This could be much longer post, but I'll try to cut to the chase.

[Atticus]

Last edited Wed Aug 15, 2018, 05:24 PM - Edit history (1)

I can't think of any type of contest in which those who win only by cheating are considered the "real" or "official" or "LEGITIMATE" winners. They are publicly stripped of any medals, crowns or other indicia of triumph. If one is tried, convicted and sentenced by someone who was not a real, official, legitimate judge, the sentence would be vacated and all of the "judge's" rulings would be considered nullities.

"IF"--------Trump was "elected" with the help of Putin and assorted GOP criminals, why should any of his "official" acts---most certainly including his judicial appointments--- be allowed to stand without full reconsideration by a new Congress and an AMERICAN president?

To say that the law does not authorize the above should not be the end if the matter. The law has never considered the legitimacy or illegitimacy of judges appointed by a mentally ill traitor.

[Crutchez_CuiBono]

1. That's a fact. And an asterisk next to his name isn't going to cut it.

[pwb]

2. I agree.

.

[zipplewrath]

3. Approved by the senate

They were all approved by the Senate. At this point, that makes them a member of the judicial branch. The only way to remove them is by reconsideration by both the House and the Senate through the impeachment process. I'm dubious that will happen.

[maxrandb]

14. A couple of things

Win enough seats and they can and should be impeached for that very reason.

There is also nothing that says Congress must provide a certain amount of funds to certain courts. I think the Congress can lower any federal employees salary to $1 a year...do that and cut off their funding.

Then, play hardball. "Hey Donnie Shit for Brains", you don't want to see Donnie Shit for Brains JR and your "not-so-secret" Crush "Soulless Barbie" to have so many fucking subpoenas shoved up their asses they'll shit copies of War and Peace, resign and take Pence with you.

I'd give this piece of amphibian shit NOT ONE SINGLE SECOND of peace where he is not responding to some subpoena going back to the days he was selling watered down lemonade at a neighborhood stand.

Then I'd shut this mother-fucking government the fuck down. Hey dickhead...no more weekly/daily trips to your Liberace and Lace Golf Courses...you sit your ass there in the White House, surrounded by protesters 24/7 without even the funds for the Secret Service to go out and get you a fucking Big Mac.

See how long he'd last.

THIS IS FUCKING WAR!!!!!!

We can worry about healing this country and moving forward AFTER Donnie Shit for Brains and his merry band of traitors are rotting in federal prison.

[zipplewrath]

22. So we should ignore the constitution

Not to mention all federal law and all historical precedent and just do what feels right?
Not sure we really wanna go there.

[Atticus]

23. No one has suggested ignoring the Constitution, but most of us,

to the horror of Fat Tony Scalia when he still stalked the earth, believe in a "living Constitution"; one that can reasonably evolve to sensibly accommodate situations not dreamed of by it's drafters and signatories. If SCOTUS can find a way to say corporations are people and money is speech, they can surely find a way to get rid of Trump in a Constitutionally responsible manner.

[zipplewrath]

33. Yes, it's called impeachment

That's the "Constitutionally responsible manner". At best that's what can be done about his judicial appointments as well, although that'd be a real stretch. One would be hard pressed to establish what the judges have done wrong to justify impeachment.,

[maxrandb]

24. Nothing I suggested "ignores the Constitution"

As far as the rest of what you said. I'm sure we'll be "comforted" that WE'RE THE ONLY SIDE that gave one-fuck about "historical precedence" and "doing what's right" as we're led off to the Gulag.

That's where we are right now. We're not "almost" to the end of the cliff that sends us tumbling into tyranny and fascism...we're over the cliff and barely hanging onto a clump of roots.

The bottom line is that it's not "us" who have the power to "uphold" historical precedent, do the "right thing", and save this countries soul...(thanks 3RD Party Voters and those who spewed that bullshit about "both sides being the same&quot

No, we have to rely on asshats like Rand Paul, Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell (ya' know, the party we ceded power to) to put a stop to this. I'm NOT hopeful.

But, go ahead and knock yourself out about how you "strongly" stood for "historical precedent" as the tanks roll over you.

[Atticus]

20. If I were to nominate someone to SCOTUS and the Senate was foolish

enough to "approve" them, would they be a legitimate justice and subject to removal ONLY by formal impeachment proceedings?

I sincerely believe my nomination would be at LEAST as valid and legitimate as either Gorsuch or Kavanaugh. I am not a traitor or a criminal and, on most days, pass for sane.

[zipplewrath]

34. Are you President?

No, I didn't think so. Like it or not, Trump is the President. The states said so and the congress formally accepted that. He then made appointments that the Senate approved. There is no "undo" in American federal politics. There are no recall petitions nor "votes of no confidence". There is the ballot box, there are courts, and their is impeachment. Take your pick.

[Atticus]

35. I only hope we have time for one of your "legal" alternatives to prevent to the

total eradication of our democracy and any who oppose Dear Leader. Though we disagree, thanks for your response.

[zipplewrath]

36. The alternative is revolution

I'm not really there yet.

[world wide wally]

4. I hope some Dem will introduce legislation to address this if we take back one of the houses.

Make the GOP vote in favor of being illegitimate.

[onetexan]

17. second that

[The Liberal Lion]

5. I agree 100%

Everything done by that orange chump is illegitimate, including but not limited to Gorsuch. As I said before and it's what I will stick to, an election is not good enough to rid ourselves of this treachery. They (the GOP) carried out a coup. Hillary Clinton IS the legitimate head of state. Being as such the GOP committed an act of both treason and war. They must surrender UNCONDITIONALLY and every malfeasance they have committed must be nullified.

[BigmanPigman]

18. Since the Russians also had US Congressmenbers

and Senators in their back pockets they should also be impeached and all legislation passed by them nullified (ACA cuts, tax plan, SCOTUS, etc.). Also, people vote down ballot so when they chose the moron they chose the GOP too.

[sweetroxie]

6. I agree also. But first we have to find some way

to all agree that he is mentally ill, a traitor and that he cheated. We are not there yet.

[gibraltar72]

7. I think We the people are going to have to take to the streets.

demand in no uncertain terms the right thing must be done.

[BamaRefugee]

8. Unfortunately this isn't the 60s (when I WAS in the streets!)

All going in the streets will do is:

1. Give Rethugs with guns PLENTY of targets to shoot at

2. Give cops with armored vehicles PLENTY of targets to run over and crush


3. Give Fox News days and days worth of "liberal snuff film" footage to play over and over


WHat we need is to WIN THE ELECTIONS and then SLASH AND BURN, none of this "Impeachment is off the table" bulls hit, that moment in time was when Republicans realized that they could get away with ANYTHING THEY DID, and they have never looked back

[Atticus]

21. Agree with your closing paragraph, but refuse to surrender the streets to

the fascist knuckle draggers. I was also inthe streets in the 60s and the 70s. Returned to them in about 2007 and continue to go out when bodies are needed to oppose the monsters. Everyone has to make their own decision about the extent of their participation, but that is mine.

I do not think the right-wing will actually shoot me, but I do think they'd like me to believe they will. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. In the meantime, they can go jump with their threats.

[bucolic_frolic]

9. What you are describing is the ripple effect of an illegitimate or illegal action

Courts reverse such actions all the time. Stolen property is returned to owner.

I see no reason why the 2016 election is any different than any other theft, IF it can be proven.

Warping votes minds, skewing the finances, plotting with FBI insiders, perhaps even flipping votes.

Americans are fair. They are not about thievery. They may be slow, but they do figure things out.

These connected issues are not random events. They are provable statistically, and perhaps even conspiratorially.

But as you say, there are no existing mechanisms for dealing with such Titanic larceny.

[Perseus]

10. Take Lance Armstrong as an example, he was stripped of his medals and tour de france

wins due to cheating.

YOU ARE 100% CORRECT! and this has to passed to everyone to read...everything this maniac has done should be reversed once he is thrown in jail.

[Texin]

11. Absolutely! Everything enacted and signed by him should be null and void.

Gorsuch should be stripped of his SCOTUS robe, because he was installed by a traitor and enabled by a supine congress, beholden to the NRA, whose biggest bankroller is Russia. He should be stripped of not only the office, he should be made to make restitution to the U.S. government for every dime spent on his worthless orange blob ass since the day he started squatting in the Oval Office courtesy of his Uncle Vlad. He should be stripped of any benefit or protection bestowed on U.S. presidents and their first ladies previously. This man is a traitor. Pure. And. Simple. Furthermore, he should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law of the land, found guilty of treason and summarily executed. And if his disgusting, entitled children (which we know they did without question) participated or knew and remained mute, they should get the same treatment.

[BSdetect]

12. Wipe out his every nasty deed re laws, treaties, trade deal etc

[PJMcK]

13. We still have a Constitution

As abhorrent as it is, the 2016 election was certified by all 50 states and the Electoral College. The results cannot be overturned because there isn't a mechanism for that in the Constitution. Other than voting Trump out in 2020, impeachment, conviction and removal is the only path we have and I think we can agree that isn't likely to happen.

It sucks to be an American right now.

[Texin]

15. It's only a useful tool if the people sworn to protect its tenets are willing to support it.

[bearsfootball516]

27. People tend to forget that.

[KPN]

16. Well said Atticus. I'm with you 110%.

[usaf-vet]

19. How about the only "official" images of him would be with him in a orange prison suit....

..... behind bars sans the rag top.

[Vinca]

25. I totally agree with you. Sadly, the founding fathers didn't foresee a clusterfuck like this.

There's no remedy for this situation. It should be that if the election is proven to have been fixed, either the opponent is installed or a new election is held.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

26. Damn straight!!

[jberryhill]

28. Retroactively revoke every federal employee and military paycheck!

yeah, that'll work.

I think you are going to have to more clearly define which acts were "legitimate" and which ones were not.

[Atticus]

29. That's clearly not the intent of the OP. Insisting that all possible though unlikely

eventualities be thoroughly addressed before acting us a recipe for doing nothing.

[jberryhill]

30. a good "recipe for doing nothing"

...is engaging in the idle fantasy that a wave of the magic wand by some thoroughly undocumented process provided for nowhere in the Constitution or laws of the US is going to "undo" everything done by an administration which, clearly, is the presidential administration for the time being.

This is not the Tour de France, and the UCI rules don't govern how the American legal system works.

[Atticus]

31. "Never do anything for the first time" is the essence of conservatism. nt

[bearsfootball516]

32. There's a lot we can do. I campaign for Joe Donnelly with hopes of turning the Senate.

I'm also a precinct chair captain who helps register voters and get the vote out.

But jberryhill is right. There's no mechanism or something that just reverses what Trump has done. The judges he's appointed won't be taken back, there's no magic button that reverses everything back to January 19th, 2017.