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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsLand 0'Lakes Butter lady: It's amazing how my perspective changed once I learned some facts
I was pretty neutral on the symbolic "Indian removal" act by Land O'Lakes. While I dislike the archaic and demeaning use of ethnic minorities as stereotypes for pushing consumer products (the Cleveland Indians' Chief Wahoo being the most egregious, but hardly the only example), I don't think I'd put the butter mascot (who I've found out has a name, "Mia" in the same category. Her artistic depiction was culturally specific, but didn't seem demeaning. It seemed random to have an American Indian represent butter, the manufacturing of which is not particularly a traditional Indian cultural practice.
So when I read this editorial by the son of the Ojibwe artist who designed the current version of the late icon, it cast the blink-and-you-miss-it controversy in a very different light. The tl;dr on it reads:
"In my education booklet, Rethinking Stereotypes, I noted that communicating misinformation is an underlying function of stereotypes, including through visual images. One way that these images convey misinformation is in a passive, subliminal way that uses inaccurate depictions of tribal symbols, motifs, clothing and historical references. The other kind of stereotypical, misinforming imagery is more overt, with physical features caricatured and customs demeaned. Through dominant language and art, I wrote, stereotypic imagery allows one to see, and believe, in an invented image, an invented race, based on generalizations.
I provided a number of examples. Mia wasnt one of them. Not because she was part of my fathers legacy as a commercial artist and I didnt want to offend him. Mia simply didnt fit the parameters of a stereotype....
With the redesign {of the label's artwork in 1946}, my father made Mias Native American connections more specific. He changed the beadwork designs on her dress by adding floral motifs that are common in Ojibwe art. He added two points of wooded shoreline to the lake that had often been depicted in the images background. It was a place any Red Lake tribal citizen would recognize as the Narrows, where Lower Red Lake and Upper Red Lake meet.
With this awareness in hand (and I encourage you to read the full article), it recasts the same newspaper's applauding of the company's disappearing of Mia in a very different light. In their editorial page, they wrote:
So we have to assume that the company realized times have changed and so (thankfully) have sensibilities about the use of Native people as mascots, logos and other adornments. We wish the company had been more candid, but what is important is that it recognized the harm caused by its Indian stereotype. Others should follow suit....
There was, of course, predictable blowback from critics who saw the company as caving in to political correctness and from some consumers who fondly recalled the iconic logo as part of growing up."
There's plenty of room for disagreement here. Certainly there's an inherent white cultural triumphalism involved in using Indian imagery as a short hand for "all-natural" or "from the earth" idea in corporate branding. On the other hand, bleaching cultural specifics from American shelves doesn't really serve the ideal of America acknowledging and embracing its diversity. Mia is presented no more harmfully or exploitively than Betty Crocker or Cap'n Crunch, artistic expressions of whiteness that no one objects to. But more to the point, the Washington Post editorial staff revealed its own non-fictional triumphalism by simply assuming there was "harm caused by its Indian stereotype" where the artist himself clearly drew nothing of the sort. They saw a Indian woman depicted in art in traditional dress and chose to read stereotype into that image. But that seems to be a function of the WaPo staff's lack of cultural awareness.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213366214
Since WaPo maybe paywalled to some DU'ers, another piece on the history of this Ojibwe artist who is now having a piece of his legacy erased is discussed in this thread:
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213366240
https://indiancountrytoday.com/news/there-s-another-story-behind-that-land-o-lakes-butter-box-v-QWAwVzCUCmHEs3OmHTdA
My dads artwork has been out there for so long, and there's so many people that just dont even know about his beautiful artwork, DesJarlaits daughter Charmaine Branchaud said. Theres a story behind that man. Its a part of history. Now, we are making history again with Mia. Shes disappeared, but that doesnt mean my dads artwork is going to disappear. She was just a little bitty part of it. He had a lot of accomplishments in his life.
I cntl+F looked for other articles in this forum before writing this and didnt' see it addressed elsewhere.
hlthe2b
(102,379 posts)I'd be lying if I said I did not feel some nostalgia for the original logo and never personally thought it demeaning. Native Americans and the "Land of Lakes" seemed more like a tribute to me and the logo was colorful and memorable. However, not being Native American myself, I am fully respectful of their making that determination. It doesn't sound as though there is real consensus though.
Turbineguy
(37,372 posts)Polly Hennessey
(6,807 posts)Bucky
(54,069 posts)Other corporate branding mascots have evolved to remove racist tropes, most notably Aunt Jemima. But you can't ever really fully remove the historical memory of the connotations. I mean, the Aunt in "Aunt Jemima" itself is part of the country's cultural baggage.
hlthe2b
(102,379 posts)Still, they managed to retain the name, so, losing the stereotypical features originally comprising the logo must have been effective.
cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)and Uncle Ben. They're really easy to spot, but I wonder how much, over the decades, those images have subtly infected the minds of white children seeing them on the table or counter. I think casual yet pervasive racism is the most dangerous kind.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Infected them with what?
Common processed food products include this guy:
Did that inspire generations of anti-Quaker prejudice somehow?
Or what about this girl:
These people:
My goodness, take a walk through a supermarket. Even the arm in Arm & Hammer is white.
So the idea is that all human food mascots must be white. Is that it?
Colonel Sanders - white.
Wendy's - white.
Ronald McDonald - really, really white.
You tell me what it "subtly infects" a child's mind with when they notice that among human food mascots, they are all white?
Why is "Whites Only" preferable ?
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Lmao!
Dont forget Mr. Clean! He was white and dressed all in white!
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)Dont forget Betty Crocker!
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)She's just a name on a spoon now.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)No doubt a gift from some well-meaning family friend.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)But I have no doubt I made some recipes out of the Betty Crocker book!
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)A&P has a special fondness to me, it used to have a stamp book program that once the book was filled with stamps handed out with purchases, a person got sizeable discounts on the next purchase of groceries. I was a tiny boy, but I remember that.
More importantly for a Black southerner, A&P was the only grocery chain where I was raised that served everyone, regardless of race. It was in it's stores, tagging along behind my mom, that I first saw White people close up. Eventhough I was really young, I remember A&P and W.T. Grant, the only stores that served Black people without making them feel inferior, if they were served at all. Although they were gone before I started elementary school, I remember the "Whites Only" drinking fountains and toilets. A lot of people that never saw that have no appreciation for how dramatically life has changed for the better.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)But, it's okay....ever since Lucille Ball married Desi Arnaz, some Latins are okay in a "whites only" world (which, really, often makes me wonder how the American television audience dealt with that).
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Somebody had that as a mascot.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)This one is outstanding:
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)kskiska
(27,047 posts)but they couldn't even utter the word, so her condition became "expecting."
Hekate
(90,829 posts)She shows up at one of his performances and persuades the band to play a lullaby. Goodness, how surprised he was when he figured it out! Ha ha.
Thing was, she was wearing a maternity outfit and about 8 months along. Fancy, expensive, outfit, too -- nothing lke that ever showed up in my neighborhood.
Most of the Lucille Ball episodes and bits that I have seen have been as an adult watching PBS documentaries on the history of (take your pick): television, television comedy, women in television comedy, women entrepreneurs in the television industry... She was really something.
Unfortunately for my tv viewing in her heyday when I was a kid -- my mom couldn't stand her.
kskiska
(27,047 posts)I remember when "Little Ricky" was born. Of course, he was a child actor.
Hekate
(90,829 posts)...a sweet article in the local paper some years back about the local family that produced a popular Mexican-food product. Sorry, can't remember what it was -- only the label had a really beautiful Latina in what the reporter called a "va-va-voom pose" in a Mexican dress with one shoulder bared, luxurious black hair tossed to one side, and a big smile. Who was this lady? She was the mother of the current (now gray-haired) Latino owner.
Not everything is cultural appropriation/exploitation.
trackfan
(3,650 posts)cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)Other than the Univ. of PA football team, I don't see the image of a quaker man seeping into the culture at large--although I'm sure you know there have been periods of intense prejudice against quakers, who were indeed identified at least in part by their broad hats. That's how Pennsylvania came to be, after all.
I likewise have not seen the other images (CrackSnapplePopLittleDebbieetc) used in any derogatory way *ever*.
Yet. My mother's best friend gave her a grocery list holder which was an Aunt Jemima analog; check out tablecloths from the 1950s and early 60s; take a look at cartoons (including mainstream ones like Bugs Bunny) from their very beginning up through the 1950s ---in fact, do you know that the white gloves worn by cartoon characters are a holdover from minstrel shows (Krazy, by George Tisserand, about the creator of Krazy Kat), the face on those cat clocks with the tail for a pendulum and on and on and on. My high school's talent show was backed by a minstrel band, complete with blackface. Have you never watched old movies?
This stuff is insidious because the people who do it are genuinely surprised to be accused of racism. They learned it from Aunt Jemima, among other sources
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)My Irish friends love this!
At least they didnt depict him as a drunk.
But hey! Whats with that Geico gecko having a Cockney accent? My dad was raised in London, pure Cockney...I bet hed be offended.
hlthe2b
(102,379 posts)Poiuyt
(18,130 posts)We're not all drunken brawlers
Coventina
(27,172 posts)reduced prices for the thrifty consumer!
They were accompanied by a winking guy in a kilt giving the thumbs up!
Because, we all know how tightfisted Scottish people are!!!
(another oppressed people against whom the English practiced genocide)
cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)has anything to do with butter. Corn-oil margarine, maybe, but she was on butter packages earlier than margarine. There are plenty of other ways to represent "all-natural" or "from nature," and none of them involves a person of any ethnicity. I understand that pictures of beautiful women have always been used in advertising, but that's hardly an excuse, or even much of an explanation.
Bucky
(54,069 posts)Ultimately it says more about us and our concerns that anything endemic to the company or the process of butter making.
They removed the hillbilly from Mountain Dew years ago to avoid the seeming insult of exploiting an oppressed culture, but eventually he made his way back in some product branding. Maybe Mia will return one day too, when she's the mascot we need, even if she's not the mascot we deserve.
I can certainly understand the company itself wishing to hopscotch away from any controversy this might generate. I apologize if you're Scottish and offended by my choice of verbs.
cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)hlthe2b
(102,379 posts)of Minnesota, a state known as the "land of lakes." I assume they had the latter name for the product before they had the logo.
LeftInTX
(25,563 posts)Almost every town in Wisconsin has NA name. (Milwaukee, Chippewa Falls, Oshkosh, Neenah, Menasha, Kaukana, Waupaca, Wausau etc etc etc)
There is the Song of Hiawatha
https://www.hwlongfellow.org/poems_poem.php?pid=277
There is also the culture of the north woods, which is considered a wilderness, which I assume Land O Lakes is trying to capture. Dairy farms don't really exist in the north woods. But the north woods are vacation areas for many who live in cities that are dotted with dairy farms. Just like Hamms beer is from the "Land of the Sky Blue Waters"....My friends had a huge Hamms mural in their basement. We lived in Neenah, which is a factory town surrounded by dairy farms. Hamms HQ is in St. Paul.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Brand loyalty starts early, and even before literacy.
For that and a couple of other reasons, putting a face on a product associates that product with the stuff we had in my house growing up in the pre-literate mind that grows to trust and recognize that face when they see it again. That face communicates a message in a very basic and primal way, and typically has been associated with feelings of love, comfort, caring and family since before that consumer could even speak.
Compare these two logos:
Which one do you trust?
Which one triggers a reflexive fond feeling, before you can even really think of why?
Which one has you thinking of some childhood memory?
The point is to make the brand seem to be an old friend. And one that stands out in a crowd.
Who doesnt love Miss Chiquita? Her smile adorns fruit products that were the best part of how many lunches, breakfasts and snacks - even though you knew, or even especially because you knew they were good for you.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Its amazing. How do you brand raisins?
cwydro
(51,308 posts)I can see that lol!
Im sure its not pc, but I used to love Mrs. Butterworth. No good at posting pics, but somehow that bottle on the breakfast table comforted me as a shy child before heading off to school.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Wow.
They were strictly Sunday morning. With bacon and grits and scrambled eggs.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Mom was wonderful though.
We had breakfast ready every morning before school.
Come to think of it - dad usually was the pancake maker, so that would have been weekends.
So much I took for granted. Sigh.
Hekate
(90,829 posts)But I buy whatever it is Trader Joe's sells.
cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)I could defend Chiquita (sort of) but I hold that Mia is indefensible.
moose65
(3,168 posts)To me, she didn't look like a Native American. She looked like a white woman in Native dress. I guess that's just the way I look at it!
Question: is it ever appropriate, then, to use a generic Native American in an advertisement? I didn't see the Indian maiden on Land O Lakes as being particularly offensive - certainly not along the same lines as the Redskins or other assorted "warrior" images. On the other hand, I also didn't know what an Indian had to do with butter.
Back in the late 70's or early 80's I remember Mazola corn oil using Indians in their commercials. "You call it corn. We call it maize."
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Maybe I was tone deaf, but it was just a picture on a box to me, I never thought much about it.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)I wonder if he smoked bongs!
Bluethroughu
(5,201 posts)I thought she was beautiful. Being a white woman, I did realize the cultural exploitation, but women of all shapes, colors and sizes have been exploited to sell everything and anything so it is nothing new for us, and I thought the natural scene that she was depicted in was in good taste. I was a little disturbed when the video went around about how to turn Mia into a peep show of sorts.
I used Land O'Lakes butter exclusively my whole life, until I read about them financially supporting the right wing nut(Steve King) in Iowa. I called and told them, I would no longer allow their product part of my family's meals and switched to an awesome vital farms product that I like better. It's been a few years, and I still glance over at Mia as I browse the butter isle, and feel bad about how my relationship with her had to end. Silly but true.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Botox to puff up lips is very commonly used by thin lipped women.
Bootie implants to make flat-assed women look "sexier" (maybe they should just workout more).
Hair curling and hair straightening products to make hair look the opposite of what it looks like naturally.
I am sure that there are plenty of others that don't immediately come to my mind.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Last edited Thu Apr 30, 2020, 09:28 PM - Edit history (1)
Thats why food mascots work. They are more than brands. They are your friends. You invite them in your home, and odds are your parents did too. You knew them as a child, and they are always associated with positive feelings.
Hermit-The-Prog
(33,447 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)Though I was always a bit frightened by Mr. Clean.
Probably why Im such a bad housekeeper lol. The trauma!
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Was that guy living on a boat in the toilet tank.
I was so glad we didnt use that stuff.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)We must be the same age!
Now I gotta go try and find that commercial... was that tidybowl or some such? Completely forgot about him. He was white, right? Or did he have a Caribbean accent like the guy in the 7up commercials?
Im so confuzzled.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)What's weirder than snooping in other people's medicine cabinets to find out if they have any good drugs?
Finding out there is a little man who LIVES on a BOAT inside the toilet.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)And I definitely remember the guy in the boat lol.
Hey, remember the 7Up guy? Didnt he have like a Jamaican/Caribbean accent? Oh, the shame.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)https://adage.com/article/people-players/geoffrey-holder-voice-7up-s-uncola-dies/295314
But Mr. Holder did more than help the company reposition itself. He broke barriers. At the time, 7UP prohibited African-Americans from appearing in its TV ads, according to Charlie Martell, the J. Walter Thompson creative director who wrote the ad. Mr. Holder's casting turned that around and helped pushed the industry forward.
In 1975, the 6-foot-6-inch Mr. Holder won two Tonys -- as director and costume designer for "The Wiz," the all-black adaptation of "The Wizard of Oz." In addition, he appeared as the James Bond villain Baron Samedi in 1973's "Live and Let Die" and as the kindly Punjab in the 1982 film adaptation of "Annie." He also choreographed for the Alvin Ailey American Dance Theater and was the author of a Caribbean cookbook.
He was great in Live and Let Die
cwydro
(51,308 posts)My dad took us to all the Bond movies back in the day.
Bluethroughu
(5,201 posts)We didn't use that either, but I always thought, if he had to live in a dirty toilet, he'd not be so cheery.
Bluethroughu
(5,201 posts)I didn't like that he allowed people to touch his belly, and then gave out a uh-heuw...
Hahaha
Tony the tiger was obnoxious, the Kool-Aid man made a mess, and Captn Crunch was a phony.
I liked the bee buzzing around the Cheerios' bowl with his wand.
Marketing is psychological warfare.