Sending Federal troops to the border is a 100 times bigger decision than

[CK_John]

Kent State shooting on May 4, 1970, of unarmed college students by members of the Ohio National Guard at Kent State University in Kent, Ohio, during a mass protest against the bombing of Cambodia by United States military forces.

This was a state decision controlled by the Governor.

Using Federal troops for police action may negate the power of every state Governor and the control of National Guard of every state would be Federalized.

The Military should let the DT45 they can not serve illegal commands. IMO.

[Haggis for Breakfast]

1. Jim Rhodes always regretted that decision.

It haunted him the rest of his life.

[GReedDiamond]

5. How horrible for Jim. It should have...

...haunted the fucker for the rest of his life, spent in a prison cell, if there had been any real "justice."

[Haggis for Breakfast]

6. I think you're being a little too harsh.

Jim Rhodes was a fairly good governor and a decent man. He certainly did NOT deserve prison. He acted out of concern for a possible riot. He had to weigh the right of assembly, freedom of speech and maintain order and safety in a roiling environment ripe with deep divisions. Safety was his primary concern.

Are you from Northeastern Ohio ? Were you there in the 60s/70s ? Because I was born there and lived there for the first 26 years of my life. The 60s/70s were very turbulent times. The country was being torn apart by the war in Vietnam and civil rights issues. Protests and riots were daily occurrences across this nation.

Additionally, I lived less than 15 miles from Kent State. You could feel the undercurrent of anger/fear/tension/uncertainty on the campus as the University struggled - as all colleges did then - to allow freedom of speech, yet keep and maintain control of events to make sure that safety for all was a primary concern.

Jim Rhodes spent the rest of his life regretting his decision to send the National Guard to Kent State that day. He certainly never thought things would unfold in the manner in which they did. But if you weren't there during those turbulent times, responsible for the lives of thousands, trying to balance order against chaos, I think your condemnation of Jim Rhodes is irresponsible and poorly thought out. He was good man.

[GReedDiamond]

8. I was 15 years old in 1970, lived in the Chicago area...

...but I was a vocal anti-war activist all through high school and after, so I was quite aware of the "very turbulent times" I was living through.

I had a draft card, and I was eligible for the last draft lottery ever held, but, fortunately, my birth date wasn't drawn...and if it was drawn, I would not have shown up for a physical and I would have gone underground.

I have always disliked republicans...Jim Rhodes was a republican.

You may like the guy but I have a different view, sorry you don't like it, and think I'm "irresponsible."

At a news conference in Kent, Ohio, on Sunday May 3, 1970, the day before the Kent State shootings, he (Rhodes) said of campus protesters:

They're worse than the Brownshirts, and the Communist element, and also the Night Riders, and the vigilantes. They're the worst type of people that we harbor in America.

Yes, this is from Wikipedia, but here is the info on the book that this quote was taken from:

Bills, Shirley; Bills, Scott L. (1988), "Scott L. Bills", in Scott L. Bills, Kent State/May 4: Echoes Through a Decade, Kent, Ohio: The Kent State University Press, p. 13, ISBN 978-0-87338-360-8

A guy that compared Viet Nam War protesters to "Brownshirts" may be "a good man" in your view, but I think otherwise.

Apparently you hold a negative opinion of people who protested against the Viet Nam War, which I think is an "irresponsible and poorly thought out" notion.

[Haggis for Breakfast]

11. Inasmuch as neither one of us was privy to what Jim Rhodes

knew or was told by law enforcement (both state and federal) about the protests at Kent State and what intel they had on the protesters, including outside agitators - which is exactly who he was referring to with his "brownshirts" comment, and given the fact that neither one of us was in his position at the time, I am willing to let Governor Rhodes' sincere regrets and life-long heartache speak for themselves.

And in case your recollection is fogged . . . Jim Rhodes didn't pull the trigger. And he never gave the order for anyone to do so.

As for me, you know nothing about me. Throughout my almost 7 decades, I have protested and engaged in civil disobedience every time I believed that it was warranted, which has been often, so please do not postulate that I have a "negative opinion" of people who protest. Because THAT would be an irresponsible and poorly thought out notion.

Have a nice day, Chicago.

[GReedDiamond]

12. I'll stop postulating about you when you stop postulating about me...

...my recollection is not fogged. I know that Rhodes did not personally pull any triggers, but it was his National Guard that fired indiscriminately into a crowd that was running away, so that responsibility was on him.

Rhodes' "brownshirts" remark that I referred to was reprehensible, and only served to increase the tensions that were building.

I don't have to agree with you that Rhodes was a good guy, and you don't have to agree with my view on him, that's fine with me.

Thanks for your activism and civil disobedience through the years, I would like to think that we're ultimately both on the side of what's good and just.

[PoliticAverse]

2. Was it illegal when Bush and Obama sent them? No...

https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/03/politics/border-troops-deployed-obama-bush/index.html

[ecstatic]

3. The interesting thing is, they did it quietly. Meanwhile, dump keeps announcing his intentions every

5 minutes and hyping up one "caravan." He's creating a dangerous situation.

[Caliman73]

7. There is a difference between National Guard and Active Military.

The problem with the Trump scenario is that he specifically said, "I not talking about the Guard. I'm talking the Military." Now he could have been blowing smoke out his ass. He lies all the time.

If he was talking about the National Guard...They are already at the border and have been there for some months now. If he is talking about active duty Military personnel, then he starts running afoul of prohibitions on using active military for police actions.

The Guard is deployed by Governors all the time during natural disasters, civil unrest like LA 1992, etc... Active military is never deployed domestically unless they are engaging in hostilities with foreign adversaries who are invading. I know that Trump keeps calling it an invasion, but again, he is full of shit. The people walking through Mexico are refugees. They are not an army.

Trump wants his followers to believe he is sending combat troops to the border. Either he is just sending more Guard and he is lying, or he is actually sending active military which is legally questionable.

[PoliticAverse]

9. When the President employs National Guard troops by "federalizing" them they are effectively

no-different than regular federal troops as the National Guard is just a reserve military force.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_National_Guard

[Caliman73]

10. True, but they cannot be deployed as domestic law enforcement when in Federal service.

That is why the Guard is there only as logistical support to the Border Patrol, not in detention or arresting capacity.

[Initech]

4. This is such an egregious misuse of our military.

All to please the fucking racist base. Fuck those assholes.