General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIs Trump laying the groundwork for mass-firings of teachers?
Notice the phrase they all use..."teachers who care about their students"
How do you know who those teachers are?
Easy! They are the ones who want to carry a gun!
And the ones who won't carry a gun - of course - don't care about their students.
These teachers will be replaced with teachers who care/carry
brooklynite
(94,598 posts)hexola
(4,835 posts)They will...
Teachers who wont arm...don't care.
onenote
(42,714 posts)hexola
(4,835 posts)Who else!?
onenote
(42,714 posts)brooklynite
(94,598 posts)Response to hexola (Reply #2)
Name removed Message auto-removed
MichMary
(1,714 posts)armed deputy at the school, making something like $75,000 per year, if he is going to stand outside (with two pistols and a shotgun) while people inside are being killed?
That $75,000 could buy an awful lot of metal detectors.
Response to MichMary (Reply #15)
Name removed Message auto-removed
MichMary
(1,714 posts)I did point out that he didn't just have a pistol. He had a shotgun, which could have done a lot of damage.
I think arming teachers is absolutely the dumbest idea to ever come out of the White House, but if we can't expect an armed, trained LEO to do his job when called upon, why have them?
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)MichMary
(1,714 posts)He was issued a gun. There are certain assumptions that go along with that. Like, you use it when you need to in order to protect lives.
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)will show that job descriptions vary widely and may include a large "community outreach" component
The job is not synonymous with "SWAT team member"
MichMary
(1,714 posts)wasn't part of his duty as a deputy sheriff, then why did he have a gun? Pretty sure it wasn't to blow away kids cheating on tests.
I really don't understand the efforts to exonerate this guy. He had a gun in an otherwise gun-free zone.He and the shooter were the only ones. He was the only one who had the means to take down the gunman. If he wasn't going to even make the attempt, he should have been put out to pasture and been replaced by someone who would try.
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)I can't see how the country benefits much if every idiotic nimrod, who (like me) posts anonymously on the innertubes, also denounces the fellow, especially since important details (such as a very accurate timeline) for the overall response aren't being widely published
And the sheriff might be going after the guy to take heat off himself: almost half of the Florida legislature has called for the sheriff's suspension
MichMary
(1,714 posts)(especially about the "yammering halfwit of a president" thing. I may use that in the future.)
There is a lot of "not my fault" going on in that department. By total coincidence I've been reading a lot about Columbine lately. Protocols were different then, and law enforcement followed standard protocols as they existed then. But there was still a lot of totally appropriate criticism of local law enforcement.
At the time of the massacre, Eric Harris should certainly been in prison. He had been arrested on a felony charge, but placed in a diversion program. Diversion would have ended if the complaints about him had come to light. But everything, multiple complaints by the Brown family of actual threats, had simply been filed away, a search warrant was never executed (had it been, the pipe bombs would have been found,) and there was no communication between the diversion people, law enforcement, and the school.
The cover-up continued long after the shooting. The records of the prior complaints and the search warrant disappeared, and as far as I know, were never found.
This case reminds me so much of what happened in Colorado in 1999. If the threats had been taken seriously by the FBI, if Cruz had been arrested during one of the 39 visits to his home, if, if, if . . . Seventeen people would still be alive.
The chilling thing about this is that there are probably hundreds of cases where shooters have not fallen through the cracks. We don't hear about those cases, because there has been effective intervention.
Don't mean to have been so snarky with you. I do see where you are coming from, and we are all a bit on edge, with the yammering halfwit in charge.
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)Michael Paluska
10:17 PM, Feb 22, 2018
12:47 PM, Feb 23, 2018
... "You dont say that you are wrong, thats why 17 children died," Diamond said. "You cant do that to an individual" ...
"I think this is such a volatile and tragic scenario that everybody, everybody is going to overreact, everyone's going to look at somebody to put the finger on ... I think it's inappropriate, I think that's scapegoating the deputy, Diamond said.
There are also questions about why a tip to the FBI about Cruz fell through the cracks. Diamond says taking all of the failures in their totality don't fall on one deputy ...
https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/local-news/veteran-officer-defends-parkland-school-resource-officers-actions-calls-him-a-scapegoat
MichMary
(1,714 posts)to "handle issues with tact and judgment," then why did he have a gun? Post-Columbine protocols include officers, even if there is only one, to go toward the gunfire in an effort to save lives.
He probably wasn't the right person for the job, or maybe his training failed. Whatever. He was there to protect lives, and he didn't do it.
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)MichMary
(1,714 posts)There are things that are known about the best ways to save lives in active shooter situations. See this article:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/15/us/florida-school-shooting-columbine-lessons/index.html
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)MichMary
(1,714 posts)the Broward County protocols must include standing around and waiting for another department to come in and save the day.
struggle4progress
(118,295 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Perhaps some day you can visit the US and learn about how our schools work.
hexola
(4,835 posts)Federal money can influence.
I live in South Central PA - ground zero for nitwits likely to support arming teachers.
DrDan
(20,411 posts)hexola
(4,835 posts)Yes - being a bit dramatic.
Trump likes to take credit for everything...I like to blame him for everything!
DrDan
(20,411 posts)madaboutharry
(40,212 posts)They work for local school districts. They are not federal employees.
Lochloosa
(16,066 posts)Schools are controlled by the local school board.
hexola
(4,835 posts)A little federal incentive and bam - armed "teachers"
It won't happen overnight...
hexola
(4,835 posts)I'll try to source that...about 15 minutes ago.
MichMary
(1,714 posts)EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)I can hear them now. "This could have been prevented if a teacher had a gun. But the TEACHER's UNION REFUSED! They let these kids die."
LastLiberal in PalmSprings
(12,586 posts)I wrote about the same thing: https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=1997963
The Republicans have a long history of blaming public school teachers (and their union) for all of society's ills. Of course, the GOP/NRA/Trump solution is the most simplistic and least likely to work (according to a 2008 study, during an active shooter confrontation police officers hit their intended target 18% of the time), but it serves the NRA purpose of selling more guns, the GOP's purpose of gaining another attack point against the teachers, and Trump's desire to be BMOC -- "Only I can arm the teachers, no one else has done it!"
Proud Liberal Dem
(24,414 posts)As others have pointed out, he doesn't have that kind of authority. I suppose that it is possible that Congress or the states could pass laws requiring teachers to carry but IMHO there would be MASSIVE resistance to such a proposal and it would go nowhere fast. I'm heartened by the fact that teachers everywhere are actually already pouring cold water all over that idea.
hexola
(4,835 posts)They are police.
ProfessorGAC
(65,076 posts)A ridiculous extrapolation from the available information, even given the sliminess of that gang in DC.
Lee-Lee
(6,324 posts)The hiring and firing of teachers is done at the local level and policy set regarding that at the highest at
State level.
The president has zero authority or ability to fire anyone who works for local or state government.
FSogol
(45,488 posts)Kirk Lover
(3,608 posts)hexola
(4,835 posts)But - I hear this phrase "who care about their students" being used by Trump, Ivanka, and I think Slurah Slanders.
This is a top down effort...i.e. "Firing"
How they achieve this - I don't know - but someone on CNN mentioned giving police officers a path to a teaching certificate.
Thats one way...
Kirk Lover
(3,608 posts)something to that effect. But this whole arm the teachers thing also comes down to money. A lot of money is to be made to outfit and train all those teachers. Who will benefit from this STUPID idea? The gun industry and the NRA will. I believe it is no coincidence that he is pushing this bullshit.
All I know is that I was away with my Trumper sister while this was going on and she was horrified...HORRIFIED, to hear this trashbag float this 'idea'. She works in a school - she knows just how insane that would be. She is disgusted and let him just keep keeping on because I'm telling you he is shedding support one person at a time..but just like his hair....he's shedding. He is done in every single way.
DinahMoeHum
(21,794 posts)n/t
duforsure
(11,885 posts)And he may try to use to it to break their union, which he'll soon be going after that with the postal people , police , firemen, and any other government jobs that have unions. They want to privatize all government sector jobs. That way they can shake them down for campaign contributions, or give the contracts to someone who will.