The media is still refusing to state the obvious about Helsinki

[Tom Rinaldo]

The reason why U.S. officials at the highest levels still don't know exactly what Trump and Putin talked about and agreed to there is because Trump didn't then and doesn't now want them to know what Trump and Putin talked about and agreed to.. That is the one and only reason why Trump would hold a summit with Putin that excluded every other member of his administration from those talks, and why not even a stenographer was allowed to be present at the meeting.

It was not simply unusual for the Secretary of State, the Ambassador to Russia, the head of U.S. intelligence operations, the CIA director, and the National Security Advisor to be excluded from all actual discussions between Putin and Trump, it was designed to keep the contents of those discussion secretive; guarded against members of our own government from discovering what actually happened in that room. The intent always was total evasion from discovery of what exactly transpired in that room.

It is that simple, and it needs to be described as what it was.

[mucifer]

1. They refuse to acknowledge what is going on. They are afraid of a third of the country who backs him

[luvtheGWN]

11. There is an abundance of facts that go unacknowledged

for public consumption, and for good, reasonable security reasons. Intel officials would be considered reckless if they spouted off stuff for which they, as yet possibly (probably) have no irrefutable proof. Certainly from what I've seen and read (CNN, Globe & Mail, WaPo) journalists are not reluctant to cast suspicions.

[lark]

2. Conspiracy against America.

That is what happened. As for the details, we will only know what Russian media tells us because drumpf won't. Putin has told him to say nothing, the better to punk him later, but fool orange assmouth just goes along like the fat giant poodle he is.

[Tom Rinaldo]

4. The ultimate "back channel" to Moscow turned out to be a private summiit

No need to use a secure phone line in Russia's Washington embassy that the CIA may or may not be able to listen in on anyway. Just get together with Putin face to face without any record whatsoever.

[Squinch]

3. Yep. This is unprecedented, bizarre and malicious. And no one is mentioning that.

[jaxind]

5. Where...

Where was the media BEFORE the one on one took place?? We all know that there is a nefarious relationship going on between tRUMP and Putin, so once it was revealed that there was going to be a private summit between the two, that's when the media should have been jumping all over it, and questioning why would such a private meeting be taking place between these two when there is such suspicion about their relationship!

[Roy Rolling]

7. "The Media"?

There is no "the media". When Trump announced his private meeting---the meeting was reported by news media and decried by objective media opinion personalities. Only propaganda media failed to do the job of informing people.

This swipe at "the media" is a propaganda concept. Please do not think that way.

[Nitram]

13. Exactly, Roy. Blaming "the media" for everything is a right-wing and Russian propaganda tool.

Anyone who parrots that is a useful idiot.

[Tom Rinaldo]

21. Utter nonsense (and insulting)

Since you are replying to my thread there is a basis for taking this personally. Where did I suggest that the media is to blame for everything? I was specific to one aspect of this one instance. The term "news" covers both factual reporting and conjecture. There has been plenty of reporting of the fact that Trump had a one on one meeting with Trump. Plenty of reporting about how much high ranking American officials don't know about what transpired. And plenty of speculation about what if anything Putin has over Trump. However I have not noticed anyone stating the obvious in the media. Trump made sure no other Americans (aside from a mandatory translator who can not speak up) were in the room because he did not want any other Americans to overhear what he and Putin had to say.

[triron]

32. I support you. The response was uncalled for.

[Nitram]

36. Tom, the weakness in your argument is that conjecture is not "news." Conjecture has its place

in an editorial or opinion piece. Faulting the media for "...refusing to state the obvious about Helsinki", when "the obvious" is just your particular view is grossly unfair. Some examples of reporting in the Post that did state the equivalent of your "obvious" conclusion:

Another accusation leveled at Trump carries particular historical weight: that Trump is appeasing Russia. Rep. Lloyd Doggett (D-Tex.) worried more about “unknown appeasement in private.” Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee (D-Tex.) went further, tweeting, “It was nothing more than the @potus agreeing hand-in-glove with the Russian autocrat.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2018/07/17/trumps-stance-toward-russia-isnt-appeasement-it-may-be-even-worse/?utm_term=.3142df019c30

If you were one of the American intelligence officers who helped gather the information that’s included in Friday’s indictment, what would you think about the fact that Trump has asked for a private meeting first with Putin?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2018/07/15/putin-must-wonder-what-else-america-knows-about-russia/?utm_term=.f0a31c833935

“Millions of Americans will continue to wonder if the only possible explanation for this dangerous and inexplicable behavior is the possibility — the very real possibility — that President Putin holds damaging information over President Trump,” Schumer said on the Senate floor.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2018/07/17/does-putin-have-kompromat-on-trump-suddenly-its-no-longer-such-a-taboo-question-thanks-to-trump/?utm_term=.50e8afc3851b

[Tom Rinaldo]

37. Again, the simplest of statements is missing

The most logical reason why Donald Trump excluded any official from the U.S. government from being in the room with him with Putin is because he did not want any official from the U.S. government to know what was said or agreed to in that room. Period. A nd to cite evidence for your position that "conjecture is not news" you quoted from one of Ameroica's leading NEWSpapers. Cable news lives on conjecture. When it is informed it can be invaluable.

My entire point, for what it is or is not worth, is that there is a simple observation to be made that is not being made in the blunt way which is called for. Trump insisted on being alone with Trump because he didn't want anyone from our government other than him to know what went on inside that room.

[Nitram]

38. OK, I guess I read more into your idea than as intend. The point you are making is so obvious that

every conjecture about what and why they met privately is based on that assumption. Yeah, they met privately because they wanted it to be private between the two of them. There isn't a person who read the story who didn't know that was a given. it is what "private" means.

and that is why I object to your using the wording that "The media is still refusing..." Every time they describe the m,eettinmg a "private", which is every single news story about the meting, they are acknowledging that no one else was supposed to know what took place during the meeting. Am I missing something here?

[Tom Rinaldo]

39. Honestly, I think you are missing something

When (to the best of my knowledge) major U.S. Summits with other world leaders prior to Trump becoming President have never been completely private affairs, and when not only prior protocol but every aspect of common sense and pragmatic realities dictate that more than one person be present when agreements are being pursued with another nation (especially one with whom the U.S. has had adversarial relations), the REASON why this summit meeting was "private" begs an answer, not merely the observation that it was private. Sure, we all know what "private" means. But why here, why now?

The setting matters greatly. A short private chat to "break the ice" and establish a rapport is one thing. The goal of that sort of exercise is understood to be to establish a rapport that can be useful during subsequent negotiations. When it comes to a Summit, that type thing is a prelude, not the main event. The implications of Trump choosing to have his Summit be entirely private need to be faced, because by almost any sane standard it is counter productive to U.S. interests not to bring experts into negotiations, and it flies in the face or reason to not have any official U.S. records of what was discussed and/or agreed to. Why have two hours of private talks if secrecy from his own government wasn't Trump's motivation, and what are the implications of THAT?

[lancelyons]

6. I could see Trump saying.. Continue meddling in our election and I will come out after the mid terms

I could see Trump saying.. Continue meddling in our election and I will come out after the mid terms and say Crimea is Russian and lets move on.

[Roy Rolling]

8. "Meddling"

There were multiple cyber attacks on U.S. companies and government operations. It is an attack, not "meddling".

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

26. Honestly, that makes me so angry.

It was an attack. Not "meddling." Ffs!

[triron]

33. +1000

[DemocracyMouse]

9. Most US journalists and pundits suffer from "complicit tongue effect"

In an attempt to sound professional and reasonable, and not be labeled a firebrand, they attempt to make neutral-sounding statements –even in the face of lunacy and corruption.

The more alert journalists are starting to change their approach, but old habits die hard.

[KPN]

24. I agree with that assessment. Spot on imo.

[H2O Man]

10. Recommended.

It is a national security crisis.

[Scarsdale]

15. Government was set up to be

a series of oversight committees, wasn't it? Surely one (incompatant) man does not have the power to just do as he pleases, when it comes to the security of the entire nation. Where were the so-called "leaders" of the gop on this? If President Obama had even mentioned doing something like this, they would have screamed IMPEACH loudly. No wonder this orange assh*** thinks he is the king of the entire world.

[Nitram]

12. No, Tom, the media where I get my news, NPR and the Washington Post, have both stated this.

[Tom Rinaldo]

23. Did they simply state that Trump and Putin met alone (and how unusual that is) or

did they say that sometimes the simplest explanation is the correct one. In this case that Trump met alone with Putin BECAUSE he did not want top officials in his administration to know what was said in that room. I think the former though it's possible in some isolated cases someone has made that latter assertion.

[True Blue American]

14. Douglas Brinkley was just on CNN

Last edited Sat Jul 21, 2018, 11:16 AM - Edit history (1)

He said,” there is something off about Trump’s actions since the Helsinki meeting. Something not right, that smells.”

The Staff all want to quit but hesitate to do that before the Elections. If they cared about their Country they would show courage and leave En masse.

Fixed,thanks!

[VOX]

17. David Brinkley died in 2003, but CNN must hold the rights to his resurrection.

Just joshing you! Couldn’t resist.

Pretty sure you meant Douglas Brinkley.

[True Blue American]

20. I thought Douglas

Apparently typed David, but Spell Check does a number on my posts,too.

[VOX]

22. Just moments ago, my spell-check turned "didn't" into "dinette."

I now watch it hawkishly, that dang “helpful” spell-check will say anything!

Cheers—

[True Blue American]

29. You should see what it does with names!:)

[VOX]

31. Hahaha it has a mind of its own.

My relationship with spell-check is something akin to that between Inspector Clouseau and Kato.

It lies in wait for a really important communique, then lets loose a surprise attack without mercy.

[Farmer-Rick]

19. It's his invitation for little Putin to come visit the White House in Nov

Along with the scheduled military parade. It's little Putins coup d'etat.

It is designed to humiliate our country. Little Putin will be addressing Congress, Traitor Trump will be breaking with over 240 years of tradition and will fly the Russian flag over top the White House. The majority of our members of congress will be groveling, fawning and kowtowing to little Putin. It is designed by Putin, a former KGB agent, to totally humiliate and subjugate the United States.

Little Putin and the KGB are noted for humiliating their enemies before they murder them.

Go back and look at that smirk little Putin is wearing as he leaves the Helinsik meeting room. We have been conquered and everyone in Washington knows it. They are keeping quiet about it because they are making money off it. It's like what Romney does to corporations after he buys them.

[lunatica]

41. It's called vulture capitalism

[Farmer-Rick]

42. Yeah, only with a formerly functioning wealthy country.

[Loubee]

16. The political media have been incredibly timid

even liberal pundits pussy-footing around the obvious ugly truth; and the local news reporting has been stenography at best, right wing propaganda at worst.

[NRaleighLiberal]

18. They just can't seem to go there...reined in by GOP ownership?

[Yellowdog88]

25. Seems like the 2 hour meeting

Had this for an agenda:

Putin goes first:
NATO (good boy, 45)
The Baltics
Hand over Obama's Rus Ambassador
We can team up to investigate election interference
Crimea wants to be Russia

45:
I think we like each other, right Vlad?
Do you want that last chicken tender?



All have been supported upon his release from Putin's chamber.

Add more... I've missed a ton, I'm sure!

[True Blue American]

30. I was surprised how quickly the Senate voted.

Mich and Ryan said Putin would get no invitation to the Senate.

Boehner invited Netanyahu as a slap to President Obama. But those days are long gone. Now,they have a traitor in the WH. Not sure what to do.

[bettyellen]

34. You forgot setting up a play date between our most corrupt billionaires and theirs- which of course

Means we have to stop sanctioning and start worshipping them instead. That joke about worshipping our new overlords- we are on our way to that.

[Garrett78]

27. There seems to be little discussion about the fact that Trump is breaking numerous laws.

Including federal records laws (which Trump violates by having private cell phone conversations with world leaders), the emoluments clause, Sabraw's court order and the Flores Settlement. These aren't disputable. Trump is, beyond a shadow of a doubt, breaking these laws.

We have a president* who is actively breaking numerous laws and clearly poses a national security risk, yet most don't seem willing to offer a very blunt assessment.

[bettyellen]

35. Rushed to look up Sabraw and Flores... (thanks!)

[nolabear]

28. Right? There's no way to implement anything positive w/o many people knowing.

Does he believe he can unilaterally implement complex plans and there’s no chain of command or cooperation needed? Does he think he can wave a wand and everyone will do his bidding?

They talked about how to unify and they talked, explicitly or implicitly, about how Putin got him elected and how great things are going to be. And Putin rode him like a two dollar mule while the wheels turn right under Spanky’s nose.

[lunatica]

40. Rachel was on AMJoy this morning as a commentator

Saying what she thinks.

She believes the Russians can claim anything they want about what went on during the meeting. Even if they taped it they can doctor the tape. There is no way we can tell if the Russians are telling lies or the truth.

We will never know what they talked about during those two hours, because we can’t believe anything they say. And we know Trump is a liar so anyone who would believe him is a fool.