; that she somehow cheated. Typical man with Small-Dick Syndrome trying to belittle a woman who is obviously his superior in every way possible.
Marie Marie
(9,999 posts)Sounded desperate to me, like he knew he had to sink her at the start or she would win the war of their policy differences. Cheap shot indeed.
Zalatix
(8,994 posts)Lightbulb_on
(315 posts)... is as you said. Something along the affirmative action angle.
She got the opportunity to become successful because she played the "Native American" card and took a spot from someone else who didn't have it. etc.. etc.. etc..
rustydog
(9,186 posts)oldhippydude
(2,514 posts)they have used the affirmative action petard since the 70's .. translation i could have been (x) but someone got my break (insert minority of choice)..
central scrutinizer
(11,659 posts)some wastrel whose pappy was an alum and is now a major donor.
GeorgeGist
(25,322 posts)oldhippydude
(2,514 posts)WELCOME ABOARD!!!
Response to LynneSin (Original post)
Post removed
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)I mean, one that's running for something these days?
Here is a great candidate, female, smart, educated, brilliant actually, accomplished, running a good campaign and you've got nothing good to say about her.
You just don't like our team anymore? It's okay, just wondering.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)supplied part of an answer. You don't like it - don't read it.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)you're right, I should have known.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)predictable - go hound someone else.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)CreekDog
(46,192 posts)I know you've said you were a longtime supporter and admirer of Hillary Clinton.
Being that Warren is a far superior candidate in knowledge and accomplishment than Brown and being that Warren is superior in terms of women's rights and Native American issues, I just cannot see how a former Hillary supporter could support Brown over Warren.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)ass-umpions.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)Last edited Fri Sep 21, 2012, 07:22 PM - Edit history (1)
edited to correct link: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=134495
she's from Oklahoma, many there have Native American heritage, even if distant, it is not wrong to cite that.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)writer of that article did.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)what's the game here? nobody says you have to like her.
Response to emilyg (Reply #51)
devilgrrl This message was self-deleted by its author.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)Response to emilyg (Reply #60)
devilgrrl This message was self-deleted by its author.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)Response to emilyg (Reply #60)
LaurenG This message was self-deleted by its author.
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)And yes, it's her blog. She mentions DU. http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2007/03/soldier.htm The writing style was kind of a giveaway anyhow.
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)You can see it in her posts. I mostly lurk these days, but she's anti-liberal and that blog is certainly no surprise. Everything is the same, the name, being from Georgia, the writing style, some of the issues, mentioning DU. Her posts should be treated with the same amount of skepticism by people here as a Paul Ryan speech.
Response to Wetzelbill (Reply #29)
devilgrrl This message was self-deleted by its author.
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)foo_bar
(4,193 posts)Not sure how that works wrt ToS, but even the Warren stuff is pretty self-evident:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=termsofservice
If that's really her blog (and she just fessed up to it) (on edit: she self-deleted the post admitting this is her blog, but I imagine the admins can see the original message, and I don't picture them taking kindly to this sort of manipulation), this should be a no-brainer:
This is NOT my party anymore.
<http://>www.drudgereport.com/
http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2012/09/dems-drop-god-from-party-platform.htm
obamanut2012
(26,111 posts)Did the poster really say it was hers? WTF???
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)She's linked to lottery post from DU and to DU from her blog as well.
obamanut2012
(26,111 posts)I mean, I have pretty conservative relatives who admit they won't vote for President Obama because he is Black, but even they think he's an American citizen.
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)There's conservative and there's fucking crazy, and that's... not conservative.
foo_bar
(4,193 posts)I didn't take a screengrab, and I don't recall the exact phrasing, but it was something like "Yeah, well at least I have a hobby..."
In any event, she plugged lotterypost.com on DU (and referenced DU on lotterypost.com):
Come join us on lotterypost.com
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x9698292#9698959
When called on it, she claimed "I don't play the lottery" (this morning?), which was a slightly misleading statement to put it mildly. Anyway, I'll cut to the chase by following the glurge:
"Of course I won't laugh," said the Nurse to the patient, "I'm a professional.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101843148 "emilyg", DU, 1/28/2012
"Of course I won't laugh," said the Nurse to the patient, "I'm a professional.
http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2012/01/nurses-usually-dont-laugh.htm "emilyg", lotterypost, 1/28/2012
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)Response to LeftyMom (Reply #25)
devilgrrl This message was self-deleted by its author.
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)aunt and lottery numbers to racism and right wing nutjobbery.
Do you know The Blacks aren't going to vote for Obama because he's gay and isn't giving them enough free stuff? emilyg's blog says so. http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2012/09/black-people-and-obama.htm
Response to devilgrrl (Reply #37)
emilyg This message was self-deleted by its author.
Cha
(297,526 posts)all the time. It's good to know who the enemies are. So bitter.
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)Cha
(297,526 posts)Which we all know what that's code for.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)first vote ever was for JFK - NEVER STRAYED FROM MY PARTY.
Response to emilyg (Reply #58)
devilgrrl This message was self-deleted by its author.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)calling me a troll. Jury decided 3-3 to let it stand. I'll take Juror 6's advise - "be nice to each other". I don't play the lottery.
foo_bar
(4,193 posts)Then you self-deleted the post:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021387798#post59
Moreover:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=9595163&mesg_id=9595933 (OP: "Ever won a lottery?..."
Come join us on lotterypost.com
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x9698292#9698959
http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2012/09/the-obama-you-dont-know.htm
http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2012/9/black-people-and-obama.htm
http://blogs.lotterypost.com/emilyg/2012/09/dems-drop-god-from-party-platform.htm
� Cannot find any of his childhood friends or neighbors;
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1391536
... ad nauseam.
emilyg
(22,742 posts)have any to waste now that I'm retired.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)Insisted in fact that the reference to God be put back into the platform and Jerusalem be the capital of Israel.
Why the hostility towards him --ironically I think your hostility is towards positions that are the opposite of ones he's actually taken --like this example shows.
Maybe you're just completely unfair to him and don't believe his positions for *some* reason you haven't explained here, perhaps the same reason you don't believe he's a natural born citizen.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)ceile
(8,692 posts)why is this person here?
emilyg
(22,742 posts)ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Yes or no.
foo_bar
(4,193 posts)Come join us on lotterypost.com
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x9698292#9698959
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)(the reason I think it is, perhaps risky, is that it appears to be a right wing blog)
obamanut2012
(26,111 posts)I am appalled a DUer wrote that.
mcctatas
(13,755 posts)If it is for real it sucks, not even creative, poorly researched, no corroborating evidence and sooooo 2009.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)for simply being the target of such racist viciousness, day in and day out.
it really is astounding.
Whoa_Nelly
(21,236 posts)That blog of hers is so full of RW aka FR and beyond!
mcctatas
(13,755 posts)really concerned about Michelle's thesis too, ugh
obamanut2012
(26,111 posts)You said it was your blog.
How can that be your blog if you are saying you're a Dem? I am not being snarky, I'm serious. September 21's post is actually birther talking points.
GObamaGO
(665 posts)CreekDog
(46,192 posts)Skinner (56,248 posts)
26. Let's just bottom line this.
Set aside the question of whether it is legal.
Do you believe it is appropriate for a golf club to discriminate based on sex? A simple yes-or-no answer will suffice.
emilyg (22,723 posts)
62. Private golf club? yes.
--------------
and your favorite first lady was Eleanor Roosevelt? uh huh.
let's not forget how many private country clubs wouldn't allow Jewish members, some until surprisingly recently.
backscatter712
(26,355 posts)This is a progressive web site. If you want to spread racist garbage, do it at Stormfront. Bigotry is not welcome here.
Yes, I know, I'm getting alerted for calling a troll a troll. Bring it on! Hidden posts don't deter me.
eShirl
(18,502 posts)I am shocked this blogger posts on DU
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)are you trying to quote part of it but stop us from reading it in context?
okay I will:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/06/us/politics/for-elizabeth-warren-bad-blood-over-indian-heritage-claims.html?_r=0
eqfan592
(5,963 posts)Why else fail to provide a link?
Changenow
(2,304 posts)CreekDog
(46,192 posts)I'm astonished he said such a thing.
But maybe I shouldn't be.
Cha
(297,526 posts)territory. Where'd Scott think he was..a private donor spread for unpatriotic republicons?
GeorgeGist
(25,322 posts)Canuckistanian
(42,290 posts)And Brown KNOWS it will get him some political traction.
But I'm astounded at how many so-called "progressives" on this site seem to agree with this criticism.
Cha
(297,526 posts)the whole story? It's something republicon researchers came up with to lie about and smear Elizabeth.
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)Millions of white people, even lots of black people, sometimes say or think they are Indian or have some descendancy. It happens all the time. Most have a good heart and believe that, whether it is true or not. It does no real good for a politician to say that, what, they going to pander to the couple votes that Indians have, especially in the East? Most natives will vote for a Dem anyway, because of policy. Here is a little secret. Every Indian has had countless white people claim to be Indian to them. Some of my good friends who I know likely don't have a drop of Indian in them have claimed to be Cherokee or something, it's a running joke for Indians, but we are goodhearted about it. The number of actual Indians who really give a flying fuck about something like this is likely pretty negligible. Mitt Romney could claim to be Native tomorrow, I could care less, he'd be just another person who wants to say it. Not really a big deal.
So Elizabeth Warren claimed she has Indian heritage. Well good, at least she cares. And she shows it in her policy. Is it true? Maybe somewhere in her family tree. Maybe she really thought she was native. But whether she is or not, Elizabeth Warren fights for things that Natives care for. That could benefit the most downtrodden people in the country. Things that would be good for the middle class. That's what is important. I don't care about what some politician may say or claim. 99 percent of them are bullshitters and embellish anyway. About something, about anything. The nature of the business is they always are trying to look good and they always say some BS thing at some time or another. But when it comes to policy, Elizabeth Warren is on the side of 99 percent of us, that's what matters. If somebody is Native and they have a problem with it, well they might want to ask themselves who do you think would be a better person for them in the senate, a working class fighter like Elizabeth Warren or a corporate tool like Scott Brown? Even if it did hurt my feelings that she claimed to be Indian, so what, at least she's not going to sell out my future to Wall Street or give away Social Security, Medicare like Scott Brown would in a second.
And if she isn't Native, so what? I can end it. Elizabeth Warren is an honorary Blackfeet, there you go, end of story.
Indpndnt
(2,391 posts)And I love the ending.
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)It's a fake controversy, drummed up to attack a person who is actually on the side of regular people. It's pushed by the right-wing and mainstream media picks up on it, meanwhile flat out demonstrable lies by politicians go completely ignored like it's ok. I'd rather know about something that matters. This might show something about character if she was a blatant liar like Paul Ryan, where the relatively frivolous on it's own marathon lie matters because it's an archetype to who he is, but Warren is otherwise proven to be an honest, exemplary person, so it means little, if anything, on it's own.
Indpndnt
(2,391 posts)No whining or complaining, just explaining that it's something she's always been told and that she never used it to get scholarships or employment. Fair enough. Now on to the issues.
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)CreekDog
(46,192 posts)what her values are and by that, I mean what she will value when she votes and represents people.
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)It's like the old "Who would you like to have a beer with?" thing. Get the fuck outta here with that. I want to know who is going to privatize Medicare or who wants to bomb another country for no reason.
CreekDog
(46,192 posts)...and let the smart guy or woman run the nation.
joshcryer
(62,276 posts)This is her when she was younger:
Not sure if she is Cherokee from this picture I have of her. But it's a family thing that has gone down through the generations and we haven't done the proper ancestry search to really prove it (really fragmented family tree line).
Wetzelbill
(27,910 posts)or that you don't have some native ancestry. Good for you if you do. Natives just hear that sort of thing all the time. What really matters if you are a good person. I look white, actually. Doesn't necessarily mean much how you look, I am almost a half all told. 1/4 Blackfeet, that's the tribe I am enrolled in. Even if a person isn't really native, if you are good to natives etc, they will welcome you in like family either way. What really matters in our culture is who you are as a person. Countless stories of people adopted into tribes or even just people who live and work on reservations and are treated and accepted just like anybody else.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)The baby is my mom's dad and the woman is his grandmother. I've also been told I have Native blood on my dad's side but do I know this for fact? Nope. I make the claim based on what I've been told but I always clarify that it's what I've been told. The only way I'd know for sure is DNA testing. That said, I look Scott/Irish (I have a very long Scottish lineage on my mom's side -- my 32nd Great Grandfather is purported to be Robert the Bruce).
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)My grandmother was 1/2 Choctaw but was never certified because her mother never wanted to be on the rolls. So here was a woman that certainly looked like a Native American (she looked full blood), but couldn't prove it and couldn't get a CDIB card. Meanwhile I was able to get a CDIB card through my grandfather's (her husband) lineage which did trace back to the Dawes rolls and the only brown I have is the ring around my asshole.
hedgehog
(36,286 posts)any Native American ancestry in order to fit in with a society that favored white people. I imagine that anyone whose family has been here more than a few generations has some Native American ancestry.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)Standing ovation, friend.
dionysus
(26,467 posts)i'm sorry your ticket with Kurovski was ended by Yak Gate
Cha
(297,526 posts)no substance. He seemed extra Pissed that Harry cancelled the Senate Vote in order to get him to Boston to Debate Elizabeth..went down hill from there for him.
To paraphrase the high priest of TV, Marshall McLuhan, Elizabeth Warren was cool, as opposed to a simmering, way too hot Scott Brown. Clearly, the Harvard professor got under our colonels skin.
Scottie wasnt simply trying to beat Elizabeth Warren. At times, it looked as if he wanted to flog her to death with his stack of papers. Shes obsessed with taxes. As if he isnt.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251102632
I read an article at Boston.com last week that there are those in Warren's family, in Arizona now, who acknowledge their Native Amercian Heritage and others want nothing to do with it. Elizabeth is proud of it..just like I am of my wee drop of Ojibwa blood.
Everytime I click the article at google it won't come up for me or I'd offer the link.
ananda
(28,874 posts)She stands for policies that are people first.
That's all I care about.
treestar
(82,383 posts)To find some little mistake and dwell on that, rather than discuss policy and issues.
GCP
(8,166 posts)It's all they've got. He's an empty suit.
librechik
(30,676 posts)that is just Repub hogwash.
However, it looks good to have a variety of interests in your background resume when you apply to school, and she had always been told she had Native American ancestors. Ther was nothing wrong with her declaring that and getting in NA organizations and so on. They just think they can spin this into her "lying on her resume" which is BS.
rox63
(9,464 posts)But she came off a very honest and thoughtful throughout most of the debate that I hope it just makes him seem like a jerk for bringing it up.
A lot of people hear of NA heritage only through family stories. My family told me that we have NA heritage. But it used to be something that could be detrimental to getting ahead. So many families have no documentation. My great-great-grandparents immigrated down to New England from Quebec, Canada in the mid-1800's. There is probably some Abenaki in our background. I had a great-aunt who looked like she could have walked right off the rez. But my brother is blond and blue-eyed. I've been told that I look somewhat NA. But it is not documented anywhere that I could find.
Javaman
(62,532 posts)to the gop mouth breathers brown making that stupid ass racist remark is a dog whistle to the moronic right wing to hate anyone who is different and who gets help due to their heritage.
And browns other out right racist dog whistle attack is "she doesn't even look Native American!!!" as if being Native American has a specific look.
brown, in a phrase, is a desperate racist asshole.
mstinamotorcity2
(1,451 posts)all in Scott Brown's Big Head!!!!Don't try and understand it its above the 47% ratio.
Matariki
(18,775 posts)and vice versa. You can't always tell by looks. Anyway, most Americans probably have some mix of ethnicity buried in their genetics.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)My last name is Italian, but I look very Scandinavian. I am very light. Very light blue eyes, blonde hair, fair skin (although I tan well, which is probably due to the olive skin that I have inheriterd from my father.) People always say "You don't look Italian", however many Italians have recessive Norman genes and end up looking like I do, even though dark colroing tends to be dominant.
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)My grandfather was born in Rome and had reddish brown hair, very light olive skin, and green eyes. I figure since half of Gaul wound up in Rome at least long enough to leave a DNA deposit, it would be more surprising if there weren't any people with that coloring.
I think people who say that really mean you don't look like central casting Sicilian gangsters from the movies.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)That's true! Even when I was travelling in Italy, they pretty much looked like us - that is all colors, shapes and sizes. There wasn't a "typical" Italian look at all, yet everybody thinks we should look like "The Sopranos" or worse, the cast of the "Jersey Shore". Gsh!
Matariki
(18,775 posts)I'm blue eyed with a Chinese family name. Diluted genes....
And I really, really get tired of explaining.