If Trump can overrule the 14th Amendment via Executive Order

[NewJeffCT]

will the next Democratic president be able to overrule the 2nd Amendment the same way?

[GoCubsGo]

1. Excellent question.

One would have to think so.

[brush]

30. Did I miss something? Been out of town for a few days.

Has this imposter admin been floating the idea of overturning the 14th Amendment?

[Blue_true]

34. He is saying that he can recind birthright citizenship with an executive order.

If the Supreme Court allows him to get away with that, they just might as well burn every copy of the Constitution on the steps of the Court, because they would have made the Constitution useless. If he does not get defeated 9-0, we are lost as a nation.

[brush]

38. Thanks for this info. Had no idea this was going on.

Every day this orange POS tries to establish his dictatorship by openly attempting to dismantle the building blocks of our democracy.

He's been attacking the press and the 1st Amendment since him and Putin and comey stole the election, now it's the 14th. What's next, the 13th?

[Blue_true]

40. I honestly think the Comey was a well meaning idiot that made a horrific decision that he regrets.

I accept his explanation that he was trying to make sure that a coming Clinton Presidency was legitimized and no questions about illegal actions hung over it.

We really must vote like crazy. Strip Trump of a republican majority in Congress, then defeat him soundly in 2020. That is the only true way forward.

[onit2day]

42. Trumpists have made their move. They control all branches of government

including the judiciary. Who will stop this PINO monster?

[Iliyah]

2. Congress is needed. shithole wants to be like

Hitler. He wants to be a dictator who can murder at will. That's why he admires Kim, Putin and other murderous dictators.

[lark]

20. He doesn't just want to be like Hitler, he's following his footsteps exactly so he is Hitler.

He read Hitler's speeches every night for 10 years per Ivanna, it's the only book she ever saw him read. The rabid hate of minorities and the press and strengthening the power of the rich is exactly the same thing Hitler did.

[The Mouth]

3. Originally, in my understanding

the 14th was entirely about forcing the post-civil war south to acknowledge that ALL African Americans were citizens. It was a big - and rather effective- F.U. to the various attempts by the formerly Confederate states to various claims that blacks weren't citizens- and thus couldn't vote or hold office because they or their parents weren't citizens, having been slaves.

[SimpleC]

4. I'd prefer not to go down that slope

I believe the Constitution was written with the premise that we did not elect Kings.

[NewJeffCT]

6. I'd prefer not to do that, either

but, if Congress and the SCOTUS let him get away with it, you need to fight fire with fire.

What's next for Trump, overturning presidential term limits via executive order? The 13th Amendment outlawing slavery?

[JaneQPublic]

5. Brilliant!

Damn!

May I quote you on that?

(Who am I kidding? I'll be using that point regardless. :hi

[NewJeffCT]

8. go right ahead

I had seen somebody on Twitter mentioned him doing the same to the amendment outlawing slavery, so I took it to the 2nd amendment.

[JaneQPublic]

17. Looks like Malcolm Nance reads you.

Link to tweet

"If Trump wants to argue he has this power then by extension a future Democratic President can eliminate the 2nd or 10th Amendment by EO (Which he/she CANNOT!!!). This false premise mate be the only way to encourage Republicans to defend our entire beloved Constitution."

[NewJeffCT]

21. I'm guessing

he posted that around the same time as me, as I doubt he reads me. He's liked a couple of my replies to him where I complemented his book "The Plot to Destroy Democracy"

[JaneQPublic]

22. You're selling yourself short, Jeff.

Looks like MN posted about an hour after you did, so...

Thanks for the book recommendation. I have his book on ISIS and hang on his every word when he appears on TV.

[JHB]

7. A point to wave in front of sTrumpets who think this is a swell idea...

...but it's still unconstitutional and should not be done. If he tries it and is allowed to get away with it by Republicans, it's the first thing to reverse when he's dethroned.

[sanatanadharma]

9. If this president is not stopped...

...this president could be the one to take away the 1st and 2nd amendments and confiscate guns because that is what right wingers expect of their dictators.

Bubba and friends may have guns but he has an army.

[Amishman]

10. Doubtful, their are few gray areas left with the 2nd. The 14th has been subject to less scrutiny

The key to a constitutional challenge is to find a scenario not previously covered by the supreme court, and have a court populated by sympathetic justices. As far as I can tell, the application of the 14th regarding those not authorized to be in this country has not yet been addressed. The second has been fought over and has a lot of boundaries already established by old cases. And I doubt the inevitable SCOTUS case would go well given the probable composition of the court.

[Blue_true]

35. You have a bad interpretation.

The main issue would be whether a President can recind a change to the Constitution approved by 3/4 of the states. That is the only issue being debated. If the Court approve recension of the 14th by saying an EO can do it, every future President can eliminate an amendment the same way, despite previous Court challenges. The 14th was crafted based upon a legal challenge, the Dred Scott decision, which the 14th reversed.

[The Mouth]

43. They will say this is not a "recension"

but merely an interpretation.

They can't rescind an amendment, but the courts do a great deal to define its application. cf the 2nd amendment, which has numerous laws limiting it (1934 and 1968 acts, etc), and the 1st, which has the exclusions, as interpreted by the courts, for defamation and incitement to riot, etc....

Not agreeing, merely saying that an amendment, or any part of the Constitution, means only what SCOTUS says it means.

[Blue_true]

45. Maybe. But if the Court go along with that Monster, the country is done. nt

[DownriverDem]

11. Legal?

I just don't think trump can change the Constitution by Executive Order. How can it even be legal?

[sarisataka]

12. I would prefer

to not set a precedent if a President ruling by fiat, so I deny the premise an executive order can overrule any part of the Constitution

[getagrip_already]

13. There are several things a president can do by exec orders....

They only impact the operations of the executive branch though.

So the potus could direct the atf to simply reject backgraound checks for an fid in certain cases.

That would be legal, and it would muck up a lot of people trying to get ccw's and gun permits.

They just have to find areas where no law forbids a practice and where it would have a marked impact.

But they wouldn't do it, because guns!

[elmac]

14. The second amendment, according to all historians who have read

the Madison papers, James Madison (1751-1836), had nothing to do with an individuals right to bare arms. Just like citizens united it was just a BS opinion that started the ball rolling to change the meaning. The US constitution is in serious danger when you have a fascist government deciding what each amendment means to suit their needs, to keep in power.

[Blue_true]

36. The Second was concerned more with protecting a young nation from armed invaders.

It gave localities the right to raise a militia to fight off, in their case, the British and British agents. In doing that it allowed farmers and citizens to own guns, only so that they could easily assemble into a militia if needed.

[Jim__]

15. The president can't overrule the constitution.

However, he can claim that the 14th amendment does not make children born in the US to non-resident parents citizens. If someone disagrees with his interpretation, the republican stacked Supreme Court gets to decide the issue. Which way do you think they'll go on Trump's claims?

If there is a subsequent Democratic president, how do you think they'll decide on his claims?

I'm willing to bet that if the very same question that they decided in Trump's favor came up again under a Democratic president, they'd still vote against the Democrat.

[Blue_true]

37. If the republican Court does that, it just as well should burn every copy of the Constitution.

Roberts is an institutionalist, I don't see him buying into Trump's interpretation, I even think Alito may balk at it also.

[Richard D]

16. The point is:

If he gets away with this, he can do just about anything

[sarge43]

18. If Trump can, then there won't be a Constitution to overrule or a Democratic POTUS to do it.

If Trump can get away with negating the 14th, you think he'd stop there? There's those pesky voting rights, presidential term limits, First Amendment and so much more.

[George II]

19. There's good and bad about this. The good is that he can't do it, but the bad....

...is that his obsessed, insane followers will think this is a great idea.

[The Liberal Lion]

23. This is very dangerous area we have entered

With talk of trump suspending habeas corpus, and now overruling the 14th amendment thru executive order it won't take long before we see martial law actions, stripping of citizenship for natural born citizens due to dissent, and abolition of the free press. We are seriously in uncharted territory. How will Americans respond?!?

[Farmergene]

24. The divider in chief

...is just fireing up his base giveing them a bone, so to speak. Never mind the facts (when did they ever matter any way?) He cannot override the constitution.

The most he can do is direct government agencies on how to enforce or implement the law of the land. To that end, he can throw endless stumbling blocks in front of little babies to tie up their birthrights until someone else unfucks it all

[SpankMe]

25. It would be an overtly impeachable offense

He took an oath to obey and defend the constitution. For him to attempt to line out one of the amendments and then act on it would be directly and explicitly not obeying or defending the constitution.

Open and shut case.

Part of me hopes he does it to provoke a constitutional crisis and get this whole "presidency" thing over with. Let's move on it.

[Nitram]

27. It would not be impeachable, just null and void.

In other words, a waste of time. But it might get a few more Trump voters to the polls.

[Nitram]

26. He can't. Constitutional amendments cannnot be made by Congress or by executive order.

It is known as "pandering for votes " when a candidate says something like this. Also called "lying."

[Cryptoad]

28. No need to worry about that,,,

if the Trumpeter can do it there will not be any more free elections..... Don Jr will be 46 after 45 passes and so on

[Tarc]

29. This is not, in any way, an attempt to overturn birthright via E.O. It is diversion and distraction

Trump, via Stephen Miller's behind-the-scenes maneuvers, is pissing in the collective cornflakes of America this morning. This bumps the "he is directly encouraging mass murderers to bomb Democrats, and antisemites to shoot up synagogues" off of the front page.

[leftstreet]

33. +1 He controls the news cycle

Sad, but true

[kimbutgar]

31. A lot of Americans are 1st generation birthright citizens

And a lot of immigrants who are naturalized have birthright children who vote repuke. I wonder how they are feeling about this today. This might have unintended consequences on November 6th.

[Fritz Walter]

32. He's pandering to his base

Clutching at straws to try to get the poll numbers up for RepubliCONs this week. Same goes for the middle-class tax cuts he promised.

[bronxiteforever]

39. He can't. There is a trifecta of law on this.

The plain language of the 14th amendment protects persons born in the US, the Sup Court has said so since 1898 and federal statutory law further codifies the 14th amendment.

If he were to do this, the USA would cease to exist.

[RobinA]

41. What About Before That?

What is any of our citizenship based on? Does this mean I could be deported back to the UK? My great grandmother came here from Wales in the late 1800's. Everybody else has been here since 1760 or so. My Grandmother was an anchor baby!

[bronxiteforever]

44. Questions we never thought we would have to ask

Until Dotard Don came to DC!