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Newsjock

(11,733 posts)
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 12:48 AM Aug 2012

Romney files multiple appeals to reduce his La Jolla property taxes by $109,000

Source: Los Angeles Times

Mitt and Ann Romney were easily able to afford a $12-million La Jolla home.

... After paying cash for the Mediterranean-style house with 61 feet of beach frontage, they asked San Diego County for dramatic property tax relief.

... Initially, the Romneys asked that their 2009 assessment, $12.24 million, be reduced to $6.8 million, maintaining that their home had lost about 45% of its value in the first seven months they owned it.

Thirteen months later, after hiring an attorney to guide them, the Romneys filed an amended appeal, contending the home had suffered a less-dramatic fall of 27.3%, to $8.9 million.

They also filed an appeal for the 2010 tax year, claiming the house had dropped further, to $7.5 million, 38.7% less than the home's assessed value.

Read more: http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-romney-property-tax-20120806,0,4428951,full.story

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Romney files multiple appeals to reduce his La Jolla property taxes by $109,000 (Original Post) Newsjock Aug 2012 OP
if only he could have a bigger tax cut he would be able to hire more people JI7 Aug 2012 #1
I'm just waiting for him to say the same thing, only he would actually mean it renate Aug 2012 #12
Why not. It's a tear-down, and totally useless to him as-is. nt DCKit Aug 2012 #2
taxes are assessed on the market value of the property, not on the value to the homeowner. HiPointDem Aug 2012 #3
That only applies to us little peoples. You know, the ones who actually pay taxes. DCKit Aug 2012 #8
you might want to put a sarcasm tag on your posts in the future, so as to save you the trouble HiPointDem Aug 2012 #9
No SS agents will be bothering neighbors Ineeda Aug 2012 #33
From your keyboard to Dog's PDA. nt DCKit Aug 2012 #65
good god have they no shame whatsoever proud patriot Aug 2012 #4
this. eShirl Aug 2012 #17
The value was recovered by the Rmoneys later..... DeSwiss Aug 2012 #5
He wants to lower his property taxes railsback Aug 2012 #6
Meh, I don't see the big deal SickOfTheOnePct Aug 2012 #7
how about if they use an army of lawyers to work the system... TeamPooka Aug 2012 #10
I don't understand the logic....probably cost him more Fla Dem Aug 2012 #21
It's California, so the assessement can never be higher than the price he paid. Bluenorthwest Aug 2012 #25
As a California property tax payer, I assure you property taxes can and do go up Retrograde Aug 2012 #49
If he's like all the crooked business men I know laundry_queen Aug 2012 #85
I just filled out a form and it dropped 20%... your stupid if you dont do it in this market..n/t Moltisanti Aug 2012 #89
He wants to drive more attention to his taxes??? Is he fucking nuts Raine Aug 2012 #11
He knows he can get away with it because corporate media BlueCaliDem Aug 2012 #28
I was thinking the same thing Rosa Luxemburg Aug 2012 #41
The both of them are rotgut disgusting people. Paka Aug 2012 #13
Oh, Yes, Property Tax Inequality DallasNE Aug 2012 #14
Property tax is determined by the local government Sanity Claws Aug 2012 #16
Just The Opposite DallasNE Aug 2012 #26
Why are you focusing on the state as opposed to locality? Sanity Claws Aug 2012 #29
Wow. Just Wow DallasNE Aug 2012 #50
Are you sure you are on the right site? Sanity Claws Aug 2012 #54
I live in San Diego nadinbrzezinski Aug 2012 #34
All Property Taxes Are Local DallasNE Aug 2012 #39
Not the national stats nadinbrzezinski Aug 2012 #43
If we knew the address, we could see an estimated value on Zillow.com. JDPriestly Aug 2012 #51
325 Dunemere, zip code 92037. There is no way Zillow's estimate will be worth squat. slackmaster Aug 2012 #77
Beachfront -- large beachfront. JDPriestly Aug 2012 #81
Yes. OUr washington state taxes are high compared to what we paid in California. progressivebydesign Aug 2012 #36
Higher Is A Relative Term DallasNE Aug 2012 #47
Wait--you say the Rmoneys paid a lower percentage than the Obamas panader0 Aug 2012 #66
What I called "Savings" For Romney DallasNE Aug 2012 #67
Everyone in California pays a lower percentage in property tax than the Obamas slackmaster Aug 2012 #76
Obama lives in the inner city, hence he pay's more crimson77 Aug 2012 #72
The real issue here is the bald attempt to undervalue it. Gormy Cuss Aug 2012 #15
Prime example of a wealthy anti-government right winger attempting to "bleed the beast" NNN0LHI Aug 2012 #18
Correction: DID call. Hassin Bin Sober Aug 2012 #58
Thanks. I didn't know about that until now NNN0LHI Aug 2012 #75
And he doesn't think it would be a good idea to wait until after the election for this? JHB Aug 2012 #19
Here's Mitten's house Fla Dem Aug 2012 #20
so that house isn't good enough for him? renate Aug 2012 #44
Take A Closer Look DallasNE Aug 2012 #53
I did not notice that. If and it's a big if, he becomes prez, you know that beach front will be Fla Dem Aug 2012 #55
Damn is that beautiful crimson77 Aug 2012 #73
Just a data point - A California property tax reduction of that nature is pretty easy to get, BUT... slackmaster Aug 2012 #22
Here's the thing about rich people--they don't get (or stay) that way by just forking it over TwilightGardener Aug 2012 #23
He really feels he owes this nation nothing. aquart Aug 2012 #24
pay - your - fucking - taxes - asshole rurallib Aug 2012 #27
...and he only pays that which is due, as a good diligent Presidential hopeful should..... Sheepshank Aug 2012 #30
Your evidence? (not holding my breath) Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2012 #32
Local press is not quite impressed nadinbrzezinski Aug 2012 #35
Most people don't hire attorneys to go before the Board of Equalization Sheepshank Aug 2012 #62
People don't stay rich by paying money they don't owe. Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2012 #31
how many people with a 400k house can afford Bluerthanblue Aug 2012 #45
Then the problem is affordable legal representation, not using laws that are there for all. Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2012 #48
Face it. A man with his claimed financial savvy would have known better than JDPriestly Aug 2012 #61
The county needs the revenue to maintain roads and infrastructure in that area. haele Aug 2012 #37
+10000! Bluerthanblue Aug 2012 #46
Here is a home, not even beachfront, built in 96, for 19 million in La Jolla. progressivebydesign Aug 2012 #38
OMG! Rosa Luxemburg Aug 2012 #40
Since 2006, my house's "value" has lost $253K (based on sales in the neighborhood) SoCalDem Aug 2012 #42
Guys, this is NOT a bfd, imo. elleng Aug 2012 #52
If everyone challenged their tax assessment and got it lowered JDPriestly Aug 2012 #63
He tried to lop almost HALF the value off his house inside of the first year he lived there. MADem Aug 2012 #70
I'm with you SickOfTheOnePct Aug 2012 #86
He is the perfect embodiment of a selfish shitheel hifiguy Aug 2012 #56
Amazing. Mitt makes millions off of policies that caused the value to go down louis-t Aug 2012 #57
Rmoney paid more for his house than it's worth? I don't want him spending my money! struggle4progress Aug 2012 #59
Say it loud~ say it often! Bad, bad businessman!! Couldn't see the downturn coming! nt MADem Aug 2012 #71
Two Points On That DallasNE Aug 2012 #82
Oh My..Say it ain't so..Joe...nt Stuart G Aug 2012 #60
Many reasonable and dem voting people file for decline in value musiclawyer Aug 2012 #64
To be fair, once the Romneys move in ashling Aug 2012 #68
What assholes. MADem Aug 2012 #69
Rmoney disgusts me, but this won't be effective as an ecstatic Aug 2012 #74
And this is an excellent example of the 1%'ers consuming government resources. rufus dog Aug 2012 #78
Actually its the smart thing to do magic59 Aug 2012 #79
oh please... the greed in this stinks up the pacific ocean. liberal N proud Aug 2012 #80
But isn't he changing the specs and making the glowing Aug 2012 #83
Looks like Romney is a job creator after all jmowreader Aug 2012 #84
According to Tax Assessors Office mary195149 Aug 2012 #87
So Rmoney paid $12 million for an admittedly $8 million dollar property. No wonder Coyotl Aug 2012 #88

renate

(13,776 posts)
12. I'm just waiting for him to say the same thing, only he would actually mean it
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 03:34 AM
Aug 2012

Or do you think... no, surely the trickle-down theory has been proven accurate over and over again, but could it be... do you think he might just tuck the money away?

No, surely the best way to spend tax dollars is to return them to Mitt's pockets.

 

DCKit

(18,541 posts)
8. That only applies to us little peoples. You know, the ones who actually pay taxes.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:33 AM
Aug 2012

They'll throw every argument in the book out there. They can afford (the lawyers) to do so. Whether or not the city and people of La Jolla are going to buy that raft of BS is another matter. What I can guarantee is that the people on the block behind him aren't looking forward to the Rmoneys building a monstrosity on the beach, from one lot-line to the other, blocking their view of the Pacific and closing down their street every time he decides to visit with the extended family and twice as many SS agents.

Additionally, you've got to wonder how a businessman as savvy as Willard didn't know what kind of property taxes he was going to get hit with when he bought the property. Really makes him look kind of stupid, eh?

But thanks for the lecture on how property taxes work. I've only owned my place for 23 years, so I'm kind of a newbie at all that.

 

HiPointDem

(20,729 posts)
9. you might want to put a sarcasm tag on your posts in the future, so as to save you the trouble
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:35 AM
Aug 2012

of getting snarky with folks who take them at face value as a defense of romney's tax dodge.

Ineeda

(3,626 posts)
33. No SS agents will be bothering neighbors
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:08 AM
Aug 2012

nor will his street be shut down. By the time his monstrosity is built, he'll be a distant and unpleasant footnote. You only get SS protection if you're a presidential candidate or actual president. Not gonna happen.

 

railsback

(1,881 posts)
6. He wants to lower his property taxes
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:08 AM
Aug 2012

by tying up the publicly funded court systems he doesn't want to pay for. Classic.

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
7. Meh, I don't see the big deal
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:08 AM
Aug 2012

My house started losing value about 5 minutes after I bought it, and I've successfully appealed my property assessment every year until this year, when it was much more accurate.

I don't begrudge anyone not wanting to pay more taxes than they owe.

TeamPooka

(24,226 posts)
10. how about if they use an army of lawyers to work the system...
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 03:11 AM
Aug 2012

in his favor in a way that is only possible if you have a tremendous amount of money?

Fla Dem

(23,668 posts)
21. I don't understand the logic....probably cost him more
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 09:54 AM
Aug 2012

in attorney fees, than he ended up saving in taxes. Only saved $109,000 in taxes over the 4 years he's owned the house. That's like a drop in the bucket for him. I also want to know if he'll be just as aggressive in getting his assessment raised when housing values increase.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
25. It's California, so the assessement can never be higher than the price he paid.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 10:08 AM
Aug 2012

No matter how high the value goes, the taxes remain the same as long as they own it even after they die and the kids own it.

Retrograde

(10,136 posts)
49. As a California property tax payer, I assure you property taxes can and do go up
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:10 PM
Aug 2012

A lot of people seem to think that Prop. 13 freezes property taxes: it doesn't. They're allowed to go up 2% every year, and the counties make sure they do. Properties can also be reassessed if major improvements -such as a new, larger building or maybe a car garage - are made. Then there are special assessments such as water district fees and parcel taxes that get stuck on on top.

If there is a major real estate crash owners can petition to be reassessed at the new market rate, but once the market picks up to where it was so do their taxes.

laundry_queen

(8,646 posts)
85. If he's like all the crooked business men I know
Tue Aug 7, 2012, 03:39 AM
Aug 2012

he probably didn't pay a dime in legal fees. It was probably all returned favors for other things. I'll scratch your back you scratch mine is their motto. And yeah, they do mix personal and business. Every chance they get.

Raine

(30,540 posts)
11. He wants to drive more attention to his taxes??? Is he fucking nuts
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 03:33 AM
Aug 2012

he's like a criminal who keeps leaving clues because he actually wants to get caught.

Paka

(2,760 posts)
13. The both of them are rotgut disgusting people.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 03:50 AM
Aug 2012

They are so privileged we should never question them. After all "you people" are just not in the same league with them. God forbid that Ann would have to mix with the "nail ladies."

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
14. Oh, Yes, Property Tax Inequality
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 04:10 AM
Aug 2012

The Romney's paid $110,180 in property taxes in 2011 on a home valued at $10 million.
The Obama's paid $27,000 in property taxes on a home valued at $1.65 million.

Had the Romney's paid at the same rate as the Obama's their property taxes would have been $163,600, or a savings of $53,420 for the Romney's.

Had the Romney's paid at the same rate as I pay on my home their property taxes would have been $269,230, or a savings of $159,050 for the Romney's.

My methodology was to use a simple percent the taxes paid were of the assessed value of the home. In the Romney's case it was 1.102%, the Obama's 1.636% and mine are 2.692%.

What this shows is the gross disparity in property taxes as home values increase. It is highly regressive in nature and reflects again the power the wealthy have to avoid their fair share of taxes, no matter whether it is income or property taxes. It is highly rigged and anything but based on one's ability to pay.

*edited to change fat finger in subject line.

Sanity Claws

(21,848 posts)
16. Property tax is determined by the local government
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 06:37 AM
Aug 2012

LaJolla taxes at a higher rate than Chicago.

That story is told throughout the country.

It is not that the wealthier property is taxed more than the poorer property.

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
26. Just The Opposite
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 10:17 AM
Aug 2012

California property taxes are dirt cheap in comparison to other States. Illinois is 50% more expensive and where I live is 250% more expensive.

Sanity Claws

(21,848 posts)
29. Why are you focusing on the state as opposed to locality?
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:00 AM
Aug 2012

The locality imposes additional taxes.

Your comparison of state vs. state tax is meaningless. If the state tax is low, it makes sense that the local government imposes a higher tax to get the revenue it needs. California law explicitly provides for the addition of voter approved local bonds to property taxes.

BTW, unlike you, I don't feel any pity for Romney and what he pays in real estate taxes. If he doesn't like the tax rate there, he can leave. If he wants the same tax rate as Obama, he can relocate to Chicago.

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
50. Wow. Just Wow
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:12 PM
Aug 2012

I spelled it out quite clearly, even explaining the methodology, and somehow it just went over your head --- zoom.

Sanity Claws

(21,848 posts)
54. Are you sure you are on the right site?
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:37 PM
Aug 2012

You're insulting and are concerned about the Romneys.

BTW, who cares about your methodology? Why should I waste my time trying to figure out some idiosyncratic thing you created to favor the Romneys?

The fact remains that property taxes are local. You can't compare Romney's real estate taxes with Obama's because they are in different states and cities.

I suggest you find a site that's more friendly to the Romneys and their money.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
34. I live in San Diego
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:24 AM
Aug 2012

The taxes are determined by the County, and are considered among the highest. They are not done at the state level.

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
39. All Property Taxes Are Local
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:45 AM
Aug 2012

Everybody knows that. But there are city, county and school district componets and this contributes to the regressive nature of the property tax. What I was saying it that the property taxes in the area where Romeny lives are dirt cheap in comparison to where either Obama or I live and the math proves it.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
43. Not the national stats
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 12:08 PM
Aug 2012

But that's ok.

That said, they are highly regressive.

Also, realize Obama is one property. This is number what...six or seven for the romneys.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
77. 325 Dunemere, zip code 92037. There is no way Zillow's estimate will be worth squat.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 08:14 PM
Aug 2012

Even Freddie Mac's Home Value Explorer chokes on that property.

I haven't looked at Zillow, but any figure it gives will not be reliable.

ETA OK, I looked. Zillow values it at almost $16 million which is not only much more than the Romneys paid, it's a lot more than any nearby home.

progressivebydesign

(19,458 posts)
36. Yes. OUr washington state taxes are high compared to what we paid in California.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:36 AM
Aug 2012

But it also varies by County, too. Each County has it's own formula. And you can be damn sure that La Jolla will be higher.

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
47. Higher Is A Relative Term
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 12:30 PM
Aug 2012

Yes the dollar amount of taxes is higher in La Jolla but the tax rate is lower and that is what the math proves and it is the rate that determines the regressive nature of property taxes. And that is why Republicans always go after tax rates to protect the wealthy, even to the extreme by dividing income into categories with each category having a different rate. Because of this just about all taxes are now regressive rather than progressive based on the ability to pay and they hit the middle class the hardest. And it is one of the main reasons that the super wealthy continue to gain share in the national wealth -- they simply don't pay their fair share.

panader0

(25,816 posts)
66. Wait--you say the Rmoneys paid a lower percentage than the Obamas
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 03:36 PM
Aug 2012

and then say they would have saved money by paying at Obama's higher percentage? What?

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
67. What I called "Savings" For Romney
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 04:13 PM
Aug 2012

Was the difference between using the rate Obama paid and the rate Romney actually paid times the assessed value of Romney's home. In other words Romney saved money by not paying at Obama's higher percentage.

 

crimson77

(305 posts)
72. Obama lives in the inner city, hence he pay's more
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 06:55 PM
Aug 2012

While La Jolla is in San Diego country it is far enough away to be considered a suburb. You choose to live in a city you pay higher taxes.

Gormy Cuss

(30,884 posts)
15. The real issue here is the bald attempt to undervalue it.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 04:16 AM
Aug 2012

There's no question that the Romneys bought at or near the top of the market and the value has declined. What's sick about this is they hired lawyers and appraisers to lowball it and kept appealing thinking that they'd wear down the county.

The county did reduce the value on a much more conservative schedule, probably because they know that beachfront property wasn't losing value the way inland properties were in San Diego county.

If the real estate market recovers while the Romneys own the property they will ultimately benefit thanks to Prop. 13, which caps the assessed value based on purchase price +2% annual increase for the existing dwelling square footage.

NNN0LHI

(67,190 posts)
18. Prime example of a wealthy anti-government right winger attempting to "bleed the beast"
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 07:52 AM
Aug 2012

This is the same person who would call complaining every day about their neighborhood not receiving enough police patrols.

Don

Hassin Bin Sober

(26,328 posts)
58. Correction: DID call.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:32 PM
Aug 2012

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/07/garden/mitt-romney-the-candidate-next-door.html?pagewanted=all

Mr. Romney and his wife take regular walks around La Jolla, exchanging pleasantries with fellow strollers and occasionally enforcing the law. A young man in town recalled that Mr. Romney confronted him as he smoked marijuana and drank on the beach last summer, demanding that he stop.

The issue appears to be a recurring nuisance for the Romneys. Mr. Quint, who lives on the waterfront near Mr. Romney, said that a police officer had asked him, on a weekend when the candidate was in town, to report any pot smoking on the beach. The officer explained to him that “your neighbors have complained,” Mr. Quint recalled. “He was pretty clear that it was the Romneys.”

JHB

(37,160 posts)
19. And he doesn't think it would be a good idea to wait until after the election for this?
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 08:01 AM
Aug 2012

At least he doesn't hide his priorities (very well).

God forbid he so much as delay working the system to cut his taxes as much as he can get away with.

Fla Dem

(23,668 posts)
20. Here's Mitten's house
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 09:48 AM
Aug 2012
http://www.zillow.com/homes/311-Dunemere-Drive-92037_rb/

Once on site, click on address to see pics of interior, also sales history and taxes paid. This is the house he wants to demolish and rebuild with car elevators.






renate

(13,776 posts)
44. so that house isn't good enough for him?
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 12:10 PM
Aug 2012

He couldn't be happy vacationing in a place like that? No wonder he can't understand how "you people" live.

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
53. Take A Closer Look
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:22 PM
Aug 2012

At the Zillow link and you will notice that there are only 6 homes where the property line includes the actual beach, meaning the beach is private. All of the other homes are beachfront but the property line ends rather abruptly where the beach starts meaning the beach itself is public. That alone should add a great deal of value to those 6 homes, Romney's included.

Fla Dem

(23,668 posts)
55. I did not notice that. If and it's a big if, he becomes prez, you know that beach front will be
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:42 PM
Aug 2012

off limits to the public. Sticking it to the little people again.

 

crimson77

(305 posts)
73. Damn is that beautiful
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 06:57 PM
Aug 2012

Love the architecture, love the landscape, right on the beach ......yes please.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
22. Just a data point - A California property tax reduction of that nature is pretty easy to get, BUT...
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 09:57 AM
Aug 2012

...it's temporary. The rate can go back up very quickly to its previous maximum level once the market recovers. That is, increases from the reduced point are not subject to the 2% annual increase imposed by Proposition 13.

I know several people who have had their property tax temporarily reduced.

http://www.sdcounty.ca.gov/cob/aab/index.html

ETA fuck Romney for building another monstrosity in the quiet beach community of my youth.

TwilightGardener

(46,416 posts)
23. Here's the thing about rich people--they don't get (or stay) that way by just forking it over
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 10:04 AM
Aug 2012

like the rest of us. They will sometimes pay as much in lawyer/accountant fees as they recover in any sort of successful challenge--but they must still try, because it's their nature to never overlook a chance to get the best deal possible for themselves. I know this for a fact.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
30. ...and he only pays that which is due, as a good diligent Presidential hopeful should.....
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:04 AM
Aug 2012

Last edited Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:48 PM - Edit history (1)

...as soon as his attorneys are done badgering and threatening the County Tax Assessor.

Bernardo de La Paz

(49,001 posts)
32. Your evidence? (not holding my breath)
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:07 AM
Aug 2012
...as soon as his attorneys are done badgering and threatening the County Tax Assessor.


I doubt you have a shred of evidence for your libelous assertion. If you have a shred, post it.
 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
35. Local press is not quite impressed
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:30 AM
Aug 2012

I mean very local press..not the Manchester owned union Trib. Stories have run in both the La Jolla Times and the North County Times of Romey's less than stellar relationship with both county and city. You know how to use the google, use it. He's also less than impressed the neighbors.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
62. Most people don't hire attorneys to go before the Board of Equalization
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:50 PM
Aug 2012

to appeal property taxes.

There is no other reason to hire attorneys than to assert legal heavy handedness....I consider that badgering and the use of financial threat.

Bernardo de La Paz

(49,001 posts)
31. People don't stay rich by paying money they don't owe.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:06 AM
Aug 2012

If the assessment was overdone and there are legal remedies, only a fool would not pursue them.

It's no different from the guy with $400k house that loses $100k in value.

If either one didn't try to get their money back (it is after all originally their money), then jackasses here would be calling them stupid.

Bluerthanblue

(13,669 posts)
45. how many people with a 400k house can afford
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 12:19 PM
Aug 2012

the kinds of legal reps that Romney does?

Romney's filthy rich station in life- (filthy rich because he stoops to immoral lengths to maintain and grow his booty)- affords him power and advantages over other people who work a hell of a lot harder than he ever has, simply to make ends meet.



People who ARE rich, stay rich by exploiting their power and manipulating systems to benefit themself.

He has the money, it will not hurt him to pay his fair share, but he isn't willing to play by the rules that the average person has to.

THAT is what is wrong with this.

If you don't get that, you really don't get it.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
61. Face it. A man with his claimed financial savvy would have known better than
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:47 PM
Aug 2012

to buy at the height of the market. Now I have interesting questions.

Did Romney pay cash?

If not, has he obtained relief on his loan?

If so, is he suing the sellers for fraud?

Why would a man who claims to be such a good businessman, so good and clever in fact, that he can lead the country to prosperity, overpay on this house to the point that he has had to ask for tax relief?

Why was he so foolish as to overpay for the house in the first place?

haele

(12,654 posts)
37. The county needs the revenue to maintain roads and infrastructure in that area.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 11:39 AM
Aug 2012

He's cheating his neighbors by not paying his fair share of the price of the community assets. $109,000 lower taxes for a $12,000,000+ home? Between the ammended appeals, I wonder how they're determining the assessment losses. One thing to remember, if he gets his assessment lowered, he recoveres the taxes plus interest on the excess from the time of the re-assessment. So not only will he get his $109K or whatever "per year" he's requesting, he'll get an additional $5K or so from the county in interest. So that will be an additional $15K or so he'll get paid for the humiliation the county put him through asking him to pay property taxes he could well afford. (Two years after the county messed up my property taxes in 2001 when I sold my house, I recieved the $530 overpayment for that year back plus an additional $53 or so in interest.)

In San Diego county, the greatest losses in value occured between the $500,000 and $2,000,000 range - that was the range the flippers generally operated in. Houses above and below those ranges did not lose as much as they weren't pumped up as much for the suckers - err, middle class buyers.
There is also the value associated with the historical value of the property; if it were lived in by someone famous or had a famous architect design it, that creates a greater value for the assessment.

I doubt the house has actually lost more than 15%, and the county assessor will probably only give them a 10% loss; just because there is no market for that type of property during those years doesn't mean it lost value.

What I suspect is that they are attempting to force a lower assessment so they avoid paying the significant increase in their property taxes after they make equally significant improvements to the property; so instead of turning a $12 mill. home (or probably more accurately, a $10 mil home) into a $18 mil. or $20 mil. home, they want to claim they're turning a $7.5 mil. home into a $12 mil. home.

I do question whether or not the Romneys intend re-assess that property every year to properly pay the amount of taxes, be they more or less, instead of, as I suspect, only the years where they think they can get a tax break - and not request a re-assessment during the years where their property increases in value.

It's not like they care make investments in their neighborhoods. If the quality of the local infrastructure goes down far enough, they'll just unload the house for a loss and walk away without a qualm.


Haele

SoCalDem

(103,856 posts)
42. Since 2006, my house's "value" has lost $253K (based on sales in the neighborhood)
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 12:06 PM
Aug 2012

and yet MY taxes have not gone down.

Maybe Mittens could intervene for us

elleng

(130,908 posts)
52. Guys, this is NOT a bfd, imo.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:20 PM
Aug 2012

We'd all do the same thing. Big difference between us is value of his property, of course.

This is what he does, and if our main problem with him is that he takes advantage of tax laws, its OUR problem. IMO.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
63. If everyone challenged their tax assessment and got it lowered
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:57 PM
Aug 2012

like Romney did, then we would have to raise the tax rate. The government has to have the money.

Schwarzenegger ran on the platform that he would find the waste in California's government and get rid of it and balance our financial situation. He could not find enough waste. There just wasn't much waste in the first place.

That governments spend too much money is a myth. What costs so much is our military and police expenditures. And we are such a violent and jealous society that we can't save that much on police.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
70. He tried to lop almost HALF the value off his house inside of the first year he lived there.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 06:51 PM
Aug 2012

It speaks to his avarice, frankly.

It may not be a "bfd," but it is suggestive of his character, or lack thereof.

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
86. I'm with you
Tue Aug 7, 2012, 05:03 AM
Aug 2012

I just don't see the big deal. I've done the same thing, (much smaller home, obviously), because I'm not interested in paying more taxes than I should have to based on the value of my home. This past year, as values have risen some, my assessment was much more in line with reality, and I left it alone.

If he paid taxes on the real value rather than on the inflated assessed value, then he paid his fair share, period, just like I did.

 

hifiguy

(33,688 posts)
56. He is the perfect embodiment of a selfish shitheel
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 01:52 PM
Aug 2012

with zero self-awareness. Jeebus, that is chutzpah.

louis-t

(23,295 posts)
57. Amazing. Mitt makes millions off of policies that caused the value to go down
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:19 PM
Aug 2012

then wants a tax break cuz the value went down.

DallasNE

(7,403 posts)
82. Two Points On That
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 10:08 PM
Aug 2012

When Romney bought in 2008 housing prices had been in decline for a year so he did not buy at the top. Yes, it has lost more value since Romney bought it, but still.

Beachfront property is not subject to the same price swings as other property so the risk for Romney was not as great. Also, Romney only wanted the land. The house had negative value to Romney since he has always planned on tearing it down. Lastly, it is but one of a hand-full of properties where the beach is private land. For other beachfront property in the area the ajoining beach is public.

musiclawyer

(2,335 posts)
64. Many reasonable and dem voting people file for decline in value
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 02:59 PM
Aug 2012

with their local county assessor when in fact the property tax bill is based on a valuation that is now highte than market because of overall decline.

To some people, even a few hundred dollar a year in saving makes it worth their time to show up at the appeal board hearing and prove up what they think is the new lower market value around the time of the lien year in question. ( In case you wanted to know, you can use any closed comps you want before the the particular lien date( Jan. 1) or any comps that closed within three months after Jan 1).

But here the point is that Romney is so out of touch and tone deaf that he has no idea how it looks to regular folks that a billionaire running for POTUS is penny pinching. The optics of this are really bad.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
69. What assholes.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 06:48 PM
Aug 2012

I own a shitbox worth nothing up in northern Maine. I could easily and successfully challenge the assessment of the property if I had a mind. I don't, because I'm not interested in saving a few bucks at the cost of schoolbooks, winter road plowing, repair of the water/sewer lines, or pothole filling. The town doesn't waste money, they're frugal. They have a small enough tax base as it is. I'd rather be a part of the solution than part of the problem, even though I could use the savings I might garner--I'm not rich, not by a long shot. I'm just cheap and don't spend money stupidly. Sometimes, a tax payment means a lot to a community, and this is one of those cases.

Mittsy and Annie are simply cheap, miserable turds. The idiots bought themselves a Beanie Baby House. When everyone was going nuts buying dramatically overpriced houses, they jumped on the bandwagon....now they're crying because it ain't worth what they paid for it. Too bad. I hope the assessor tells them to shove it up their gold plated asses if they try this again.

The truth is, when you pay CASH for such an over-the-top, luxury house smack dab on the beach, it's worth what you paid for it. Same way if you buy that stupid Beanie Baby you just "have" to have.

But ya know what's really funny? Mittsy's supposed to be such a sharp businessman...why did he allow himself to be "taken" in such a lousy real estate deal? Or was living next door to one of his best buddies all THAT important to him?

Just another brick in the wall. What a complete lack of character these soulless bastards have.

ecstatic

(32,704 posts)
74. Rmoney disgusts me, but this won't be effective as an
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 07:31 PM
Aug 2012

attack line. A lot of people--from all income levels-- attempted to get their taxes lowered after their homes lost value.

The key is to bring up things Rmoney has done that the rest of us can't do:

Most of us can't just pay zero income taxes based on so called losses.

Most of us pay taxes at a rate higher than 13.9%.

Most of us don't have multiple homes in multiple states.

Most of us can't lie about where we live to run for office in another state.

Most of us don't have offshore bank accounts.

The list goes on and on...

 

rufus dog

(8,419 posts)
78. And this is an excellent example of the 1%'ers consuming government resources.
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 08:14 PM
Aug 2012

Us little people don't pull this stuff, nor do we use the court systems except for minor traffic offenses.

They consume massive amount of resources through appeals, numerous court cases, SEC filing, etc, and expect us to pick up the bill.

 

magic59

(429 posts)
79. Actually its the smart thing to do
Mon Aug 6, 2012, 08:33 PM
Aug 2012

Its just good business to request tax reduction after property value declines and they did decline in a big way. My property is assessed at twice its value yet have been unable to get it adjusted. Maybe I will lawyer up like Mitt.

 

glowing

(12,233 posts)
83. But isn't he changing the specs and making the
Tue Aug 7, 2012, 12:25 AM
Aug 2012

home bigger.. Along with the car elevator? So, how does or when would that factor in? I assume to build up the property the contractors must file with the city and have inspections to the property.

His neighbors are already pisses off he's going bigger and blocking beach Accra/ views, there by diminishing others around him property value. Plus he's claiming the property isn't as valuable; while that may save some property tax for him, he is also bringing the neighborhood values down.

Now, imagine he actually wins/ steals te election.... Even more neighbors will be pisses at him for jamming their high end street with secret service and pool reporters.

Mitt, making enemies every where he goes, all to save tax money he can easily afford and the state of CA needs. What a jack ass!

BTW, which state does he claim he lives in anyway? Is he voting in MA because he's living in his son's unfinished basement (guess Mitt and the Wife are re-limit their "poor days" like back in college where he had to cash in stock options for living. Or one of his many other homes he has for himself? Does Mitt even know where his residence is.. Or will he fly to multiple states to vote in each polling site and commit fraud.

jmowreader

(50,557 posts)
84. Looks like Romney is a job creator after all
Tue Aug 7, 2012, 03:23 AM
Aug 2012

It seems La Jolla is going to need at least one full-time employee to handle all Mitt W. Romney's frivolous filings and appeals.

mary195149

(379 posts)
87. According to Tax Assessors Office
Tue Aug 7, 2012, 03:03 PM
Aug 2012

Romney's annual real estate taxes for this year are $96,844. He has already received a reduced amount on his taxes as he is paying on a value of $8,700,000. He paid $12,000,000 sale price for the home. California has a 1% base tax rate which would bring that to $120,000 + another .112% for Local (La Jolla) tax. If values have not dropped, his tax bill should of been $133,440. He now has a savings of $36,596.This reduced amount is temporary and good for the present year. When prices go back up, so will his taxes. His tax base will go back to being based on the original sales price of the home with a possible 2% increase yearly.

Of course, when he builds his new home, San Diego will reassess the value of his home at that time.
I'm in the real estate business and have researched these numbers with accuracy.

 

Coyotl

(15,262 posts)
88. So Rmoney paid $12 million for an admittedly $8 million dollar property. No wonder
Tue Aug 7, 2012, 08:47 PM
Aug 2012

he feels a need to reduce his taxes.

He just lost 4 million dollars on his own decision. And he wants poor people to vote for him!

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