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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThat preacher at the wedding is too long winded. eom
Last edited Sat May 19, 2018, 10:28 AM - Edit history (1)
madaboutharry
(40,224 posts)mfcorey1
(11,001 posts)Hortensis
(58,785 posts)these days that he focused most heavily on the teachings of Jesus. When it comes to politics, religious conservatives, in many nations and definitely here, seem to have compartmentalized religious principles well away from political choices. And these days conservative politics seem to be infesting almost everything, very much including corrupting religion itself.
Coincidence that he took this opportunity to speak to a billion people about doing right?
demtenjeep
(31,997 posts)he flat out told them to love others before them.
Some of the stuffy royals needed to hear that
d_r
(6,907 posts)BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)As part of the Anglican liturgy, it includes a Homily (sermon), which is what he just completed.
samnsara
(17,640 posts)...funny watching all the royals squirm. I think Charles is asleep.
BannonsLiver
(16,470 posts)snowybirdie
(5,240 posts)Meghan is embracing her heritage and taking out royal stuffiness! Love the choir too.
mfcorey1
(11,001 posts)a wedding! Her heritage is the beautiful part of her and the message was about love which is generic to all people who embrace it.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Her father was Episcopal, but she had to covert to CoE regardless before the wedding.
Note that the Episcopal Church is the Anglican / Church of England in the US.
But someone said her heritage, so I wondered if she was Episcopalian as a child.
My parents are English. I was christened there and was attended Episcopal church as a child.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Great speaker, but the Industrial Revolution?
NCjack
(10,279 posts)SoCalDem
(103,856 posts)I switched over to HBO's comedy wedding coverage until the wedding started back up..
Siwsan
(26,295 posts)I thought his addition was a wonderful touch.
MariaCSR
(642 posts)That's how they do it. I thought it was incredible. He was preaching! Amen.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)this wedding, of course. And a gospel choir at a royal wedding. I think they did it wonderfully right.
Of course some will think it's too long, even those who actually flipped channels but want to complain about this couple's wedding choices anyway. This is the fast-forward era, short attention span era, after all.
redstatebluegirl
(12,265 posts)Also loved seeing people squirm who had never heard a real sermon delivered with passion! Great sermon!
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Good thing it wasn't first Sunday
SallyHemmings
(1,823 posts)MariaCSR
(642 posts)nitpicker
(7,153 posts)He was NOT the main celebrant at the event.
It was not billed as a "black gospel wedding".
So why did he portray non-white clergy in such a light?
I think his ego got in the way.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)He was actually pretty understated compared with many black ministers.
Harry and Meghan surely were familiar with his style and message and his homily was no doubt approved, practiced, and timed in advance.
But how does anything he said or did put any other black clergy in a bad light?
It's all good.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)when he was told the couple wanted him to be the key speaker at their wedding.
Those not used to long sermons and who don't happen to care for his joyous style might be happier with his politics? He's progresssive and an activist for civil rights, including LGBT. His Episcopal Church is in hot water with its larger, more conservative coalition for changing its service for same-sex marriages.
Yet another all good message.
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)Being Episcopal, his homily was pretty "staid" compared to some Baptist sermons. I'm sure you have heard many famous black "preachers" highlighted over the years (MLK, Jesse Jackson, etc), and this was nowhere near that because "black gospel weddings" as you so term them, would be call and response during a sermon.
And note, he is the Presiding Bishop (titular head) of the Episcopal Church USA.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Now THAT would have made this wedding pop!
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)we have some call and response - although the other big jumping black Episcopal church here in the city goes full on.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)My great aunt used to fall out every Sunday right at the same point in the sermon. When we were kids, we would wait for it - better than going to the movies.
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)At least it wasn't hot all up in there in that cathedral-size "chapel". Here, you'd have the ladies getting the hand fans out and whatnot. I know they had to finally replace the AC in our old building a bunch of years ago because the big ceiling fans weren't cutting it.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)And have their "pocket" calendar in your purse (my mother always got her little calendar from the funeral home every year).
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)when I was little.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)MicaelS
(8,747 posts)A black church and be preached to by a black pastor. The differences between black and white pastors is striking. Frankly, I am 60 yr old white man, and would rather listen to the average black pastor, than the average white one. Black pastors just seemed to be filled with more of the Holy Spirit than white ones.
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)And the bride and groom seemed to love it, which is all that mattered.
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)Philip paid rapt attention and was in awe. The man will be 97 years old next month!
Brother Buzz
(36,469 posts)I was lying in bed, listening to it on the radio and grew tired of it quickly. I was to lazy to change the station so I started listening and began to enjoy what he was saying, and that was without a cup of Joe in me.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)Had it not been him it would have been some boring white Brit droning on about something for the same 15 minutes or so.
He gave a good inclusive message and brought something from the brides heritage into a 1000 year institution.
I am sure some there were uncomfortable about it. Good.
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)racist...not saying you...This man is not Baptist...and if you think this is a Baptist service well, it is not. People of all colors go to the Episcopal church. I thought he did a fine job...you should have seen my Episcopal wedding...it took almost two hours.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)I was responding to those who said he spoke to long. That was his job. To deliver the homily. At least I think thats what Episcopalians call it. The part of the service that in the Baptist church would be called the sermon. And I should have noted that I am no longer Baptist, nor really Christian for that matter.
That gentleman delivered a powerful message about love. The lack of that kind of message is what drove me from the Baptist church and religion all together.
Again, I apologize that my meaning was a veiled by poor writing.
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)was. Please accept my apologies. The Episcopal church is know for their long services so it does seem lengthy those not accustomed to it.
Kittycow
(2,396 posts)I was hanging on every word, thinking back and forth between romantic love and the lack of love for the common good exhibited by many in the US.
I'm also used to boring Catholic sermons that drone on, so that's my frame of reference.
T_i_B
(14,749 posts)I also thought the ceremony was an interesting mix of high and low church Protestantism.
Some might have me down as a little odd for thinking about the theological implications of a royal wedding, but it's all part of the history and significance of such things. Be it Henry VIII, John Knox, the English Civil War, Oliver Cromwell, the Restoration and the Glorious Revolution.
MaryMagdaline
(6,856 posts)Do Anglicans play Ave Maria in church or was this a nod to inclusiveness?
I know DU has musical and religious historians on board
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)because it is all about "the smells and the bells".
My church is Anglo-Catholic Episcopal (also known as "High Episcopal" ), is almost Catholic in terms of the service except no Pope or Mary-worship, although we do have a Lady (Mary) Altar. We have 14 stations of the cross on the pillars (instead of 12) and Confessional boxes in the back.
MaryMagdaline
(6,856 posts)Princess Di's brother made the sign of the cross at her funeral. None of my Protestant friends knew if this is s common thing among Anglicans.
Do Anglicans make the sign if the cross?
Do American Episcopalians make the sign of the cross?
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)You nod when the name "Jesus" is mentioned and bow when the procession with the cross comes down the aisle... and you make the sign of the cross when -
1.) You dip into some Holy Water and make a sign of the cross with the droplets as you enter the church aisle
2.) You are facing the high altar and genuflect before going into the pew
3.) Whenever the priests says - "In the name of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit (or "Ghost" depending on version)"
Believe it or not, the Church of England is generally considered "low" church nowadays. But then the whole concept of "church" was always baked into their original governance where it is separate in the U.S.
I did finally catch the beginning of the BBC replay (that I had missed) and they mentioned the invitations had indicated that guests (females) should wear "day dresses and hats". And traditionally, you covered your head with something (veil/hat) when in church and I know for (older) Catholics, that is a biggy and for many black churches of any denomination, that is an expectation.
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)the family service at 10:30.
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)"Low Mass" and "High Mass". Usually there is no Communion at Low Mass and it is a shorter service (I think ours is at 7:30, with High Mass at 10). Of late, they have just been doing the Low Mass during the weekdays.
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)zeusdogmom
(998 posts)Our choir has also sung all of the choral music performed at the wedding. We don't have boy sopranos though.
Guess our congregation is a little on the "high church" side. You should see what's in store for tomorrow - Pentecost.
I thought the service was lovely, the sermon rocked and so did the gospel choir. Even the congregational singing was good.
MaryMagdaline
(6,856 posts)BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)but I expect that was only done for the family out of sight. Thus somewhat "low" church - but then I think because of the circumstances, they have to do it that way.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Did they do that in previous royal weddings?
BumRushDaShow
(129,543 posts)The logistics would be too much (although the Catholics manage to do it for thousands by having literally hundreds of priests and deacons walking around with chalices and hosts).
Plus they didn't show an "offering" but I expect they bake that in there somewhere too in a different fashion.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)underpants
(182,904 posts)WillowTree
(5,325 posts)I enjoyed every minute of it.
WhiteTara
(29,722 posts)You get to change the channel.
mfcorey1
(11,001 posts)Some thought he did and some thought he didn't. My channel stayed where it was. Now you might have rudely changed your channel but I endured.
WhiteTara
(29,722 posts)sorry that's how it came out. I confess, I didn't watch any of it, but I did see the hats on AM Joy and they were priceless!
TomSlick
(11,110 posts)There should have been an altar call after.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)raging moderate
(4,311 posts)That was what the timeline indicated on the little video I saw. It seemed okay to me. And he did a great job! (except he mispronounced the name of Teilhard de Chardin-eh, bien!).
mn9driver
(4,428 posts)I can tell you that this one had two levels. On one level, it was a wedding homily about love.
But on a deeper level, which is the way he preaches, it was actually quite political. The US Episcopal Church is currently on probation with the worldwide Anglican communion. This is because we have welcomed EVERYONE into the US Episcopal church, at every level, from congregants to Bishops. All you have to do is commit to the two great commandments.
Many Christian denominations arent ok with that. Including the Church of England.
OldHippieChick
(2,434 posts)nothing to do w/ race. Cowboy churches (notoriously white) will go on for hours. Many protestant ministers/pastors give sermons of length and they are repetitious as they wish to make their point. It was stated that the Crown is based upon the Church and that the service would be heavily Christian. This is a marriage before God, not a civil ceremony. I thought he was a masterful orator. The only one seeming to be lost was Camilla.
lame54
(35,326 posts)They must long and hard to find him
mulsh
(2,959 posts)that the young couple chose better than than they knew.
Since studying de Chardin's works in my Catholic High School religion classes I've long maintain that modern philosophy eventually comes down to de Chardin.( The church censored his works but the good Christian Brothers made sure we were well versed.)
Besides it was some added Afro-American culture the royals and all of us can benefit from.
Demsrule86
(68,696 posts)I am an Episcopalian and he is a wonderful man...proud that he is there.
Judi Lynn
(160,631 posts)The people there certainly didn't have anything else they intended to do, they were there for the entire event.
Why not just ease off your criticism. It wasn't actually designed to please you, but to fit the occasion, address the elements involved, etc.
I trust the man knew what he was doing. I certainly could afford to take the time to listen to him.
To attack him just might be out of place.
Alethia Merritt
(147 posts)However, messages of hate like "LOCK HER UP" and "WITCH HUNT" tend to make their mark quickly and are readily absorbed.
"Love thy neighbor as thy self" takes longer, especially when one is trying to block it out.
Judi Lynn
(160,631 posts)Some can hear it, some won't.
Thank you, so much.
Welcome to D.U., Alethia Merritt.
raging moderate
(4,311 posts)That's how long the tape ran, and it showed the sermon start to finish. I thought it was lovely!
MustLoveBeagles
(11,636 posts)He was one of the highlights, so was the choir. I went to gospel service many years ago. This was understated and streamlined by comparison. Not everyone will like it. YMMV.
Raine
(30,540 posts)for the vows BUT I listened when it was repeated and it was a terrific sermon, very uplifting, inspirational and really special!
mfcorey1
(11,001 posts)conclusion. I later understood that it was actually supposed to be a sermon instead of just comments. I was unfamiliar with a sermon at a wedding. My bad!
3catwoman3
(24,054 posts)I listened to it again during the recaps. And I'm not even traditionally religious at all.