After failing to tip Outback server on $735 order, mega church finally pays up

[jpak]

http://www.tampabay.com/news/business/After-failing-to-tip-Outback-server-on-735-order-mega-church-finally-pays-up_165437896

After being fired from Outback Steakhouse for posting about a church not tipping her on a $735 take-out order on Facebook, Tamlynn Yoder was finally compensated.

Yoder would not specify how much the Palm Beach Gardens church, Christ Fellowship, gave her, but told the Miami Herald that the compensation totaled "more than 20 percent of the bill."

"A few church families came together and gave it to me. It was a very heartwarming situation," Yoder said. She noted that Outback has not contacted her since her termination.

Last week, Yoder spent most of her shift at a Naples Outback readying a take-out order for 25 church members. The 75-item order — placed by Christ Fellowship on Wednesday — included 25 steaks, 25 chicken dinners and 25 sides of potatoes.

<more>

[RKP5637]

1. Naples? That's a poverty stricken area of Florida, isn't it?

[snowybirdie]

39. We're not too far from there

Won't darken their door again

[RKP5637]

45. I've been there a few times, the opulence is just too much, showing who has the

most money. I don't care for it at all.

[spooky3]

2. I really wish we would move away from the tip system, like other

developed countries (in restaurants, that is).

She clearly should have received either a tip or more $ from her employer. The church people should have asked about this, but I do think it is confusing for normal take out orders, since you don’t get the usual service as if you came in and “were waited on.” You don’t give tips at McDonald’s for example.

[Initech]

4. That would require restaurants to pay their employees more.

And if you've seen Fox Business, or Bloomberg lately, that ain't happening.

[spooky3]

10. Yes, I know. Several restaurants have tried it, with mixed

Success.

[Iggo]

40. I think it's hilarious when establishments tell me there's no tipping allowed.

Oh really, I says.

[spooky3]

47. I don't think most servers would spit in your beer if you tried to give them a tip anyway.

[Iggo]

48. Know'm say'n?

[hlthe2b]

6. I agree with the confusion on tipping for take out orders... I usually do, but not always and

certainly not 20% unless some extra service was provided--as it isn't clear to me that the service provided is consistent with a waiter spending an hour or more tableside.

I can appreciate that a group (of any kind) might have inadvertently neglected this but I'm glad they did once aware... But that she lost her job is horrible. I think Outback is responsible for not having an automatic tipping policy/service fee for large take out orders, just as most restaurants do for large parties.

[spooky3]

9. Agree. And the church was also helping her to find

another job.

[customerserviceguy]

24. That was my reaction, partly

I don't know how we get to more wages from an employer, and if that would make service suffer as some who go to Europe tell me, but I could see confusion about whether a tip is customary, morally required, or necessary in the case of take-out food. I don't go for take-out very much, and when I do, it's usually a pizza. I would indeed tip a driver that brought the pizza to my house, but, he's clearly performing a personal service for me.

Do people tip at the deli? Do you tip a fast-food worker whose counter you go up to, then they call your number, and you take the tray back to a table you've selected, then clean up after yourself? How about the cashier at my supermarket, they're doing a service for me regarding my food, most of the time, they bag it up for me, too.

I can see the ambiguity of the situation, and I applaud the members of the church who realized that not only should there have been a tip, but those who were appalled at the loss of her job over her displeasure at the snub. I'd make sure that I avoided that restaurant if I lived in the area, and would encourage other people to do so.

[Hortensis]

37. Sure. My problem is squarely with Outback, which should have

compensated her for lost tips while tending to this special order. THAT was dishonorable and exploitative. No ambiguity at all.

I'm certainly with you that that restaurant would be permanently off my list.

Btw, have we met before? Your name sounds familiar.

[SWBTATTReg]

55. I agree w/ you...Outback should have been more responsive to the former employee...

most normal people leave or provide a tip. They didn't. Should have checked at the receipt of the meal and bill when picked up.

Someone knew that these people are working for tips, period. Just too tight w/ the wallet. By the way, if it was in a poor area less inclined to afford the meals, they shouldn't ordered but make the meals in-house to save money for the church as well as the church attendees. I would have w/ the churches I've previously attended.

[Hortensis]

62. :) Interesting point about the church. Never thought

about kitchens in megachurchs. With large memberships, wouldn't be surprising if meals weren't normally prepared there. I've never belonged to a church, but I helped in a friend's church kitchen once and it was such a nice coming together I've actually felt a little sorry for churches without kitchens ever since.

[SWBTATTReg]

64. I was never in a 'megachurch', so don't know about the kitchens in one...

I assumed that they had, being that most of the small churches I went to, had a small kitchen usually. Sometimes another nice thing they had us all do (church attendees) was Pot Luck dinners. Congregation was divided into sections and each section (5-7 people each) would bring salids, veggies, meats, desserts, etc.

This was nice, especially if neighbors were invited (very rural area, all knew each others), and all came, didn't care about denominations, acted more like a community center...I enjoyed these types of activities, for there was no preaching in your face, and all shared news, hints, etc. of the day.

Have a nice day!

[Hortensis]

66. :) You too.

[GoneOffShore]

42. Service in Europe is much better than it is in the US.

Servers don't try to be your friend.
They don't generally interrupt conversations to take your order, tell you the specials until you ask, nor are they constantly checking to make sure that 'everything is alright'(if it's not you motion them over and tell them). In a 'white tablecloth' restaurant, one very seldom has to ask for water refills or drink refills - the servers keep an eye on those things. Most of the time they will not bring the bill until you ask for it, because the table is yours for the afternoon or evening, unless you've been told otherwise when you made the reservation.
Best of all, a gratuity is not expected, because they get paid a decent wage. I'll generally leave 20¢ on a coffee, 1-2€ on dinner unless I'm in a high end place and then, if the service is exceptional, 5-10€, but not often.
In the US I tip 20% in most restaurants and higher when in a BYOB or low priced family run place. And I hate the whole tipping thing, but having worked in restaurants, understand how badly people are payed.
If the Dolt45 proposal that restaurants distribute tips instead of them going directly to the servers, the number of places I go to will go down.

[Lord_at_War]

57. And, it goes even deeper than that.

How many people tip the gal restocking shelves at Target?

My first job was "paperboy" for the Columbus (OH) Citizen-Journal. I regularly made more in tips every 2 weeks than I did for delivering the paper- and Christmas season made me a fat boy! Fresh Florida oranges in December in Ohio in 1977, not to mention the cookies and other sweets...

It all helps... when I worked a receiving dock in a warehouse, Larry (a trucker) always showed up first thing on Monday morning with a dozen donuts (AKA "beer sponges" )- Who do you think was the first guy out?

[customerserviceguy]

68. Same here

I delivered the afternoon newspaper in a medium sized city in Washington State. It taught me a lot of people skills that served me well later in life. But, kids don't have those kinds of jobs these days, if they go to anyone, it's to an adult who is supplementing another income, usually.

There were all kinds of opportunities for a young person to work when I was growing up, I don't think there's as many now.

[hatrack]

3. Oh, well that purported $140-odd will really help since she got fired . . .

[Bengus81]

23. That was my first thought....

I see she was "finally" compensated by Outback. Sure...after the stories hit,otherwise...nothing IMO.

[Renew Deal]

5. You dont have to tip on a takeout order

It stinks that she lost a shift to putting this order together, but I don’t think she’s right.

[ProfessorGAC]

7. To Be Fair To Her. . .

. . .a kitchen staffer should have been doing the prep, not someone losing a shift of tips to prepare a take-out order.

So, while i see your point, this is kind of on the manager for the day to have a tip based worker spending an entire shift not getting any tips to service an order that only benefits the restaurant.

[Renew Deal]

11. I agree

This is a screw up.

[WillowTree]

13. Agree that the manager should be responsible in this case. Stinks that he/she fired the poor girl.

Surely not the customer. People don't ordinarily tip on carry-out orders and they wouldn't have had any way of knowing that one person had done most of the work co-ordinating their order and lost out on her ability to earn tips for the day.

That said, it's just never a good idea to complain about such work-related things on social media. More often than not these days it's likely to come back to bite you, as it did in this case. Better and safer idea to call your sister of BFF and yak about it to get it off your chest.

[sdfernando]

27. I always tip on a take out order.

I'm a good tipper and give 20% minimum at a sit-down meal...unless the service is REALLY bad. On a take-out I typically do 10% and 15% on a delivery order.

[WillowTree]

32. Who does that tip go to?

If you leave cash, who do you give it to? The cashier? If you add it to your check and pay with a credit card, what's to say that it doesn't just go into the restaurant coffers? In a situation like this one, would you know that one person spent most of her shift working on your order so you could direct the tip to that person?

The person I was responding to cussing out the customer for handling the situation the way most people do instead of letting the fault lie entirely where it belongs, the management of that particular store, is just venting and pretty ridiculous if you think about it. If they had added a tip to their tab, do you honestly think that waitress would have seen a cent of it, considering the apparent mentality of her manager?

[sdfernando]

36. The cash goes to teh server..If I don't have cash it goes on the card.

I suppose that the restaurant could take it at that point and not give to the server. I choose to believe in the good not the bad and that the tip goes where it is supposed to. Maybe I'm naive about that but If I believed they were all bad people I wouldn't survive in this world.

[Iggo]

41. And then he fired her.

What a guy!

[Blue_Tires]

52. That's how you were raised...

I was raised to always kick in 10% for takeout and 15-20% for dine-in... And if possible add a couple extra points for really big orders...

[Renew Deal]

54. 15-20% is stingy for dine in

And good tippers tip after tax.

[Blue_Tires]

61. 15-20 is the minimum, and I scale up depending on quality of service

yeah, I take care of folks...

[NewJeffCT]

8. While I don't think it's required you tip on take-out orders

I normally try to give around 10% instead of the 20% for eating in a restaurant.

I do agree that the tip system needs to go

[BSdetect]

12. Never going to outback again

What a ridiculous decision to fire someone for that.

Hope she sues for wrongful termination.

And as for the church that did not tip fuckem.

[WillowTree]

14. You usually tip on a carry-out order?

[Aristus]

15. I do. Not everyone does. But I do.

Just a couple of bucks, usually. But always something.

[Beaverhausen]

17. I do too

maybe not the entire 20% I usually tip but someone did take the time to handle the order and should be tipped.

[unblock]

31. i try to tip but lol, they try to refuse.

when we get take-out it's nearly always indian, and at least for this one restaurant it's just not considered proper to get tipped for take-out. they always refuse my tip. i've asked them, they say, please, don't be silly, it's just take out, no tip.

even when i put it on the credit card slip they key in the lower amount when the process it. i mean they really go out of their way to not get tipped.

[obamanut2012]

46. I do -- 10%

[WillowTree]

50. Again, when you're just going in to pick up your order, who do you give the tip to?

[Skittles]

53. I ask for the person whose name is on the order

[WillowTree]

56. That's fine as far as it goes.

In a case like this one, who knows whose name may have been on the check (or register tape, etc)? The person who took the order over the phone? The person who rang it up? Did she do either of those things? Was the manager, who we already know is a schmuck, the person who wrote it up and put his/her name on it? We don't know. I just think it's foolish to go off on the customer who 1) did what most people do when they pick up a carry-out order; and 2) did come through when they learned what happened to the girl. YMMV.

[Skittles]

60. they verify who put the order together

[Skittles]

51. yes

[Mariana]

58. The servers who prepare your take-out orders

don't magically get paid more when they're assigned to do that instead of serving tables.

[Danascot]

16. I'm really surprised that someone in PR at Outback

hasn't acted to defuse this situation. I think a number of people like BSdetect will decide not to patronize Outback based on this incident. This kind of publicity is not good for them.

I'm not going to go to an Outback in the future either but it's because I went once and the food was terrible.

[unblock]

29. you think servers should be allowed to insult customers online without getting fired?

plenty of wrong in this story.

the restaurant should pay servers enough so they're not reliant on tips.
the restaurant shouldn't take someone away from tipping tables to do often untipped or poorly tipped work like take-out orders
the server shouldn't have insulted the customers
and obviously, the customer should have tipped.

mrs. unblock used to be a server, she said that was the one cardinal rule about tips, you *never* complain about a tip within earshot of the customer. in the kitchen with the door closed, absolutely. but nowhere where a customer might hear you.

broadcasting it on social media is absolutely solid grounds for firing someone, even if the restaurant shouldn't have put her in that position in the first place.


good on the customer for apparently going above and beyond to try to make the situation right.

mrs. unblock and i tip quite well, but i wish the tip system would just go away. it sucks on many levels.

[NCTraveler]

18. Her employer should be paying her fair compensation.

I get that many servers want to keep the tipping system. Problems: Companies get to pay abusive wages. Across the board, tips are an inconsistent income source. Tips are expected as a general societal contract. No guarantees. It leads to extreme tax evasion when looked upon as a whole.

The system must change. If you need an employee to work at your business you should pay them a fair wage.

Pay people a living damn wage if you want to run a business.

[customerserviceguy]

25. In this situation

she should have had her wages bumped up to that of one of the non-tipped employees, since there were efficiencies reaped by the employer in fulfilling this large order. No doubt, it was ordered well in advance, which gave them some certainty of income for that day, and there were minimal costs in cleanup, etc., not to mention the efficiency of only one financial transaction rather than many such transactions.

It's like having a commission-based salesperson doing office work. If everybody's gotta do their fair share (like real estate agents staffing the office on rotating weekends) then that's one thing, but if you pull a person whose pay depends on their ability to do their job well off of that job, and on to another that may pay less than minimum wage, that's wage theft.

I don't know how we switch off the tip system, so many depend on it, because their superior abilities get properly compensated more often than not, and if we would not like the results of leaving that system. You'd essentially have to outlaw tips to get away from tipping, because not a lot of people would want to look like a jerk for not tipping in a situation that normally has called for tipping.

[NCTraveler]

28. Pay them a living wage.

The cost on the menu increases.

That alone would curb tipping in a huge way.

If this change were made, everyone in the country would know about it overnight.

"she should have had her wages bumped up to that of one of the non-tipped employees"

Not possible. Under what scenario should she be bumped down to that of the non-tipped employees? This isn't about pitting people against people. It's about a livable wage.

[customerserviceguy]

33. I was assuming

that cooks were paid higher than servers, since cooks don't get tipped.

So, who's going to go first with, "Come eat here, our prices are higher than everybody else's, but you're under no obligation to tip, because we pay our workers $20 an hour, whether they do a good job for you or not." That's the message that some restaurant would have to sell, and it won't be an easy one.

I am familiar with the fast-food chain known as Burgerville, USA in the Portland, Oregon area, they provide a better than minimum wage plus health insurance benefits for their workers. There's no "dollar menu", but the company has stressed an ethos that revolves around sustainability, and eco-friendliness in the provision of their products, but it hasn't driven the local Wendy's, Burger King's, and McDonald's out of business, either. They thrive in their environment because they are the only ones who run their restaurants that way, and people with enough of a sense of affluence in the Northwest will support that business model, because it's well known by the locals. I don't know how it would work in other parts of the country that are not as progressive or prosperous.

Unless tipping is outlawed, or a higher minimum wage is enacted for jobs where people customarily are tipped, I don't see a path out of the tip system.

[NCTraveler]

34. "who's going to go first with,"

Every business wanting to stay within the law.

"Unless tipping is outlawed, or a higher minimum wage is enacted for jobs where people customarily are tipped, I don't see a path out of the tip system."

+1

"because we pay our workers $20 an hour, whether they do a good job for you or not."

That makes no sense. Why would a restaurant owner keep someone not doing their job?

I pay every employee a livable wage. My Administrative Assistant currently makes a middle class income. I'm a small business owner. If they do a bad job, they get fired. I don't evaluate and lower their pay.

[customerserviceguy]

35. Under the present tipping system

the customer being served gets the power to deem it a good job or not. Many people like having that sort of control.

But, we agree, it would take a law change to effectuate this. Maybe someday when we take back the government from the Pukes, that can be on our to-do list.

[NCTraveler]

38. "the customer being served gets the power to deem it a good job or not"

That isn't how it works. The customer could be in a bad mood. They could be a nightmare. They might never tip. They might not like the color of the servers skin.

A lot of it is not based on the service provided. That aspect can be seen in study after study.

That still leaves out the enormous tax evasion aspect. The theft and pitting of employee against employee that occurs under a tipping system in restaurants. The fact that it allows for racial discrimination and entices women to allow shady behavior in order to fee their families. So much is wrong with the tipping environment.

http://www.tippingresearch.com/uploads/customer_racial_discrimination10-30-06.pdf

http://rocunited.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/REPORT_TheGlassFloor_Sexual-Harassment-in-the-Restaurant-Industry.pdf

[SWBTATTReg]

65. I disagree w/ the concept of 'customer getting the service' has power to deem it a good job or not..

My cheap uncle always tipped a quarter whether or not dinners were $5 or $25 each. My family always hated going out on tipping events w/ him and his family. Usually we ended up throwing in more money to cover his share, eventually we quit asking him & family out to tipping events (actually, all events, too cheap).

Some people think that they know the value of a dollar, w/ the above, I kind of doubt that with these kinds of people. They basically cheat others, in effect.

[NCTraveler]

67. My grandfather gave nothing for good service.

A quarter for above average service, and for excellent service he would rub the quarter on his parts to shine it up. Yes, he would tell them he shined the quarter for their good job. These were places we would frequent. I lost a lot of money going behind his back to make up for how offensive he was.

[Blue_Adept]

19. A takeout order like that should have it built into it for gratuity because of the size

Takeout generally does not have a tip applied simply because it's kitchen to door and no waitstaff involved.

I don't tip when I do takeout - though I do for delivery.

Similarly, I don't tip for buffet. I'm doing all the "work" in that sense.

[bullwinkle428]

20. It seems like lots of restaurants do have an automatic gratuity built in

to the bill when there are around 6, maybe 8 people or more these days. No reason why this should not have been the case for this particular order, even if it was take-out.

[Blue_Adept]

21. It's almost never applied to take out orders

Mostly because an order that sized isn't considered takeout but catering. The management dropped the ball here from start to finish.

[JI7]

49. I usually don't tip on takeout but i would if it was an order this large

Or i had some special requests and the person looked like they were putting in a lot of effort to get things right.

On an order this large i would tip for sure.

[nadine_mn]

22. I don't get how she spent most of her shift readying the order

I mean a shift is what 6-8 hours? I can see the time packing it, but wouldn't it be on the cooks and probably a manager making sure everything was together on an order that large?

It's a big no no to blast customers on social media...most businesses have a policy against that and most restaurants have a policy on large orders like that (I mean that is a huge amount of food that needs to be ready around the same time so you don't have a lot of cold food).

This was just a hot mess all around. I wish we would just get rid of tipping, it's ridiculous and stupid. Everyone did something wrong - not tipping, posting about it on social media, manager not handling it etc.

[msongs]

26. so called tips should be added to checks as a required service fee so customers have an option to

pay it or go elsewhere. what has always been a reward for good service above and beyond is turning into extortion. of course restaurants could just pay a better wage to its servers and put a no tips notice on menus

[saidsimplesimon]

30. Thank you, jpak and FL

Tampa Bay, quelle surprise, some so-called people of "faith" say they believe in "trickle down" but always prove they lie.

[crazycatlady]

44. From what my friends who have been servers told me

The after church crowds are the worst tippers. Some even leave a religious tract in lieu of a tip.

[beachbum bob]

43. she lost her job and Outback no longer on our places to go.

[Mariana]

59. Sounds like collections may have been down last Sunday

at Christ Fellowship because of the bad publicity. Oopsie.

[LuckyCharms]

63. I always pay a generous tip on take-outs.

Someone had to take the order, submit the order to the kitchen, check the order for accuracy when done, package the order, ring up the order.

Did the cook, rather than the host or hostess do some of this? Maybe, maybe not. In any case, someone's going to get a tip, because it is the right thing to do.

People worrying about paying 20-25% on top of the meal cost for meal related service should not be ordering out. Pay the goddamn tip and don't complain about it.

For me, it will be this way until restaurant employees are making a living wage.