W T F happened in Luzerne County (PA)? Trump won an Obama county by 20%! Torshin involved??

[Roland99]

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

Link to tweet

FULL thread unrolled. Kinda hard to cut and paste. But a must read

https://t.co/R0tSD0uxIr?amp=1

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1072005153912315905.html

[madaboutharry]

1. The possibility that voting machines were hacked is very real.

It would not shock me at all if we come to find that the 2016 election was outright robbery.

[Lonestarblue]

12. I have always believed that the election was hacked.

There were simply too many coincidences to believe the election was fair.

[NRaleighLiberal]

18. Me too.

[triron]

62. 2nd that.

[Fuzzpope]

23. I three.

We know it can be done, it's been proven.

The trend is to flip inside the +5/-5 margin between candidate tallys.

One county literally was observed with a Democrat's totals going in reverse, live on local news.

People kick this can down the road because they feel helpless in the face of such a vast and seemingly hopeless issue, but there is a fight here and it's not going to stop by itself.

[Raster]

45. I four...

...many things about (s)Election 2016 do NOT pass the smell test.

[uponit7771]

56. +1, hell there are way too many admissions to logically conclude it was fair

[triron]

64. I don't think MSM will ever go there. Too disruptive.

The election was a fraud.

[Hekate]

69. Rachel Maddow

[triron]

70. Maybe Rachel but no one else.

[PatSeg]

53. I would think it was a little bit of everything

Social media trolling, Russian bots, Wikileaks, and for good measure tampered voting machines. Putin probably covered all options possible to insure disruption of our democracy. It was diabolically brilliant.

[BumRushDaShow]

2. There and Erie County, PA too...

Erie had been reliably blue for who knows how long... until 2016.

ERIE COUNTY

CLINTON, HILLARY (DEM) 46.99% Votes: 58,112
Running mate: TIM KAINE

TRUMP, DONALD J (REP) 48.57% Votes: 60,069
Running mate: MICHAEL R PENCE

CASTLE, DARRELL L (CON) 0.39% Votes: 488
Running mate: SCOTT N BRADLEY

STEIN, JILL (GRN) 0.92% Votes: 1,139

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Erie&ElectionID=54&ElectionType=G&IsActive=0

In 2018, 45 campaigned in Erie for bogus Barletta for Senate, but thankfully he was defeated statewide, including in Erie County -

ERIE COUNTY

CASEY, ROBERT P JR (DEM) 58.39% Votes: 58,906

BARLETTA, LOUIS J. (REP) 39.99% Votes: 40,348

GALE, NEAL TAYLOR (GRN) 0.61% Votes: 611

KERNS, DALE R JR (LIB) 1.01% Votes: 1,024

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Erie&ElectionID=63&ElectionType=G&IsActive=1

EDIT TO ADD THIS:

Erie County, Pa., Weighs Options in Move to Paper Ballot Backups

A state mandate has put pressure on the state’s 67 counties to adopt voting machines that supply a paper backup. The options are limited and will come at a cost to voters.

by Matthew Rink, Erie Times-News / January 7, 2019

<...>

Erie County bought its 750 touchscreen voting machines — the iVotronic, made by Election Systems & Software of Omaha, Nebraska — in early 2006 to replace machines that used a lever or punch card. The current machines were first used in the primary of that year.

http://www.govtech.com/security/Erie-County-Pa-Weighs-Options-in-Move-to-Paper-Ballot-Backups.html

[brush]

11. Huge repug-to-Dem turn around from 2016 to 2018 in the county...

and if it happened in this county and state it's likely it happened in the other two states that went for trump and swung the EC count for him.

Many of us here have felt all alone that there was vote count cheating in the 2016 election. This just about proves the WH was stolen by trump/putin/repug operatives.

[BumRushDaShow]

14. Erie was always reliably blue

and although I probably shouldn't count out disaffected Democrats there, it still seemed fishy.

The margin here in Pa was only about 44,000 to flip the state and if anything, there were more than enough Stein votes to cover that margin and then some (she only got about 21,000 votes in the 2012 Presidential election) -

PA STATE-WIDE 2016 GENERAL

CLINTON, HILLARY (DEM) 47.85% Votes: 2,926,441
Runningmate: TIM KAINE

TRUMP, DONALD J (REP) 48.58% Votes: 2,970,733
Runningmate: MICHAEL R PENCE

CASTLE, DARRELL L (CON) 0.35% Votes: 21,572
Runningmate: SCOTT N BRADLEY

STEIN, JILL (GRN) 0.82% Votes: 49,941 <---
Runningmate: AJAMU BARAKA

JOHNSON, GARY E (LIB) 2.40% Votes: 146,715
Runningmate: WILLIAM WELD

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/SummaryResults?ElectionID=54&ElectionType=G&IsActive=0

[brush]

19. Translation, pls. Are you saying there was or wasn't likely vote tampering.?

[BumRushDaShow]

24. Let's just say I am suspicious

given they used the ES&S machines.

However I read some article awhile back about some of the disaffected. Can't find it at the moment but here is a similar one here - http://www.goerie.com/news/20161113/unlikely-voters-in-erie-county-helped-elect-trump and another one is here - https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/13/us/politics/pennsylvania-trump-votes.html (which suggests the GE plant closure may have been one impetus in the flip)

The articles suggest a purported "reluctance" to vote that way but they did it anyway. I expect now many who did, have learned their lesson.

The margin there was only 1,957 votes.

[brush]

27. Ok, but that's one county. It seems to me the trump/putin/repug operatives didn't limit...

their chicanery to that one county. The obviously calculated precision of just the right number of votes needed to swing the EC to trump had to happened in more than that one county in that one state.

And the fact that the narrow vote margin for trump was the same in some counties in WI and MI seems to indicate that this was a tri-state operation purposely calculated and targeted to swing the EC vote to trump, in other words, to steal the election.

Thank God Mueller has tracked down what many of us suspected all along.

[BumRushDaShow]

30. Oh I agree

It was definitely a targeted effort. There were those 2 counties that flipped by 1,957 & 26,237 respectively here in PA (the latter being the subject of the OP), PLUS a doubling of votes for Stein (+~28,000) from what she got in 2012... Et voila!

The total vote margin was 44,000 here in PA, which I think was the largest margin of the 3 states (but then we also had the largest population of the 3).

So there were a combination of strategies deployed, including something to do with those ES&S machines.

[brush]

42. Ahhh...so you think Stein's total was manipulated upwards to make it look good...

avoid suspicion and shift the blame to her?

That possibility is an added element—every trick in the book, the evilness of it all. They sit up at night thinking of ways to steal elections so we have to sit up at night thinking of ways to combat them as they will never stop—witness all the vote suppression just this past November.

[BumRushDaShow]

50. She was my biggest red flag here in Philly

where her numbers were triple what they were in 2012 -

2016

President of the United States

STEIN, JILL (GRN) 0.94% Votes: 6,679
Running mate: AJAMU BARAKA

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Philadelphia&ElectionID=54&ElectionType=G&IsActive=0

2012

President of the United States

STEIN, JILL (GRN) 0.31% Votes: 2,162
Running mate: HONKALA,CHERI

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Philadelphia&ElectionID=27&ElectionType=G&IsActive=0

So with a multi-pronged attack, in order to skim (vs hack) from the urban areas with non-ES&S machines (we didn't have those), you throw this one at the crowd -

[oasis]

3. Kick for important exposure!

[Crutchez_CuiBono]

4. New voting machines should be a priority.

No more hacked elections.

[BumRushDaShow]

9. They now are here in PA

By our (D) governor's mandate and must be in place before the 2020 election. All of the counties are going through their review/procurement processes right now. Some counties are ahead of the game, like Montgomery County, Pa, which as already put in their order -

[Crutchez_CuiBono]

10. Sweetness!

[Roland99]

39. Good

[bluestarone]

51. GREAT news

Needs to happen in MANY states!! This should be a top priority when we get control!!!!

[rickyhall]

5. That alone put Trump in the WH.

[Buckeyeblue]

6. There are many oddities or coincidences with 2016

For instance, the similar margin of victory in both WI and MI. It's perplexing. But how do you prove a stolen election on such a big scale? It will be interesting to see if Mueller's report/investigation gets into this. Since he seems to be good at following the bouncing ball, maybe something will lead him here.

[Rene]

63. you need access to the vote counting server logs....see the url's.

You'll see a switch of url from the vote counting server....perhaps to Alfa Bank's server/or server in Trump tower in NYC......and back a few minutes later, with vote count switch. It's so easy to 'switch' url's and run rogue probram code to flip counts...and 'switch' back. and now we know PC-Anywhere is installed on all the vote counting servers for remote access.

[garybeck]

77. Not really. It's the memory cards.

Nearly all the voting machine technologies share one dirty Little secret. They have removable memory cards. Before each election, they are removed from the machines, sent to a central location and programmed for the candidates and issues on each ballot. because all the memory cards are in one location this becomes an extremely vulnerable spot. However it gets almost no attention. Is there that the memory cards could easily all be infected with vote switching software that could not be detected by any of the testing that is done on the machines.

We know very little about the places where the memory cards are programmed. in some cases it is by the same company that manufactures the voting machines. In others it is a third party company that we know nothing about.

It doesn't matter if there is a paper ballot or if it is a touch-screen voting machine. All of them are vulnerable to this. scientists have shown many times that anyone with access to the memory cards can do just about anything they want and never get caught.

[Cracklin Charlie]

7. Must read after I wake up a little more.

[2naSalit]

8. K&R!

[modrepub]

13. Trump Won Almost All Counties Outside of Philly and Pittsburg

Typically, Dems do better in the NE and NW counties than Hillary did. If you take the results at face value then IMHO, people in these areas had a real problem pulling the lever for her. PA is a closed primary state meaning only registered party members can vote.

Dept of State Site:

2016 Primary Results:

Luzern County

Hillary: 20,542
Sanders: 18,543

Trump: 28, 680

Erie County

Hillary: 20,395
Sanders: 18,362

Trump: 16,495

Philadelphia County

Hillary: 218,959
Sanders: 129,353

Trump: 25,738

2016 General Election

Luzern County

Hillary: 52,451
Trump: 78,688

Erie County

Hillary: 58,112
Trump: 60,069

Philadelphia County

Hillary: 584,025
Trump: 108,748

[BumRushDaShow]

20. No he didn't

The rim counties of Philadelphia did NOT go for Drumpf.




(the below shows the weight of vote by population)



Graphics from here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_United_States_presidential_election_in_Pennsylvania

Most of the "red counties" here in PA are literally rural, many of them having less than 10,000 people in the whole county.

All that was needed to do was skim votes from some previously blue counties and/or up the turnout of the never-voted lunatics.

[dalton99a]

34. +1

[uponit7771]

72. Wouldn't be shocked or surprised if the "Skim voting" went into overdrive

[BumRushDaShow]

73. I believe the Stein push was part of that

targeting the urban areas and rim suburbs - https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211677300#post50

[uponit7771]

75. Whoa !! That's where votes went ... I don't believe 3 times as many voted for her though

[BumRushDaShow]

79. Philly and all of the Philly rim counties

have the same or similar model Danaher 1242 machine, which is a membrane pad thing. In fact when researching this, apparently the whole state of Delaware uses these too. I think it basically has firmware vs an operating system. You see the higher totals for her in those counties, which are already blue. IMHO that may be a social-engineering vote increase.

But remember her recount effort?

In retrospect, this ditty is now raising red flags to me given who she kept company with -

Stein had raised $7.3 million for swing-state recounts and had hinted that donors would have the ability to vote on how she would spend any leftover money. But those recount efforts came to an end in December 2016 and no votes have been offered. Instead, since then, the Stein campaign has pursued recount-related litigation in Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, seeking to access the source code of electronic voting machines.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/jill-stein-finally-reveals-how-shes-been-spending-recount-money

As a side note, with the membranes pulled off, this is what they look like -



More: http://perfect.cse.lehigh.edu/Danaher.html

Tear-down summay of one by Lehigh University (PDF) - http://perfect.cse.lehigh.edu/Documents/SemihDemirbagPosterFall2007.pdf

When they put the membrane sheet over top with the candidates/questions printed, it looks like this -



(sorry... this is cool )

[modrepub]

86. Contrast

Last edited Wed Jan 16, 2019, 08:01 PM - Edit history (1)

My point is Hillary did not do as well as Obama in 2012. Compare the map:



Hillary flipped one of the Philly area counties (Chester) but gave up a lot of the Lehigh Valley and Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area (Biden's original home town).

General Election:

Philadelphia County

2012 2016

Obama: 588,806 Hillary: 584,025
Romney: 96,467 Trump: 108,748

Luzerne County

Obama: 64,307 Hillary: 52,451
Romney: 58,325 Trump: 78,688

Erie County

Obama: 68,036 Hillary: 58,112
Romney: 49,025 Trump: 60,069


These results seem reasonable given the large negatives Hillary had in PA in the run up to the 2016 election; I live here and noticed a lot of people expressing their displeasure about both of the candidates. The Russian echo chamber (but her emails...) was well known across the Commonwealth unless you weren't paying attention. This skimming business seems unlikely since Dem's controlled the Governor's office and thus the Dept of State, which oversaw the 2016 election. Any fishy business should have been quickly identified at the state level IMHO. On top of that, last I checked Luzerne, Erie and Philadelphia counties were all controlled by Democrats so again if there was any fishy business the county election boards, controlled by Democrats should have identified them.

I just don't buy wide-spread conspiracies since someone would have let the cat out out of the bag by this time, like some of Trump's associates have done since his election.

I like your population based county maps . I agree that these county maps are very misleading. They make it appear that a "minority" (area wise) is electing candidates at a state-wide level. I've actually seen people try to say each PA county should be given one vote in the state legislature. Peace

[BumRushDaShow]

90. But Obama didn't do as well as Obama the 2nd time around

It's turnout that really matters!

There were actually almost as many voters in this 2018 mid-term election than in the 2012 Presidential, each around 5 million (5.0 million vs 5.3 million), which was unprecedented in modern elections. The 2014 midterm was a pretty bad low point as a comparison (~3.3 million).

The 44,000 vote difference in 2016 was like 0.7% out of ~5.7 million cast.

[watoos]

15. I've been voting on those damn machines,

in Jefferson county in central Pa. I always ask for a paper receipt and am never given one. I mean our local borough council is usually split pretty even between D's and R's but I admit this is Trump country. The thing is the margins keep growing, our district voted for Trump 80% - 20% in 2016 and I have never seen margins like that.

I would prefer paper ballots but getting rid of those no trail machines is a start.

When people say there is no evidence that any machines were tampered with that is absolutely true because no machines are ever independently audited, the manufacturers claim proprietary rights.

I can say that there is no proof that votes were not flipped and be correct.

[scarytomcat]

48. dump talked like a populist and people believed him

from bringing back jobs
to clean coal
clearing the swamp
but he lied big time
I hope people are figuring it out and can overwhelm any ballot box shenanigans
some how we need to make our elections right
having questions like this hanging over us is intolerable

[BumRushDaShow]

52. "in Jefferson county in central Pa"

The County with this guy -





(he'll be up and running and then back to sleep in a couple weeks )

[Botany]

17. Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania had not voted red in a Presidential election since 1984

Russia/Putin did not spend millions of $s and God knows how many man hours just
to "look around" our voting infrastructure.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-13/russian-breach-of-39-states-threatens-future-u-s-elections

https://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/news/2017/01/23/russians-suspected-hacking-local-dems/96965824/

[BumRushDaShow]

31. Here in PA, since 1988 (the state voted for Poppy in 1988).

[Botany]

32. Thanx

n/t

[triron]

65. But they just "looked around" and then decided not to go any further.

[Botany]

67. And the ES&S voting machines just happen to have "electronic backdoors" installed on them ...

.... that allows for remote access to the data.

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/mb4ezy/top-voting-machine-vendor-admits-it-installed-remote-access-software-on-systems-sold-to-states

[ehrnst]

21. So maybe those sick of Democrats,"Obama 2012/Trump 2016" voters aren't as numerous as we thought?

Get out.

[TSheehan]

93. They're more numerous than you think. nt

[wcollar]

22. Check out this book

Written by David Pepper, Chairman of the Ohio Democratic Party.
It's fictional but..............
"The Peoples House" - Notice the copyright - 2016.

[shelshaw]

25. Dead batteries?

Viruses tend to consume more power since they are continuously running in the background. Very suspicious...

[Loki Liesmith]

26. Knowing Luzerne county

I’m not surprised.

[yardwork]

28. Wow!

[MyOwnPeace]

29. Wish someone "official" would take this seriously............

there was NO WAY Clinton should have lost PA - and NO WAY Toomey should have won.

[BumRushDaShow]

33. That teabagger Toomey win was a fucking disgrace!

When you look at the voting here, ALL of the rest of the top-of-the-ticket STATE races (Auditor General, State Attorney General, State Treasurer) were won by a Democrat!

I'll see your & and raise you a

[watoos]

40. Toomey is up in 2020 I think

[Amishman]

46. 2022, 6 year term just like all other senators

In a midterm year with a Democratic president, he might have a chance to survive. We need to run someone really good against him. McGinty failed to gain much traction outside of the Philly metro area, and it takes more than that. Tom Wolf is a great example of how to have state wide appeal. He gets some rural interest by paying attention to farm / environmental issues. His standing up to the oil companies was big in my area as there is a lot of discontent over several pipelines going in.

[BumRushDaShow]

54. "McGinty failed to gain much traction outside of the Philly metro area"

She never really campaigned here in Philly either so am not sure where she was campaigning. Toomey ran ads non-stop during the spring and summer here. Clinton even got almost 24,000 more votes here than McGinty so you may have had some who just voted the top of the ticket and walked out.

[Amishman]

58. Ok, maybe I gave her too much credit

Either way it underscores my point on running a good candidate who can compete statewide.

[BumRushDaShow]

61. Oh HELL yeah!

I'm sure you remember when Lynn Yeakel ran in an attempt to unseat Arlen Specter. She unfortunately lost by ~113,000 votes statewide (vs McGinty's ~87,000) but it is what it is.

Heck, maybe John Fetterman may consider it at some point in the future.

[MyOwnPeace]

81. I would really expect

Lt. Governor Fetterman to go for it - and he would be an OUTSTANDING candidate!

[BumRushDaShow]

83. Trying to imagine him

wearing a suit every day in the Senate chamber...

Link to tweet

TEXT
John Fetterman
✔
@JohnFetterman

My 1st Harrisburg negotiation: kids agree to floss for Governor Wolf in my office, NOT during his inaugural address.
531
6:16 PM - Jan 15, 2019 · Pennsylvania, USA

[MyOwnPeace]

85. Yeah, but.........

who's gonna' call him on it? Can you see McTurtle pulling him aside and saying, "Son, we need to talk........"

[BumRushDaShow]

87. Fetterman is 6'8"

He could just bat the guy out of his way! Turtle'll be running for the exits!

[MyOwnPeace]

96. Yep, that's McTurtle!!!

[Amishman]

44. She was really unpopular here. I do not believe the vote totals were hacked

I'm in Lancaster county, and I saw little Clinton interest and nothing from the campaign. Trump shit was everywhere.

Hacking PA would be extremely difficult, bordering on impossible. The machines aren't connected to the internet and each machine would need to be tampered with physically. There are many different kinds. The most common are old Elect-Ronic machines which are from the 80s and are glorified oversized adding machines, not programmable.

election interference in PA was in the form of misinformation and social media distortion. The voting machines weren't hacked, the voters brains were.

[BumRushDaShow]

59. "She was really unpopular here. I do not believe the vote totals were hacked"

She had handily won both the 2008 and 2016 primaries and only lost by 44,000 votes statewide.

I think the OP article is talking about the issue of Luzerne and the type of machine they had (and the interests in that county involved in the company) -



vs what you have in Lancaster County -



which is different even from what we have in Philly and its rim counties! Our machine has no "CRT" or "LCD-type" screen at all -



The ES&S (and Diebold) machines, like what Luzerne and Erie have, were shown to flip votes or have other glitch issues.

I am actually concerned because here in Philly, this will be a sea-change from what we have had in the past, going from the lever machines to the membrane pad and now to who knows what, although it sounds like it will be something that either prints a ballot out once the selections are made where the voter can verify and then that paper gets turned in - OR- the voter manually fills out ovals on a piece of paper, feeds it in to verify tally, and then submits.

[Stuart G]

35. Here is the answer to the 2016 election......

..Imagine if you can, (this is not very hard)..that the very best, and smartest in the CIA, FBI, and other agencies were brought together for a very important project. Hard working, dedicated, highly intelligent, reliable, people who need to do a most difficult project. That project is to hack an election in Great Britain to save the U.S.A. from total destruction..Now of course that is not going to happen and we don't need to hack an election in Great Britain to save the U.S.A, but just imagine that idea for a moment. Could our people do that?..In order to save the U.S.A. from total destruction? Think deeply about it. If true, then this discussion is over. Nothing more to discuss.

.................................have a good day...........................................

[dalton99a]

36. The Russian coup was years in planning

[Stuart G]

37. That is correct, and what else is there to say? Look who is now President of the U.S.A.

[catbyte]

41. And the GOP was involved. McConnell fought way too hard to not give Merrick

Garland a hearing. At the very least, he knew there was a damned good chance--if not a certainty--that the Democratic candidate would lose the election. Very suspicious.

[dalton99a]

43. +1. The sneaky bastard is up to his eyeballs in the plot

McConnell's role is critical in pushing and protecting Trump's agenda


https://www.democraticunderground.com/100211677344

[catbyte]

49. OMG, I missed that one. The "mugshots" are priceless.

[catbyte]

38. I'm not surprised in the least. I'll never believe that 2016 was a legitimate election.

[BumRushDaShow]

47. Here is another oddity from Luzerne for the Senate/Governor's race - it's right stinky in fact

2018

United States Senator
CASEY, ROBERT P JR (DEM) 45.43% Votes: 49,200

BARLETTA, LOUIS J. (REP) 53.59% Votes: 58,040 *

GALE, NEAL TAYLOR (GRN) 0.46% Votes: 497

KERNS, DALE R JR (LIB) 0.52% Votes: 559

Governor
WOLF, THOMAS W (DEM) 51.69% Votes: 55,734
Running mate: FETTERMAN, JOHN K

WAGNER, SCOTT R (REP) 47.02% Votes: 50,701
Running mate: BARTOS, JEFFREY A

GLOVER, PAUL (GRN) 0.52% Votes: 562
Running mate: BOWSER-BOSTICK, JOCOLYN

KRAWCHUK, KENNETH V (LIB) 0.77% Votes: 826
Running mate: SMITH, KATHLEEN S

* - I do know Barletta lives in the county

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Luzerne&ElectionID=undefined&ElectionType=G&IsActive=undefined

2014

Governor
CORBETT, THOMAS W. JR (REP) 43.93% Votes: 32,605
Running mate: CAWLEY, JIM

WOLF, THOMAS W (DEM) 56.07% Votes: 41,609
Running mate: STACK, MIKE

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Luzerne&ElectionID=41&ElectionType=G&IsActive=0

2012

President of the United States
ROMNEY, MITT (REP) 46.87% Votes: 58,325
Running mate: RYAN,PAUL

OBAMA, BARACK (DEM) 51.68% Votes: 64,307
Running mate: BIDEN,JOE

STEIN, JILL (GRN) 0.44% Votes: 546
Running mate: HONKALA,CHERI

JOHNSON, GARY (LIB) 1.01% Votes: 1,261
Running mate: GRAY,JAMES P

United States Senator
SMITH, TOM (REP) 43.28% Votes: 53,168

CASEY, JR, BOB (DEM) 54.50% Votes: 66,951

SMITH, RAYBURN DOUGLAS (LIB) 2.23% Votes: 2,738

https://electionreturns.pa.gov/General/CountyResults?countyName=Luzerne&ElectionID=27&ElectionType=G&IsActive=0

In 2012, Casey was elected with a 13,783 margin over the Republican in Luzerne County. But in 2018, he lost by 8,840 in the same Luzerne county. In the case of governor, Luzerne elected and re-elected the Democrat Tom Wolf by 9,004 in 2014 and by 5,033 in 2018.

[Roland99]

57. We should dye thumbs with ink to prove someone voted

And hand counted paper ballots

Make it a week long process. Get the msm outta the way

[BumRushDaShow]

60. I know other countries do that and it sounds good "on paper"

but then here in the U.S., you'll have the lawsuits about people being "allergic" to the dye, etc.

I think by at least mandating the "paper", even with it being machine-read, this can allow for manual hand-counts later if necessary. The issue has been just getting the paper!

But you also must take into account the procedure for where to store the paper and for how long - perhaps including an archive process being to digitize ballots after x amount of time for electronic storage.

[Thrill]

55. Election stolen on several levels

Unreal

[akraven]

66. Vote on paper and keep a copy.

It works.

[Hekate]

68. Oh, but Hillary ran a bad campaign and didn't visit them or something...

Some dimbulb actually posted that on the thread about whether Hillary should run again.

As for ES&S -- we told you so.

[uponit7771]

74. +1, yep ... ignore Trump admitting he was working with the Russians while they were attacking

... America but we're supposed to believe that was only business ... cause you know ... emails and shit.

Stolen election no doubt

[Sparkly]

78. Right, and nobody got "excited" about her which is why

there have been no women's marches or successful women campaigns since and now all we want are white men candidates. ....

[triron]

71. knr

[Drunken Irishman]

76. All interesting but let's also look at some other facts...

Luzerne County is 90.7% white. While Obama won it in 2012 and 2008, the county has been trending GOP the last few election cycles.

Bill Clinton won the county by 14 points in 1996. Gore won the county by eight-points in 2000. Kerry won the county by three-points in 2004 and, while Obama did increase the margins in 2008 to a similar total that Gore saw in 2000 (he won it by eight, as well), in 2012, his margin decreased to four - nearly mirroring Kerry's in 2004. What does that mean? The Democratic margins, beyond Obama's landslide year, increasingly shrunk between 1996 and 2016. Granted, a 24 point swing is massive but you also have to factor in a few things:

Hillary not only underperformed Obama in Pennsylvania (Obama won the state by roughly five-points, Hillary lost the state by less than a full percentage point - so, about a six-point swing in Trump's direction), she underperformed him nationally. Obama won the popular vote by 3.86 nationally in 2012. Hillary won the popular vote by 2.09 nationally. That's nearly a two-point difference. That swing had to inevitably be made up somewhere. It just so happened to be in counties like this. Predominantly white. Generally not terribly large. Luzeme County has a population of only 300,000 or so.

[BumRushDaShow]

84. "Luzerne County is 90.7% white."

Most of the state of PA is "predominately white" (82%, with 12% black, 7% Hispanic, 4% Asian, 0.5% Native/Pacific islander). Even Philadelphia is still majority white.

I posted here in this thread how Luzerne still voted for Wolf (D) over Wagner (R), both in 2018 & in 2014. The flip came with Casey (D) for Senate where they voted for him in 2012 but for a native son Barletta (R) in 2018.

No doubt there have been some demographic shifts but there's also some unexplained other things going on there as well when compared to the consistency of the other counties.

[Blue Owl]

80. Smells like CHEATING

[triron]

82. kick for visibility

[DeminPennswoods]

88. Luzerne is right in the middle of PA's coal country

Trump promised to bring back coal. Luzerne countians believed him.

[Baltimike]

89. Thank you for this...knr!!!

[Botany]

91. And that would be the same Alexander Torshin who was such a good friend of Ms. Butina?

And WTF was he doing inspecting American voting machines?

[UTUSN]

94. K&R

[rockfordfile]

95. If they got in there that far, you would never hear it from officials.

No way. I mean when Nixon was being a traitor with the North Vietnamese you didn't hear about for years.