Washington bans anyone under 21 from buying assault rifles

[applegrove]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/washington-bans-anyone-under-21-buying-assault-rifles-n953576

AP

"SNIP.....

SEATTLE — Washington on Tuesday joined a handful of other states that ban anyone under 21 from buying a semi-automatic assault rifle after voters passed a sweeping firearms measure in November that has drawn a court challenge from gun-rights advocates.

The ballot initiative seeks to curb gun violence by toughening background checks for people buying assault rifles, increasing the age limit to buy those firearms and requiring the safe storage of all guns. Only the age-limit portion of the measure goes into effect on Jan. 1; the rest becomes law on July 1.

Kristen Ellingboe, a spokeswoman for the Washington Alliance for Gun Responsibility, said the initiative was one of the most comprehensive gun-violence prevention measures to pass in the United States. It specifically targeted "semi-automatic assault rifles" in response to mass shootings across the country, she said.

....


Fifty-nine percent of Washington voters approved Initiative 1639 in the Nov. 6 general election.


.....SNIP"

[SunSeeker]

1. Good start. nt

[applegrove]

2. Yes it is. And those activist kids from Parkland have long lives in front of them to do it.

They've changed many a heart.

[Joe941]

3. I don't like this.

Harkens back to earlier days: If you are old enough to serve in the military and be drafted you are old enough to vote. Same concept.

[applegrove]

4. Nobody needs a assault rifle. It is not used for target shooting or hunting

animals or protection.

[iluvtennis]

10. Ditto.

[aikoaiko]

13. Lots of people use so called assault weapons for target shooting, hunting, and protection.

I'm one of them.

[MrsCoffee]

17. Doesn't make it right.

Or sensible.

[Hoyt]

30. If only gunners would think about society, and not their preference in armaments. Fat chance.

[Joe941]

18. Then ban them for everyone - do not separate out young people.

They deserve every right everyone else has.

[Recursion]

20. They're used for target shooting and hunting small animals

They in general aren't powerful enough for deer hunting.

What you care about is the ability to shoot 60 bullets in 60 seconds. That's what I care about too.

The problem is, you've been convinced that "assault weapons" can fire that fast, and other kinds of weapons can't. This is absolutely wrong.

Ban semi-autos, or don't. It's stupid to waste time screwing around with what kind of grip they can have or whether they can have bayonet lugs.

[NutmegYankee]

34. Then ban them for everyone. Don't start clawing back adulthood again.

Alcohol is already an obnoxious example. You can vote and die in a war, but stay away from that beer!

[EarnestPutz]

5. Somebody should ask Donny Bonespurs if he thinks...

...that we should bring back the draft, you know, make everyone
pull their weight.

[Hekate]

6. When you leave the military they don't let you take your mass-killing machine with you, do they?

Nor do they let soldiers out in leave carry around their weapons of war in civilian populations, unless they happen to be in an active war zone.

We're not talking flintlocks here.

[orleans]

7. well said

(even tho i don't know what "flintlocks" are)

[Hekate]

12. Flintlocks are rifles circa 1776

They took awhile to load, shoot one bullet, repeat assembly process with powder, ball, rag, etc. The flint was part of the sparking mechanism to make the gunpowder explode and send the single bullet on its way. That was the sort of thing the hallowed and sacred 2nd Amendment was talking about.

[Aristus]

23. Here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flintlock

Also verbal shorthand for 'difficult and time-consuming to load.'

[Hekate]

42. Thanks -- interesting

[Recursion]

21. I just can't work up energy to care about banning a certain grip shape

If we want to ban guns capable of firing a large number of rounds in a short period of time (and I do) then we should just try passing laws that do that. We should not waste time keeping the rate of fire legal but regulating what the gun can look like.

I mean, at this point I'm mildly for it just because it pisses off the MAGA brigade, but a bill that actually solves the problem we're concerned about would also piss off the MAGA brigade, and I'd rather just do that.

[Wounded Bear]

26. It's not about the 'grip'...

focus on the semi-automatic wording. That means every time you pull the trigger, a bullet goes down range, the cartridge is ejected, and another round is chambered, meaning the weapon will fire virtually as fast as one can pull the trigger.

That simplifies life for mass shooters.

[hack89]

29. The Sandy Hook shooters rifle was not an assault weapon

according to CT's Assault Weapon Ban because it didn't have certain cosmetic features.

So yes, in many cases it is about the "grip" or other cosmetic features. No present or proposed AWB actually makes semi-automatic rifles illegal. They ban certain rifles with certain features. But the semi-automatic capability will still be legal.

[Recursion]

32. You're so close it's maddening

A bill that would prevent younger people (or everyone) from buying a semi-automatic would be good.

This law says that if they buy a semi-automatic, it has to have a certain grip shape. I just don't care about that

[sl8]

36. Where do you see that?

From https://www.sos.wa.gov/_assets/elections/initiatives/finaltext_1531.pdf

Initiative Measure No. 1639, filed May 2, 2018

AN ACT Relating to increasing public safety by implementing
firearm safety measures, including requiring enhanced background
checks, waiting periods, and increased age requirements for
semiautomatic assault rifles and secure gun storage for all
firearms; amending RCW 9.41.090, 9.41.092, 9.41.094, 9.41.097,
9.41.0975, 9.41.110, 9.41.113, 9.41.124, 9.41.240, 9.41.129, and
9.41.010; adding new sections to chapter 9.41 RCW; creating new
sections; prescribing penalties; and providing effective dates.

...

(25) "Semiautomatic assault rifle" means any rifle which
utilizes a portion of the energy of a firing cartridge to extract
the fired cartridge case and chamber the next round, and which
requires a separate pull of the trigger to fire each cartridge.
"Semiautomatic assault rifle" does not include antique firearms,
any firearm that has been made permanently inoperable, or any
firearm that is manually operated by bolt, pump, lever, or slide
action.

...

It looks to me that it applies to all semiautomatic rifles.

[Recursion]

38. Oh, good, they changed it from how it was introduced

That's excellent news. It previously had a feature requirement.

[Wounded Bear]

39. Yeah, the wording was edited and the Initiative re-introduced...

I live in WA state and I got to vote for this.

[Recursion]

41. Great job, and congrats!

That will teach me to despair too early

[Hoyt]

31. I agree, ban the damn things and don't let gun-humpers' lobbyists try to save as many

as possible from the impact of the ban by throwing in grips, color, etc. If they have to concentrate on anything, concentrate on magazine capacity.

[Recursion]

33. Oops. Nevermind

Last edited Wed Jan 2, 2019, 02:42 PM - Edit history (1)

They took out the feature language since last year. Great news.

[uponit7771]

44. Typical gumper retort, you understand we're not talking about grips only

[Recursion]

45. For the *very first time*, yes! This is finally a sensible law!

I'm so glad a campaign finally managed to not make it about grip shapes!

[Aristus]

22. Concern noted.

I joined the Army at seventeen, but wasn't allowed to buy a drink until I was twenty-one. I chafed at the 'unfairness' of it, until I learned that raising the drinking age from 18 to 21 significantly decreased DUI's and deaths from young drinkers.

[Iggo]

24. I love it.

If gunfuckers want sane and reasonable gun laws, then get to the fucking table.

[WeekiWater]

28. What is the connection between serving in the military, voting, and owning a weapon? NT

[uponit7771]

43. MILITARY is were war weapons should be used?!

[caraher]

8. The local gun nuts are quite unhappy about this initiative

I keep telling them it's on them if activists who "don't know anything about guns" are writing bad laws. If responsible gun owners would step forward and propose common-sense rules that are better in the areas they critique, they could get the laws they prefer passed. But since they are stuck on the NRA hard-line against any kind of restrictions whatsoever, they make the choice to let the regulations and laws be written by those willing to make proposals, and passed by voters who want to see limits on the carnage.

[applegrove]

9. How is this a bad law?

[caraher]

11. I don't think it is bad myself

I think some don't like the age restriction. Another gripe regards the training requirement. Supposedly the appropriately vetted and certified courses are not yet available. This is mainly from an Afghanistan vet I know who thinks it's ridiculous that he has to jump through all these hoops when he was handed fully automatic weapons at age 18 and everything turned out fine (well, apart from the three times he got hit by IEDs, but that's another story).

To all of which I say the same thing: people need a better system, why don't you and your pals come up with a more sensible law, propose it, and see if it passes.

[NutmegYankee]

46. I myself do not like laws that raise the age of anything above adulthood.

It makes no sense to tell someone they are an adult and can go off and die in a war, but they can't drink a beer (and other examples). Honestly they should just ban the assault weapons for everyone.

[pintobean]

16. Actually, it's the job of the courts

to keep bad laws off the books, whether voters want them, or not.

[elias7]

15. No one should be able to buy an assault rifle - Ever

[spanone]

25. No one under 121 should be able to buy them....

K&R...

[hack89]

27. But they can still own and possess rifles if given as a gift

So their parents, grandparents or aunts/uncles can buy them guns if they wish.

(4) This section does not apply to:
(a) A transfer between immediate family members, which for this subsection shall be limited to spouses, domestic partners, parents, parents-in-law, children, siblings, siblings-in-law, grandparents, grandchildren , nieces, nephews, first cousins, aunts, and uncles, that is a bona fide gift or loan

https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.113

[maxsolomon]

35. For non-WA commentors, this is because handguns are 21+ here, and have been for some time

As a result of that restriction, a 19 year old name Allen Ivanov, unbeknownst to his parents, bought a semi-automatic military-style rifle, waited 3 days for the background check, passed it easy-peasy, got his guns and ammo, and put the weapon in his trunk. He later drove to a party that his ex-girlfriend Anna Bui was attending, read the instructions in his car, loaded the rifle, hid outside a party in the bushes, and then killed her and 2 other partygoers: Jordan Ebner and Jake Long. 1st time Ivanov had fired a weapon, IIRC.

Now, a remorseful Ivanov will be in prison for the next 60-odd years, and 3 more young people are sacrificed on the pyre of rampage shootings to the dumbest of all amendments.

Until we decide to well-regulate the unregulated militia, this law will keep SOME deadly weapons out of the hands of SOME teenage sociopaths. In theory. They can still buy hunting rifles and shotguns at 18.

But fear not, I'm sure some 2nd Am. Absolutist is filing a lawsuit today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Mukilteo_shooting

[sl8]

37. Link to text of initiative:

PDF of Washington Initiative 1639:
https://www.sos.wa.gov/_assets/elections/initiatives/finaltext_1531.pdf

Ballotpedia has a good summary:
https://ballotpedia.org/Washington_Initiative_1639,_Changes_to_Gun_Ownership_and_Purchase_Requirements_Measure_(2018)#Definition_of_semiautomatic_assault_rifle

[billh58]

40. K&R!

A small, but excellent step.

[sl8]

47. There may be a problem with how the initiative is written.

The new age limit for purchasing "semiautomatic assault rifles" took effect on January 1, but it doesn't appear that the new definition of "semiautomatic assault rifles" takes effect until July 1.

Initiative Measure No. 1639, filed May 2, 2018

...

NEW SECTION. Sec. 17. This act takes effect July 1, 2019,
except for section 13 of this act which takes effect January 1,
2019.
...

From https://komonews.com/news/local/new-state-law-sets-age-limit-of-21-for-purchase-of-assault-rifles

New Washington gun laws spark defiance

by Jennifer Sullivan | KOMO NewsTuesday, January 1st 2019

...

Only restrictions went into law Tuesday. The other two parts of the law don’t go into effect until July 1, said Tallman Trask, policy and advocacy director for the Washington Alliance for Gun Responsibility.

Teasdale and her staff at Lynnwood Gun are continuing to sell semi-automatic rifles to customers under the age of 21.

...

Teasdale said she has consulted with lawyers about the language of the law. She said she has also reached out to Attorney General Bob Ferguson’s office, but hasn’t heard back.

“The term semi-automatic assault rifle doesn’t exist for another six months,” she said. “How are they telling us we can’t sell something that doesn’t exist?”

...