Feb 21: Sanders on VT public radio: "I did not know Russian bots were promoting my campaign."

[ehrnst]

Last edited Wed Feb 21, 2018, 04:38 PM - Edit history (1)

Link to tweet

"I did not know Russian bots were promoting my campaign."

"The real question to be asked is" why the Clinton campaign didn't do something.

[LexVegas]

1. What the fuck?? nt

[rockfordfile]

9. To me that means he knew Russians were helping him.

[CTyankee]

63. What? That would mean treason. I just can't believe Bernie would ever commit treason...

I voted for him in our CT primary because of his beliefs, his principles. While I believe it was entirely possible there was some involvment with Russia in the primaries, I cannot believe that Bernie knew. I have to believe that if he knew he would have gone to the FBI asap.

[Hortensis]

67. Well, he sued the DNC when his campaign stole

Clinton Campaign data. He filed lawsuits against multiple state Democratic parties whenever he got less than a majority to underline his claim that corrupt state parties stole his majority vote.

I think this pattern could be claimed to be evidence that he might not have known, since if he had he would undoubtedly have filed a lawsuit against Hillary's campaign for not stopping it. And then dropped it after the press moved on, of course, as per pattern, but the filing of a fake lawsuit is the important thing. Or in this case, lack of one.

[ehrnst]

15. Interesting in light of this:

A huge wave of fake news stories originating from eastern Europe began washing over the presidential election months earlier, at the height of the primary campaign. John Mattes, who was helping run the outline campaign for the Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders from San Diego, said it really took off in March 2016.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/05/donald-trump-russia-investigation-fake-news-hillary-clinton

[Hortensis]

68. I'm remembering taht Sanders refused to endorse Hillary

as the candidate for a whole, unheard-of month.

At the time speculation was that he was hoping that somehow criminal charges would finally result from the FBI investigation, but, even though he seemed to be coming to believe his accusations about corruption, that still seemed unlikely to me because he had to know the whole emails thing was phony. Comey did and had said nothing would be found, so I chalked it up to churlishness and getting carried away with his campaign rhetoric as much as anything else.

But now, since he knew since March at the latest, another, more plausible reason might be that he hoped Russia would take Hillary out. He's nothing if not a true believer in himself, and he might have felt it was wise and virtuous to delay conceding while he held himself ready to step forward for America.

[ehrnst]

69. There was mention of "a major external event" potentially happening

in a memo left on a restaurant table.

Google "End-Game-2016 - DocumentCloud"

According to Donna Brazile, Weaver relayed Sanders' offer to replace HRC right after her bout with pneumonia.

That makes so many other things that did - and didn't - come before so much clearer.

[Hortensis]

76. Interesting document, provided by BuzzFeed.

But bizarre. I'd forgotten it and am not sure I ever read it. Purportedly out of the Sanders campaign. It may be just revelatory of delusional thinking in a mourning camp that hadn't reached the acceptance stage yet. Thoughts of what they could do if some "external event" still changed everything are scattered throughout, while the memo's really about what they could leverage from the party after defeat.

Thanks for the link to it in any case. It's an amazing view into campaign thinking at that point, though this staffer may well not have been privy to everything. Sanders is not a babbling idiot like Trump.

But, I mean, the opening premises alone are astonishingly ridiculous. Could any of them believe "Clinton will undoubtedly be short of a convention majority based on pledged delegates" meant she wouldn't be nominated? And yet Sanders really did go to the superdelegates, among whom he had no support, and ask them to set aside the majority vote and essentially appoint him the candidate, another thing that everyone else knew would and could not happen. They exist to backstop the democratic process, to make sure it doesn't somehow go terribly wrong, not to subvert it. But he did it anyway.

To me this propensity for deluded hopes in campaign and candidate actually undermines the idea of a plan to let the Russians create a path to the White House for him, though in light of the new information from Mueller it seems it must have been on the list of possible "external events" still hoped for, like Hillary dropping dead.

As for Brazile, she seems to have Trump's attitude toward truth. Still, her "pneumonia" nonsense could conceivably be a protective euphemism for a plan to stand back and wait for Russia to destroy Hill and move him to the front. Frankly, though, I can't imagine Sanders trusting her with important information, or with anything at all.

Well, this was fun to speculate about, so thanks. The question of all that might be on a "major external event" list that could have taken out our candidate remains open.

[yardwork]

80. I mourn for our democracy. It wasn't perfect, but it was ours.

I feel an overwhelming grief now.

[Hortensis]

81. :) But presumably you'll be voting November 6, anyway.

Time for a . I only buy that stuff when we have houseguests so gotta enjoy when I can.

[yardwork]

82. I always vote. And I love coffee!

[yardwork]

79. He's saying now that he knew THEN about Russian interference.

[NCTraveler]

2. Uretsky wasn't promoting your campaign. He was a key player.

[tonedevil]

7. Wait...

What? Is there some evidence of this?

[ehrnst]

26. You do know who Josh Uretsky is don't you? (nt)

[tonedevil]

37. Perhaps I didn't understand...

I thought the comment was implying that Mr. Uretsky was somehow responsible for the Russian Bots. I don't belive there is any evidence of that.

[NurseJackie]

16. Daaaaaaamn!

[R B Garr]

25. Clinton database breached. Democrats purged from rolls...

hmmm. Manafort/Gates. Manafort/Devine. Same attacks on Hillary. hmmm

[uponit7771]

42. +1

[yardwork]

74. The connection to Manafort is VERY troubling.

This looks worse and worse.

[sarah FAILIN]

77. But if you say that, you are hidden/deleted

Even though we are just now finding this out and even though we are getting conflicting accounts of this from the 2nd Russian assisted campaign, we can't talk freely about what we just found out. That would be either talking bad about a democratic figure or re-fighting the primary.
I would like to know when current events are open for discussion and when someone is no longer a dem.

[BoneyardDem]

3. the real question is how could he not see it?

His own analyst knew https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10259017

[PubliusEnigma]

4. Bullshit!

[MineralMan]

5. Blaming Hillary?

Weird.

[rockfordfile]

6. That I don't buy.

[NightWatcher]

8. Did he know his biggest advocate, Thom Hartmann, was on RT's payroll?

He had been so for years, probably around the same time he started his weekly Beunch w Bernie segment.

[Me.]

10. He JUst Can't Quit Her

Considering his reaction when his team was caught stealing her data...this is rich. Doesn't speak well of him.

[NurseJackie]

14. It's obvious what he's trying to do... but he's not going to get the desired results.

Doesn't speak well of him.

Many many many people agree with that observation.

[kcr]

23. I suspect these statements were for a different crowd.

It smacks of desperation. I wonder if we're about to hear worse.

[Hortensis]

71. Definitely for those who'll believe it. But I'm wondering

if he may be to sort of a degree one of those believers-despite-everything he's speaking to.

Toward the end of the campaign he was a very, very angry man, as if he really believed something was stolen from him. His staffers were all amazed and alarmed by it. Not a rational thing, but seemed rather more an over-invested thing. Where emotion rules and intellect and integrity take a holiday.

That might have been expected to have passed. But to this day as we watch what electing Trump is meaning for the nation, there's no indication he regrets anything. And this auto-turning and casting blame at Hillary for the Russians' assistance with his campaign (!) certainly suggests his throwing mud on her is still SOP.

And, when you think about what that suggests about his self discipline and judgment, worse should not be surprising if it happens.

[Me.]

34. Apparently He & The Comrade In The WH

can't accept responsibility for what went on in their own campaigns. She did it/was responsible will be his new meme.

Back at you NJ

[ehrnst]

18. He claims not to know about a whole lot that's coming out now about people working for him.

[Me.]

29. I'm Calling BS

He may not want to know but burying your head in the sand doesn't make it go away. And mark my words....more to come.

[NurseJackie]

35. Heaven help us all.

[uponit7771]

43. +1

[Scoopster]

11. CLEAN YOUR OWN DAMN HOUSE, BERNIE.

He has some real fucking nerve demanding this of other candidates when his own campaign DID ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO STOP HIS OWN CAMPAIGN FROM BEING TARGETED.

What a fuckiing hypocrite. I will NEVER trust Bernie Sanders again.

[NurseJackie]

12. Oh, good Lord! It never ends, does it?

[NCTraveler]

41. No, it doesn't seem to.

Now Jane's daughter is running for Mayor of Burlington. Yes, the daughter who was able to take half a million out of Burlington College before it closed. The Sanders throw money at one and other like it's nothing. They promote themselves completely different to their base. I'm confident that is why his full taxes won't be released. That and his tax preparer for the last couple of years is currently under FBI investigation.

[R B Garr]

56. Wasnt she in charge of running his campaign?

He seemed very busy with his campaign stops, but she seemed to be very involved. I forgot her exact title. I bet she talked with Devine a lot, hmmm.

[obamanut2012]

13. lolz

[mythology]

17. Open mouth, insert foot

I don't think Sanders himself knew, but wow is this incredibly dumb of him to say.

[ehrnst]

22. Something that big, that was impacting his official FB pages, especially during the General?

There must have been a very tight bubble surrounding him then, because he was stumping for Hillary, and one of his own people brought it to the attention of her campaign.

A huge wave of fake news stories originating from eastern Europe began washing over the presidential election months earlier, at the height of the primary campaign. John Mattes, who was helping run the outline campaign for the Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders from San Diego, said it really took off in March 2016.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/05/donald-trump-russia-investigation-fake-news-hillary-clinton

That's not comforting to hear about someone that was endorsing the Democratic nominee.

[GusBob]

19. Not a Bernie fan but I believe him

I got the hides in '16 to prove I ain't a big Bernie fan

But I will give him the benefit of the doubt, I don't think he knew the Russians were boosting his campaign. The '16 primary was a cut-throat bloodbath across the spectrum literally a war without scorecards or name tags.

The Clinton part is a bunch of bullshit as far as the primary goes. I don't think she knew about Russia meddling until August of '16.

Is he claiming she should have done more about it during the general election?

[ehrnst]

24. Sounds like it.

Her campaign was told by one of his own people.

It seems odd that he wouldn't have been asked by the Democratic candidate to address it directly. Or that his team member investigating it wouldn't have told him.

There must have been a very, very tight wall surrounding him otherwise.

[GusBob]

28. When did they tell her?

Was this when it all came to light from the CIA? I believe that was in August

Clinton had access to the Steele Dossier correct?

Edit I see the answer above. March

[ehrnst]

32. No idea on the Dossier. But the analyst told Clinton and Obama in September 2016

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/05/donald-trump-russia-investigation-fake-news-hillary-clinton

[GusBob]

38. Yes I see.

The Steele dossier came to light in August, it never mentioned Bernie to my recollection

The Bernie guy saw a bunch of activity after the primary was over which made him suspicious so he called it out.

Nobody outside of the Trump campaign knew it was happening. Except for the Russians and some US and foreign spies

[ehrnst]

39. Actually, earlier than that.

A huge wave of fake news stories originating from eastern Europe began washing over the presidential election months earlier, at the height of the primary campaign. John Mattes, who was helping run the outline campaign for the Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders from San Diego, said it really took off in March 2016.

From July 2017: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jul/05/donald-trump-russia-investigation-fake-news-hillary-clinton

[R B Garr]

20. The whole Manafort/Devine connection is looming large...

Time to blame Hillary.

[mcar]

21. ...

[Jose Garcia]

27. This sounds like something Trump would say

[Blue_Tires]

30. Well, #Bernie2020 is now dead in the water before even leaving port...

[Exotica]

48. I agree

[Ezior]

31. That's enough. Not trusting him any longer.

I still like most policies he claims to support, but the guy can go pound sand. This is something Trump, or any other useful idiot (or worse – traitor), would say. Either he was ignorant, or he's a liar. His / his campaign's statements from past weeks seem to indicate the latter. In any case, he's not a politician I can support.

- very disappointed ex Bernie fan.

[frazzled]

33. Maybe ... but neither did he lift a finger to counter or disavow

any of the despicable lies that those bots were spreading about Clinton. It doesn't matter if he knew they were bots or only thought they were his supporters: for a leader, when people speak in their name, it is up to that leader to confirm or disavow what is being said.

As for putting it onto Clinton's shoulders ... well, that is a horrible abrogation of leadership.

[ehrnst]

36. "Bernie Sanders says his 2016 team saw effects of Russian anti-Clinton campaign"

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210268223

[LexVegas]

44. Somebody's gettin' paid? Where the hell is my check? nt

[ehrnst]

51. I know, right?

[ehrnst]

47. Vermont Public Radio is a paid shill?

Really?

I had no idea. Got any evidence to back that up?

[Exotica]

49. what are you on about?

what a silly little comment

[Cha]

54. All you have all insults, Turn CO blue.. Absolutely nothing else.

When you don't have anything useful to rebut. by all means.. call people who have been on DU for years.. "paid shills".

That shows you have no freaking idea what you're talking about.. and you have to resort to hurling insults at those you don't agree with.

[ehrnst]

58. (crickets)

And that's all we're going to hear from "Co blue."

[ehrnst]

57. What is stunning is the unfounded, insulting accusation you just made.

Of course you aren't going to actually back that up. You can't.

Did something get under your skin about what Senator Sanders said to Vermont Public Radio?

You should take it up with them or Senator Sanders.

This is Democratic Underground, and you should remember that.

[The Polack MSgt]

45. "WHAT ABOUT HILLARY?!?!"

Weird. This seems to be the question every man who ran for President in 2016 wants answered.

Odd that they seem to only ask this when their own conduct is being examined

[Cha]

53. Exactly! Trying to change the subject.

[Cha]

50. NO, BS.. the Real Question to be ASKED..

is why you're trying to Change the gd Subject.

[ehrnst]

61. Well, Hillary is a convenient subject/target

for men in politics when they want to change the topic very, very quickly....

See also the last couple of years.

[Cha]

62. Yeah, I noticed who he was going about

so busy blaming the loss on .. when it was the fucking Russians.

[ehrnst]

66. But she was, so, you know, "flawed."

Unlike any man who has run, because certainly, if "flawed" is a dealbreaker, then no previous candidate was guilty of that....

So really, what's to lose blaming it on her lack of action, or overreacting, or whatever?

[Ken Burch]

52. And he probably didn't.

It's not like the guy WANTED us to end up with T___p.

[ehrnst]

59. Yesterday, he said this:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210268223

I am getting whiplash.

[betsuni]

72. First he says he knows, then he says he doesn't: that's sloppy knowing.

Sloppy bookkeeping is a slippery slope I guess, next thing you know everything's sloppy.

[lark]

55. i've never said this before, but fuck him.

With drumpfs being a traitor to our country to help russia and himself, Sanders chooses to attack a fellow liberal, WTHF! He's just proven who he is and it's so ugly. No votes for him, ever again in my life (I don't live in VT). If I lived in VT, I probably would vote for him because even he is so superior to russian nra repugs.

[dalton99a]

60. Bernie, you know that's bullshit.

[lunamagica]

64. What a trumpesque reply

[Squinch]

65. To all the bros: NOW do you see it?

[betsuni]

73. The ones who used the word "weathervane" constantly.

[Squinch]

75. Ugh. I'm having flashbacks.

[LexVegas]

78. ...

[JHan]

70. but he's said before that he was aware of Russian disinformation.

This is a terrible statement in any case.


I mean really