Impeachment floor vote should wait until February at the earliest

[Fiendish Thingy]

Lots of court decisions and other events that could increase chances of conviction, or at least maximize impact on public's awareness of Trump's crimes.

Marcy Wheeler and team make the convincing case at the emptywheel blog:

https://www.emptywheel.net/2019/12/05/pelosi-goes-from-slow-walking-to-sprinting/

Pelosi dragged her feet at first, now she's rushing when there's no need- lots of shoes to drop in the next couple of months.

[Pachamama]

1. I trust Pelosi on this one

[mopinko]

2. we can impeach him again.

we can impeach him as many times as we want. we need to stop him from stealing 2020.

[TheBlackAdder]

3. It will get lost in the holiday hustle and bustle. People will focus after first bills come in Jan.

[UniteFightBack]

29. Agreed...not to mention there is 'good cheer' at this time of year and just the optics of it...right

after New Years would be better in my opinion.

[StarfishSaver]

4. Lol

Four months ago, it was almost too late, now she's going too fast.

People still be trying to splain it to the Speaker ...

[Fiendish Thingy]

5. Not really a substantive rebuttal

With the odds in favor of getting the testimony of Bolton, McGahn, Mulvaney, Parnas; getting Trump's financial records; a Giuliani indictment, and further document dumps such as the recent phone records, don't you think it's strategically to our benefit to wait until February to proceed to a floor vote?

Yes, I know congress CAN impeach Trump more than once, but I don't think they WILL, I don't think Pelosi has any intentions of allowing a second inquiry under any circumstances.

[StarfishSaver]

13. Actually it's very substantive. And factual.

But since you brought it up, you know why there's now a possibility of getting "Bolton, McGahn, Mulvaney, Parnas; getting Trump's financial records; a Giuliani indictment, and further document dumps such as the recent phone records"? Because of the careful groundwork laid by Pelosi and the committee's last spring and summer - including the much-maligned "sternly worded" letters - that some d yours complained about incessantly. The fact that the Democrats followed proper process and procedure and took their time to get it right is the only reason there's a possibility of obtaining those materials and testimony.

Given that, I don't have a lot of patience for the same people who second-guessed, bashed, and trashed them at every turn back then now lecturing them about how they should proceed moving forward. Pelosi and her team have proven, time and again, that they know exactly what they're doing and they know far more about how to proceed than the armchair quarterbacks barking orders at them online.

Let them do their jobs.

[Fiendish Thingy]

14. It appears that much of Pelosi's "careful groundwork" is about to be abandoned

Just before it comes to fruition.

I support the move to consider Trump's strategy of running out the clock as Obstruction of Congress, however, when we know there are pending court dates in December, January and February that will reward Pelosi's careful groundwork, why rush to conclude Congress's role, when there is a chance to put even more evidence in front of the American people and critically, the Senate.

Trump dared/begged Congress to hurry up and impeach him before Christmas in a tweet yesterday- why give him what he wants?

In addition to the upcoming court rulings, more evidence surfaces daily that bolsters the case for impeachment.

I'd be satisfied with the judiciary committee completing their draft of articles of impeachment before the Xmas recess, with a vote planned for the New Year.

Let Trump stew and fret over the holidays.

[StarfishSaver]

15. "It appears" to YOU

'Nuff said

[Fiendish Thingy]

17. If you've got secret info, please share

The rest of us have only public statements and actions (and for some , blind faith) to go by.

[StarfishSaver]

19. I don't have secret info

But unlike some others around here, I don't assume that if I don't know about it, it doesn't exist.

[Demsrule86]

26. There is no upside to continuing this into an election years...empty wheel sounds like empty head to

me. And considering that SCOTUS is right wing...there is no assurance that we win these court battles...impeach the bastard...and get on with winning 2020.

[Fiendish Thingy]

32. Your name calling of Marcy Wheeler only reveals your own lack of knowledge nt

[MineralMan]

6. It's pretty easy for us, including the emptywheel people, to

say stuff. However, none of us know exactly what is going on in the House of Representatives. We are not in that loop, even if we pretend to be in our writings.

You know who is in that loop? Nancy Pelosi. She's weighing all of the factors and has information none of us are privy to.

The floor vote will take place when it takes place, emptywheel.net notwithstanding.

There will never be an end to things that could be brought in. New facts, new documents, new court decisions. That would never end. At some point, it becomes time to hold the vote and impeach Donald J. Trump.

I"m going to defer to Nancy Pelosi and her consultations with the chairs of the various committees. Yup.

[LiberalFighter]

8. Yep! How many were surprised about the call logs?

Nobody in the media knew about it until the report came out. That shows Pelosi and the committees have a lot of information we all don't have.

[MineralMan]

9. Yes. Not everything that is known by House leadership is public knowledge.

And that's as it should be. It will all come into play, though.

I have a long memory, and my memory about emptywheel is not all that positive, really. I discount most of what is written on that blog and twitter feed. I certainly don't take advice from that group over the knowledge in the House.

Oh, well...

[StarfishSaver]

10. I recall a whole lot of bitching, moaning and second-guessing a few months ago

when the Dems were laying the groundwork for getting this testimony and materials. "STOP with the harshly-worded letters and IMPEACH THE MF ALREADY!!!"

I'm starting to think some people aren't really all that interested in impeachment and really just are looking for opportunities to Bosch Pelosi and the Democrats, no matter what they do.

[MineralMan]

11. Yes, well, that crowd isn't really about progress as much as it claims.

It's about stirring the pot and making sure all the ingredients are well-distributed.

If I didn't know better, I might think they're trying to create confusion and misunderstandings to hinder someone or something. Shades of the past.

[StarfishSaver]

16. Oh, no. You don't think it could be that, do you?

[LiberalFighter]

7. So EmptyWheel thinks they know better than the Speaker? Hah!

[Fiendish Thingy]

12. Yes, they were way ahead of Pelosi in calling for impeachment

While Pelosi is a powerful force to be reckoned with, she had been reluctant to proceed until the Ukraine revelations made it unavoidable; now, she seems to be rushing to conclude the house's role, almost certainly ensuring an acquittal in the Senate (something Trump dared her to do in a tweet), rather than wait for additional incriminating evidence almost certain to be revealed early in the new year.

Emptywheel isn't just a bunch of random bloggers; Marcy Wheeler is a veteran lawyer who has investigated and fought the Bush/Cheney regime, provided information to the Meuller investigation, and is a contributor to MSNBC.

[StarfishSaver]

18. LOL

The fact that they screaming for impeachment before Pelosi pulled the trigger doesn't mean she followed their lead.

Post hoc fallacy.

[LiberalFighter]

22. Thumbs up

[MineralMan]

20. Oh, bother. I've been reading Emptywheel for a long, long time.

Marcy Wheeler is not all that. See ya!

[LiberalFighter]

23. So impeachment should had been started 9 months ago? Bull!

So impeachment should had been started when there weren't enough members on board to support even an inquiry? Bull!

[Demsrule86]

25. There is not now nor ever has been a chance of conviction..the GOP will stick with him.

Nancy felt she had no choice and I get that...enough has come out that some will be swayed...now let's get it over with...and focus on how we really get rid of Trump...win the 2020 election.

[dewsgirl]

27. Seth Abramson is saying the same thing, they are going too fast.

[bluestarone]

21. Please give it a rest!

Nancy's on top of it!! I want NO OTHER person in charge of this impeachment. Love her AND her TEAM!!

[StarfishSaver]

24. Cut them some slack

It must be very frustrating (not to mention somewhat embarrassing) to have spent months castigating Nancy Pelosi and Democratic leadership for months as hapless cowards only to be proven wrong every time she whips out a healthy dose of badassesdness.

They gotta save face, so they just keep finding new and more ridiculous things to whine about ...

[UniteFightBack]

28. I think it should not occur right before Christmas. nt

[rzemanfl]

30. Excuse me while I wash some socks. BBL. n/t

[Midnightwalk]

31. I predicted after January before super tuesday

Months ago. I figured the hearings would go up to thanksgiving (turned out to be longer) and that the house wouldn’t vote to impeach too close to Christmas break.

My posts doesn’t go back far enough to link it.

But it was and is just my guess. I have no reason to second guess Pelosi and the other impeachment leaders.