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mahatmakanejeeves

(57,464 posts)
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 09:33 PM Dec 2019

McConnell's vow of a rigged trial gives Dems an opening.

McConnell's vow of a rigged trial gives Dems an opening. They can try to force votes on fairer rules, and call for admission of new evidence, putting vulnerable Rs in a tough spot. Expert @mollyereynolds helps explain the process. @paulwaldman1 and me:



For more on the procedural nuances to this, see this @NormOrnstein thread. Norm and @mollyereynolds are two of the best out there on Congressional procedure, so it's good to see them weighing in similarly:



Mitch McConnell's stunning and outrageous admission that he is in the tank already for Trump on the trial rules, is a flat violation of the oath he will take as a juror. If a jury foreman in a murder trial was found to have worked closely with the defense he would be prosecuted.


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McConnell's vow of a rigged trial gives Dems an opening. (Original Post) mahatmakanejeeves Dec 2019 OP
The Russiapublicans are going to break their oath they take to be jurors in the impeachment trial UniteFightBack Dec 2019 #1
K&R 2naSalit Dec 2019 #2
KICK bluestarone Dec 2019 #3
Oaths? We don't need no stinking oaths. Cartoonist Dec 2019 #4
Ornstein on Democrats calling witnesses. Hortensis Dec 2019 #5
I'm not a lawyer, but grumpyduck Dec 2019 #6
Lol. Has to be "in violation of something". That perfectly KPN Dec 2019 #16
The House should take him to court to force his recusal. Recusal. Period. ancianita Dec 2019 #7
that won't work ... Hermit-The-Prog Dec 2019 #10
Then Senate Democrats, or some Repub influenced by Romney can make a motion to force ancianita Dec 2019 #12
What, you don't think we could get 67 senators to KPN Dec 2019 #17
Jury foreman vows to work with Al Capone to prevent miscarriage of justice at trial struggle4progress Dec 2019 #8
Power, long held, breeds arrogance and becomes hubris bucolic_frolic Dec 2019 #9
CJ Roberts can't rule on anything. He can only provide legal options to the Senate jury. ancianita Dec 2019 #13
It sounds like he's deligitimizing the president's defense case eleny Dec 2019 #11
interesting read, thanks Takket Dec 2019 #14
Or as someone said Dan Dec 2019 #15
They can opt to not send it to the senate at all. mahatmakanejeeves Dec 2019 #18
Halo!, you can read it here: Thread by @ThePlumLineGS: McConnell's vow of a rigged trial gives Dems mahatmakanejeeves Dec 2019 #19
 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
1. The Russiapublicans are going to break their oath they take to be jurors in the impeachment trial
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 09:43 PM
Dec 2019

and they don't give a shit...that is a serious problem. Dem's need to hammer....RIGGED RIGGED RIGGED.

Dem's need to coordinate and attack...why is this not done? We need to take a few pages from the Russiapukes.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
5. Ornstein on Democrats calling witnesses.
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 10:29 PM
Dec 2019
on adoption of the rules McConnell apparently will write alone, in consultation with Trump and Pat Cipillone. From what #MoscowMitch has intimated, he might just push for a kind of summary judgment-- no trial, a vote for acquittal.

Or #MoscowMitch might just allow the House managers to present their case, the president's lawyers to present theirs, and do a vote without witnesses or relevant documents produced. If, on the other hand, he adopts a version of the Clinton trial rules, the House managers

will call Mulvaney, Bolton, Defense Secy Esper, Acting OMB Director Vought, Pence, Pompeo, and ask for the full tapes of phone calls to Zelensky and Putin. Chief Justice Roberts will rule on their admissibility, and the case is compelling.

So imagine the optics if #MoscowMitch got 51 votes to overrule the conservative Chief Justice. A blatant coverup. Collins, Gardner, Ernst, McSallySullivan, the two Georgia senators up next November, will have to choose, in each of these cases, which group of voters to enrage.


As I relax in my easy chair, many people are engaged in a fierce battle, already begun.

grumpyduck

(6,240 posts)
6. I'm not a lawyer, but
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 10:29 PM
Dec 2019

I would think that if he goes thru with this, he would be in violation of something -- his oath of office or the legal profession's ethics, or something concrete. In which case he should be disbarred.

Maybe no biggie for him personally, but a precedent and a warning to other MoCs who choose to act like assholes.

KPN

(15,646 posts)
16. Lol. Has to be "in violation of something". That perfectly
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:45 PM
Dec 2019

describes the sheer absurdity of this national cluster we are now experiencing. Seriously ... couldn’t state it better.

Thank you for that simple, straight-forward and logical statement, and ....

Hermit-The-Prog

(33,348 posts)
10. that won't work ...
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:02 PM
Dec 2019

I refer you to Article 1, Section 5:

Each House may determine the rules of its proceedings, punish its members for disorderly behavior, and, with the concurrence of two thirds, expel a member.


https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articlei#section5

ancianita

(36,060 posts)
12. Then Senate Democrats, or some Repub influenced by Romney can make a motion to force
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:29 PM
Dec 2019

the majority leader to recuse himself by floor vote. That's a proceeding change.

bucolic_frolic

(43,173 posts)
9. Power, long held, breeds arrogance and becomes hubris
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:01 PM
Dec 2019

Dems should strategize on flummoxing Moscow Mitch in courts before the trial, if they can find any angle, and impromptu at Senate trial with Senate rules based on Clinton's impeachment, or for CJ Roberts to rule on.

Mitch is exposed and vulnerable if a counter-strategy can be found and formulated

eleny

(46,166 posts)
11. It sounds like he's deligitimizing the president's defense case
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:09 PM
Dec 2019

It's not going to be a regular court of law.

But taking this route, it sounds like he's revealing the president, himself and the Republicans as the fascists we understand them to be. Great fodder for the upcoming election season.

Takket

(21,573 posts)
14. interesting read, thanks
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:40 PM
Dec 2019

I guess the question the GOP has to ask itself is "do we look worse just covering all this up an acquitting without even having a trial, or do we look worse letting all this damning evidence get called, so at least the process looks fair even if Trump looks MORE guilty, and we acquit anyway."

Funny thing is drumpf wants the "long" trial because he is completely delusional and thinks the whistleblower, Hunter and Schiff are the real criminals. He wants to put THEM on trial and thinks it will vindicate him but he's so dumb he doesn't understand that if McConnell sets the rules for the "long" trial that all drumpf's evidence gets brought in to.

This is where his handlers need to take him by the hand to mcdonalds, sit across the table from him with a filet of fish and a new toy, and explain to him in little tiny words that he's as guilty as fuck and needs to let the grown ups save his ass.

for the GOP the best thing to do is the "short trial" no evidence or witnesses and just pretty much say "the articles are BS, we vote to dismiss/acquit right now." Then just let the news cycle move on like none of this ever happened. Then pray the damage is limited enough that they don't lose the senate in 2020. The Democrats need to be prepared for this... and make sure every GOP Senator running in 2020 wears the sham trial like a noose for all of 2020.

To me the goal of all this is to win the Senate next year as fallout for the GOP betraying the country. Since conviction is impossible with these traitors.

Dan

(3,564 posts)
15. Or as someone said
Fri Dec 13, 2019, 11:44 PM
Dec 2019

Vote for impeachment, and then hold off sending the articles of impeachment to the Senate until after the election. Thereby neutering Moscow Mitch and (as he said) and let the people decide.

mahatmakanejeeves

(57,464 posts)
18. They can opt to not send it to the senate at all.
Sat Dec 14, 2019, 03:09 PM
Dec 2019
They can opt to not send it to the senate at all.
Then they have no chance to acquit him


mahatmakanejeeves

(57,464 posts)
19. Halo!, you can read it here: Thread by @ThePlumLineGS: McConnell's vow of a rigged trial gives Dems
Sat Dec 14, 2019, 03:10 PM
Dec 2019
Halo!, you can read it here: Thread by @ThePlumLineGS: McConnell's vow of a rigged trial gives Dems an opening. They can try to force votes on… https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1205596680202178565.html …. Share this if you think it's interesting. 🤖


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