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shockey80

(4,379 posts)
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 01:10 PM Jan 2019

Does mueller have proof Tump gave away secrets to Russia? That could be treason.

I have said from the beginning Mueller is going to shock the American people. I don't know what Mueller has on Trump, but I know it's going to be big.

No one knows what Mueller has and he has a lot.

24 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Does mueller have proof Tump gave away secrets to Russia? That could be treason. (Original Post) shockey80 Jan 2019 OP
You mean just More treason. triron Jan 2019 #1
how? qazplm135 Jan 2019 #2
No, because the President has the right to declassify secrets at will... brooklynite Jan 2019 #3
If that is true, we are fucked and stupid. shockey80 Jan 2019 #4
We are ignorant. Our agents battling on the front lines Hortensis Jan 2019 #6
What if that president is under investigation as a national security threat? Claritie Pixie Jan 2019 #5
"National Security Threat" is a generic term... brooklynite Jan 2019 #8
Can you point to a statute that says he's immune to everything? Claritie Pixie Jan 2019 #11
Trump is afraid of the Mueller investigation. That's why he so desperately wants to shut it down. TSheehan Jan 2019 #7
And like Michael Cohen said....#MuellerKnowsEverything. They shan't get away with this. nt UniteFightBack Jan 2019 #10
Yes I think they have proof....and with the House hearings the proof will be getting out to the UniteFightBack Jan 2019 #9
Yes, it has been publically reported Nictuku Jan 2019 #12
Before being elected? Bradical79 Jan 2019 #13
Espionage, not legally treason. nt tblue37 Jan 2019 #14
Treason means attacking US or aiding war enemies, Russia not at war withUS Cicada Jan 2019 #15
bullshit. triron Jan 2019 #17
Trion, why wasn't Rosenberg charged with treason? Cicada Jan 2019 #18
Not Bullshit Quixote1818 Jan 2019 #19
This message was self-deleted by its author ooky Jan 2019 #23
Trump nuts don't need a reason. If he loses re-election I'm ooky Jan 2019 #24
knr triron Jan 2019 #16
espionage scarytomcat Jan 2019 #20
If he gave away secrets to Russia, that could be espionage, what the Rosenbergs were charged with.nt pnwmom Jan 2019 #21
Trump's only "defense" is that this is political persecution, not criminal prosecution Mr. Ected Jan 2019 #22

qazplm135

(7,447 posts)
2. how?
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 01:15 PM
Jan 2019

He can declassify anything for any reason?

The office presupposes a rational person with American interests first...putting someone like Trump in there literally breaks the presidency.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
6. We are ignorant. Our agents battling on the front lines
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 01:30 PM
Jan 2019

are anything but. You must have noticed that nothing is a fraction as simple as it first appears.

Btw, we KNOW that Trump gave classified information to Russia. Israel had a major and righteous hissy over one incident. There have to have been others.

I will also be extremely surprised, Shockey, if we or one or more of our allies did not have records of some communications between Trump and the Kremlin/Putin. including one or more of their five unrecorded (by Trump) personal meetings. The person on one side is incredibly clueless about security, and the people on the other are happy to help him eventually destroy himself as long as it hurts and supposedly humiliates us in the process.

We'll see.

brooklynite

(94,624 posts)
8. "National Security Threat" is a generic term...
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 02:15 PM
Jan 2019

...you need to point to a Statute that the President isn't immune from by virtue of his position as President.

Claritie Pixie

(2,199 posts)
11. Can you point to a statute that says he's immune to everything?
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 02:21 PM
Jan 2019

From what you and some others are saying - sure seems as if he would be once elected.
Pretty darn near untouchable.
He can choose to divulge anything to anyone, even if he's the target of a counterintelligence investigation under suspicion of working with a foreign enemy.

 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
9. Yes I think they have proof....and with the House hearings the proof will be getting out to the
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 02:19 PM
Jan 2019

public...this has to be laying the groundwork for some explosive shit.

Nictuku

(3,616 posts)
12. Yes, it has been publically reported
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 02:33 PM
Jan 2019
President Trump revealed highly classified information to the Russian foreign minister and ambassador in a White House meeting last week, according to current and former U.S. officials, who said Trump’s disclosures jeopardized a critical source of intelligence on the Islamic State.

The information the president relayed had been provided by a U.S. partner through an intelligence-sharing arrangement considered so sensitive that details have been withheld from allies and tightly restricted even within the U.S. government, officials said.

The partner had not given the United States permission to share the material with Russia, and officials said Trump’s decision to do so endangers cooperation from an ally that has access to the inner workings of the Islamic State. After Trump’s meeting, senior White House officials took steps to contain the damage, placing calls to the CIA and the National Security Agency.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trump-revealed-highly-classified-information-to-russian-foreign-minister-and-ambassador/2017/05/15/530c172a-3960-11e7-9e48-c4f199710b69_story.html?utm_term=.7cab36f4de98
 

Bradical79

(4,490 posts)
13. Before being elected?
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 02:37 PM
Jan 2019

Afterwards, we know he did, though as President it wasn't illegal.

If before, it could maybe be treason, but an espionage charge of some sort might be more likely in that case. There's an extremely large range of charges for something like that depending on the details.

Cicada

(4,533 posts)
15. Treason means attacking US or aiding war enemies, Russia not at war withUS
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 02:47 PM
Jan 2019

Mr Rosenberg gave away atomic bomb plans but he could not be tried for treason. Trump can favor Russia over US but it’s not treason. The only effective way to end Trumps hold on us is to vote him out of office. Trump nuts will have no reason to riot or rebel if he just loses the election. That is the best way to get rid of him. And the only practical way also.

Cicada

(4,533 posts)
18. Trion, why wasn't Rosenberg charged with treason?
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 08:28 PM
Jan 2019

Trion, By your theory Rosenberg was guilty of treason, right? Giving nuke bomb design secrets to the USSR? If your theory is correct why wasn’t he charged?

Response to Cicada (Reply #15)

ooky

(8,924 posts)
24. Trump nuts don't need a reason. If he loses re-election I'm
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 08:59 PM
Jan 2019

pretty sure they will be awful.

I think he would be prosecuted for espionage. He could be charged with it as part of the impeachment process, or arrested for it once he leaves office. And if there is a dem president he won't be able to hide behind a pardon. In fact, espionage is starting to look like a real possibility now. To me anyway.

scarytomcat

(1,706 posts)
20. espionage
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 08:33 PM
Jan 2019

this is espionage
treason is during a declared war
we have killed spies during the cold war
if he was giving secret classified information to Russia he is a spy and could be executed

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
21. If he gave away secrets to Russia, that could be espionage, what the Rosenbergs were charged with.nt
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 08:34 PM
Jan 2019

Mr. Ected

(9,670 posts)
22. Trump's only "defense" is that this is political persecution, not criminal prosecution
Sun Jan 13, 2019, 08:44 PM
Jan 2019

That's why he has spent the past 2 years politicizing every comment, every issue, every tweet. It's his only hope of survival. "This is a Democratic witch hunt". "This is retribution for Crooked Hillary". "This is sour grapes because you lost".

On the merits, there will be no doubt. This man committed and continues to commit espionage. He has also undoubtedly laundered money, racketeered, perjured himself, filed false tax returns, obstructed and any number of other ancillary crimes. But the big one, the one Mueller has been entrusted with investigating, is this collusion matter, conspiracy to defraud the US electoral system, and much of this took place PRIOR to his swearing in. At that time, he was a private citizen and lacked all the protections afforded the President. For these crimes he should be indicted and tried.

He can shift the sands and pretend this is political, but it isn't. It's only political because Republicans in Congress refused to do their jobs and provide oversight. They made it political. I'd like to think if a Democrat was in the Oval Office and could rightly be accused of treason or espionage, we would hasten his or her departure. It's the American way. But it's not the Republican way.

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