Enuff with pro/con Bernie threads. We have to focus on November!

[tavernier]

I understand that many here love Bernie and an equal number don’t, but right now we are in crisis mode and we need our attention to focus on getting our candidates elected in November, and how we are going to do it. Organization and idea sharing should be our mission at this point. As it is, there are ppl here who don’t have our best interests at heart and who try to distract daily. Let’s not help them.

Thank you, and Go Blue Wave!

[Chemisse]

1. Divisiveness is beneficial - to the other side! Think Bluenami! n/t

[tavernier]

4. Bluenami!!

[Glorfindel]

2. Thanks, tavernier. You have said EXACTLY what needs to be said.

Victory in November should be our number one priority.

[tavernier]

5. # 1!!

[Hortensis]

29. Cook Report just changed the ratings of 13 more districts,

ALL of those changes favoring Democrats.

Cook Report:



Full List of Changes:
CA-21: Valadao (R)
Likely R to Lean R

IA-02: Loebsack (D)
Likely D to Solid D

NV-03: OPEN (Rosen) (D)
Toss Up to Lean D

NV-04: OPEN (Kihuen) (D)
Lean D to Likely D

NJ-03: Tom MacArthur (R)
Likely R to Lean R

NJ-05: Josh Gottheimer (D)
Lean D to Likely D

NY-18: Sean Patrick Maloney (D)
Likely D to Solid D

NC-09: Robert Pittenger (R)
Likely R to Lean R

OH-10: Mike Turner (R)
Solid R to Likely R

WA-03: Jaime Herrera Beutler (R)
Solid R to Likely R

WA-05: Cathy McMorris Rodgers (R)
Likely R to Lean R

WI-07: Sean Duffy (R)
Solid R to Likely R

WV-03: OPEN (Jenkins) (R)
Solid R to Likely R

The good news for Republicans is that President Trump's approval rating has, on balance, ticked up from 38 percent to 40 percent since January as attention has shifted from unpopular GOP proposals on healthcare and taxes to the economy, tariffs and Stormy Daniels. Commensurately, Democrats' lead on the question of which party voters would support for Congress has shrunk from a dozen points in January to about eight points today.

The bad news for Republicans, of course, is that Trump's approval rating is still 40 percent and that they still trail Democrats on the generic ballot by eight points. That's enough to offset the GOP's edge from favorably drawn districts and endanger their 23-seat majority (by our estimate, Democrats would need to win seven to eight percent more votes for House to win 218 of 435 seats).

Moreover, in a reversal from the 2014 midterms, Democrats enjoy a wide voter enthusiasm gap. According to a new CNN/SSRS survey, 51 percent of Democrats and Democratic-leaners said they were "extremely" or "very" enthusiastic about voting in November compared to 36 percent of Republicans/GOP leaners. Young voters, Trump's weakest age segment, also express far more interest in casting ballots than they did four years ago.

If Democrats pick up at least eight Republican open seats (and today, eight of the 36 are leaning their way), they'll already be a third of the way to the 23 they need for a majority. Beyond those, there are 18 Republican incumbents in the Toss Up column and another 20 in the Lean Republican column —- including five in California, three in Texas and three in Virginia. Private partisan polling continues to show most GOP incumbents in much weaker positions than last cycle — even in districts Trump won. ...

Our latest ratings feature 55 competitive seats (Toss Up or Lean Democratic/Republican), including 50 currently held by Republicans and five held by Democrats. There are also three non-competitive seats poised to switch parties thanks to Pennsylvania's new map (PA-05 and PA-06 to Democrats, PA-14 to Republicans). Overall, Democrats would need to win 27 of the 55 competitive races to win a majority. We continue to view Democrats the slight favorites for House control.

http://cookpolitical.com/analysis/house/house-overview/april-house-overview-ratings-changes-13-districts

"If you want to talk the talk
Then you got to walk the walk, baby (ooh-ooh)
Talk the talk
And you got to walk the walk, yeah"

[tavernier]

38. Yes!!! Support them all the way!

Thanks for this!

[democrank]

3. Put the country first

Unite!

[tavernier]

7. Put Country First

Excellent bumper sticker!

[NurseJackie]

6. Agreed! Time to support Democrats. Time to...

... stop smearing and denigrating the Democratic party. Time to stop with the insults of Democratic candidates. The attacks on Democrats and the Democratic party only serve to divide and weaken us. The Democratic party is not a "failure" ... nor are our Democratic Party leaders in any way "feeble". Our great Democratic party is not "ideologically bankrupt" and our Democratic candidates are not "corrupt" and they are not "incompetent".

I think we can all agree that saying such things about Democrats and the Democratic party serves no good purpose.

[rgbecker]

8. I know. It's so hard to not trash a uniting thread isn't it?

[NurseJackie]

48. I wouldn't know about that. I haven't seen any of those recently.

[tavernier]

9. Maybe we should post our candidates in coming months

from each state. Perhaps get a few to post on DU so that we know them better and are inspired to go out and work for them.

[RandomAccess]

10. So, how do you propose that happen?

It's fine to say that, but SOMEONE always starts it, and then lots of people end up joining in. What do you propose happen to stop those SOMEONES who always start it??

[jmbar2]

11. AMEN!!!

These types of posts could very well be coming from Russian trolls. Don't take the bait!

Time to clean house - the White House, the Senate, and the House of Reps! We cannot afford circular firing squads.

[sarcasmo]

12. Bernie needs his own section in Topics. Russian Bernie bots will be back in force come September.

[Tom Rinaldo]

14. Ya think bots only play one side? Quaint n/t

[sarcasmo]

20. Deny all you want, it was obvious here in 2016.

[Tom Rinaldo]

37. Russia always plays both sides off against each other. A case in point for starters:

Russian Trolls Stoked Anger Over Black Lives Matter More Than Was Previously Known
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2018/01/russian-trolls-hyped-anger-over-black-lives-matter-more-than-previously-known/

"...In data collected over a nine-month period ending in October 2016, the UW team found clearly defined left-leaning and right-leaning clusters—about 10,000 accounts in each sphere—tweeting about police shootings and including the three hashtags related to #BlackLivesMatter. Two of the Russian accounts found were among the top 12 most-retweeted accounts overall across all 20,000 accounts. “This suggests that troll content was relatively widely broadcasted in the contexts of this network,” the research team wrote in their findings. “On both sides, we see troll accounts gaining traction in polarized, audience-driven discourse.”

“It’s striking how systematic the trolls were,” says Ahmer Arif, one of the researchers on the study. The operation, he says, was sophisticated enough to exploit both sides: “The content they’re sharing is tailored to align to each audience’s preferences.”

[Demsrule86]

22. Yeah I do. And Mueller said the same thing.

[Tom Rinaldo]

36. Mueller said the Russians wanted to hurt Clinton AND tarnish belief in our Democratic process

Intelligence officials also say that Russia continues to meddle in our Democracy even though Hillary is no longer a candidate for anything. For them it was not just about stopping Clinton. It was and remains about messing with our Democracy. Hurting Clinton at the time (the woman they and virtually every world pundit then assumed would be our next President) involved attacking her from every conceivable angle and promoting any and all conceivable adversaries of her. The Russians were never trying to get Sanders elected. Or Stein or Johnson either. If Biden had run in the primaries and lost the Russians would have used his criticism of Hillary against her also - Biden had plenty of negative things to say about Clinton himself but they weren't weaponized against her by Russia because he didn't run.

There is plenty of evidence that Russian bots play both sides against each other as standard operating procedure because it increases the disillusionment of voters: a desired end goal of the Russians.

[Demsrule86]

43. The Russians supported Sen. Sanders which is not his fault...it is what it is.

WASHINGTON – It turns out Donald Trump wasn’t the only candidate the Russians allegedly tried to help during the 2016 presidential campaign.

"A 37-page indictment resulting from special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation shows that Russian nationals and businesses also worked to boost the campaigns of Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders and Green party nominee Jill Stein in an effort to damage Democrat Hillary Clinton.

The Russians “engaged in operations primarily intended to communicate derogatory information about Hillary Clinton, to denigrate other candidates such as Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio, and to support Bernie Sanders and then-candidate Donald Trump,” according to the indictment, which was issued Friday."

[getagrip_already]

15. they are here now.....

both pro and con. He just needs to drop out of the primaries and we can focus on the future.

[David__77]

32. I do think many more pro-Sanders voices will be here.

Not bots - people posting, like I have since 2001.

[getagrip_already]

13. Sadly, he is a candidate, so he will be discussed.....

If he drops out or publicly says he isn't running, then I'll gladly make this a bs free zone.

But to just keep quiet gives him a free ride to the primaries, and that isn't acceptable.

[Tom Rinaldo]

16. Let's see. The midterms are in seven months

The first primaries are in 22 months. That leaves well over a year between the midterms and the casting of a single ballot for the 2020 presidential nomination race to prevent anyone from "getting a free ride".

Some find it unacceptable to insist on fighting about the primaries and who might be in them now when we have a nation to save in November via our unity.

[getagrip_already]

18. I think we can multitask just fine thanks....

One doesn't block the other. But despite the first ballot being 22 months off, some candidates are already campaigning. They are also saying dumb and divisive things, and should be called out for it.

The fact that the candidate creates such a toxic response is a very good reason they shouldn't run. They won't win the general if nominated. And as inportant as the midterms are, another 4 years of trump is a much more serious threat.

[Demsrule86]

24. He is already in campaign mode.

Thus it needs to be discussed.

[mentalslavery]

17. But I wanna fight the last election!

[Demsrule86]

25. This is about 20.

[marble falls]

19. Amen. Hillary and Bernie aren't fighting, why are we? Hillary and Bernie are out campaigning...

for candidates in state and federal contests all across the US. Why aren't we? 2018 is not clearly in our bag yet. Why is there so much Hillary vs Bernie crap on DU???

[IronLionZion]

21. Or we could run facing backwards and trip and fall face first into the pavement

It would be much better for the GOP if we continue to fight amongst ourselves instead of focusing on the election coming up in 7 months with primaries to select our candidates right now.

There are people here who have divisive interests at heart and know how easy it is to bait liberals.

[Demsrule86]

28. Who provoked the last 'discussion'.

Who went to Mississippi and said stuff about pres. Obama and the Democratic Party? Why should Sen. Sanders say stuff like that and it be unchallenged? If he were were to win the nomination in 20 and I don't think he will, it would be way worse in terms of vetting.

[EffieBlack]

44. I seem to recall a number of posts last week touting Bernie's trip to Jackson as proof of how great

he is on civil rights, etc.

But when he went there and put his foot in it, no one is supposed to talk about it because that's "divisive."

[IronLionZion]

52. Stuff that divides us is divisive

di·vi·sive
dəˈvīsiv/Submit
adjective
tending to cause disagreement or hostility between people.

[EffieBlack]

53. Racism causes division, not the discussion of it

But trying to shut down uncomfortable conversations about race by accusing those of us interested in discussing it is a common tactic among those who want to control and tamp down anything that makes them uncomfortable.

It's also a hallmark of privilege and entitlement to deign to tell others what can and can't be discussed and when and how it can be brought up and to accuse anyone who does not comply with their instructions of causing "division" - something very simple and convenient to do when they believe that the underlying problem does not affect them.

[LSFL]

57. Effie

You are rapidly becoming my hero. Well said as always.

[FailureToCommunicate]

23. Amen x 1000

[The Mouth]

26. Yes, but..

At some point we are going to have to address the underlying issues that Bernie's candidacy brought to a boil, and a few others as well:

-Who/what is a 'Democrat'? Should people who don't put time and effort into building the GOTV infrastructure have a say in the platform or candidates selected for support?

- economic justice- is it the major issue and if not what is? Does racial justice require economic fairness?

- how, or should we address the firearms issue in areas with lots of gun owners and a strong tradition of shooting sports while having a nationwide policy that appeases inner-city and other highly RKBA restrictive areas?

-Is a woman's right to choose an absolute litmus test?

-Should we support 'Democrats' who are obviously beholden to pig pharma/ the M.I.C. or foreign interests? Particularly if their positions are explicitly anti-liberal in regards to their financial concerns?


I agree that the midterms are not the time to rectify these, but any or all can only be pushed under the surface or otherwise ignored for so long.....

You are, however, right- taking back enough seats to derail our trump train to fascism is the first priority.

[Demit]

33. A woman's right to choose is an absolute litmus test, absolutely.

I don't know why you would put a question mark after it.

[The Mouth]

71. *I* Think it is

I think it needs to be explicit. Some don't

https://wtop.com/elections/2017/08/idea-of-democrats-funding-anti-abortion-candidates-draws-ire/

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-democrats-abortion-20170801-story.html

[MaryMagdaline]

27. Good post! We need to be unified

[Nitram]

30. I'd like to agree, but I'm not sure ignoring attacks on the Democratic Party should be ignored.

[David__77]

31. I think, if anything, the amount of Sanders focus will increase.

...

[Tipperary]

34. I am no Bernie fan, but I have noticed there are two people who continually post anti-Bernie

threads. I have no idea why. IMO the guy does not have a chance in hell of being any kind of threat in ‘20.

Posting all these threads about him just give his supporters more reason to sing his praises. Ignore him. He is just history at this point.

[mentalslavery]

35. ohh he'll probably get the nod in 20...but that does not mean anything now

got more immediate problems

[Adrahil]

41. Lol... yeah, no he wont

But he’ll probably drag it out again, damaging the eventual nominee.

[mentalslavery]

45. I don't know...we tend to put up the "next in line" type candidate

but either way it is irrelevant in 18...

[BeyondGeography]

51. It is not about 2020

It’s about the past.

[tavernier]

39. Does anyone know any of Nov Dem candidates personally?

Enough to ask them if they would consider posting a short bio on DU? I think we could get ppl more involved if they knew the candidates.

[MuseRider]

63. I know a few from my state and

people who work here and a few from other states. They are not going to post here, it looks like kindergarten most of the time. They pay little to no attention to this site anymore.

[KTM]

40. But then about 20 people at DU would have nothing to do !!

But hey, you gave some of them something to do today I guess.

[Jim Lane]

42. Dream on.

Your advice is sound, but it's pretty clear from this thread that not everyone will follow it.

[Pluvious]

46. We need to remain vigilant and call out attempts to foment discord

Reply to such efforts with "please stop, you are not being helpful to our Party's goals" and such.

[tavernier]

47. Yup.

Will Rogers... herding cats...etc.

However, even cats know when the house is on fire.

[Trumpocalypse]

49. Thanks

Sometimes it seems more like Bernie Sanders Underground rather than Democratic Underground.

[Awsi Dooger]

50. Wrong...registration numbers are more important than November

Every emphasis should be long term. This is an amazing short-window opportunity to get young first time registrants in fold. That has life long implications for the vast majority of them. College campus registration drives should be topic A-Z on this forum and elsewhere.

Then everything else takes care of itself, in 2018 and beyond.

Notice what Dean Heller said in that speech behind closed doors. He wasn't trying to beef up his GOTV operation. There was no talk about the type of campaign he would run. He told his base that it was all about math, that if the Nevada Republicans managed to get the statewide registration deficit from 59,000 deficit to below 50,000 deficit, then he couldn't lose.

That's the way we should be thinking. It was pathetic how that topic was handled here and on other liberal sites. Everyone was mocking Heller for saying he wanted a low turnout election. That's not what he said at all. It was a matter of fact description of the terrain, that his party tends to participate more heavily in midterms, but that trend wouldn't carry the day unless the bottom line numbers cooperated.

You can't rely on getting this person to the polls or that person to the polls. I worked GOTV in Nevada twice. I was struck by how ridiculous it was. Normalcy is normalcy. On the ground we weren't going to be worth 2% or anything close to that. It was simpleton hogwash rationalization.

But if you swell the registration numbers on your side, and then the typical percentage of your voters turn out in midterms and in presidential years...now you have something.

As I've mentioned, Rachel Maddow can scare the opposition via only one method: Spotlighting those registration drives and doing her show from remote locations, interviewing college kids who registered for the first time. It doesn't even matter what side they are on. In fact, bring on the young Republicans and let them speak freely.

That type of programming would earn widespread attention and Republicans everywhere would be trembling.

But since Maddow is an incompetent handicapper like the rest of our party, she'll continue to babble about very troubling and interesting things from our past that will likely lead absolutely nowhere.

[elocs]

54. Sanders is not a Democrat but he is more than willing to use the party

to further his own ambitions. If he becomes an actual Democrat then maybe his criticism of the party will appear less self serving. Perhaps he could tone it down until after November.
But as a lifelong Democrat I resent when a non-Democrat wants to just use the party as a vehicle for his own ambition to run for president since he is smart enough to understand he could never win as an independent.

[tavernier]

56. I dont care either way. I only care that we take the House

and hopefully the Senate this year, and stop being distracted by all the other stuff.

Focus on the Bluenami!!!!

[davsand]

58. Either side that provokes that sh*t is suspect in my book.

It serves Dems no good to keep fighting about any of that with the midterm looming, but there's ALWAYS energy to either defend it or condemn it. Did anybody ever wonder WHY? Is it possible that keeping that shit riled up serves somebody's purpose? Has it occurred to folks that prolonging that argument does an excellent job of distracting from the serious stuff and it helps keep Dems out of office?



But, by all means, be sure an exercise your right to get suckered in by the trolls and the bots. Absolutely, you need to do that...

[left-of-center2012]

59. One reason the attacks on Bernie need to stop

Bernie Sanders is a member of the Senate's DEMOCRATIC leadership.

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/306336-sanders-named-to-senate-leadership-post

[NurseJackie]

62. ...

[NurseJackie]

64. Nobody is "attacking" him. He's being criticized, that's all.

I believe that's primarily a ceremonial position that means more to you than it does in real life, or even to him.

[bluestarone]

60. I truly like the thought behind your thread.

And i agree, but lots here do not. I for one will only be concerned about MYSELF! I'm a DEM and I know the difference, I will VOTE STRAIGHT DEM!! I will not take part in the division.

[MuseRider]

61. For me

I just stopped responding. In fact, I have almost stopped looking at the Forums because of it. I keep hoping the hatred and those that fan it constantly will go *bzzzzzz* and get clue. It is apparent that even having the same thread posted over and over and over and over and even hidden over and over and over again will not change this. It does not stop until they each have a turn and that is what they are all about. Bots, I do not know what they are bots for but surely they are. They will never chase all the people away. Frankly I do not understand how intelligent people can go on about the same things forever and ever.

Ignore them, even if you don't ignore the person with the button. They are never going to stop and they are never going to be unified with anyone who has a single thread of a different way of thinking. They are disruptive and boring and angry and mean and then THEY call for unity. They are not worth even thinking about tavernier, they are not about winning anything except their petty fights. They are obviously allowed to stay and do this and obviously allowed to stay and continually post the same crap over and over. There is nothing we can do but skip the constant bullshit and realize that even though we may like some of these people and some of what they say they are nevertheless trolling the site. You have to let it go and help others to stop being insulted. Nothing they say is worth fighting about. They are few but disruptive as hell. Notice that the Democrats in office do not feel this way. These people here and their nastiness do not matter.

[mvd]

67. Most of the time I don't respond either

I don't think it's worth it as no minds will be changed. Look, Bernie is not perfect (sometimes I don't think it looks good to change the subject when racism is mentioned), but he means well and remains my favorite major politician. Even though I was not a Hillary supporter in the primaries, I don't feel the need to dig up stuff to bash her. Good post.

[MuseRider]

68. I said my piece about Hillary

a while back and am done with it. She is a private citizen. Like you, Bernie remains my favorite.

At this point I find most good discussion here gets shut down quickly and devolves into kindergarten crap. It is sad.

We are never going to be cardboard cutouts of one type of liberal and trying to make that happen will make us just like the R's that we abhor. Whatever, I do not think it is going to change here until the people who are doing this are ignored and end up burning themselves up screaming at the walls.

[ecstatic]

65. I think Tom Perez needs to get involved, and quickly.

He needs to tell Bernie to STFU or at least help him to update his tired and divisive stump speeches. Bernie is the only person dividing the party right now! We cannot have another 2016-like disaster!!

[NurseJackie]

66. Many people share your feelings.

[tavernier]

69. Well, I did get a smidgen of positive input before it all unraveled.

It’s harder to reach the shore when swimming against the current, but perhaps the wave will carry us in.

[democrank]

70. Keep swimming in spite of the sharks.

You can bet they'll show up each and every time there's an opportunity to chew another hunk off the unity boat. Just unite and keep believing.

[tavernier]

72. Blue Wave!!!