Wingnut Meltdown Over Romney Is In Pandemic Stage

[bigtree]

Ezra Klein ?@ezraklein
Go read @davidfrum's last (few) tweets


davidfrum ?@davidfrum

. . . voters do care about the q: what will this presidency do for me? And "dick you over" is not a winning answer


davidfrum ?@davidfrum

Over course of campaign, Romney has changed from a pragmatic, capable manager into a dog-whistling culture warrior.

(davidfrum ?@davidfrum
This AM's Politico story about Stuart Stevens being to blame for Romney campaign's troubles utterly misses the point. )


davidfrum ?@davidfrum

(6) The problem isn't the campaign leadership; it's the party's followership


5m davidfrum davidfrum ?@davidfrum

How do you message: I'm doing away w Medicaid over the next 10 yrs, Medicare after that, to finance a cut in the top rate of tax to 28%?


5m davidfrum davidfrum ?@davidfrum

The policy problem is that the Romney campaign offers nothing but bad news to hardpressed Americans and the broader middle class.


6m davidfrum davidfrum ?@davidfrum

The Romney campaign has a messaging problem because it has a policy problem.

[BootinUp]

1. nice post to wake up to. nt

[calimary]

19. Yeah, no kidding! BUT DON'T GET COMPLACENT!!!!!!!!!!!

We don't have this thing won yet.

[Cha]

39. Same here in

Hawai'i! I couldn't sleep so got up earlier than usual.

Thanks David Frum for tweeting some FACTS!

Thanks bigtree.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

2. I love it when they are 'eating their own'

[malaise]

3. Their pandemic meltdown is

our orgasmic reduction of the anxiety level

[tama]

4. Make my day!

The total meltdown of the Other party, if true and plays out as expected, is excellent news.

In wider analysis I see this as consequence of the change in national dialogue and conscience that Occupy movement opened year ago, rather than any merit or success of Obama administration in responding to needs and hopes of Americans.

[randome]

5. Bwaa-ha-ha-ha!! Good one!

[bigtree]

7. I do think you're right that the impetus for progressive change has always been the product

. . .of agitation from outside the system. The most obvious agitators were/are the Occupy protestors who spooked the political establishment enough to at least provide some lip service and posturing to economic demands.

I do think you've sold the Obama administration short here. I know we'd see much more of a progressive policy and legislative progress if president Obama had his way to himself on a myriad of issues and initiatives. We're left to judge the impact of his presidency through his legislative accomplishments, rather than his proposals.

That's certainly fair, but you'd be missing the point of this presidency if you don't take the republican's unprecedented obstruction into account. I also think we have to be realistic about the reluctance and failure of the overall electorate to advance a true progressive to a successful nomination.

In that effort, even as Occupy and other agitators and activists fall short of convincing voters to elect a progressive legislature, President Obama is certainly furthering many of the challenges protestors are clamoring for; even if politics inevitably dilutes the end product of his initiatives and ambitions.

[tama]

15. I'm not very interested in partisan politics

and the representative system, but the way I see it, as Obama admin is just inch away towards S-W form Romney in the 2-dimensional map in the opposite corner of DU and I guess American public in general, total meltdown of the Other party would mean the removal of the Catch-22 of voting lesser evil (and getting more evil instead of what people really want), Democratic party by hugging Official Right to death and extinction would be returning to historical position of the RW-conservative party with room for new party of Real Left of radical progressive policies. But nothing but speculation here, we'll see.

[bigtree]

20. I think it's more about the political system he faces than anything else

It's not as if the national legislature we have today is just going to open up and allow a progressive agenda to proceed unhindered and unaltered.

On Obama, the evidence just isn't there to paint him as a neo-Romney . . . not without a heaping pile of that 'speculation' you mentioned.

[tama]

23. I don't know the man

and what his real believes are, all I know is what is in the open, the policies of this admin. I don't have a vote there and speaking just in the role of external observer, so I don't have the same problem as so many progressive voters who in the 2-party catch-22 situation wrestle with their conscience on how to vote (or not to vote). All I can say is that I understand the problem and can't offer any advice except that however they decide to vote, politics is not limited to party-politics and there's lot to do outside the system. In the end, all political parties are just tools for people, not purposes as such.

[dreamnightwind]

61. Exhibit A = TPP

"On Obama, the evidence just isn't there to paint him as a neo-Romney . . . not without a heaping pile of that 'speculation' you mentioned. "

Obama is solidly behind the Trans-Pacific Partnership. How about you? Plenty of other examples if you really care. The poster you're arguing with seems to have it right.

By the way, thanks for this thread, I welcome the meltdown of the Romney.

[Vincardog]

24. You make good points. The problem here is that we are in election mode. To criticize the dear

leader is implied support for the other side. While some people realize that "the lesser of two evils is still evil";
others do not want to admit how far to the right the current president really is. There is a reason neo-liberal policies are as
far right as they are. The DLC and New Dems are as much a creation of the Koch's as the Te party.

[tama]

29. I know about the election mode

and how much it gives rise to the one dimensional us-against-them tribalism. All the more reason to keep the dialogue going on about our common issues and visions and hopes without being confrontational.

[Meandering1]

46. I almost understand what you just said

Run that by me one more time in plain words and w/out the abbreviation s-w. thanks.

[tama]

49. Sorry

SW = South-West. Talking about the 2-dimensional political map of the Political Compass (http://www.politicalcompass.org/analysis2) - which I find difficult to express in words. In that both Obama and Romney are located in the corner of Authoritarian Right, and DUers who take the test and share the results are in the opposite corner of Libertarian Left.

[Meandering1]

60. It is Obama's authoritarian handlers in the military industrial complex

who have pushed him rightwards. If he weren't in politics he'd be somewhere within the same scope as the rest of us.



Who was it Juan Peron? Who said:

"Power is like the violin, you take it from the left but play it from the right"

[tama]

62. Yeah

And that's the saddest truth of party politics. What it does to good people who get sucked inside the Game.

[dreamnightwind]

63. Disagree

He's just the kind of person we're allowed to run for POTUS in the Democratic Party at this point in time. He made his Treasury appointments, he picked his cabinet, he is pushing the TPP. He's a true believer in neo-liberal policies.

I don't have any particular interest in ranting against Obama here, so I'll let it go. I just can't stand to see him represented as some kind of benevolent leader who is forced by others to implement policies he doesn't believe in. There is too much evidence at this point to the contrary.

[AverageJoe90]

67. I can't really agree with this, sorry. nt

[dreamnightwind]

75. Fair enough. nt

[Meandering1]

73. I remember you!

Back when I was just a lurker I always read your posts.

First and foremost Obama is a politician. There are places he can not go due to the powerful interests blocking his path. The same power wielders who refused to give Dennis Kucinich a forum on the debates of 2008. Seeing these obstacles Obama chose to walk around them. The question that remains is if the American political system worth saving? Obama believes this is so.

Apparently you and I both have our doubts about this. We just see Obama from a slightly different lens. So I think.

He ran on a more Liberal premise in 2008 and yet still hasn't closed Guantanamo Bay. And he certainly never prosecuted the Wall Street robber barons or the Bush Family.

However I truly believe that he knows just how evil those M/F's are (and I don't mean "Maynard Ferguson" either). In the meantime he's thrown us a few bones. From the social values area.

Something I think Argentine President Juan Peron once described. "the art of the possible". Or maybe it was just a a song from "Evita" lol.

[dreamnightwind]

74. If we could get the corporate money out of our politicians' pockets

this would be a wonderful political system capable of governing for the happiness of its citizens rather than for the profits of a few.

Welcome, hope you post more often.

[tama]

77. Gandhi

called politics "the art of the impossible". That's what Occupy is doing.

[pediatricmedic]

68. thanks for that political compass, it was actually informative

I fell in the middle of the pack of the Libertarian Left on the international chart. Probably explains why I feel Obama is the lesser of two evils. They really are not that different from each other, usually only differing in degree. Both Obama and Romney are part of the Authoritarian Right as you stated.

I don't see a wingnut meltdown either, I see them not really caring for Romney. They are not enthusiastic about him at all. They are not beaten, not dieing off, and not going away.

[tama]

70. Wellcome to DU!

[juajen]

78. A simpler version of your post would be appreciated. It appears incompresensible.,

[tama]

79. Yep

See #49 and keep asking if that doesn't help.

[creon]

16. yes

There is a lot of truth in your post.

[Ikonoklast]

14. Oh, my.

[brush]

21. Yes

I think you're right about Occupy opening many eyes and minds. Good post.

[JDPriestly]

54. At this time, I note that some of the middle-class Democrats are dividing their time between

the activities of Occupy groups and the Obama campaign.

The Occupy group is attractive because it is hones about the fact that Republican economic theories have led to the sacking of the middle class.

Obama can't deal with that issue head-on because he has to placate the bankers. But the fact remains that both the Occupy Democrats (that group of Democrats with one foot in Occupy) and the Ron Paul devotees are trying to address those economic issues that mainstream politicians refuse to deal with.

The Occupy movement and the spotlight it has thrown on the financial injustice that took over our nation with Reaganism is the key to winning this election for Democrats in my opinion.

Republicans cannot run from their role in bringing about the debt and wealth disparity, and we Democrats should not let them. That is where the Occupy movement comes in and helps Democrats.

[heaven05]

28. oh

nothing about TOTAL rethug obstructionism, along with their 'blue dog' cronies. Just no merit for Obama . Well uninformed is...????

[tama]

31. Obstructionism

That is no doubt another major factor, just looked the David Frum link in this thread and saw that Tea Party is now according to some poll even less "popular" than Moslems and atheists, the only two groups it was ahead of in the previous poll. The general mood is changing towards better direction.

Obstructionism comes in many forms, and what else was and is the violence against Occupy camps and the people participating in demonstrations but obstruction of authentic democracy?

[heaven05]

34. ok

I have no problem with the Occupy Movement. They at the least brought attention to the obvious failings of this 'democracy'. Yes, small D. I have my problems with some of the compromised language and action of this administration like not closing gitmo, attacks on medical marihauna clinics and practice and the like. Yet he is, to me, one of the best Presidents produced by a faulty system with huge warts of hypocrisy and stupidity in the last 100 years.. Go Obama! Go Michelle!

[tama]

38. Very good

I would like to have sauna or sweat lodge with Barack and a good heart to heart. He's not more important than me and you, or less important. Just another human being and we all have our warts.

What I'm not willing to forget and forgive, especially today, are the political structures (Democratic party included) that violently obstruct people practicing authentic democracy to build better lives for ourselves and our children.

[dreamnightwind]

64. That was excellent!

"What I'm not willing to forget and forgive, especially today, are the political structures (Democratic party included) that violently obstruct people practicing authentic democracy to build better lives for ourselves and our children."

I find it hurts most deeply to see Democrats on the wrong side of this fight.

[Cha]

41. Well, then you don't know

all there is to know about what the Obama Admin has Accomplished.

[tama]

44. I will never

know all there is to know about anything.

[tama]

52. PS

Here's something that Obama Admin has so far failed to accomplish: http://www.truthdig.com/report/page2/we_won_--_for_now_20120917/

What everybody should worry about and perhaps even be angry, is that they keep pushing it instead of doing good.

[Cha]

55. P.S. You're pushing "fail" and not acknowledging

accomplishments. I'm not impressed.

goodbye.

[tama]

56. Fail

I'm not pushing anything. And I'm not pushed of by your refusal of dialogue.

[Cha]

57. Here's some dialogue for ya..

"What has Obama Done? Here Are 200 Accomplishments! With Citations!"

http://pleasecutthecrap.typepad.com/main/what-has-obama-done-since-january-20-2009.html

[tama]

58. By all means vote Obama

But if you want a detailed discussion of the accomplishments in the link, post it as a new thread, perhaps other DUers more familiar with those will offer their views.

[StrictlyRockers]

69. Quien es mas progressivo?

I can out-liberal you! I can do it just by acting all bummed out about one policy that is in place to help fight the war on terror and keep us safe.

Pffffffftt

Sure, many of us may not agree with the NDAA. It is what it is. Now is not the time. There's an election coming! I don't think the Libertarian candidate is going to win this time. Keep your powder dry, son. We'll fight the NDAA after we get the Prez re-elected.

[druidity33]

65. I like the cut of your jib, sailor! nt.

[grantcart]

6. frum has been an independent thinker for a while now

[bigtree]

10. I like his independent thinking

. . . it's the republican/conservative bull which I assume he still falls back on that I can't stomach.

It's really not hard at all to find a rational argument against today's republican agenda and practice. I look on with satisfaction at Frum and others who are trying to pull their party out of the abyss and just know that there will never be an acceptable floor to their defense of their regressive party. It's just not true, as Frum and his turncoats might protest, that this extremism and avarice we're seeing from their desperate and marginal pols is some new thing . . . Maybe more prominent, but the hate and divisiveness have been their base for as long as I've been watching politics. I believe Frum and the rest would be happy if their racism, bigotry, and greed were all under the surface -- away from discerning voters' eyes. I think that's mostly what they're lamenting.

[creon]

17. agreed

yes he has.

[liberalmike27]

26. Yea About Frum

He has yet to come grips with the idea the party has moved way right of him, and he needs to change his affiliation to an (I) at least. The throngs of old republicans are growing, just like old democrats, myself included. Ahhh, I wax for the days when I hated Scarborough, and thought Frum was a pompous ass. Long time since.

OK, I'm going to defend Romney--he is the worst candidate, except for the rest of that bunch they put up there. Now I'm going to defend them all. No one could win with their BS, insane policy choices, where they name all of the problems we already know about, then offer solutions, the same ones that put us there, that will only magnify said problems.

Wealth disparity? Solution? Make it worse.

Jobs? Do nothing, give rich people more money, they'll do nothing or invest in China or some other God forsaken place, and do nothing.

Poverty programs we've paid for, that we need more than ever? Get rid of them. So, can anyone win in the Republican Party, when everyone is becoming more insecure, and racism and war-mongering are the only things you cling to?

[grasswire]

37. good analysis nt

[zeemike]

8. Yes but the beauty of it is...

That if they can steal if for Rmoney they can say that is what the people want....they will have a mandate...something Obama never claimed and the media never spoke of.

[BumRushDaShow]

9. "turning on each other like a pack of crowbar-wielding Tonya Hardings"

I guess some pundits just don't need to have a twitter account at times like this?

[byeya]

11. Very positive thread and heartening. I do worry about the ability of copious amounts of money

to paper over the idiocy long enough to get them through the election.

[lindysalsagal]

25. I speculate that this year may prove that multi-national corporations are wasting their money on our

elections.

When they sit down at the end of the year and check the balance sheets, they may regret throwing all that money at commercials that people Tivo-over and miss.

Remains to be seen.

I do know that if all this money had been assigned to civic services: teachers, police and firemen, the local governments would be able to take care of their constituents 3 times over.

[k2qb3]

12. The real problem the Romney campaign has is Americans aren't buying what they're selling.

The GOP followed the PNAC crowd off the cliff a decade ago, threw everyone who questioned it under the bus and has refused to acknowledge reality or adjust to it. In short they're still not part of the reality-based community. A sane political party would have made an attempt to rebrand itself.

If you really want to point at an event that's representative of the problems the GOP is having the firing of sectreas Paul O'niel ten years ago is a much better choice than Romney's campaign staff.

[porphyrian]

13. . n/t

[OneGrassRoot]

18. So many golden nuggets in this post. Thanks. :) n/t

[PatrynXX]

22. hey thats an offensive Tonya harding remark

and Tonya had nothing to do with wielding anything but the knowledge her now ex was going to have someone do it.

[liberal N proud]

27. The problem is the party's followership

republicans not acting like republicans? Gasp!

[fredamae]

30. LMAO today But always

remembering the GOP WILL turn out en masse' b/c they Hate Obama/Dems so much they Are willing to "cut nose off to spite face". The disgruntled Will Not Vote---
Stay alert, don't get comfy, it's so not over.

[flamingdem]

32. Yup, they tend to mostly do what Fox tells them to do n/t

[Arugula Latte]

33. OMG--This is hilarious: "The problem isn't the campaign leadership; it's the party's followership"

[Cha]

43. That's exactly right..no leadership

whatsoever.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

45. Extremism is all the rage:

[brooklynite]

35. In all fairness, Frum isn't a Wingnut...

Conservative, yes, but relatively sane in comparison to the rest of the right-wing blogosphere.

And by the way, remember that Tonya Harding didn't wield the crowbar...she outsourced.

[bigtree]

48. quibbles

. . . both, more or less responsible for the worst from their principals that they supported into being and practice - I don't care how they tried to position themselves to avoid blame.

[M_M]

71. "Axis of Evil"

Frum wrote that.

[Ganja Ninja]

36. "The problem isn't the campaign leadership; it's the party's followership"

Spot on! They tried to build a party following out of hate groups, religious fanatics and the most gullible people in America.

[spinbaby]

40. I have an old FR ID that may be still active

Now might be the perfect time to dust it off and go on there singing the praises of Ron Paul and whining about how Romney isn't a true conservative.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

51. Be sure to mention that Romney speaks French and loves them! nt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

59. Bonafides: Romney's gonna win in a landslide, could be a massive landslide:

Just freshen up your bonafides by properly denying the reality of polls and trends like this post:

To: xzins

I don’t think this is going to be one of those classic red state/blue state elections with only a small handfull of swing states deciding the elction. Under normal conditions that is usuaaly the case.

But with REAL unemployment close to 15%, astronomical national debt above $16 trillion, 46 million on Food Stamps, one out of six living in poverty, gasoline going through the roof, we have the potential for a MASSIVE landslide election. I’ve even some polls which show the election tighrening in Illinois, a state bankrupted by the Democrat Party.

60 posted on Monday, September 17, 2012 03:00:50 PM by Trapped Behind Enemy Lines

[JohnA1]

42. How long will the RICH support crazy Romney?

Romney is looking more and more like he would be a colossal disaster if he were to become president. Sure he seems appealing to the 1% but do you think that even they might be thinking Romney would be a bad investment considering all of the enormous fuckups hes been having lately? I wof course the brain deads like Trump, and the cock bros wont think this due to their over inflated holier than thou souless egos.

I forsee a Romney/Ryan presidency decimating this country and not only taking down the poor and middle class but also those in the upper echolons of society. It will be a disaster of epic proportions and it cannot come to pass.

Its so obvious Romney is a self absorbed entitled twit who thinks he can buy his way into office and not answer for anything he deems thats none of our business. He is a pompous self righteous bastard who is rotten to the core. I firmly believe this and I'm glad his facade is slithering off of his smarmy ass and exposing his decrepit underbelly.

Forward!

[JHB]

47. One thing Frum won't be tweeting:

"Holy Crap! How much of my life did I spend working to put these people in power? Feeding that followership? Screw you guys I'm going home (to Canada)"

[itssimplestupid]

50. It's Nice To Know

That David Frum agrees with me.

http://www.RepublicansAreADisease.com

Republicans are a disease, and watching them, and all their lies melt down in front of us is heart warming.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

53. Just imagine what it would be like if Perry, Bachmann, Cain, or Santorum were the nominee

It would be funnier than any reality show ever conceived.

[Doctor_J]

66. Welcome to reality, Mr. Frum

we are glad to take any former teabagger who sees the light.

[Hubert Flottz]

76. I never heard of a teabagger seeing the light.

Mr. Frumpy Frum just wishes Newt or Sarah was in Mitt's place.

[tavalon]

72. Crowbar wielding Tonya Hardings

That is one of the best lines of the year.