With London swooning, Mitt aims for Israel

[demwing]

Last edited Fri Jul 27, 2012, 12:35 PM - Edit history (1)

The birthplace of Mormonism.

No shit, the Mormons think the lost tribes of Israel ended up in North America and became Native American Indians (despite all DNA evidence to the contrary), which is how Joseph Smith supposedly got his hands on the magic golden tablets from which the Book of Mormon was allegedly translated.

One can only hope that the subject comes up during his visit, so that Mitt can turn on his world famous charm and unite America's two greatest allies in one harmonious 24/7 news cycle of Romenyistic sound bites, thus feeding a new round of Team Obama commercials to nourish and maintain DU through the coming Republican cage match in Tampa.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. I hope he doesn't offer to baptize Netanyahu's deceased relatives.

[KurtNYC]

3. you know some people believe in the whole "better to ask forgiveness than permission" approach

and still others don't ask forgiveness OR permission.

Baptize dead Jewish people ? BTDT

[demwing]

38. retroactive retirement, retroactive baptisms

what is it with Mormons and all this retro-activity?

[monmouth]

2. Even though Bibi and Mitt are both on the same page politically, Bibie has to know this nimrod will

never be elected. I'll be interested to see how warm and charming he is towards Mitt.

[justabob]

5. he has already distanced himself from Mittens

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021024474

[hifiguy]

4. Mittwit will probably ask for a ham on white with mayo

if he visits a restaurant. Or even the PM's residence.

[Aerows]

9. Or bacon wrapped shrimp.

I just don't think he can help himself from going on an offend-a-palooza.

[Jayce Cox]

6. The Birthplace of Mormonism

Last edited Sun Jul 29, 2012, 08:26 PM - Edit history (1)

Was Fayetteville NY, April 6th 1830. We don't believe the "lost tribes of Israel" ended up in North America. The Book of Mormon tells of 2 families from Jerusalem coming by boat to the Americas around 600 BC. This may sound nuts to most of the world and some days to me. But no crazier than the origin stories of all world faiths. This mormon believes President Obama has done much for the US and needs four more years. Mitt no more represents my faith than pedophile priests represent Mother Teresa's. To group us all into one negative stereotype serves no one.
Brother Cox

op-ed piece: http://www.mansfieldnewsjournal.com/article/20120729/NEWS01/207290305 and
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/765592705/It-is-OK-to-disagree-not-dehumanize.html

[cali]

10. You're right. It's not fair to stereotype all Mormons

anymore than it's right to stereotype any group.

Having said that, I'd like to gingerly and gently discuss the point you attempt to make about the origin story of Mormonism being no nuttier than any other world faith. I'm sorry, I disagree for essentially two reasons. The first is that Joseph Smith is a modern, not an ancient figure. Thus, we actually know quite a bit about him. What we know does not exactly speak to sterling character. Secondly, it actually is crazier than say, the origin of Buddhism but more importantly, it's contains far fewer if any profundities. It has no contemplative branch, that I know of and it seems to be the earliest of what we now call "prosperity gospel".

I'm feeling kind of like a heel saying this to you, but as I once said to a friend of mine who is a born again fundamentalist Christian- and oddly a liberal- if Jerry Falwell is in Heaven and Gandhi is in Hell, I prefer the company below.

[Jayce Cox]

20. Mormons don't believe in hell

So Gandhi are Jerry are most likely having coffee (De-Caff of course) and discussing there differences as we speak.
Gandhi would be preferred company for me as well, Jerry is still reeling from the discovery that mormons, catholics, Lutherans, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus as so on, are all there in "Heaven". But he will have to answer for all the Judgment he cast.
Jayce

[Xipe Totec]

30. Welcome to DU

I hope we can find common ground.

[Sheepshank]

33. They most certainly do...but they like to call it perdition

ask any faithful mormon what happens to their eternal soul if they deny the Holy Ghost

[Jayce Cox]

35. Outer Darkness

Is what it's called, and ask any faithful mormon, they will tell you it's nearly impossible to get there.

[Sheepshank]

43. Bull crap its easy as pie....as an ex mormon I've been told I'm going there because I openly denied

the Holy Ghost, the 'witness' and testimony thereof.

As a future son or daughter of perdition, it's not simply an eternal life in outer darkness, it is a place without the celestial light and touch of heavenly father. It's to be banished from his presence for eternity, to know that one could have been 'in the light' for eternity. The Mormons may not use the word 'fire' or 'flames'...but they certinaly do believe there is a hell where one is without their God...I remember even being told that paying tithing was 'fire insurance'. Down playing mormonisms idiocy won't fly.

[Jayce Cox]

45. I'm sorry

When I left the church after my mission I was told that I would end up in the lowest kingdom, and that my parents would only be able to visit me. I eventually returned and married in the temple and had six delightful and exhausting children. I was not raised in Utah, but in Sunday School I was taught that the only way to end up as a son of perdition was to have seen Jesus Christ in person and then to deny it. Maybe we benefited from being away from the mormon cultural center, as we didn't get taught up in all the cultural baggage BS. I have heard older members refer to their "Fire Insurance". As a former Branch President, I never implied leaving the church would cost anyone their soul, just that they were welcome to return anytime and that nothing could remove them from the love of Heavenly Father. I am grateful that I was raised and currently live in the "Mission Field&quot Outside the Utah-Arizona-Idaho Mormon Belt) as my grandparents called it. I am horrified that your experience was so terrible. What ever you believe, whether active, inactive, or on a new path all together, I wish you well. I am confident that had I experienced the same things when I stepped away, I would have surely never returned. You have every right to be angry and hurt by your experience.
I am sorry my comments may have seemed dismissive or arrogant.
Jayce

[Sheepshank]

46. I certainly appreciate your heartfelt response..... n/t

[demwing]

16. And who were those two families?

Come one, Jayce. I spent 10 years in Utah, and had countless debates with Mormons about this very subject. You cannot tell me that the LDS church does not believe that 2600 years ago Israelites came to America and that at least some of the Native Americans are their descendents.

[Jayce Cox]

19. We do

Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints believe that some Native Americans have Semitic ancestry. The lost ten tribes are a whole other ball game. Our Sacred Myths are young and understandably open to inspection, disbelief, and even mockery. They have nothing to do with this election and should be left to other forums for debate.
Respectfully
Jayce

[demwing]

21. Why do you believe that?

We're not talking pig picture "Is there a God" stuff, this is specific, and the scientific evidence is clear - the claim is not true.

Knowing this, why do you believe otherwise?


And yes, I think that a candidate closing his/her eyes to a clear scientific proof should be the subject of political discussion, because it begs the question of what else Mitt Romney will simply ignore on the principle that it challenges some claim of his religion.

Climate change?

LGBT rights?

The separation of Church and State?

[Jayce Cox]

34. Because I Can

In the United States we are free to believe any nonsense we would like. And explaining matters of faith in this type of forum will get us nowhere. And frankly you have already made up your mind that any answer I were to give would be categorically unreasonable. Fixating on a tiny aspect of an elaborate belief system may make you feel superior, but does little to promote honest and friendly dialog. This election will be close, and we cannot afford to alienate any voters, even mormon democrats. Do you have the same concerns regarding Senator Harry Reid's leadership?

[demwing]

37. I'm not focusing on a "tiny aspect of an elaborate belief system"

I'm focusing on the ability to simply disregard proven science in favor of completely made up falsehoods.

You can believe anything you want to in this country, and there is no religious test for the Presidency, but there is no religious firewall for the Presidency either.

Mitt Romney can worship Hypno Toad, and run for President. No law will stop him, but neither will any law or code stop anyone from questioning such beliefs, especially when those beliefs contradict facts.

this conversation doesn't make me feel superior, it makes me feel frustrated.

And if/when Harry Reid runs for President, I'll ask the same damn question.

[Jayce Cox]

39. Just as frustrated as I feel!

Last edited Sun Jul 29, 2012, 08:30 PM - Edit history (1)

Demwing you have every right to ask any question you would like. Lets stop and work toward getting President Obama re-elected.

Op-Ed http://www.deseretnews.com/article/765592705/It-is-OK-to-disagree-not-dehumanize.html

[Marrah_G]

36. Yes- religion and politics should stay away from each other

Like a religion providing massive funds to take away the rights of people they don't like, based on their religious beliefs, in another state.....

The world would be a better place if politics and religion never met.

[Sheepshank]

44. And the the preamble in the book of mormon was changed to accomodate the DNA findings

...retroactively of course. Romney learned this lesson well.

[nolabear]

18. Good post, and good to know there's dissent.

Mitt's agenda and bizarrely inhuman character alarms me more than his religion, but I must, with some embarrassment, admit I worry that the Mormon governance has a hand in his promotion as a special child, and that we come closer to a theocracy with him in office because of the ubiquitousness of the faith in all its adherents do.

I also think there's a metaphorical bent and an attempt to be inclusive after all these centuries with most religions (not all, clearly). Mormonism is so new and so literal that it does seem more concretely bizarre to those of us who just don't believe it.

That said, I appreciate you speaking up and respect the defense of your religion. It would be good to talk rather than just posture, which happens all too often on the internets.

[Tom Ripley]

31. Really? All origin stories were cooked up by CONVICTED fraudsters?

I didn't know that

[Aerows]

7. With the way Mitt likes to comment on the weather

I'd expect something like "Wow, it's hot as an oven here!"

[justabob]

11. ooooooh

You nailed it. That is *exactly* the kind of horrid thing I am expecting to come from Mitt in Jerusalem.

[truebrit71]

29. "What's that smell? Did someone leave the gas on?"

....

[LiberalEsto]

8. I'm breathlessly waiting for him to call Netanyahu "Big Chief"

and greet him with one hand up, saying "How?"

[hifiguy]

14. Something about that mental image...

[demwing]

12. Obama helps Mitt gets some name recognition in Israel

[malaise]

13. Has he left before the opening ceremony?

[demwing]

17. lol, wouldn't you

if you were him?

[BumRushDaShow]

15. Let's hope he doesn't gaffe his way into a damn war

I can see this jingoistic ass spouting nonsensical neocon talking points thinking he can somehow convince Bebe and Likud that he has at least one functioning brain cell.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

22. Is "swooning" usually accompanied by fits of laughter?

[demwing]

25. I was hoping

that this would be one instance where using the tag would not only be unnecessary, but would take away from the fun

[magical thyme]

23. Not to worry! Romney now using mnemonic techniques to remember leaders' names:

The Daily Edge ?@TheDailyEdge

"I can't wait to meet Benjamin Netangoogle"

[pinboy3niner]

24. *snort*

[demwing]

26. Duzy /nt

[nolabear]

27. LOL! Love it.

[nolabear]

28. My poor little ROTFL Smilie is going to need some time off.

Mittens has just about worn his ass out. But just one more...

[Buns_of_Fire]

32. "My work here is done," sayeth MitTwit...

"Boy, I sure hope I can get some good baby back ribs when I get to Tel Aviv..."

[B Calm]

40. Since half the country is made up of Rich American

Businessmen, (my cousin being one of them) he will probably be welcomed with open arms!

[Ikonoklast]

41. "First off, I'd like to thank Mr., uh, Premier for the warm welcome."

"Secondly, I never realized that there were so many Amish living here in Israel. You learn something new every day!"

[demwing]

42. that made me guffaw

and I like guffawing