While all the guys with green teeth have their tighty-used-to-be-whiteys in a twist about

[Atticus]

the Confederate flag being banned by NASCAR and Congress moving to strip rebel names from US military bases, let's remind them of some facts.

Every man who wore the Confederate uniform and took up arms against the United States of America was a TRAITOR. Each was guilty of TREASON. After they were thoroughly defeated, it was only the generosity and civility of the North that kept their officers from bring hanged.

The specific "cornerstone" of the Confederacy was a renunciation of "all men are created equal" and the insistence that it was the white race's God-given right to own and enslave black people.

"Them's the facts". The "states' rights" tripe was---and is---a childishly transparent lie.

[brush]

1. Agreed 100%. Traitors all.

[RKP5637]

2. K&R!!!!!!!!!!!!!! n/t

[MyOwnPeace]

3. I thought the recent series

about U.S. Grant (General and President) did a marvelous job of spelling out how he chose to handle the defeated leaders and troops of the Trum - er, Confederate states. And YES, TRAITOR and TREASON are two very important words that need to be attached to all of them.

[SWBTATTReg]

4. Yes, and in his great wisdom, Lincoln didn't want any retribution taken against the South. He...

wanted the healing process to begin ... a wise man indeed...shot and killed way before his time and before his healing process for the Union to heal thyself could be fully embraced.

[Wolf Frankula]

43. Another reason was to prevent irregular warfare.

It was feared, that if the Confederate traitors feared prosecution, they would resort to irregular warfare and keep fighting. The intent was to get them to "Go home. Follow peaceful occupations. Obey the laws."

Wolf

[sop]

5. Remember when they used to argue the Civil War was about "state's rights" and "economics"?

Sure...The right of southern states to legalize the buying and selling of humans, and the loss of all that human labor capital if slave owners were forced to free their property.

[Locrian]

35. states rights total bs

On March 22, 1861, ten days after the Confederacy adopted its new constitution, Vice-President Alexander Stephens made the case for it before a huge crowd in Savannah, Georgia. The United States, he complained, “rested upon the assumption of the equality of races.”

"Our new Government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery — subordination to the superior race — is his natural and moral condition. "

https://neaedjustice.org/social-justice-issues/racial-justice/corrected-confederacy-race-relations/

[dawg day]

6. Also losers.

Why would we want our soldiers trained somewhere named after a loser?

[Tipperary]

7. Um.

“Tfeason?”

[Atticus]

8. Oh, fer cryinoutloud! Thanks! nt

[paleotn]

21. Forget it. He's rolling.

[Martin Eden]

9. The Confederacy lasted less than five years

And yet, in the long history of the South, why do so many choose to elevate that treasonous rebellion for perpetuating slavery to a special place of honor?

[demigoddess]

10. to make themselves feel better about losing.

I lived in Mississippi for a short time and it seemed to me every one I met had that superiority thing that comes when you know your people are not superior in any thing. In English class (senior year) the spelling words we had to learn were: two, too, to, there, their, our, hour, etc. I had learned that stuff in grade school!!!

[Martin Eden]

12. Continually bringing up a crushing defeat makes them feel better?

I think idolizing their Confederate "heroes" and the "Lost Cause" has a lot to do with whitewashing the treasonous/racist aspects of that struggle while making it into something noble and glorious.

In doing so they are denying any guilt and trying to justify what really was indefensible.

[oldsoftie]

16. I had 2 great-great-grandfathers who fought for the South. One was wounded.

The stories passed down from my grandparents is like what i've heard from a couple others. One day troops showed up and said "come on, you're going to fight". And that was that. One of them didnt even know there was a war going on apparently. The other one knew, but thought he was too young. Both survived the war. Both limbs of that side of my family tree were never more than sharecroppers. I remember when i was a kid, I asked where OUR plantation was? Everyone over 70 laughed. I grew up a military brat & didnt get back to GA until middle school. So I didnt really know a lot of family history & I just thought EVERYONE had "family land". And my moms side didnt show up in America until after 1900.
Turns out the dad's side of the family never owned any property until the 1950s!

[Martin Eden]

23. Thank you for that personal story

Hundreds of thousands of poor whites who didn't own slaves died to preserve the way of life for the wealthy plantation owners, including their "right" to subjugate an entire race of people.

[Sherman A1]

33. Maternal Great Grandfather and his brother

who served in a NC Infantry Regiment, they apparently were in the local militia company. Great Grandfather served for less than 6 months then deserted taking his family through we believe Indiana before landing in Illinois. His brother also left but the story goes he was found by the Home Guard and either hung or shot and is buried in an unmarked grave near the local church. It was said that his sweetheart never recovered from the loss and never married.

Another Maternal side ancestor served with a Virginia Cavalry Unit but I know little of him. My Paternal Great Grandfather is said to have served on the Union Side but I have no precise unit information.

[murielm99]

15. I don't know how old you are,

but I went to college in the 1960's. I had a prof who said he had taught in Mississippi for a while. He said the big thing he noticed was the lack of intellectual curiosity in the college students there.

[Cirque du So-What]

11. They will often trot out tariffs as the root cause for war

They polish a turd that grows ever more odious with the passage of time.

[keithbvadu2]

26. Yet republicans love tariffs now.

Yet republicans love tariffs now.

Fox has my gfriend convinced that China paid all those billions in tariffs.

[Cirque du So-What]

29. Confederates loved them during the civil war too

Tariffs were used to fund the war.

[ZERTErYNOthe]

13. Even in Maryland I see this ...

I live just south of the Mason Dixon line, a Yankee transplant. I grew up in Northern PA, and one person in my high school (early 80s) flew the rebel flag. He also bragged his family was part of the KKK (seriously). It took many years down here before I got to know locals, those born here, who trace their family back to civil war times. Passions still run deep. I once attended a Halloween event, dressed as a civil war soldier. I hadn't considered which uniform to wear, thank god the rental place had my best interests in mind and gave me a southern uniform. I was told later in the evening that if I had come as a northern soldier I would have been asked to leave. I don't think it had anything to do with racism, especially considering all of their friends, and who was at the event. It was really interesting to see the still smoldering remembrance of a loss by their ancestors. I don't have anything to compare this to. My ancestors have only been here for a few generations, and include "illegals" - an army deserter from a European country, and a bunch of people who lived on the Canadian-US border in the late 1800-early 1900 who just walked back and forth over the border, delivered milk on both sides, and then lived in the US without formal papers. However, I have read about the Dutch in Chicago (from one side of the family), and how the Irish were treated (the other side). While I am passionate about my heritage, I honestly don't understand some of the continued hurt over the confederacies. I also expect that those people don't give a flying F about the treatment of the Irish or the Dutch immigrants in America. But, I try to understand and have empathy.

[procon]

14. Green teeth! Yikes...

OMG did that ever bring back unwanted memories of days long gone. My family transferred from So. Cal. to west Texas when I was in high school. First day of school I see all these local kids, mostly the boys, with their flat top, buzzed hair and hideous, gag worthy, green gunk growing around their gum lines. Kids from the base had normal teeth.

I don't remember if flossing was big back in the 60s, but certainly brushing your teeth wasn't a novel idea. There were rotten teeth everywhere, along with the blackened, broken, missing, and scummy green moldy ones. No one had figured out that brushing prevented tooth decay.

What a revolting memory. I hadn't thought about green teeth until you mentioned it, and it was not a pleasant image.

[cwydro]

39. I grew up in NC.

Never saw anyone with green teeth, I have to say. I did grow up in an educated neighborhood surrounded by educated people.

But I did go to public schools, and I met many not as fortunate as I. None had "green teeth."

I worked during my working life with many poor white and black people. I've seen bad teeth, but can't remember ever seeing "green teeth."

Please.

[procon]

41. The green gunk started at their gums and was

a visible dark green, like a packed line of spinach. It spread around the surface of every tooth. It was probably a stinking miasma of old rotten food and bacteria. Those guys had the worst bad breath, I couldn't stand anywhere near if they were talking because I'd start to gag.

Since almost every student had green teeth in various stages of decay, I guess they thought it was normal.

[cwydro]

42. Mm. Ok.

[GrapesOfWrath]

45. I hear ya

I remember the Charlie Daniels Band song “Uneasy Rider” that used to crack me up as a child 😂
One of the lyrics was:

Just when I thought I'd get outta there with my skin
These 5 big dudes come strollin' in
With this one old drunk chick and some fella with green teeth

[BBG]

17. Them's the facts, traitors were traitors

Quick, short rundowns like this are helpful in articulating to folks who otherwise get lost in the drama and myths.

[Major Nikon]

18. Some were conscripted

Although certainly none of the traitors these shitstains want to honor were.

[SheltieLover]

19. K&R!

[cwydro]

40. There you are.

[Marthe48]

20. exactly

After the United States defeated the south's attempt to form a slave nation, every person who served in the southern army was required to sign a loyalty oath to the U.S.A. to get his citizenship back. Many chose not to and emigrated to Brazil, where to this day, there is a place called Little America. Anybody who loves the confederate flag should go there.

If you want to fly a flag that indicates that you are a rebel, how about the Don't Tread on Me? Original rebellion and not against your country.

[Squidly]

36. Since the Dont Tread on Me flag was coopted by the Tea Party...

..I view anyone flying that now days as despicable as anyone flying a Confederate flag. Usually they go hand in hand.

[Ligyron]

22. Yes, and a lot of people displaying it originally have since thought better of it.

Tom Petty comes to mind, no relation to the NASCAR Petty clan.

[Hassler]

24. Unlike POUTUS, I like naming forts for people who aren't

Treasonous losers. Same goes for statues.

[warmfeet]

25. Yep.

The truth.

[world wide wally]

27. ALL enemies... Foreign AND Domestic

So, where do you stand?

[IDreamOfGreen]

28. Articles of secession

Don’t know if it was already mentioned but each of the confederate states released articles of secession explaining their reasons for leaving. Some of them clearly state their opinion they would never allow former slaves to hold equal status with whites. Textbook white supremacy.

[The Magistrate]

30. Welcome To the Forum, Sir

In fact, most of the Articles went further, stating that slavery of negroes to whites was the natural and proper, even divinely ordained relation between the races....

[IronLionZion]

31. Welcome to DU!

[mercuryblues]

34. I read several of the states articles of secession

a while back. Every single one of them that I read explicitly stated slavery as the reason for seceding from the Union. Anything else being pushed today is revisionist history.

[MustLoveBeagles]

44. Welcome to DU

[IDreamOfGreen]

32. Thank you.

Been reading the board for a very long time and had preferred staying as far off the grid with online responses as possible but there is something about this argument, about the confederacy, about their battle loss flag and the purely inhuman treatment of African Americans have endured that truly makes my blood boil. It is amazing how many of these people will argue states rights and don’t even know the confederate states signed their evil confessions.

[Faux pas]

37. Kickin'

[krispos42]

38. Wikipedia had a copy of the Confederate Constitution

Look it up and do a control+f for things like "negro" or "slave".

Article I Section 9(2)
The importation of negroes of the African race from any foreign country, other than the slaveholding States or Territories of the United States of America, is hereby forbidden; and Congress is required to pass such laws as shall effectually prevent the same.

Article I Section 9(4)
No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed.

Article IV Section 2(1)
The citizens of each State shall be entitled to all the privileges and immunities of citizens in the several States; and shall have the right of transit and sojourn in any State of this Confederacy, with their slaves and other property; and the right of property in said slaves shall not be thereby impaired.

And this one is pretty juicy:

Article IV Section 3(3)
The Confederate States may acquire new territory; and Congress shall have power to legislate and provide governments for the inhabitants of all territory belonging to the Confederate States, lying without the limits of the several states; and may permit them, at such times, and in such manner as it may by law provide, to form states to be admitted into the Confederacy. In all such territory, the institution of negro slavery as it now exists in the Confederate States, shall be recognized and protected by Congress, and by the territorial government: and the inhabitants of the several Confederate States and Territories, shall have the right to take to such territory any slaves lawfully held by them in any of the states or territories of the Confederate states.

IT WAS TOTALLY ABOUT RACIAL SLAVERY

[Raster]

46. "State's Rights" meant the right to be a slave-holding state...

...and ensure that other potential states could be admitted to the Union as slave-holding states.
It was all about continued racial slavery.

I live in Arizona. There was just the briefest flirtation by a small few in the Arizona Territory with slavery, which was roundly routed and defeated. Arizona was NEVER part of the Confederacy. Nonetheless, you see the treason stars and bars more on vehicles than you do the Arizona state flag. There is even a newly reconstituted version of the "Sons of the Confederacy," that in the past has sponsored treason stars-and-bars floats at county and city parades to promote "heritage not hate."



It was NEVER about heritage. It was ALWAYS about hate. It was ALWAYS about slavery.