This is not just to drop another log on the fire raging in DU about Trump voters

[The Polack MSgt]

Although in a roundabout way, it kinda does.

Despite prominent Republicans and GOP friendly press pushing the Illinois GOP to not vote for an actual no shit Nazi running for congress, 20,400 residents of Chicago's southern suburbs took time out of a work day, went to their precinct house or school auditorium, filled in the oval next to Arthur Jones name turned that ballot in and walked out of the polls wearing a fucking I voted sticker.

Arthur Jones, the former head of the American Nazi Party, GOP candidate for IL 3

It was not a secret - no GOP voter was blindsided or tricked regarding his views or history - this freaking Nazi was talked about in local state and national news articles since January

The National Review even urged that Repubs vote for Democratic candidate Lipinski because of his anti abortion, anti LGBQT equality positions.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/03/jeanne-ives-illinois-governor-endorsement-rauner-forfeited-conservative-support/
(The Lipinski endorsement is at the end of the article)

I will bet you Cognac to Possum piss who these fine "not racist" folks voted for in 2016...

So even if the impossible happens and we somehow convince a sizable portion of these mouth breathing hate weasels to vote for Democrats, WHY WOULD WE WANT TO?

Don't poison our party - Peace

[dameatball]

1. I would like to see how many votes this guy gets. Needs its own billboard along a busy highway.

[HopeAgain]

2. Somebody who would vote for Arthur Jones would never vote for a Democrat.

I have spoken to some of these hard right wackos who have been convinced by the right wing media that progressives are the most evil people alive. They will tell you they didn't vote for Jones because he was a Nazi, they would look you straight in the eye and tell you they voted for him because a Nazi is better than a liberal.

Sure they are probably racist, but that racism has been nurtured, by fairly mainstream sources, to develop a deep, deep hatred of liberals. They wouldn't vote for a Democrat. Ever.

[barbtries]

4. in fairness

that's how i am but with republicans. if there's a non-partisan race for judge for example, if i can't figure out whether the candidate is a republican or not i don't vote at all for that office.

i hate them so much at this point that to even consider voting for one is more than i can do.

[JHB]

6. Except your opinion is not based on fantasy and horseshit...

...it is based on what Republicans actually do.

Theirs, on the other hand.... is a house constructed from horseshit, standing on a foundation of bullshit, atop a mountain of elephant shit.

And inhabited by chickenshits.

[Ligyron]

18. +1

Yes, there is a big difference.

[sdfernando]

19. Damn!...Thats a lot of shit! /NT

[JHB]

33. As befits people who are always so quick to lose their shit...

...and yet are always full of it.

[barbtries]

34. my sentiments exactly.

it's when i look at the totality of what they have done to this country just within my lifetime...no. just cannot.

[The Polack MSgt]

5. In the Special election in Alabama

A state GOP official said that she believed the woman's story about Roy Moore behavior when she was a 14 YO child - But still believed Moore to be better than a Democrat.

So yes, exactly right. They hate us.

What bothers me is the flood pearl clutching outrage in DU when ever I point out that I hate them back

[Eliot Rosewater]

20. There was a time way back if a liberal on a liberal message board said

"I have those fucking republicans" they would get universally lectured about how we dont hate, we are better than them, etc.

And that lecture was the correct lecture, at the time.

Not anymore, I hate losing, I hate hunger, I hate misogyny, I hate racism, I hate xenophobia, I hate homophobia, therefore I hate...

you
know
who

[LonePirate]

7. Agreed. His voters always vote red regardless of the candidate and/or they support his views.

I suspect a significant portion of his voters know absolutely nothing about him. They simply voted for him, possibly randomly.

[The Polack MSgt]

21. I believe that the vast majority of Trumpsters are unreachable

Just my opinion, but if there were more than 2 out of 100 that weren't flaming unrepentant racist fucksticks - I would be shocked

Stunned flabbergasted gobsmacked - pick a word.

These people look just like me. They live all around me. Work where I work.

I am the perfect damn undercover agent to expose just what these people think - Ya wanna know why? - BECAUSE I CAN"T GET THEM TO SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT IT.

Make no mistake - Democrats are no angels when it comes bias bigotry and reflexive, unreasoning racism.

We see and do it all the time. The best I can say is that a good portion of us recognize this and try to correct the most egregious examples.

And as much as I wish Democrats would be more introspective and thoughtful when it comes to correcting our own thoughts words and actions - Not one bit of that - NOT ONE OUNCE of that is something that any Republican would ever do.

How about we get out the vote instead?

[Gidney N Cloyd]

3. The interesting thing is this guy runs all the time and every previous time the GOP mounted...

...another candidate to oppose him. It only takes about 600 names on a petition to do it. No big investment, just pick someone willing to run (they don't have to campaign) and send a few volunteers out with clipboards for an afternoon.

But THIS time for some reason the GOP didn't think a Nazi was damaging enough to their brand to bother opposing him in the way they always had before. I wonder what changed?

[Generic Brad]

10. Simple. The GOP has gone full Nazi.

Never go full Nazi.

[Martin Eden]

8. Many of those voters probably never heard of Arthur Jones

In primaries with only one name for an office, people often fill in the oval even though the candidate is running unopposed.

[The Polack MSgt]

9. They would have to be functionally illiterate to NOT know- Not a stretch I know - But

Even down state in the corn where I live this was being talked about.

There were articles asking why the GOP couldn't get anyone on the ballot.

Talking heads opining that no one should vote for this guy on local morning shows - Out of St Louis MO - FFS

I can't believe anyone who could navigate a bus schedule or drive a car in the Chicago area - with all the local media that city has - didn't know that a Nazi was running unopposed in IL 3

[Martin Eden]

11. This is Reublican voters we're talking about

If Jones wasn't exposed as a Nazi on Fox news, they probably don't know what he is.

Of course, for some GOP voters fascism is a positive feature.

[Mr.Bill]

28. I agree. These people watch

Fox News or HeHaw reruns. That's the full spectrum of their take on the state of the world.

[mythology]

12. Considering that the Republican primary in 2014

Had 30,000 votes, I'd say there are at least 10,000.

I would also be curious where they got their numbers from. The Illinois state site doesn't list any votes nor does the New York Times or the Washington Post or the Chicago Tribune that I could find.

[The Polack MSgt]

14. I have this article, but I find it odd that ballotpedia has not -

Published the numbers on the GOP side. Let alone WP, NYT or any Chicago Daily.

Wonder why that is? (I have no proof they are sitting on it, I am just a bitter untrusting cynical bastard)

Anyway - here's a link
https://thinkprogress.org/20000-illinois-republicans-voted-for-nazi-7bbeeb7631fd/

[brer cat]

13. Wish I could give this two recs...

the "possum piss" deserves one by itself, and the rest is a fine rant.

[meadowlander]

15. I don't think anyone is saying "court any and all Trump voters".

That's just a strawman.

What I would say is if you're in a conversation with someone who is "gettable" or seems to be on the turn or who is admitting that they regret voting for Trump that's probably not the best time to say "You fucking moron, how could you have voted for him the first place? You're responsible for every bad thing that has ever happened including climate change, hurricanes and gun massacres."

We need every vote we can get for the midterms and there are a lot out there that we could get without sacrificing core principles. But we're pointlessly hobbling ourselves if we assume everyone who voted for Trump must be a hardcore Nazi who will never see the error of their ways and therefore we don't need to even pretend to try to understand where they are coming from.

I think there are people who are just not that engaged with politics, never watch the news, and voted for Trump because they vaguely remember hearing what a successful businessperson he was and that he was going to bring back jobs to their communities. And they may now be waking up to the fact that it was all a big con. You don't win a person like that over by insulting them to their face, even if you feel like it.

13% of Trump voters also voted for Obama. I don't think those are former members of the American Nazi party. They're economically insecure people who bought the lies and they are gettable. So why not make the tiniest effort?

[The Polack MSgt]

17. Aproximately 9% of Obama voters voted for Trump - 9.2% according to NYT

Last edited Thu Mar 22, 2018, 02:37 PM - Edit history (1)

Just remember saying that 9.2% of Obama voters voted for Trump isn't the same thing as saying 9.2% of Trumpsters would vote for other Democrats

So yes, a slice of his supporters may be reachable. By some one who is NOT ME.

I don't have the make up to sift through 90.8% of metric tons of garbage for sliver of possible converts...

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/15/upshot/the-obama-trump-voters-are-real-heres-what-they-think.html

Oddly enough, a similar number of Sanders supporters voted for Trump - Which means 90% of Sanders supporters WERE NOT GARBAGE PEOPLE WHO SHOULD BE SHUNNED.

So we got that going for us - which is nice.

https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds

[ehrnst]

30. Maths AND statistics!

There you go getting all fancy with those facts and stuff...

[Eliot Rosewater]

16. Possum piss ... ...

Deplorables have to stand on the shoulders of alley rats to be higher than Possum Piss.

[bigbrother05]

22. Note the tacit GOP endorsement of Lipinski

Could that have swung the Dem primary? Lipinski outpolled the more liberal candidate to retain the Dem nomination. If the GOP had a competitive primary, i.e. anyone besides the Nazi, would there have been any crossover voters?

[The Polack MSgt]

23. That's a good question

And I think - it probably did. Enough to push Lipinski through the door? Who knows?

If the Think Progress article has the vote total correct, there are a bit more than 10k GOP votes missing compared to 2 years ago.

How many stayed home? How many asked for the Democratic ballot?

We just don't know -yet

[grantcart]

26. Highly doubtful because there was an uber right wing in the Gov primary race

It doesn't make sense that super ideological people would opt out of voting for Ives so that they could vote for Lipinski. Ives, a West Point right wing nut job, is the dream candidate for the Trump/tea party and she was locked into a very close and heated election against a corrupt Republican governor.

Its hard to see that they would sacrifice their vote in that election so that they could participate in a Dem primary where the Dem is guaranteed to win.

[The Polack MSgt]

27. Good point.

I don't know how many GOPers would put forth much effort to oppose a Nazi after all...

[bigbrother05]

32. Thanks, not following that closely from GA to know the GOP ballot details

[Hortensis]

24. Nobody wants rabid social conservatives

who'd vote for a Nazi to join us. Good thing, because they'd be destined to be disappointed.

It should be noted that Nazi Arthur Jones was the only Republican on the ballot. In spite of his notoriety, you can bet that a few were clueless and that a larger number believed the Nazi stuff was all Democratic lies, just as the same sorts did and do believe the Russia-Trump stuff is all Democratic swiftboating.

Despicable, but insurance that no one needs to worry those'll be calling themselves Democrats any time soon.

[The Polack MSgt]

35. Nobody wants rabid social conservatives who'd vote for a Nazi to join us

But Hortensis, that is my point.

I believe that the overwhelming majority of Trump voters. Did. Just. That. - Willingly voted to further racism and anti-Semitism xenophobia etc. Really, just general hatred of any one different that they are.

There were no secrets regarding what Trump was. He's been a famously sleazy piece of shit for decades.

He settled a damn fraud case DURING the election.

He was a noted adulterer who once had the brass to take his mistress to Easter services while still married.

His closest advisors included known white supremacists and at least one known Neo-Nazi.

With all that as common knowledge - he won the GOP nomination with the most votes ever cast in a Primary.

His supporters are poison. They should not be coddled or sheltered from the repercussions of their actions.

So this is my POV - They are unclean.

Unredeemable pieces of shit and we should not spend an ounce of energy or a speck of concern for them

[Hortensis]

36. For a majority you're tragically correct. But while there are

ANY conservatives who deplore and regret what is happening, and there are, my feeling is that bigotry against all conservatives is as terribly wrong from us as bigotry against any group is from anyone else.

Conservatives are no more one despicable person replicated 150 million times than POC would be.

I've known, and know, too many basically decent conservatives to sign on to this kind of thing. It would be a betrayal of not just old friends and acquaintances, but of myself and who I think I am.

Only those who voted for a Nazi are those who voted for a Nazi. Simple enough to me.

[The Polack MSgt]

37. My wife would agree with you

So would many DU posters.

But through my life experiences; the sports I played, the career I had in the military and civilian world, my natural reflex is to regard opponents as enemies

I could set that feeling aside after a wrestling match or football game but not with these people.

My daughter would either be dead or we'd all be bankrupt without the ACA.

I have a Muslim family who are friends of my wife and I.

I love my nephew, but that other side says he's a threat to there life style and happiness - because of sex? Sight unseen he is less than human because of sexual attraction?

They have declared themselves my enemy. For decades they have been loud and clear on this.

Now we suffer under the mis-governance of the ultimate perfect Republican, the pinnacle of what these shits wanted.

Sorry, no. No forgiveness no acceptance and no "understanding" - I feel that I understand them perfectly well.

[Hortensis]

38. Are you sure you aren't demonstrating much

the same kind of "understanding" of others that those you rail against do, just a mirror image with different sets of "us" and "them"?

And now, let's end this. I've defended people I know who deserve at least some defense against this kind of talk and I've also respected your thoughts on other threads and want to be able to continue to.

[The Polack MSgt]

39. Certainly. I appreciate your inputs to these threads

And this is a good spot to disagree and disengage.

Peace

[Hortensis]

40. :)

[IronLionZion]

25. You're thinking of the most extreme example of the other side's voters

and there are still way too many like that who are beyond help. No one here wants to coddle the types who would send us to the camps or still support that orange dotard after everything he's done.

But there are also plenty of voters that are not so partisan in their beliefs, and may have voted for Obama/Dems in the past, and could be flipped over to our side since Trump has failed them. We've seen this happen in Western PA, Alabama, Virginia, and lots of other Trump districts that elected Democrats this past year in special elections. Plenty of Trump voters voted for our Democrats. The big blue wave is here. Let's ride!

[Honeycombe8]

29. This is shocking. It's not stopping. If anything, we are advancing toward 1930s Germany.

This is unacceptable. Totally unacceptable. This cannot stand. First, the Dem must win. Whatever it takes. Then...the Dems need to NOT FORGET what happened while Trump was in office, and to try to combat it FORCEFULLY in some way.