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kentuck

(111,104 posts)
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 12:04 PM Apr 2019

DoJ lawyers and Mueller team lawyers are working together on redactions

This is what AG Barr stated in his testimony a couple of days ago.

If this is true, I would be surprised if Barr lets the redactions go as the two teams of lawyers decide?

Because the Mueller team lawyers are very bright and they will fight to keep their work from being redacted.

We may be surprised at some of the information that gets thru after redactions, would be my guess.

And my hope....

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kentuck

(111,104 posts)
3. My hope is that he is too fat and lazy to edit the redactions.
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 12:08 PM
Apr 2019

If that is the case, the Mueller team may be able to get out more information than anticipated?

kentuck

(111,104 posts)
4. No, I don't think so?
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 12:11 PM
Apr 2019

That is why we ended up with stains on the blue dress and all the sordid details. Then, they whined about what the children might see on TV. A bunch of assholes!

tymorial

(3,433 posts)
5. It was a different position and Starr reported directly to congress
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 12:35 PM
Apr 2019

Starr was not a special counselor, he was an independent counsel or prosecutor. That position was distinct and separate from the Attorney General and they reported to congress not the DOJ. When the position was retired in 1999 the office of special counsel was created in replacement. Special Counselors are called by the Attorney General and as such they report to the AG and DOJ rather than congress. Because of this Mueller had to give his report to Barr. Its up to Congress to fight it out and attempt to get a copy but there are quite frankly, no guarantees.

tymorial

(3,433 posts)
9. They arent weaker. They have the same authority.
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 06:56 PM
Apr 2019

The ultimate problem is the same issue we have with politics as a whole. We have a constitution and laws in place which allow for due process and the mitigation of corruption. My biggest takeaway from the last 2 years isnt just outraged at Trump's behavior. No, my frustration derives from the reality that the rule of law and the balance of powers requires men and women to participate in the process honorably. It requires accepting the oath of office as not just a necessity but sacrosanct. It requires that Congress acknowledge and accept that their responsibility is to not just legislate but to also ensure that the executive branch is held in check. What we have today is a senate that is engaging in collusion with the presidency to circumvent the rule of law. There are guidelines in place to address the situation we have today but it requires that our elected and appointed officials place their responsibilities above personal and or political interest. This is not happening.

McConnell is actively engaging in suppression of minority party concerns. He is refusing points of order and calls for vote not only on party lines but based upon the desires of the president. This is a blatant and gross violation of his oath of office. He has abandoned debate and discourse to achieve his and his party's personal desire. McConnell and Trump are working in conjunction to create a right wing state which may last for decades unless something changes.

Regarding Mueller specifically, Barr has obstructed the special counsel investigation in blatant disregard for his responsibility to law and order. The rules in place for the office of special counsel require the AG to work in collaboration with the SC but that isnt happening. Barr is suppressing evidence and using the new law to sweep the entire investigation under the rug. Mueller critics believe that he is complicit but I see no evidence of this. Under the new laws Mueller must report to the doj and the Attorney General. It is up to the attorney general to determine next steps and Barr made it known he would never seek to sanction Trumlp.

Even under the old rules, there is no guarantee that Congress would move to exercise their powers to challenge the President. Even if the house voted to impeach, I hold no illusion that the Senate would try and remove Trump from office even in the most damning of evidence. Further, I am not convinced the Democrats would move against the president to ultimate conclusion if the evidence proved without a doubt he colluded. The election is less than 2 years away. I honestly believe many on our side would rather hope for a change in power rather than announce to the world that we allowed our country to be manipulated by foreign I influence. That we failed to safeguard the rights and privileges of our citizens. That we allowed an evil, racist and bigoted man to seize power and though we knew him to be what he is, we didnt do enough to protect those who he harmed (those children in cages).

I'm sorry this is so long but it's not Mueller that's the issue. It's not the weakness of his office. It's us. We dont learn our lessons and we dont hold our representatives to account.

I know some of my comments will offend and probably caused this post to be flagged. I am not specifically insulting any Democrat and of course I will always vote for a Democrat. Our problem today is not strictly party because I do believe there are decent people on the right and the left who would act today if given the chance. I do believe we are honorable men and women on both sides who accept that their oath and honor is more important then party, donations or even the people who put them in office. Yeah, those people are very important but in the end, they are charged with defending us. So so many have failed.

kentuck

(111,104 posts)
11. Obviously, it has a weak link in that it has to report to the AG, who can throw it in the trash can.
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 07:50 PM
Apr 2019

...if he wants.

tymorial

(3,433 posts)
13. Do you think Holder would have engaged in obstruction?
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 07:54 PM
Apr 2019

And I'm not questioning whether Obama was guilty of anything because obviously she was not I'm talking about individuals.

Tom Rinaldo

(22,913 posts)
7. My Guess; Barr sets the redaction guidelines of types of material to block and
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 12:52 PM
Apr 2019

Mueller's team attempts to follow them with actual redactions. Borderline calls may end up being mutually discussed, but the "innocent third party" and "Grand Jury" redaction categories provide Barr with cover to redact a whole lot of stuff (since he won't ask a judge to clear Grand Jury testimony.)

The part Mueller's folks are most likely taking the lead on is what needs to be redacted to avoid interfering in ongoing probes.

former9thward

(32,028 posts)
10. The Mueller lawyers will not "fight to keep their work from being redacted".
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 07:16 PM
Apr 2019

Because they are "very bright" they know it would be a felony for them to allow Grand Jury testimony to be released. They also know various evidence relating to national security has to be redacted. They also know DOJ policy about not harming various 3rd parties by using their names in the report.

sweetapogee

(1,168 posts)
14. I know that
Thu Apr 11, 2019, 08:18 PM
Apr 2019

my views about to be expressed will not be appreciated by many here but someone has to say it.

The Mueller investigation produced a number of indictments and convictions. It appears that the indictments have all been played out, the convictions settled. If there is anything in the report that could be used to indict it would have been processed by now, I suspect.

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