Hillary Clinton told the truth: Trump's voters are backwards and stuck in the worst parts of America

[sheshe2]

Hillary Clinton has a problem. She tells impolitic truths at inopportune times. During the 2016 presidential campaign she described a large subset of Donald Trump's supporters as being "a basket of deplorables." She was correct. Donald Trump is an authoritarian petite-fascist who is also racist, ignorant, greedy and corrupt. He may be a traitor in cahoots with Russia and is certainly a misogynist and serial liar who brags about sexually assaulting women. Anyone who would vote for such a person is in fact deplorable. Moreover, anyone who continues to support Donald Trump after witnessing his behavior as president is deplorable in the extreme.

snip

Republicans attacked Clinton's latest comments, of course, as an example of how the Democrats are supposedly "isolated," "elitist" and "out of touch." Some of her fellow Democrats piled on with complaints that Clinton is being "unhelpful" by "re-litigating" the 2016 presidential election instead of looking to the future.

These voices of protest have provided little if any evidence to disprove Hillary Clinton's central thesis. Why? Because the facts are on her side.
Political scientists and others have repeatedly shown that women often demur to their husbands' political decisions. This dynamic is especially pronounced among white conservatives and other authoritarians (such as evangelical Christians) who believe in "traditional" family arrangements -- i.e., in which women and children are supposed to obey their husbands and fathers.


snip

The Republican Party has enacted a range of policies to prevent African-Americans from voting. The Republican Party's voters support those initiatives. In addition, according to a 2016 poll by YouGov, at least 20 percent of Trump supporters believe that African-Americans should still be slaves. More than three-quarters of Republicans also express sympathy for the Confederacy, a white supremacist breakaway republic that waged a bloody and treasonous war in defense of the "right" to keep black people in chains.


snip


The Republican Party is a masterful machine of deception. For at least the last 50 years its leaders and media have consistently lied to the American people about almost every issue, including the economy, the environment, international relations, civil rights, crime and health care. This strategy created the poisoned swamp from which Donald Trump and his proto-fascist movement emerged.

Read the rest: http://www.chaunceydevega.com/2018/03/hillary-clinton-told-truth-trumps.html


Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hillary told an inconvenient truth. Truth hurts, doesn't it? Sure, yet it doesn't change that it is in fact the truth.

Have we made mistakes? Yes we have. WE can correct those together with out party being trashed.

[stonecutter357]

1. K&R

[FakeNoose]

2. I guess that makes Hillary the exact opposite of Cheeto

But we already knew that, didn't we?

I'm happy that people are starting to realize the value of Hillary Clinton, now that it's too late.

[sheshe2]

3. I miss her.

She spoke for me...all of us and I miss her.

[leftstreet]

4. There's probably a difference between his 'voters' and 'supporters'

Good article, and it's true she told an inconvenient truth

But I suspect that truth applies to his supporters, not necessarily everyone who voted for him

[sheshe2]

7. My opinion.

Supporters and voters are one in the same. They embraced his (((values)))

[radical noodle]

38. A voter for him is twice as guilty

as someone who supported him. Let's not make excuses for his voters... they're the ones who put him where he is today.

[sheshe2]

57. Fact.

Thank you.

They are quilty as charged and I will never forgive them.

I have heard a lot of BS that millions of trump voters were Obama voters due to a poll that is being posted, Lol. Squinch knocked that flat on another thread.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210366958#post22

Bull Effing SHIT!

[Ninsianna]

89. If you voted for him, you supported him.

[Beartracks]

5. Stuck in the worst places? Or do they make them the worst places?

Hmmmmm...

==========

[Comatose Sphagetti]

6. From the article:

"Political scientists and others have repeatedly shown that women often demur to their husbands' political decisions. This dynamic is especially pronounced among white conservatives and other authoritarians (such as evangelical Christians) who believe in "traditional" family arrangements -- i.e., in which women and children are supposed to obey their husbands and fathers."

You see this dynamic everywhere in Christian, right-wing, rural America.

[melman]

8. It doesn't do anyone any good to call 30 states 'the worst parts of America'

Also, when you bold entire paragraphs it makes it hard to read.

[sheshe2]

12. I did not say this, nor did Hillary. Thirty states.

melman
8. It doesn't do anyone any good to call 30 states 'the worst parts of America'

Oh and bolding makes it difficult to read. So sorry...

Also, when you bold entire paragraphs it makes it hard to read.

Never heard this complaint from anyone ever. It just highlites points in a thread.

Thanks for your imput Melman. I will take it under consideration next time I post. I do not want to make it hard for you to read. I want you and others to understand the full impact of what the article is saying.

[Eliot Rosewater]

29. LOL oh my

I dont know about you but I am sick of reading BASHING posts about Hillary.

But, that is what we get.

[sheshe2]

37. She is not liked???

No clue why other than she is a bold woman that speaks her mind and supports DEMOCRATS 24-7..365 days per year.

Others...not so much.

[Hortensis]

81. Attitude toward Hillary has become a character test.

There are legitimate reasons for some to like.
There are legitimate reasons that some might dislike somewhat.

There are no legitimate intellectual reasons for intense dislike. Meaning the reasons are other.

As for enabling the haters and Hillary-deranged, what kind of person would add power to their demonizing and verbal witch burning? This can't be dismissed as a misjudgment when it's been continued without compunction or regret for years. And is still indulged in.

[Me.]

34. Bold Doesn't Bother Me

I like it when an emphasis is made clear

Also, you might like this article about Nancy Pelosi, which references HRC, as the writer considers both of them powerful women who generally get maligned unfairly.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/04/the-nancy-pelosi-problem/554048/

[sheshe2]

40. This says it all.

The Nancy Pelosi Problem
The first female speaker of the House has become the most effec­tive congressional leader of modern times—and, not coinciden­tally, the most vilified.

Last May, The Washington Post’s James Hohmann noted “an uncovered dynamic” that helped explain the GOP’s failure to repeal Obamacare. Three current Democratic House members had opposed the Affordable Care Act when it first passed. Twelve Democratic House members represent districts that Donald Trump won. Yet none voted for repeal. The “uncovered dynamic,” Hohmann suggested, was Nancy Pelosi’s skill at keeping her party in line.

She’s been keeping it in line for more than a decade. In 2005, George W. Bush launched his second presidential term with an aggressive push to partially privatize Social Security. For nine months, Republicans demanded that Democrats admit the retirement system was in crisis and offer their own program to change it. Pelosi refused. Democratic members of Congress hosted more than 1,000 town-hall meetings to rally opposition to privatization. That fall, Republicans backed down, and Bush’s second term never recovered.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/04/the-nancy-pelosi-problem/554048/

Go Nancy Go. You Rock.

[George II]

44. Been here 12 years, never had a problem with "bold paragraphs". In fact...

...that directs me to the pithy points of posts, thanks for that.

[sheshe2]

47. Me.

Less years here than you. Yet when I'm am reading a thread with bolding it catches my eye when I read an OP. I find it helps when you are tired from work or whatever to focus and reread it all.

Thank you George. The article and bolding said it all. Not sure why others only high lighted the bolding and not the content.

Sigh.

[Hekate]

31. Melman, neither the OP nor HRC said that.

[sheshe2]

43. Thank you, Hekate.

[BoneyardDem]

36. You know what would be fun?

Posts that shit all over Republicans for what they say......and not so much on fellow Dems for posting styles.

[George II]

45. Bazinga! Thanks.

[sheshe2]

64. Teach!

[George II]

39. Are you defending trump voters against Democrats? Really?

BTW, I had NO problems reading the post.

[Squinch]

52. If it's too hard for you to read, then don't read it. The rest of us find it useful.

[sheshe2]

61. I un-bolded this for you.

I want you to read it and understand. This is pathetic. so very sad.

The Republican Party has enacted a range of policies to prevent African-Americans from voting. The Republican Party's voters support those initiatives. In addition, according to a 2016 poll by YouGov, at least 20 percent of Trump supporters believe that African-Americans should still be slaves. More than three-quarters of Republicans also express sympathy for the Confederacy, a white supremacist breakaway republic that waged a bloody and treasonous war in defense of the "right" to keep black people in chains.

You want us to reach out and touch these people. These misunderstood voters.

*Who? The 20% that believe that African-Americans should still be slaves.

* Who? The More than three-quarters of Republicans also express sympathy for the Confederacy, a white supremacist breakaway republic that waged a bloody and treasonous war in defense of the "right" to keep black people in chains.

These are NOT the people we need to reach out to.

[Cary]

63. Oh, but it does so much good to attack sheshe!

Nice priorities you got there.

[sheshe2]

94. Thank you Cary.

[herding cats]

69. That was your takeaway was here?

Hmm, narrow and shallow. No wonder so many people forded past this so easily.

[ehrnst]

75. Don't believe everything you think.

Alternate facts aren't facts, no matter how much they might seem to validate one's emotional response.

[betsuni]

79. Oh, melman.

[sheshe2]

95. Oh! betsuni.

[George II]

86. Does less damage than appearing before a crowd of working class voters and telling them...

...the Democratic Party doesn't do enough for the working class.

[Gothmog]

88. That claim has been fact checked and shown to be false

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10369651

[Ninsianna]

90. It doesn't do anyone good to insist She said things based on

What the GOP has said, also, it's helpful to read her actual.words, even if they are bolded to see what she actually said. While the biased media and the Republicans are expected to be both lazy and dishonest when it comes to attacking Hillary, Democrats here are expected to do better than our opposition.

[heaven05]

91. I couldn't find

Last edited Mon Mar 19, 2018, 09:25 AM - Edit history (1)

Where was it said 30 states are a write-off? And no, bold type makes it easier to read and understand a point being made.

[sheshe2]

96. Hey.

Thank you heaven.

I love it when people bold as it draws your attention and you can focus on the importance of the article and what the issue that the Op is focusing on.

[Gothmog]

125. Have anyone seen any proof of this claim?

[Cha]

9. Yes, we are always evolving, but not

because anyone is bashing our Democratic Party.

Compelling article highlighting why Hillary is right and just keeping it real.

Thanks, she

[Libloom]

10. I agree with this but there's nothing helpful for us by saying this

Again and again. It only divides us more and riles up their base. Actually so much so that I get suspensious. I want them asleep come election time not pissed off. We'd be better off focusing our attention on how shitty this administration is and not as much on how deplorable or stupid the voters are.

[Skittles]

11. honestly, rational thinking people are fed up catering to the feelings of idiots

ENOUGH ALREADY

[Ohiogal]

13. Agree 100% Skittles

[Skittles]

17. they can all go FUCK THEMSELVES

because they are actively trying to FUCK this country

[George II]

41. And they're trying to bring down Democrats too.

[Libloom]

19. Im not saying let's help them feel better

A lot of their votes was a big "fuck you" to us. They think we're always looking down on them and they feel inadequate...and they probably should. They are idiots. But I want us to win this November and rehashing the same ol shit won't get us anywhere. A lot of them know trump sucks and will at worst stay home and at best vote for our guys. But if we go around saying they're not capable of making good decisions because of how stupid they are, they won't give a shit how bad trump is, they'll say"fuck you!" . It's better playing to our strengths and letting the administrations weaknesses play out over and over. They'll stay home or vote for us. I dont want Republicans using it for their gain.

[Skittles]

21. WE NO LONGER GIVE A SHIT WHAT THEY THINK

FUCK THEM

we need to concentrate on the people who FAIL TO VOTE

[JI7]

23. Exactly, Hillary would have won without Comey

And done even better without russian hack.

They can't stand that she didn't kiss their asses and beg therm for votes and still got millions more votes.

[sheshe2]

97. THIS

[mahatmakanejeeves]

33. "They think we're always looking down on them and they feel inadequate.... They are idiots."

They think we're always looking down on them and they feel inadequate...and they probably should. They are idiots.

Gee, I wonder what gives them that idea.

[Woodycall]

50. I grew up in a little town full of them

They are fucking idiots!

[Squinch]

54. There is nothing we can do to fix their stupid. They'll say "fuck you!" no matter what we do.

They're not the key to our future elections.

GOTV among women and people of color is the key to our future.

Worked even in Alabama, but it's not stressed because it doesn't cater to the demographic that thinks its the only important one.

[brer cat]

77. *This*

Exactly. We don't need them to win, and we don't need to spit in the face of our base by trying to curry favor with those who will never share any of our values. We won't gain new voters from among the disengaged or newly eligible by taking most of our existing voters for granted while we hold hands and sing Kumbaya with those who think our base needs to be back in the kitchen/cotton field/closet or behind a wall.

[betsuni]

80. +1

[happy feet]

83. +1

[sheshe2]

98. Yes.

GOTV among women and people of color is the key to our future.

These are our base.

[bettyellen]

123. Remember fuck your feelings on Trump tees? Well they think youre a big sucker for giving them any

bit of ground, any respect or even an ear. They hate women and POC and want us back to second class status in every way. It’s actually a stark line we cannot cross. The only people I see conceding to their feelings are white men- they gotta grow some spine and get behind us. They abandoned Obama after one term, they need to suck it up and fight for us now. No excuses!

[herding cats]

68. Mmm, yep. This!

I’m so sick of people telling me I need to feel this or say that because of the sensitive RWer I might offend. Umm, they’re jackasses who keep voting to hurt themselves and all the rest of us, too!

My sympathy has dried up for their delicate sensibilities a long time ago!

[BeyondGeography]

26. Its not always smart to tell the truth

You can get fired for that.

[sheshe2]

27. Not sure what "suspensious" is.

However

We'd be better off focusing our attention on how shitty this administration is and not as much on how deplorable or stupid the voters are.

The admin is as shitty as the shitty deplorables are that support him. They are the voters that got us here. They are complicit.

[JI7]

70. Why would it upset them ? THey are ok with Trump's Bragging about Pussy Grabbing , they are ok with

Trump referring to mexicans as criminals, rapists etc. they are ok with Trump referring to non white countries as Shitholes .

[yardwork]

93. I think it's time bring back SHAME as a motivator.

People who remain willfully ignorant deserve to be SHAMED, because they are betraying their responsibilities as citizens to our democracy.

People who vote against candidates out of fear that their AR-15s might become a little more difficult to buy deserve to be SHAMED, because their selfishness results in the murders of innocent people, including children.

[joshcryer]

116. This is like saying it did no good for Jesus to throw out the moneychangers.

While true, after all, he was crucified and nothing in particular changed in that respect, it detracts from having the moral high ground.

Pandering to the deplorables does not help anything. Coddling their "sensitivities" does not help anything. They will come out in droves come election time. The emporer's clothing must be ripped off. They must be made ashamed of what they voted for.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

14. RepubliCONMEN & women: "The Republican Party is a masterful machine of deception." . . . . nt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

15. USA always been progressive, liberal, until RepubliCON voter suppress., gerrymander & dirty tricks.

[ismnotwasm]

16. And as usual her words were spun all over the place

Stupid fuckers

[sheshe2]

18. Yep.

Good to see you ism. Miss your wisdom.

So many drifting away.

[ismnotwasm]

22. Cant abide people defending racists.

[sheshe2]

32. Nor can I.

Fug em.

[Eliot Rosewater]

30. Has there been an exodus of certain folks who just cant do it anymore?

I am getting there myself.

[sheshe2]

35. Exodus?

Dunno.

A lessening of interest? Perhaps.

Who needs to be battered day in and day out hearing Democrats suck on a Democratic board?

[mahatmakanejeeves]

20. I figure him to be about a 46 or 48 regular. He's definitely not a petite. NT

[lunamagica]

24. She is honest. People keep complaning that politicians aren't honest

Then, when one speaks the truth, they complain.

I've always admired Hillary's honesty.

[sheshe2]

28. THIS

She is honest.

[UTUSN]

25. *and* she was correct with the "Deplorables" *and* the "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy" labels!

[BoneyardDem]

42. You bet this citizen spoke up and told the truth.

The secondary message I get from Hillary, is one I already know. There is 1/3 of this country that isn't worth one moment of effort. They must wake themselves up, I cannot and will not take the time to do it.

[sheshe2]

46. They must wake themselves.

Fact.

We are woke and have been for a long time. Once again and forever more we are demonstrating in the streets. The children that are woke. No more gun violence. They want to live. They want an education without fear.

They GOPers need to be woke or die. Their choice to be stupid.

[BoneyardDem]

49. The party of reponsibility.

Wallow in stupid ignorance or rise above...its up to the individual

[sheshe2]

62. That party sadly may wallow.

We however will rise.

[beaglelover]

48. Damn straight!!! Nt

[padfun]

51. We used to call them "Trailer Trash"

And when she came out with "Deplorables" I knew that she found the right term.

[Dawson Leery]

53. Be honest, the GOP base would be the Nazis during the 30's.

[StevieM]

55. Did anybody else notice (please reply if you did) that even in this pro-Hillary piece the writer

repeated the false claim that she didn't campaign much in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin or Michigan?

The claims that she didn't campaign in PA and OH are based on absolutely nothing. She campaigned there relentlessly.

She spent more money in Michigan than Obama in 2012 and visited there 7 times. She did let up towards the end, but only because Donald Trump basically gave up there.

Wisconsin is a place where you can make an argument that she made mistakes, just like you can say that about Bill Clinton in Colorado in 1996 and Al Gore in Tennessee in 2000. No candidate is perfect, and in the end Wisconsin moved with the rest of the country. Had her national lead not slipped it would not have slipped in WI either.

Also, Trump canceled an appearance in Wisconsin towards the end. And Clinton had more staff there than Obama did in 2012. And she spent a lot of money there until Trump largely gave up.

Michigan and Wisconsin moved with Pennsylvania, Florida, North Carolina, Arizona and the rest of the country in the final 2 weeks in response to the Comey intervention and, to a lesser extent, the Russian manipulation.

[betsuni]

60. This makes me mad every time I see it.

I've been meaning to take the time to find links to disprove it, keep forgetting.

[Gothmog]

56. Some fact checking to support the OP

Link to tweet

[sheshe2]

58. Makes me cry.

So I won the places that are optimistic, diverse, dynamic, moving forward.

..................................

What we lost.

Thanks Gothmog.

[Gothmog]

84. Same here

[betsuni]

59. Thank you.

Every single time. Everything Hillary says has to be given the worst possible spin. I feel nostalgic for the days when only the Right did this kind of spinning, but now it's everywhere.

[brer cat]

74. Thanks for posting this, Gothmog.

What is frustrating is the "obviously deliberate misreading" that occurs with some on the left as well as the right.

[Gothmog]

85. Facts are important

[betsuni]

65. What I don't understand is why the worry about Trump voters/supporters

feelings. There's so much manufactured outrage at nothing all the time, would they even notice if someone like Obama or Hillary actually came right out and said "Anyone who voted for Trump is a fucking idiot"? They think we're libtards and are 100% sure they're right about everything despite our libtardy habit of insisting on facts and figures that clearly prove them wrong -- why would they care what any of us think of them? They never listen to anyone anyway. I don't get it.

[sheshe2]

66. I don't give a shit about trump voters/ supporters.

They made their bed enthusiastically. They doubled down and slept with him. He owns them and they own him. There is nothing redeemable about them and I would not bother to try to sway them. They are lost souls full of hatred.

Do not waste a moments of sleep on them. They are lost souls that someone thinks worth saving. I do not and never will. Haters will always hate.

[Cha]

71. Exactly, betsuni! So much of what trump does...

is Insult and LIE about Dems and the Democratic Party with his tweet tool.. And Hillary can't tell the truth about them?

Poor little sensitive mole fans.. they all can dish it out.. but they just can't take it

[sheshe2]

99. This, Cha.

[Jamaal510]

67. K&R

[TexasTowelie]

72. K&R.

[oasis]

73. Trump voters aka Deplorables can go straight to hell. (eom)

[ehrnst]

76. Kick and Reced!

[Sancho]

78. Excellent article - thanks sheshe!

My observation of GRITS (girls raised in the South) is consistent with the article - some traditional wives vote as their husband instructs them because of social/traditional conventions. I will say that this is changing in some of the red areas. I currently attend a white traditional church (someone has to be the token liberal!), and I still see it frequently. OTOH, my young, female students are changing rapidly - they are much more progressive and internationally focused - so there is hope for the future. The HS students who stood up after the Miami shooting are good examples.

I have no doubt that a large portion of tRump's support are due to Archie Bunker, uninformed voters who identify with their neighbors, but don't really understand that they are voting against their own interests - much less upholding archaic values.

Because of the electoral college, a small but solid base, and lousy voting machines...it's possible for the GOP/Russians to manipulate enough independents, hack enough votes, and restrict enough registrations to barely win elections that they actually lost. That happened in 2000, 2004, and 2016 nationally, but it happens regularly on the state and local level. Some of that solid base are still "red state" folks that Hillary accurately describes. They have informational problems, but also have moral and ethical views that are not defensible.

I don't care if words are bold or in italics or underscored . I can deal with it...

BTW, I believe that Hillary was the most prepared person to be President in my lifetime - by experience, core values, and intelligence. It's a tragedy that we missed having her as our President. Putin won this "battle" on the backs of republican traitors.

[sheshe2]

100. As always it is great to hear from you Sancho.

Fact

BTW, I believe that Hillary was the most prepared person to be President in my lifetime - by experience, core values, and intelligence. It's a tragedy that we missed having her as our President. Putin won this "battle" on the backs of republican traitors.

We lost one of the best.



Thanks Sancho.

[Mike Nelson]

82. I believe...

...Hillary was correct. I understand many Democrats/Progressives feel the topic should be ignored in favor of more positives messages. We can have both. The media ignored Hilary's positive messages and highlighted her "deplorables" comment. The media highlighted the negative Trump. Maybe Hillary could have had more media attention by making the "deplorables" message central?

Everyone should talk about the "deplorables". How can the USA, in present-day, have enough people to form a crowd of KK torch-carrying marchers chanting "Jews will not replace us!" and have a President say they are some "very nice people"? They are out there - not talking about them does not make them go away.

Keep talking, Hillary!

[sheshe2]

101. THIS

Thank you.

[mcar]

87. But, but, I thought she never said anything that hadn't been poll tested!!11

Which is it, Hillary haters (in the media and on the web)? She speaks "impolitic" truth or she's a big phony?

[heaven05]

92. masterful example

Thank you

[sheshe2]

103. ;)

[Caliman73]

102. At the VERY LEAST, they are gullible fools and that is being kind.

We can put aside the racism, misogyny, and religious bigotry for a bit, though I would be very comfortable saying that the majority of his voters and supporters embody at least one if not all of those traits.

I can understand the idea that some of those voters were people who feel left behind, feel desperate, and were just looking for change of any kind. In the same way that I can understand that some of the guys I grew up with, came from home situations where they felt that joining a gang was the most viable way to get love and respect that they lacked.

The problem is that in both situations is two fold. The result is a dangerous situation for everyone around AND it is based on bullshit. I know, or at least, was acquainted with guys who ended up in prison or dead. They believed that gangbanging was going to lead somewhere. They were gullible. They were fools, and many of the ones who got out will tell you that.

Trump voters are fools. They believed that a rich man who has a history of lying, cheating, stealing, bullying, and running profitable businesses into the ground; was going to offer them opportunities that they had been denied by some "governmental elite". Utter bullshit. Trump depends on the status quo. His money is tied up in the very system that he pretended he was going to upend. His supporters are fools. They really think that he will bring back jobs when his company produces its goods overseas for his maximum benefit.

The Democratic party has definitely made mistakes in both messaging and policy. Government is big and slow, and prone to the whims of those with money and power. However, it is the only force that can wield enough power to counteract the greed and heartlessness of those who would promote corporatism, racism, misogyny, religious extremism, etc... What is needed is people who are informed and vigilant. People who hold accountable, those in power and who wield their votes as leverage for the vulnerable against the very few, but powerful forces that would work us to death for a little more profit.

[ollie10]

104. It was NOT the truth.

Not every person who voted for Trump is a racist or misogynist. Many simply voted against hillary. THAT is an inconvenient truth

[sheshe2]

105. Sorry.

They are racist, misogynist and bigots. Just look at his rhetoric at his rallies. Look at the cheers and chants then and today. Same shit. This is exactly who they are. You are correct it is an inconvenient truth and a well known fact.

They are also knowingly supporting Russia and applaud him for his support of them.

[ollie10]

108. look at the numbers

his approval rating is in the 30s. Yet the number who voted for him was in the 40s. Not everyone who voted for him approve of him now.

Some can be peeled off. But not by calling them a racist.

Yes. many were/are racists. But not all.

[ehrnst]

121. Remind me - when did HRC call any voters "racist?"

I don't remember that.

Please share a link.

Or please correct your post.

[ollie10]

126. hillary: "you dont like black people getting rights"

[ehrnst]

128. She was describing what DT's message actually was to those people.

Last edited Mon Mar 19, 2018, 09:36 AM - Edit history (3)

Again, in case you missed it the first two times:

So, I won the places that are optimistic, diverse, dynamic, moving-forward, and his whole campaign, "Make America Great Again," was looking backwards. You know, you didn’t like black people getting rights, you don’t like women getting jobs, you don’t want to see that Indian-American succeeding more than you are. "Whatever your problem is, I’m going to solve it."

So it was a symptom, but it was also a cause, because having someone run for president who voices those ideas, who rejects so much of the American story and our values, was also the underlying cause, as well.

So no, she didn't call people "racist," she was translating what DT's message was in "MAGA."

I hope that clarifies things for you.

[sheshe2]

138. Thank you for posting the whole quote, ehrnst.

You clarified exactly what she said without the spin...she was clearly translating trumps very own words and the message behind MAGA.

Thanks

[StevieM]

106. A lot of them were persuaded to do that by the actions of James Comey. The FBI played a huge role

in this election.

And I believe they would have been investigating any Democrat who ran for president this year. It was going to be ugly no matter who we ran. I admit that running a former cabinet secretary who Congress could claim the right have oversight responsibilities for was particularly problematic.

For the record, Bill Clinton would have been impeached for something in the 1990s even if Monica Lewinsky had never existed. And I suspect the same thing would have happened to Bob Kerry, Tom Harkin, or Jerry Brown had they been president in the 90s, assuming they even won the presidency.

[ehrnst]

110. A lot were persuaded by Lefty friends who

swallowed and spread the anti-Hillary lies from the GOP and Russia.

[ehrnst]

109. Hillary certainly didn't say every person supporting DT was a racist.

But way more than she sad were racist actually were.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/letters/2017/08/15/clinton-was-right-about-deplorables-now-they-storming-out-basket/4Uac7SNZZozi8AyAix6UiN/story.html

[ollie10]

111. What she said at that fundraiser definately got that message out

[ehrnst]

113. No. She said "half."

And yes, she said deplorables. And many people agreed with her.

Many wanted her to use stronger language - call Law Enforcement in the US executioners of black men, for instance, in the debates. That "proved" to many that she was not going to be tough enough.

She could never seem to be severe enough for some, or polite enough for others.

Par for the course.

If one has their mind made up about someone, then anything they say - or don't say - "sends the wrong message."

[ollie10]

114. Her speech in india wrote off entire sections

Of our country

[ehrnst]

115. So now you are changing the topic to ANOTHER speech.

Because you can't support your statements on her "fundraiser speech."

Got it.



https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/150/Red-Herring

But I'll bite - in what way did she insult/write off "entire areas of the country?"

[ollie10]

117. She said....

"....If you look at the map of the United States, there is all that red in the middle, places where Trump won," she said. "What that map doesn’t show you is that I won the places that own two thirds of America’s Gross Domestic product. I won the places that are optimistic, diverse, dynamic, moving forward. And his whole campaign, Make America Great Again, was looking backwards. You don’t like black people getting rights, you don’t like women getting jobs, you don’t want to see that Indian American succeeding more than you are, whatever that problem is, I am going to solve it."

I think that qualifies as writing off entire sections of the country.

This was the speech she got paid the mega bucks to do in India last week. Still making the mega bucks for speaking.....

[ehrnst]

118. Oh, so now we're switching to the India speech....

I take it you have problems with people getting "mega bucks" for speaking?

Or just Hillary?

What constitutes "mega bucks" as you put it?

[ollie10]

119. I was always talkinga bout the india speech in case you failed to notice

She lost because of several reasons. He mega bucks speeches being just one more reason.

[ehrnst]

120. I don't recall a "fundraiser speech" being made in India....

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210368854#post111

And you still haven't quantified what "mega bucks" is.

And how did these "mega bucks speeches" as you call them, harm her chances of winning?

[ollie10]

131. Are you even listening?

The speech was made just recently. In India. Not during the campaign, so it did not change her chances of winning.

Go ahead and read the following link, if you care to:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/democrats-distance-themselves-from-hillary-clintons-backward-claim/2018/03/13/51cb1ba6-26e3-11e8-b79d-f3d931db7f68_story.html?utm_term=.f37be5a6869d

So you don't think Hillary's speeches, such as to Goldman Sachs, became an issue in 2016? Really?

[ehrnst]

133. So you are trying to switch the the topic again...

From how her "mega bucks" was "one of many things that hurt her in the 2016 elections" back to the "india speech."

And once again, because you don't seem to be "listening:"

Politifact just posted the full transcript of Hillary's "controversial" remarks, and it shows conclusively that she was talking about Trump's *message,* not his *voters,* despite the widespread and obviously deliberate misreading to the contrary.

Many things that were not actually problematic about HRC were made into "issues" in 2016. On the left and the right, due to widespread and obviously deliberate misreading to the contrary.

Is that clearer?

[ehrnst]

129. You mean like Michael Moore getting $40,000 per speech for speaking at universities in 2004?

http://cdn.deseretnews.com/media/photos/a092904uvsc.pdf


Hillary is getting $25k to speak at Rutgers later this month.

Apparently speaking fees are only "mega bucks" and a sign of corruption if a woman is getting them.

[MrsCoffee]

135. But her emails.... But her speeches....

Fuck that noise.

We don’t need 2016 propaganda against Democrats respammed here. One might consider that trolling.

But nice to see where some folks priorities lie.

[ehrnst]

137. Indeed (nt).

[ehrnst]

122. Perhaps you missed this in the post further up:

"Politifact just posted the full transcript of Hillary's "controversial" remarks, and it shows conclusively that she was talking about Trump's *message,* not his *voters,* despite the widespread and obviously deliberate misreading to the contrary"

I hope that clarifies things for you, so you don't need to be angry about something that isn't factual.

You're welcome.

Still waiting on the clarification on what "mega bucks" is, and why you claim "the speeches" that you say "got mega bucks" hurt her campaign.

Link to tweet

[ollie10]

124. clear as mud, but nice try

Last edited Mon Mar 19, 2018, 07:19 AM - Edit history (2)

her speech was counterproductive. she doesn't speak clearly at all, since you have to explain it. The message came through....that maga appealed to racists. Fact is it appealed to a lot of people who were not racist at all.

Pretty lame when your argument is a variation on a theme of she didn't really say that.....

[ehrnst]

127. I think there are those who will interpret anything HRC says

in a way that fits their own narrative.

You don't like her. I get that.

Doubling down when being corrected really underscores your specific feelings about her. Anything that HRC says would feel "counterproductive" to someone with that intense a dislike.

[ollie10]

134. You haven't been paying attention

I have posted that I admire her. I have stated that she would have made a great president. And, of course, I voted for her.

My problem with her is not in her personally, it is that her speech hurt Democrats. She is a poor campaigner, as shown by her facing two presidential campaigns where she entered as the OVERWHELMING INEVITABLE FAVORITE and losing both.

She made the mistake in 2016 of talking about deplorables. She realized it was a mistake and stopped it, but it was too late, and the damage was done. It is obvious she has not learned her lesson from this, because in India she basically rinsed and repeated the same mistake. She just doesn't get it. We are not going to win in 2020 without getting more states to vote for us, and what she said basically called Trump supporters in all these states racists and misogynists. There are better ways to get their votes than by insulting them....like....DUH......focussing on the economy, on health care, on the crappy tax cuts that favored the rich. THIS is the way to win back these states, not by harping about deplorables who won't vote for us anyway and alienating those who voted for Trump but are now wavering.

[ehrnst]

136. No, as has been pointed out to you repeatedly, the "mistake"

Last edited Mon Mar 19, 2018, 10:46 AM - Edit history (1)

is on the part of those who didn't accurately report what she said in India, leaving out the context.

Whether it's the "mega bucks" of her speeches that offend you (but apparently not $750k book advances), or the litany of "mistakes" you say she made, or continued repeating of misreporting of what her speech in India was, you have not shown any respect for her.

And who is "harping about deplorables" in this election cycle?

[SunSeeker]

107. K & R

[Scurrilous]

112. K&R

[LexVegas]

130. A bunch of bigots in the worst shitholes in the USA. Simple as that. nt