CNN Sources: Sikh Temple shooter was an Army Veteran; may have been a White Supremecist

[brooklynite]

...according to this morning's newscast

[Junkdrawer]

1. Reincarnation of Tim McVeigh?

I guess it's a more comforting narrative than the examination of our ( very real ) RW Militia problem.

[nadinbrzezinski]

44. What militia problem?

DHS under bush no less, tried....but the RW was thrown into pearl clutching mode.

Good news, call it what it is.

Bad news, will be a lone wolf.

[Junkdrawer]

47. Basically, the NRA issued a General Call for Preemptive Action....

In the world of RW gunner asshattery, the NRA is the Sinn Fein of the spectrum - the sensible, politically engaged arm of the movement. When they issue statements like this, it's tantamount to a call to arms:

Obama’s Secret Plan To Destroy The Second Amendment By 2016



by Wayne LaPierre, NRA Executive Vice President

If you want a glimpse of a genuine nightmare for America, just look at what’s headed our way.

But unlike a nightmare, this isn’t some fantasy. It’s a very real, very dangerous conspiracy of public deception intended to destroy your Right to Keep and Bear Arms. It’s targeted directly at you.

...

Over the past three years, the Obama administration and its anti-gun allies have been engaged in a silent but sophisticated long-term conspiracy to:

1. Neutralize gun owners and NRA voters as a political force in national elections, and thereby:

2. Win re-election to a second term in the White House, where they then will be immune to the will of voters and free to continue consolidating and misusing their ever-increasing power to:

3. Prosecute a full-scale, sustained, all-out campaign to excise the Second Amendment from our Bill of Rights through legislation, litigation, regulation, executive orders, judicial fiat, international treaties—in short, all the levers of power of all three branches of government.

...

But that’s just a diversion to distract you from their true beliefs and objectives.

Think about it: Before moving into the White House, Barack Obama spent his entire career proudly, publicly advancing the most radical anti-gun positions you can imagine.

He endorsed a total ban on the manufacture, sale and possession of handguns. He opposed Right- to-Carry laws. He voted to ban nearly all common hunting-rifle ammunition.

In short, Obama never met a gun he liked, and never met a gun ban he didn’t like. The same was true of his running mate, then U.S. Senator Joe Biden, D-Del.

...

Yet so far, President Obama and Attorney General Eric Holder have done nothing but shrug their shoulders, shirk responsibility and stonewall the investigations at every turn, as if Americans shouldn’t care that a massive criminal enterprise seems to have been run right out of our own Justice Department, just to set the stage for a future Obama gun ban.

....

http://www.nrapublications.org/index.php/11920/obamas-secret-plan-to-destroy-the-second-amendment-by-2016

Expect more, MUCH MORE, RW terrorism in the coming months.

[nadinbrzezinski]

50. Sin Fein...apt analogy

He gets reelected, I expect the violence to get to low level civil war in a year or so. This technically is, but it's hard for most people to see it.

[siligut]

53. Is the NRA part of the fascist conglomerate?

I recognize that the tea baggers and NRA overlap, but are they both under the Kochs? Or is it a mutual admiration thing?

[Junkdrawer]

54. Things that make you go hmmmmmm.....

Windbaggers Stoop to New Low. Death Threats to Wind Worker.

Windbagger groups will say they don’t condone this, but when you traffic in the kind of far right wing conspiracy craziness that they do, the intent is clearly to draw out the nutbag element. It’s a tactic that far right wing hate groups have deployed consistently right back to the civil rights era – intimidation with deniability.
This incident shows that they are successfully reaching their intended audience.

CBC News:

West Grey Police are investigating alleged threats against a worker, who says he had a shotgun pulled on him while working on a wind turbine site northeast of London, Ont. Police are also investigating threatening phone calls the man says he received.

Jeff Damen was doing preliminary work at the site of a proposed wind farm in the community of West Grey, near London last week when he says a red pickup truck pulled alongside his vehicle and the driver asked what he was doing.

After Damen explained the work he was doing, the driver pulled out a gun, Damen said.

“He reached over his back seat, and pulled out a shotgun, pointed it at me and stated, ‘Why don’t you leave us all alone? If I catch you back here again, I’m going to kill you,’” Damen said. Damen was unable to get a licence plate number. It was covered by a folded down tailgate.

....

http://climatecrocks.com/2012/08/05/windbaggers-stoop-to-new-low-death-threats-to-wind-worker/

[siligut]

55. Paranoia is practically a given with these extremists

While there is a strong interest in suppression of alternate energy production, the way this guy spoke, makes me think that he may believe that the wind farm is just a ruse to spy on his group.

Of course this guy probably gets his information from extremists groups, who in turn get it from special interests/wealthy activists.

[banned from Kos]

2. name is Wade Michael Page

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/08/06/sikh-temple-shooter-ids-as-40-year-old-wade-michael-page-that-left-7-dead-including-the-gunman/

if you believe this and Fox News (below)

Sources identified the dead suspect as Wade Michael Page, who was at one time attached to the Fort Bragg Army installation in North Carolina. Local authorities have scheduled a 10 a.m. press conference, where more details may emerge about Page and what the FBI is treating as an act of domestic terrorism in the temple, in the Milwaukee suburb of Oak Creek. Six people were killed and four wounded, including a police officer, before the man being identified as Page was shot dead by a police officer.

[UTUSN]

8. Ya beat me to it. From the same Faux:

*************QUOTE*************

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/06/authorities-search-for-motive-in-deadly-shooting-at-wisconsin-sikh-temple/#ixzz22lVGcsLX

[font size=5]Authorities search for motive in deadly shooting at Wisconsin Sikh temple[/font]

CUDAHY, Wis. – The man authorities say killed six in a Milwaukee-area Sikh temple before police shot him was a heavily-tattooed, 40-year-old ex-Army soldier, sources told Fox News, but what triggered his rampage remains unclear.



Sources identified the dead suspect as Wade Michael Page, who was at one time attached to the Fort Bragg Army installation in North Carolina. Local authorities have scheduled a 10 a.m. press conference... ....


.... A woman who says she was a neighbor of the suspect tells FoxNews.com that last week she heard yelling coming from the apartment she believes is the same one the FBI is now searching.

The neighbor says, as she understood it, the suspect had lived in the apartment with his girlfriend until their recent break-up. The suspect had then moved into another apartment nearby two weeks ago. She says he had returned to the old apartment and was banging on the door of his old apartment, demanding to be let in. The neighbor also said she believed the suspect had a 9-11 tattoo.

Another local resident Kurt Weins told the Journal Sentinel he rented out the upper flat of the duplex to a man in his 40s.

"I had him checked out and he definitely checked out," Weins told the newspaper. "The cops told me they don't want me to say nothing right now." ....

*************UNQUOTE*************

[winstars]

12. What is a 9-11 tattoo???? n/t

[aikoaiko]

13. There are a lot of 9/11 tattoo designs

Many of them involve images of the towers and the date.

https://www.google.com/search?q=9/11+tattoo&hl=en&prmd=imvnsu&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=hbYfUJ_yAYqo8ATUhoCQAw&ved=0CEgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1440&bih=785#hl=en&safe=active&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=9%2F11+tattoo&oq=9%2F11+tattoo&gs_l=img.12...0.0.0.2615.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0...0.0...1c.LBNTPicGqEU&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=66ebd8fd03f58703&biw=1440&bih=785

[Warren Stupidity]

3. Nothing to see here move along.

Guns and right wing extremists, really it is not representative at all.

[Ikonoklast]

24. They just attend peaceful political rallies armed to the teeth.

Just exercising their rights, nothing to see here, move along now.

No one could have predicted that after twenty years of hate radio that anyone would act violently upon the non-stop message of fear and hatred being broadcast over the land.

Nothing to see, keep moving.

[xchrom]

4. It's going to be interesting to watch this info unfold. Nt

[malaise]

6. Isn't that the truth

Thanks Rush, thanks Michelle Bachmann - keep on feeding them hate.

[siligut]

41. Especially now, before the election

Keep the shootings in the news and throw in Fast and Furious and with Obama's feet to the fire, take whatever he says and skew it to reinforce that he is going to take away our guns (and kill babies, but that is a different matter).

Yup, that will get the RW voters out.

[piratefish08]

5. Terrorist right? oh. white dude.

got it.

[HappyMe]

7. The FBI and local police

are calling this an act of domestic terrorism.

[piratefish08]

37. if they are then i am truly SORRY for my sarcastic post.....

i'm used to brown killers being terrorists and white killers being lone wolves in almost every instance of mass murder.......

[HappyMe]

40. I heard it this morning on

ABC and NBC. Also last night a short statement from the police chief in that town, indicated that he thought this was domestic terrorism.

This guy is tied to white supremacists.

[Marrah_G]

49. Every report i heard this morning called it domestic terrorism

[Warren Stupidity]

26. care to elaborate on that comment?

what exactly did you get?

[uponit7771]

35. The reluctance to call mass shootings by a white person as terrorism. If this person was Muslim and

...had religious tattoos the partiality has been obvious

[davidpdx]

9. I think it's too early to know if the information coming out is completely correct

I do know the person who did it has to be one fucked up loon.

[malaise]

10. More here

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/authorities-identify-sikh-temple-shooter/
<snip>
The details are still emerging from Sunday’s horrific shooting at a Sikh temple near Milwaukee, Wisconsin. After much speculation about the assailant, who killed six people before perishing in an exchange of gunfire with police, sources claim that the man responsible is Wade Michael Page. The 40-year-old was an active Army serviceman out of Ft. Bragg in California.

Prior to being identified, the shooter was described by police as a white man in his 40s with a shaved or bald head and a number of tattoos. This information, teamed with biographical data, led authorities to classify the attack as an act of “domestic terrorism.” This essentially means that there was a probable political agenda attached to the crime. Considering these factors, the FBI is now leading the investigation.

Prior to the identification, ABC News reported that the man behind the attack was a “white supremacist“ and a ”skinhead.” The suspect’s landlord also told the Greendale Patch that she believes the man had “just broken up with his girlfriend.” As of Monday morning, no details regarding a potential motive were released. While details are still murky, Fox News reports that local authorities will hold a press conference at 10 a.m., where more information will be distributed.
=================
I also heard that he was discharged from the army

[LiberalLoner]

30. Just an aside, Ft. Bragg is in NC, not CA.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

32. There's a Ft. Bragg in California (Mendocino coast), but it's not a military town n/t

.

[LiberalLoner]

34. Oh, okay, thanks! Didn't know that! Saw other postings talking about Ft. Bragg NC.

[Le Taz Hot]

11. and . . .

no doubt obsessively listening/watching hate radio/tv. It's important that this connection be made to FINALLY shine a huge spotlight on the consequences of their 24/7 hatefest.

[msanthrope]

14. Dishonorable discharge in 1998, according to CBS news. nt

[davepc]

15. link anywhere? or on air?

[msanthrope]

18. PsyOps, Fort Bragg....discharged 1998, dishonorable.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57487094/sikh-temple-shooting-suspect-identified-as-wade-michael-page-motivation-unclear/

[TheMightyFavog]

16. How'd he get a hold of guns? Aren't people with Dishonoroable Discharges barred from gun ownership?

Stolen? Straw purchase at whatever the fuck Badger Guns is calling themselves these days? Gun show loophole?

[msanthrope]

17. Nope. nt

[TheMightyFavog]

19. Umm...

http://www.ehow.com/list_6139124_consequences-dishonorable-discharge-military.html

In addition to losing his veterans benefits, the dishonorable dischargee will be unable to apply for unemployment benefits upon entering into civilian life. More than likely the dischargee will also lose the ability to apply for bank loans and will be barred from serving in any level of government service--especially those of the armed forces. If the soldier was discharged because of a felony conviction, he also loses the right to vote and the ability to hold public office, and will be unable to sit on a jury for an extended period of time. The dischargee is also barred from purchasing or owning any sort of firearm under Title 18 of the United States Code.

[msanthrope]

22. I checked the code. I am wrong. He's not allowed to have guns, legally. nt

[Atypical Liberal]

21. Incorrect. You will fail a NICS check with a Dishonorable Discharge.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/general-information/fact-sheet

Federal Categories of Persons Prohibited From Receiving
...
■A person dishonorably discharged from the United States Armed Forces.
...


Of course, in most states you can buy a firearm from a private individual with no background check or other paperwork. All you have to do is open your local Penny Saver.

[msanthrope]

23. You are right. I was wrong. He should not have been able to purchase. nt

[Warren Stupidity]

25. well we wouldn't want to infringe on a sacred right to have massive loopholes

in a minimal sensible regulation of weapons purchases.

[Warren Stupidity]

27. It seems he got discharged with reduced rank.

OAK CREEK, Wis. (AP) — Officials on Monday identified the gunman they say killed six people inside a Sikh temple in Wisconsin as a 40-year-old Army veteran.

First Assistant U.S. Greg Haanstad in the U.S. Attorney's office in Milwaukee identified the shooter, who was shot and killed by police outside the Sikh Temple of Wisconsin, as Wade Michael Page. The ex-Army man was reduced in rank before his discharge about 12 years ago, according to a defense official who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release information yet about the suspect.

I think that is not a dishonorable discharge and thus he was legally allowed to arm up for mass slaughter.

[johnd83]

28. He probably just bought it at a gunshow

There are no background checks at a gun show. Thanks NRA.

[Mojorabbit]

51. or from a friend, or on craig's list or on the street. Could have been anywhere.

What must happen for someone to hate others so badly? Did he grow up with bigots? It amazes me that people can hate like this.

[DevonRex]

36. General Discharge according to the presser

just now.

[HappyMe]

43. Yes, that's what they said.

'Unable to re-enlist', but they are unsure of the reasons.

[obamanut2012]

20. A lot of Aryan Nation types go into the military on purpose

To learn certain skills and even to steal certain arms and explosives. If you live in a military town, you know bases are always being "locked down" for stuff missing, but that stuff is very rarely ever found. (ie Timothy McVeigh and co.)

It's why I am never too shocked to hear about military atrocities against people in Iraq and Afghanistan. We have some scary people wearing the uniforms of our nation.

At least the Army DQed this guy.

[nc4bo]

33. Hate to say this but the hushed whispers in our little neck o' the woods

say exactly the same thing.

Stuff missing/stolen - it hardly ever makes the news though except for the occasional live hand grenade mysteriously found on a CIVILIAN Fayetteville road.

[obamanut2012]

56. Are you in Fayetteville?

I have civilian friends there and relatives and friends who are and were stationed at Bragg. Happens a lot, and they are also always busting Neo Nazi types who are enlisted. Hell, military could legally belong to these orgs until not all that long ago.

[nc4bo]

57. Just outside Bragg, I'm in Harnett County.

Hate to say it but the military training is a perfect fit for the neos and other hate groups, just perfect.

Was reading an article that there are those who mask their racism and bigotry so that they can train as law enforcement officers and soldiers. I immediately thought about the violent methods we've seen some police officers used/are using against peaceful protesters, against minorities, against women, against Occupy, against citizens in general, it should make everyone ask if this is what's occurring in our streets. How the police are so quick to TASE, pepper spray, physically abuse the innocent and the perps, no one is safe. Real hateful, brutal uncalled for violence by those who took oaths to serve and protect.

Maybe we should ask why soldiers deliberately killed innocent Iraqi and Afghan men, women and children while overseas or getting so much obvious pleasure posing with naked suspected terrorists or torturing prisoners.

Living so close to Bragg, I've seen some really wild, hateful, meanspirited stuff from our soldiers, some definitely related to fatigue and PSTD or mental illness from too many tours, too much death and destruction but how many out of those are there because they are exactly what the SPLC is warning us about?

You just have to wonder. I find myself wondering about it all the time.

[obamanut2012]

58. I totally cosign your post

And, this week at the Olympics a German rower was sent home because her boyfriend was publicly exposed as a Neo Nazi. But, get this: SHE is also one, and had been a POLICE TRAINER until she was exposed last year, and was fired. It was hushed up, since she was an Olympic-caliber rower.

It's not only here, and it is really scary.

[leeroysphitz]

29. Wrong. According to Pat Robertson he was an atheist who hated all religious people. n/t

[spin]

31. We do seem to have a serious problem when you mix an individual with a severe mental issue ...

and firearms.

Perhaps we need to improve our NICS background check system to better detect such individuals and stop the legal sale of firearms to them. Almost all of these individuals who used firearms to commit a massacre had raised red flags prior to the incident. Apparently this shooter had been released from military service.

CBS News reports that Page enlisted in the Army in April 1992 and was given a less-than-honorable discharge in October 1998. He was last stationed in Fort Bragg, N.C., serving in the psychological operations unit.
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/08/06/cbs-news-shooter-identified-as-former-us-military-member/

This is obviously a red flag. As time passes more red flags may be uncovered.

We also may need to consider overhauling our mental healthcare system.

It could also help if our news media didn't cover each and every shooting 24/7 for several days as this might lead to copycat massacres. Glorifying a mass murderer is a bad idea. It is entirely fair to spend perhaps an hour a day discussing a shooting and to report on such incidents and new developments as they happen. I understand that the media opposes gun ownership and mass shootings support that cause. Still the media may have blood on their hands because of its excessive fascination with one story.

[mod mom]

38. He was assigned to a branch "devoted to deception and propaganda."

"He was assigned to psychological operations, a branch of the Army devoted to deception and propaganda."

-snip
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/05/wisconsin-shooting-sikh-temple_n_1744256.html#93_alleged-shooters-army-records

[spin]

45. Further details will leak out ...

in a few days we will have a far better picture of the shooter.

[w8liftinglady]

39. he was in Psy-ops and dishonerably discharged.

http://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/browse-career-and-job-categories/intelligence-and-combat-support/psychological-operations-specialist.html

[nadinbrzezinski]

42. Relevant op I started yesterday

Based on reading of the fire across the plain, book by same name, while dated, is worth reading.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1077015

Suffice it to say, neither surprised or shocked...nor clutching pearls. This was obvious by known patterns.

[Fire Walk With Me]

46. Anonymous shares links on the white supremacists music group(s) he was in:

Bulletin: Alleged Sikh Temple Shooter Former Member of Skinhead Band

The man who allegedly murdered six people at a Sikh temple in suburban Milwaukee yesterday, identified in media reports as Wade Michael Page, was a frustrated neo-Nazi who had been the leader of a racist white-power band.

In 2010, Page, then the leader of the band End Apathy, gave an interview to the white supremacist website Label 56. He said that when he started the band in 2005, its name reflected his wish to “figure out how to end people’s apathetic ways” and start “moving forward.” “I was willing to point out some of my faults on how I was holding myself back,” Page said. Later, he added, “The inspiration was based on frustration that we have the potential to accomplish so much more as individuals and a society in whole.” He did not discuss violence in the interview.

Page told the website that he had been a part of the white power music scene since 2000, when he left his native Colorado on a motorcycle. He attended white power concerts in Georgia, North Carolina, West Virginia and Colorado. At various times, he said, he also played in the hate rock bands Youngland (2001-2003), Celtic Warrior, Radikahl, Max Resist, Intimidation One, Aggressive Force and Blue Eyed Devils. End Apathy, he said, included “Brent” on bass and “Ozzie” on drums; the men were former members of Definite Hate and another band, 13 Knots.

[nadinbrzezinski]

48. And a few of us are going

This is not shocking or surprising.

[Ruby the Liberal]

52. When you tattoo a 14 (or 88) inside a celtic cross on the most prominent spot on your body,

There is no "may". Dude was a full out nazi.