Column: Gun Owners Surveyed By Frank Luntz Express Broad Support For Gun Control Policies

[samsingh]

Source: www.huffingtonpost.com

The study, which was conducted in May by GOP wordsmith Frank Luntz, revealed the following data points as well:

•74 percent of NRA members believe concealed carry permits should only be granted to applicants who have completed gun safety training.
•68 percent of NRA members believe concealed carry permits should only be granted to applicants who do not have prior arrests for domestic violence.
•63 percent of NRA members believe concealed carry permits should only be granted to applicants 21 years of age or older.
•75 percent of NRA members believe that concealed carry permits should be granted only to those applicants who have not committed any violent misdemeanors.
Taken in full, the numbers cut against the conventional wisdom, which holds that there is little political will for tackling gun control legislation in the wake of Friday's shooting in Aurora, Colo. But that theory, the study's authors insisted, was always based on a false reading of the public opinion data.

“Gun owners and NRA members overwhelmingly support common sense steps to keep guns out of the hands of criminals, even as the NRA leadership continues to oppose them,” said New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, chair of Mayors Against Illegal Guns, which commissioned the study. “It’s time for those in Washington -– and those running for President –- to stand with gun owning citizens who are concerned about public safety, rather than influence peddling lobbyists who are obsessed with ideology."

link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/24/gun-owners-frank-luntz_n_1699140.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

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[rrneck]

1. It's bullshit whether it's accurate or not.

It's Frank Luntz on Huffington post.

[samsingh]

2. i thought it was a rw pollster that conducted the survey

[rrneck]

6. Frank Luntz could lie to you telling you the sky is blue.

I wouldn't piss down his throat if his guts were on fire.

[TheWraith]

18. In this case, all of those things are ALREADY THE LAW.

With the exception of Vermont and Wyoming, being that those states don't require permits for concealed carry.

[rrneck]

19. Yep. nt

[Gold Metal Flake]

3. "It's bullshit whether it's accurate or not."

That sentence is some kind of work of art.

[samsingh]

8. how can it be bullsit if it's accurate?

[rrneck]

9. Factual statements can br used to mislead people.

Luntz has made a career of it.

See post #4.

[samsingh]

12. another survey at post #10

[rrneck]

13. Interesting.

Aside from the fact that some people didn't understand the question in the first two items, what policy proposals would you suggest based on those polls?

[samsingh]

14. i think the survey results allow proposals to be considered

i would want to consider meaningful and thoughtful ones that would be the best for society as a whole.

[rrneck]

16. Sure. Like what? nt

[samsingh]

17. okay

- automated alerts when someone buys over 100 rounds of ammunition
- restrictions on the size of magazines

[rrneck]

21. Well,

Reloading time does not affect lethiality. Here's a video that shows how quickly one can reload with practice. I can manage it in about two or three seconds, and I haven't been to the range in forever.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1020598

You may find the entire sub thread informative.

An alert on a hundred round purchase? For most shooters, a day at the range is two or three times that. For avid and competitive shooters it's a factor of ten. A one hundred round red flag would produce an ocean of useless data for preventing crime. And that's not to mention how easy it is to load your own. Although it would be a nice data mining opportunity for someone like Dick Cheney.

A lot of people don't know a lot about guns. And that's fine. But that lack of knowledge makes them susceptible to polls like these that snooker them into thinking workable policy is being discussed. And those polls get trotted out by people and used as a fallacious argumentum ad populum for their own ideological ends.

How many average Americans would have approved of deregulating the home lending market in 2006?

[X_Digger]

4. Frank Luntz, whose company motto is, "It's not what you say, it's what people hear"?

When this *cough* poll came out the first time around, it was discussed widely.

Luntz carefully orders and words the questions to lead people to the conclusion his client pays him to elicit.

In the above list of 'results'- those are mostly already the law.
-most states require at least an NRA-certified pistol course before granting a permit
-domestic violence is already a disqualifier for permits in all states I'm familiar with
-21 is the minimum age for permits in most states
-violent misdemeanors are already disqualifiers in most states.

So what you have are a bunch of people agreeing with the laws as they are generally already written-- spun by Luntz (working for Bloomberg) into 'support for stricter gun control'.

Should anyone be surprised that Luntz produced a poll favorable to his clients' goals? The name of the company is 'Spin Doctors'.

[-..__...]

5. The survey is pretty much exclusive to the issue of CCW...

and none of the other issues that come under the heading of "gun control" (registration, AWB, mag capacity limits, waiting periods, one gun per month, etc).

Funny how Bloomberg is waiving this "survey" around to back up his claim that even NRA folks
are supportive of "gun control" measures... when Bloomberg himself would never be supportive of CCW permits even if all those restrictions were in effect.

I could go along with all those listed (with the possible exception of "violent misdemeanors" being cause for rejection)... but only if all CCW licenses were "shall issue".

[NewMoonTherian]

7. Is THIS what people mean...

when they say that most gun owners favor gun control?

Of course I believe violent criminals shouldn't receive concealed carry permits! I'm indifferent toward gun safety training requirements, because states that use the "Constitutional Carry" policy demonstrate it to be unnecessary. The proposal here I most strongly disagree with is the 21 year age requirement. It should be 18 - just like military service and the traditional definition of the citizens' militia.

It's elementary that plenty of gun owners would be fine with restrictions such as these. By this standard, I am all for gun control.

Gun control advocates say that this polling indicates that gun owners support common-sense gun control. Then they go on to change the definition of common-sense gun control to include whatever they choose.

I support barring violent criminals from acquiring guns. I do not support assault weapons bans. I'm fine with requiring safety training to carry and handgun in public. I don't support the NFA or the Hughes amendment. I believe there should be an age requirement to buy and carry handguns. I don't support Michael Bloomberg or the MAIG, or any of their ideas. Anyone who says the majority of gun owners do is misinformed, or lying.

[DanTex]

10. This is no surprise.

Polls have consistently found that comfortable majorities support most common-sense gun laws, including majorities of gun owners.

Here's another poll, conducted jointly by Republican and Democratic polling firms:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/18/poll-americans-gun-owners-stronger-laws_n_810069.html

Among the results
85% of gun owners support requiring background checks for all gun sales at gun shows
81% of gun owners support requiring background checks for all gun sales period, including private sales
56% of gun owners support background checks for ammo purchases
49% of gun owners support banning high-capacity magazines (58% overall)
49% of gun owners support registering all guns in a national registry (66% overall)

It is very clear that common-sense gun laws like these are not unpopular with the general voting public. It's just special interest politics.

[samsingh]

11. this is amazing and would go a long way towards appeasing those wanting stricter gun control WITHOUT

losing all the votes of the gun owners.

we're all running scared from the gun voters that are the most vocal

[DanTex]

15. The numbers for gun registration are most remarkable.

A national gun registry would go a long way towards preventing guns from getting into the hands of criminals. And it would also be very helpful for tracking and catching people trafficking guns, for example, into Mexico. The pro-gun extremists are strongly opposed to gun registration, because in their paranoid minds if the government has a list of guns then pretty soon they are going to go door-to-door and take those guns away. This survey shows that only 6% of Americans, and only 9% of gun owners are "strongly opposed" to a gun registry. And 66% of Americans are in favor.

It just goes to show how small a minority the true gun fanatics really are.

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. Supported by multiple polls

why I have said over the course of the last few days, that we have a VERY LOUD MINORITY hijacking the debate.

Americans, not just GUN OWNERS, want SENSIBLE gun control measures, but here in the old DU, even 100% background checks, which are all but controversial, ARE.

You go figure, but this SMALL but LOUD group is actually quite bipartisan.

I have to conclude their opposition lies in NOT being able to pass a background check.