White Male Privilege Writ Large

[Soph0571]

Link to tweet

Paul Manafort is a rich white man who stole millions, tampered witnesses & undermined US democracy. He got 4 years in prison.

Crystal Mason is a black woman who mistakenly cast a ballot in a local election. She got 5 YEARS.

Never tell me there is equal justice in this country.

Systemic injustice still alive and well in the 21st Century

[uponit7771]

1. Judge Ellis sentenced Rep Bill Jefferson***A BLACK MAN*** to 13 yrs for white collar crimes.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

3. Jefferson (D) embezzled about $130,000. Manafort (R) gained (and forfeited) tens of millions.

Manafort's crimes extended at least a decade (that's when they stopped looking back at them, might be more).

Manafort broke the law (lied to FBI and lied in violation of the agreement) from within prison!

Not a "blameless life".

[uponit7771]

6. +1

[olegramps]

8. T. S. Ellis, Trump Suckass Ellis is just another corrupt Republican. Filthy bastard.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

11. I don't think he is corrupt. I think he is biased, badly, & prob unconsciously.

I get the sense that he is one of those racists who say "I'm not racist! I'm always fair! And some of my best friends are, you know, those people."

[democratisphere]

14. Corrupted by racism.

Ellis should never have been placed as a judge. Incompetent.

[47of74]

26. No he's entirely corrupt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

30. And you have receipts? Going against your wishes is not proof of corruption. . . . nt

[jberryhill]

32. None of these people have any idea what they are talking about

Faced with being required to impose an onerous sentence on a young African American man, Ellis hired top-notch help to find a way around it.

Ellis did not do this for Manafort:

https://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2018/07/06/t-s-ellis-mandatory-minimum-sentences-697826

In April, confronted by a 28-year-old armed robbery convict facing a mandatory minimum 82-year sentence, Ellis' frustration grew so intense that he balked at imposing what he called a "very severe" sentence. Instead, the judge recruited a high-powered law firm to scour the law in search of some way to avoid imposing what is effectively a life sentence on Lamont Gaines, who was convicted of a string of robberies of 7-11 stores and a check-cashing business.

The judge appointed Daniel Suleiman, a former aide to Attorney General Eric Holder, to come up with any argument that might help Gaines win a more lenient sentence. Suleiman, a partner at Covington & Burling, set on one possibility: a Supreme Court ruling in April that invalidated a law very similar to the one requiring the lengthy sentence for Gaines.

People want to be ignorant and angry.

It's why Trump was elected in the first place.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

39. Thank you for some very interesting background. . . . nt

[olegramps]

38. Everyone has a right to their opion. What he did I consider a corruption of his duty.

It flies in the face of his treatment of other cases that have been cited on this board. It shows his judgement to be arbitrary and therefore corrupt in my estimation.

[duforsure]

2. The Manafort sentence

Is just another example of a biased judges partisan political influence in place of justice. This is what corruption looks like. A career criminal getting this sentence also shows this judges contempt for the rule of law, in the absence of equal and fair justice. I suspect this is why Mueller has split up so many cases, and I'd bet they have a boat load of other things to go after and put away Manafort for life with. Mueller's no fool , and knows some judges with partisan views will ignore the rule of law when its their political side, but do the opposite when its not on their political side.

[Auggie]

27. +1

[Bernardo de La Paz]

31. Manafort can still be tried on the multiple counts that jury hung on. . . . nt

[Ramsey Barner]

4. But But But . . . Manafort wuz an Altar Boy!!!

[IronLionZion]

5. Voting for Hillary is considered a dangerous crime if black

and Crystal's provisional ballot wasn't even counted. In Texas, a Trumped up red state. The only reason she was sent to prison is blatant voter suppression and intimidation to stop other people from voting. When a convict has served her time and rejoined society, there is no reason to lose the democratic right to vote. They just don't want minorities voting, because they tend to vote for Democrats!

They blatantly challenge the citizenship of many Hispanic and other minority US citizens who try to vote for the same reason. Make America White Again!

[KY_EnviroGuy]

12. Rarely mentioned are the long-term effects on poor people's lives.....

even from serving a minor sentence or just the ordeal of fighting a court case. Many lose their jobs and the crime is on their record, which affects ability to get future work, credit and housing.

In contrast, if a wealthy person does time (if they even serve time), they have connections, top-rate lawyers and various ways to both clear their record and to move on with their lives as if nothing happened.

The real sin here to me is that wealthy people can afford far better legal representation whereas many poor people can't afford any at all, or they get very poor service from public defenders. In other words, in the US you only get quality, expedient justice if you can afford to pay for it.

That is a huge travesty in our country and seems contrary to our Constitution.

Sometimes I think Republicans actually want inequality of that type to keep the work force fearful and working on the cheap!

...

[IronLionZion]

16. The conservative mindset is all about promoting inequality

considering how aggressively they obstruct social programs that help the less fortunate. It's easy for them to claim personal responsibility when they turn a blind eye to the privileges and benefits they were born with.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

24. Privileged people I sort of understand. The ones I struggle with are....

those that I've known for many years that came out of poor or middle-class families that were loving, kind and generous people, yet completely changed after advancing themselves and gaining a measure of wealth. They had a complete flip of personality and became greedy, independent-minded, crass and selfish....and flipped from Democrat to Republican.

As a hobby, I enjoy trying to understand what makes us how we are through amateur study of psychology. I also use my over 50-years of adult hard knocks, wins and losses. I suspect a percentage of our populace has a twist in their genetics - a "touch" of psychopathy and tendency toward FEAR if you will - that erupts only after they have lots of possessions.

There surely must be some primitive protective mechanism that kicks in and causes this change from nice guy to asshole.

...........

[IronLionZion]

36. The zero sum game, scarcity of resources mentality

they believe that when someone benefits, another must lose. If minorities or lower income people rise, up then middle class white people got screwed over somehow. It's the opposite mentality of rising tide lifts all boats, everyone does better when everyone does better.

You can see this in action with those who believe in supply side economics vs the more liberal demand side economics.

[jberryhill]

35. And Rarely Mentioned Is What Ellis Has Done In Those Situations

https://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2018/07/06/t-s-ellis-mandatory-minimum-sentences-697826

In April, confronted by a 28-year-old armed robbery convict facing a mandatory minimum 82-year sentence, Ellis' frustration grew so intense that he balked at imposing what he called a "very severe" sentence. Instead, the judge recruited a high-powered law firm to scour the law in search of some way to avoid imposing what is effectively a life sentence on Lamont Gaines, who was convicted of a string of robberies of 7-11 stores and a check-cashing business.

The judge appointed Daniel Suleiman, a former aide to Attorney General Eric Holder, to come up with any argument that might help Gaines win a more lenient sentence. Suleiman, a partner at Covington & Burling, set on one possibility: a Supreme Court ruling in April that invalidated a law very similar to the one requiring the lengthy sentence for Gaines.

Carry on.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

40. Carrying on, allow me to explain my context.

JBH, my comments were entirely within what I see as the context of the OP, which was to discuss inequality in our system of justice and not a commentary on any specific case. Others may see it differently.

I would guess that very few here are qualified to make rational comments regarding judgments in any legal case and Manafort's is no exception. I can attest that I am not qualified. Just my cursory review of it tells me it's quite a complex case and I don't thoroughly understand the charges, laws behind the charges, evidence presented, or sentencing procedures.

However, we are a nation of free speech (warts and all) and it's also not healthy in a democracy to outright dismiss citizens concerns when they observe case results that don't appear right. But do we really have a practical mechanism to resolve those concerns?

Within the context of our personal experiences as laymen, I think what some of us here are trying to do is express what we've seen that's happened to people we actually know that are not wealthy who have been caught up in the meat grinder of our justice system.

For most Americans, unless we have a family member or close friend that's gone through being charged and tried for a crime, we never hear of the struggles, costs and loss of a big chunk of a human's life - quite often just over a minor infraction. The same is true of our penal system.

That is the travesty I speak of, as people just disappear in the system (out of sight/out of mind) and I'm sure you're very aware of those challenges. Americans simply need to get involved, learn about these things and question them when appropriate. Otherwise they will remain hidden. We do appreciate you sharing your thoughts and knowledge.

[jberryhill]

34. Armed Robbery Is Also Considered A Dangerous Crime If Black

Please explain this behavior by Judge Ellis, if you can:


https://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2018/07/06/t-s-ellis-mandatory-minimum-sentences-697826

In April, confronted by a 28-year-old armed robbery convict facing a mandatory minimum 82-year sentence, Ellis' frustration grew so intense that he balked at imposing what he called a "very severe" sentence. Instead, the judge recruited a high-powered law firm to scour the law in search of some way to avoid imposing what is effectively a life sentence on Lamont Gaines, who was convicted of a string of robberies of 7-11 stores and a check-cashing business.

The judge appointed Daniel Suleiman, a former aide to Attorney General Eric Holder, to come up with any argument that might help Gaines win a more lenient sentence. Suleiman, a partner at Covington & Burling, set on one possibility: a Supreme Court ruling in April that invalidated a law very similar to the one requiring the lengthy sentence for Gaines.

Why did Ellis do that?

Was Gaines the right shade of black?

Or could it be that you don't know what you are talking about?

[IronLionZion]

37. Your post about sentencing has nothing to do with my post about voter suppression

but you probably know that

[VOX]

7. Far too many POC don't even get the "luxury" of a trial; rather, they're executed on the spot.

How many times a month/year does this despicable scenario repeat itself: white cops stop a young African-American male, and within moments, he’s shot multiple times (often in the back)?

This country’s heart and priorities couldn’t be more out of whack right now. Trump is the personification of unfeeling, insatiable greed. He’s a pied piper for the gullible and a sugar daddy to the 1%.

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game

[Lonestarblue]

9. White collar crime needs to be a focus.

For too many years, our justice system has ignored white collar crime until it gets too egregious to ignore, as in the cases of Enron and Bernie Madoff. Had Donald Trump been prosecuted instead of just fined for the obvious money laundering he was doing through his casinos, we wouldn’t have him as president. If corporate CEOs were held accountable for the damage and even deaths their decisions caused, as in knowing about product safety issues and deciding that it’s cheaper to pay off the families of those who get killed, they might make better decisions about their products.

I don’t know much about the new criminal justice law that was passed recently, but we need a serious overhaul of the criminal justice system that equalizes white collar crimes with other forms of criminal behavior.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

13. +1 . . . nt

[llmart]

23. Terrific post!

[47of74]

25. Our justice system needs to be much more swift and sure

When it comes to dealing with these wealthy white people. As in decades long prison sentences. Get rid of all the club feds and require these people be sent to maximum security institutions. Also mandate public executions for treason and not give judges any discretion in sentencing.

[ck4829]

10. K&R

[pdsimdars]

15. Makes me sick. We no longer live in a country of equal justice.

[Ferrets are Cool]

17. We are all appalled, but is ANYONE surprised?

I am not. But worse yet, there is NOTHING I can do but complain.

[Traildogbob]

29. Just waiting!!!

Just yesterday Squinty eyes and the meat puppet had Aaron Shock on after 24, let me repeat, 24 felony charges dropped after given fine to pay IRS back about half of a congress annual salary. A clean slate. He ranted about prosecutor over reach and grand jury ignorance is destroying people's lives without any checks, and oversight. Now Manafort; so if anyone thinks there will be any justice for ANY Meiller convictions, forget it. Making AmurKKKa great, for treasonous criminals and 1% tax less assholes. N.C. District nine election fraud, no big deal, allow the fraud to run again in re-election. I am beginning to be ashamed to have joined, yes joined the military during Veitnam, no way close to being drafted, draft number 324. I am disgusted with my own country. I will be taking a knee and never again salute the flag until republican's are burned into a heap of ash.

[Ferrets are Cool]

33. Thanks. Nice rant.

[DirtEdonE]

18. Coverage on MSNBC this morning

A panel was on scarborough's show this morning. I forget the specific guy's name but what does it matter? They're all basically the same talking head anyway.

After discussing the ridiculous 47 month sentence for manaford they went on to Judge Berman Jackson's sentencing of manafort next week. They discussed whether the judge would sentence manafort to the full 10 years and run consecutively. The one talking head had the nerve to say that no one believes she would do that because IT WOULD BE SO FAR OUT OF THE NORM!!!

Isn't 47 months with 9 months credit for time served on a conviction that carried 19 to 24 years under sentencing guidelines FAR OUT OF THE NORM???

I have NO hope for next week. Berman Jackson won't even jail roger stone after death threats and repeated thumbs in her eye ignoring her gag orders.

I have NO hope for this country. Even if these traitors and criminals are convicted they're let off the hook by some right wing arch conservative activist judge appointed by the likes of reagan and such while the repubicans whined for decades about liberal activist judges!

Discussing this is only good for therapy because nothing is going to change. The game isn't just fixed, it's been permanently changed and there is no changing it back. The rules no longer apply. It's Bridgegate Syndrome where everyone knows "who done it" but the system protects their own to the point where the guilty party's name can't even be revealed as an un-indicted co-conspirator.

I hate that phrase "this is the new normal" because there is nothing normal about any of this. This is the new abnormal.

[GatoGordo]

19. Takeaway message: Never talk to LE unless you are the victim

[pdsimdars]

20. They said no collusion . . . well, there was also no evidence of duck poaching . . . so what?

[bronxiteforever]

21. Kick and recommend.

[debsy]

22. It is truly disgusting and appalling.

Here's a government report that confirms the injustice...

[link:https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/research-and-publications/research-publications/2017/20171114_Demographics.pdf|]

[bigbrother05]

28. Clearly she affected one local election, while he ...

Got make an example to protect our elections

[hughee99]

41. It sounds like her original conviction resulted in her getting

Somewhere around 4-5 years in jail and she was supposed to pay back about $4million that she defrauded the federal government of. That sounds like roughly the same sentence Manafort got.