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blitzen

(4,572 posts)
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 09:48 AM Apr 2020

Yale Immunology prof answers questions, such as "Will summer save us?" Very informative...

[Here are some excerpts. There is a lot more, all of it interesting. The last paragraph that I posted suggests that social distancing over time--I would imagine a long time--makes the virus adapt to become less virulent.]

http://nautil.us/issue/84/outbreak/summer-wont-save-us-from-covid_19

What role did winter play in the spread of the pandemic?

Winter definitely plays a role because we know, by studying many other respiratory pathogens, that the winter months provide an ideal situation for viruses to transmit in the air. If you look at the influenza virus, the peak is in winter. Part of the reason for this is because we have low humidity indoors during winter, and that is an ideal condition for the virus to survive in the air. Another part is the fact that our defense against respiratory viruses declines in low-humidity settings. These things usually contribute to infection and transmission of influenza and other respiratory viruses.

Why does low humidity help the virus spread?

What happens when you cough or sneeze is that you expel the virus particle inside these droplets. When the droplet hits the air, and it’s very dry, it loses the water content and it becomes desiccated. Little dried particles float in the air, and they tend to persist in the air for hours. Whereas if the humidity is high, those droplets acquire water vapor from the air, and they become larger and they drop on the floor instead of infecting someone else. The low humidity basically allows these aerosolized particles to remain in the air for much longer because they don’t retain the water very well.

Did another winter factor come into play?

Likely sunlight, because it’s important to metabolize vitamin D. In the winter, people tend to stay indoors more often and they’re not getting enough sunlight. Vitamin D is well known to boost the immune system. That’s another winter factor that might affect the person’s ability to defend against the respiratory infection.
We’re not even at the peak of it. We are just bracing.

Will summer save us?

No, this doesn’t mean summertime will basically cure the virus. The aerosol transmission will likely reduce in the summer, but the direct transmission—as well as fomite transmission through things like skin cells and clothes—is still going to happen.

What sets this virus apart from common cold coronaviruses?

Definitely this virus is more virulent, more lethal. You don’t really die of the common cold, but this virus kills. The other difference is it seems we don’t have any prior immune response to this version of the coronavirus, so nobody has resistance. Whereas with the common cold, most of us have been exposed multiple times—we have antibodies and T-cell response, so the disease is much milder. This virus also has a very long incubation period. You might be infectious but you don’t know, because you don’t have any symptoms. That makes this virus very contagious, with the ability to spread well among humans. The key gap in the field is to try to understand what type of immune response is protective. We still don’t know exactly what we’re even aiming for with a vaccine. We don’t know which type of antibody responses confer protection versus which type will trigger worse disease. Similar for T-cell response, and so on. These are insights needed for therapy and vaccine strategies.

How does a novel coronavirus differ from viruses that have been with us for a long time?

If you look at pandemic viruses that emerge as human-to-human transmission for the first time, they tend to be quite virulent, at least the ones that we understand, we know of. When a pandemic flu, or this COVID-19, first emerge in humans and start transmitting, they tend to have quite high virulence. What happens is that the virus will eventually be selected for its ability to replicate and transmit. Those features might be in conflict with virulence because if a virus makes you so sick that you’re not going out of the house and infecting other people, then the success of the virus dies right there. For viruses that have been circulating for many years, like the rhinovirus, you usually don’t get so sick to a point where you stay home and don’t interact with anyone. That sort of makes these viruses much more successful than if a virus were to kill you immediately. There’s a balance that the virus has to strike to become successful. Over the years, usually the virus that’s circulating in humans tends to have less virulence so that people go out, infect others. I’m not sure whether that’s going to happen to this particular virus.

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Yale Immunology prof answers questions, such as "Will summer save us?" Very informative... (Original Post) blitzen Apr 2020 OP
Excellent article! Cracklin Charlie Apr 2020 #1
Interesting and informative. Thank you for posting. n/t Laelth Apr 2020 #2
Doctor trump should be sued for medical malpractice, duforsure Apr 2020 #3
Amen. n/t blitzen Apr 2020 #4
Thank you for posting this. An excellent comprehensible interview. n/t. NNadir Apr 2020 #5
I've read that it seems to be infecting fewer people where Hortensis Apr 2020 #6
Maybe because those are also humid climates? n/t blitzen Apr 2020 #7
Maybe, but many aren't and it didn't differentiate -- Hortensis Apr 2020 #8
It is already in the 90s in Florida Chainfire Apr 2020 #9
The effect isn't like a switch. Igel Apr 2020 #11
Good explanation Steelrolled Apr 2020 #15
True... though it's also interesting to look at that info in the context of... thesquanderer Apr 2020 #17
I don't see any reference about humidity in that article, although I couldn't read past... blitzen Apr 2020 #18
It was in that post, but here's more... thesquanderer Apr 2020 #19
Informative. I didn't know about the link with humidity. dameatball Apr 2020 #10
"... [T]he virus will eventually be selected for its ability to replicate and transmit." mahatmakanejeeves Apr 2020 #12
Or, some kind of mutation? Pence would know a lot about that. n/t blitzen Apr 2020 #14
There is an early study from China that Steelrolled Apr 2020 #13
And schools are out in the summer IronLionZion Apr 2020 #16
kick for afternoon folks n/t blitzen Apr 2020 #20

duforsure

(11,885 posts)
3. Doctor trump should be sued for medical malpractice,
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 10:24 AM
Apr 2020

Then sued for political malpractice too. Making false claims daily lying about something like this is evil . Intentionally misleading the American people in a health crisis isn't making us great , and his followers are realizing that now. Forcing people to work while a pandemic is attacking will also get their attention how corrupt and evil he is too.
trumps stiffing America now

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
6. I've read that it seems to be infecting fewer people where
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 10:35 AM
Apr 2020

the average annual temperature exceeds 74.something Fahrenheit. Where we are now in FL is only 70-72. But in any case, we're talking about hot climates. This virus likes the temperate climates most humans do best in also.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
8. Maybe, but many aren't and it didn't differentiate --
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 10:45 AM
Apr 2020

at certain latitudes the rates of infection are consistently lower.

Chainfire

(17,544 posts)
9. It is already in the 90s in Florida
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 10:48 AM
Apr 2020

That is Summer time weather for a great part of the country, and we have not had any miraculous halting of the virus.

Igel

(35,317 posts)
11. The effect isn't like a switch.
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 11:41 AM
Apr 2020

Think of it as a brake.

When you brake you don't suddenly stop. Most of the time you don't even stop. You slow down a bit. (Unless you're in Los Angeles, Manhatten, or I-45 in Houston, then since you never get moving fast "slow down a bit" = "stop.&quot

So the interviewer asked if summer will stop the virus. Answer: "No." But the epidemiologist continued to say that transmission will be reduced. Then he points out ways it might still be transmitted--direct contact and fomites. (Although that last hasn't been demonstrated yet, as far as a I know). And, of course, it will still be transmitted by aerosols and droplets.

It's the same conceptual problem that many had with saying that younger people were "at lower risk." Many assumed it was all or nothing, and if they weren't "at (special) risk" it meant they were "at no risk."

 

Steelrolled

(2,022 posts)
15. Good explanation
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 12:01 PM
Apr 2020

It is so annoying when people assume things are so black and white. So much of our medical advances (e.g. treatment of cancer) have occurred slowly, but over time it adds up. I've seen it first hand.

thesquanderer

(11,989 posts)
17. True... though it's also interesting to look at that info in the context of...
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 12:36 PM
Apr 2020

...the article posted at https://www.democraticunderground.com/100213257153 which indicates little confidence that this particular virus will be highly impacted by increases in temp/humidity.

blitzen

(4,572 posts)
18. I don't see any reference about humidity in that article, although I couldn't read past...
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 12:43 PM
Apr 2020

the subscribers-only wall. Humidity definitely lessens transmission--it's clearly explained by the Yale prof: water vapor weighs down the virus particles and brings them to the ground.

thesquanderer

(11,989 posts)
19. It was in that post, but here's more...
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 01:12 PM
Apr 2020

From the DU post:

But the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering and Medicine, in a public report sent to the White House, has said, in effect: Don’t get your hopes up. After reviewing a variety of research reports, a panel concluded that the studies, of varying quality of evidence, do not offer a basis to believe that summer weather will interfere with the spread of the coronavirus. The pandemic may lessen because of social distancing and other measures, but the evidence so far does not inspire confidence in the benefits of sun and humidity.


Additional from the linked NYTimes article:

The report from the National Academies, independent agencies that advise the government and the public, cited a small number of well-controlled laboratory studies that show that high temperature and humidity can diminish the ability of the novel coronavirus to survive in the environment. But the report noted the studies had limitations that made them less than conclusive.
...
The report sent to the White House also struck a cautionary note: “Given that countries currently in ‘summer’ climates, such as Australia and Iran, are experiencing rapid virus spread, a decrease in cases with increases in humidity and temperature elsewhere should not be assumed,” it said.

Pandemics do not behave the same way seasonal outbreaks do. For the National Academies’ report, researchers looked at the history of flu pandemics as an example. “There have been 10 influenza pandemics in the past 250-plus years — two started in the Northern Hemisphere winter, three in the spring, two in the summer and three in the fall,” the report said. “All had a peak second wave approximately six months after emergence of the virus in the human population, regardless of when the initial introduction occurred.”




mahatmakanejeeves

(57,472 posts)
12. "... [T]he virus will eventually be selected for its ability to replicate and transmit."
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 11:45 AM
Apr 2020

What? Evolution? Not with Pence in charge.

 

Steelrolled

(2,022 posts)
13. There is an early study from China that
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 11:56 AM
Apr 2020

showed this effect for their covid-19 outbreak. In other words, transmission was lower with high heat/humidity, after trying to remove other factors such as economic status. I'll take anything we can get.

IronLionZion

(45,447 posts)
16. And schools are out in the summer
Thu Apr 9, 2020, 12:35 PM
Apr 2020

that's a big seasonal factor for other viruses. Children spread the common cold very quickly.

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